UM Athletics Operated in Red Last Year

[grizindabox]

We can however, commit to a payment of $260,000 for Dixie St. to play in Missoula in 2027. We have four games coming up with them, three here. Those should be really tough tickets.

https://fbschedules.com/dixie-state-byu-colorado-state-plus-eight-more-future-schedules/

That article is worded odd, as I am pretty sure the $260,000 is a lump sum for the 2026 and 2027 games, to be paid after the 2027 game.

 

[PlayerRep]

With Montana one of the states with leading alcoholism and suicide, along with auto disasters, I doubt beer at a UM game is a good idea.

I see your point, but at the same time the Adams Center sells beer during concerts and other events, along with WGS.

UM athletic/sponsored events, UM assumes liability....concerts and other events, promoter assumes liability.

UM may have liability in some situations, but they don't "assume" it. The GSA serves beer at games. Businesses serves beer at their tailgates. Liability may come in some situations from over-serving an obvious drunk. I don't see liability as a big deal.

 

[Sam A. Blitz]

You're naïve to think that UM hasn't considered alcohol sales at sporting events. The liability risk outweighs any profits that could be generated from that. Assume you net $2 profit per beer sold and 25,000 attendants each buy 2 beers over 6 home games, you've only generated $300k in additional net income per year (this being generous). Consider the liability you assume by selling/serving alcohol and being at risk of a multi million dollar law suit. Doesn't seem worth it.

Hmmm. (25,000)(2)($2)(6) = $600,000. The liability, of course, would be covered by an insurance policy, cost unknown. But can't be that different from the Pubs. Most plans consider this with a one-way gate at halftime, which would likely result in more food concessions as well. But more bathrooms needed... Other BSC venues like PSU and UNC seem to have it managed when their income is but a fraction of what we could expect.

I guess the only thing naive is my confidence in my math...

Would be interesting to know what an insurance policy for stadium booze on a college campus looks like... If an underage kid is overserved by alcohol purchased from a University beer vendor and falls and seriously hurts themselves, does a policy cover that? I'm just guessing the economic opportunity doesn't outweigh the liability.

 

[PlayerRep]

You're naïve to think that UM hasn't considered alcohol sales at sporting events. The liability risk outweighs any profits that could be generated from that. Assume you net $2 profit per beer sold and 25,000 attendants each buy 2 beers over 6 home games, you've only generated $300k in additional net income per year (this being generous). Consider the liability you assume by selling/serving alcohol and being at risk of a multi million dollar law suit. Doesn't seem worth it.

Hmmm. (25,000)(2)($2)(6) = $600,000. The liability, of course, would be covered by an insurance policy, cost unknown. But can't be that different from the Pubs. Most plans consider this with a one-way gate at halftime, which would likely result in more food concessions as well. But more bathrooms needed... Other BSC venues like PSU and UNC seem to have it managed when their income is but a fraction of what we could expect.

I guess the only thing naive is my confidence in my math...

Would be interesting to know what an insurance policy for stadium booze on a college campus looks like... If an underage kid is overserved by alcohol purchased from a University beer vendor and falls and seriously hurts themselves, does a policy cover that? I'm just guessing the economic opportunity doesn't outweigh the liability.

Yes, a policy would cover that. However, the chance of UM over-serving and underage kid, is close to zero. UM checks id's way better than bars. They "over-check".

Can you point to one example in MT where anyone has won a claim against a bar or university for over-serving them, and then they fell down? People who get "over served" don't bring claims. People hit by them in cars occasionally bring claims, if they can show the bar or server over-served an obviously drunk person.

Anyway, that is what insurance is for.

My god, how do some of you even get through a day of life.

 

[Sam A. Blitz]

You're naïve to think that UM hasn't considered alcohol sales at sporting events. The liability risk outweighs any profits that could be generated from that. Assume you net $2 profit per beer sold and 25,000 attendants each buy 2 beers over 6 home games, you've only generated $300k in additional net income per year (this being generous). Consider the liability you assume by selling/serving alcohol and being at risk of a multi million dollar law suit. Doesn't seem worth it.

Hmmm. (25,000)(2)($2)(6) = $600,000. The liability, of course, would be covered by an insurance policy, cost unknown. But can't be that different from the Pubs. Most plans consider this with a one-way gate at halftime, which would likely result in more food concessions as well. But more bathrooms needed... Other BSC venues like PSU and UNC seem to have it managed when their income is but a fraction of what we could expect.

I guess the only thing naive is my confidence in my math...

Would be interesting to know what an insurance policy for stadium booze on a college campus looks like... If an underage kid is overserved by alcohol purchased from a University beer vendor and falls and seriously hurts themselves, does a policy cover that? I'm just guessing the economic opportunity doesn't outweigh the liability.

Yes, a policy would cover that. However, the chance of UM over-serving and underage kid, is close to zero. UM checks id's way better than bars. They "over-check".

Can you point to one example in MT where anyone has won a claim against a bar or university for over-serving them, and then they fell down? People who get "over served" don't bring claims. People hit by them in cars occasionally bring claims, if they can show the bar or server over-served an obviously drunk person.

Anyway, that is what insurance is for.

My god, how do some of you even get through a day of life.

Thanks for answering the question. I get through daily life just fine.

https://www.alcohol.org/laws/over-serving/

There is liability for over serving and have been cases where people have sued for damages to an establishment that over served. I don't know if any claims have been successful. I'm not a lawyer and don't know how those cases work in Montana or anywhere else. Maybe a competent lawyer could enlighten us?

I don't think it's an easy task to regulate alcohol consumption in general seating of a large stadium. Checking ID's at the beer gardens hasn't stopped underaged drinking at concerts or other events I've been to. Doubt it would at a football stadium. Just my opinion.

However, if over serving or contributing to over intoxication is an insurable peril and it does in fact mitigate that risk, what are the reasons for not selling beer if it would net strong additional earnings? Most colleges don't serve alcohol outside of private boxes. Maybe there are other factors...

 

[kemajic]

You're naïve to think that UM hasn't considered alcohol sales at sporting events. The liability risk outweighs any profits that could be generated from that. Assume you net $2 profit per beer sold and 25,000 attendants each buy 2 beers over 6 home games, you've only generated $300k in additional net income per year (this being generous). Consider the liability you assume by selling/serving alcohol and being at risk of a multi million dollar law suit. Doesn't seem worth it.

Hmmm. (25,000)(2)($2)(6) = $600,000. The liability, of course, would be covered by an insurance policy, cost unknown. But can't be that different from the Pubs. Most plans consider this with a one-way gate at halftime, which would likely result in more food concessions as well. But more bathrooms needed... Other BSC venues like PSU and UNC seem to have it managed when their income is but a fraction of what we could expect.

I guess the only thing naive is my confidence in my math...

Would be interesting to know what an insurance policy for stadium booze on a college campus looks like... If an underage kid is overserved by alcohol purchased from a University beer vendor and falls and seriously hurts themselves, does a policy cover that? I'm just guessing the economic opportunity doesn't outweigh the liability.

Actually the naive goes far beyond your math. Your "guessing" and your assumptions are just as far off.

 

[kemajic]

Most colleges don't serve alcohol outside of private boxes. Maybe there are other factors...

Actually many do, including PSU in UNC in our own conference. At UNC, there is no beer garden, just a separate concession booth for beer and they do check IDs effectively. Then you are free to take your beer back to your seat like any other concession.

 

[retiredpopo]

Most colleges don't serve alcohol outside of private boxes. Maybe there are other factors...

Actually many do, including PSU in UNC in our own conference. At UNC, there is no beer garden, just a separate concession booth for beer and they do check IDs effectively. Then you are free to take your beer back to your seat like any other concession.

UNC has a stadium capacity of what 8500 and generally get only 3500-4500 seats filled. PSU even less. I think it would be much more difficult in WGS to monitor over consumption. There are some long steep stairs for drunks to fall down lol. some poor innocent 80 yoa lady at the bottom gets mowed down you can bet U of M's risk management would be sweating bullets.

 

[Silvertip]

Picked up some notable fund raising numbers this week out of MSU which just completed an eight year funding campaign...(maybe somebody'll produce comparable numbers for UM during the same period)
Their "What It Takes" campaign raised a total of $ 413 million dollars including $15,046,206 million for athletics - 502% of their goal. As a footnote their enrollment increased from 13,559 to 16,902 for Fall 2018 during that period.

For those who may or may not remember, dethroned UM President Royce Engstrom had a one year head start on MSU's new president, Waded Cruzado who was hired away from New Mexico State in October 2009. In the nearly six years Engstrom ran UM enrollment fell from 15,642 (MSU had 13,599 then) to 12,412 when he was terminated in December 2016. Enrollment remains in free fall (though some campus wags say retention is up) standing at more than 30 % since the early days of the Engstrom era.

Why bring up the uncomfortable facts?.. Because some folks may need a reminder that restoring health to UM's various departments - including athletics - will be a long and arduous job. Here's hoping current president Bodnar doesn't burnout before the job is done.

 

[Spanky2]

I think parasite Engstrom is still on the UM payroll.

 

[Silvertip]

I think parasite Engstrom is still on the UM payroll.

Unfortunately the last I heard he was still hanging on as a tenured chemistry prof...who the hell would willingly take him?

 

[dbackjon]

Build that wall! The Northern Wall. Perhaps a ready made moat to be filled with all the Saskatchewan Sarcasm dripping from the great white north. :lol: :thumb:

But it would just freeze over in the winter.

 

[Sam A. Blitz]

You're naïve to think that UM hasn't considered alcohol sales at sporting events. The liability risk outweighs any profits that could be generated from that. Assume you net $2 profit per beer sold and 25,000 attendants each buy 2 beers over 6 home games, you've only generated $300k in additional net income per year (this being generous). Consider the liability you assume by selling/serving alcohol and being at risk of a multi million dollar law suit. Doesn't seem worth it.

Hmmm. (25,000)(2)($2)(6) = $600,000. The liability, of course, would be covered by an insurance policy, cost unknown. But can't be that different from the Pubs. Most plans consider this with a one-way gate at halftime, which would likely result in more food concessions as well. But more bathrooms needed... Other BSC venues like PSU and UNC seem to have it managed when their income is but a fraction of what we could expect.

I guess the only thing naive is my confidence in my math...

Would be interesting to know what an insurance policy for stadium booze on a college campus looks like... If an underage kid is overserved by alcohol purchased from a University beer vendor and falls and seriously hurts themselves, does a policy cover that? I'm just guessing the economic opportunity doesn't outweigh the liability.

Actually the naive goes far beyond your math. Your "guessing" and your assumptions are just as far off.

K.... which assumptions are off? Enlighten us

 

[kemajic]

Hmmm. (25,000)(2)($2)(6) = $600,000. The liability, of course, would be covered by an insurance policy, cost unknown. But can't be that different from the Pubs. Most plans consider this with a one-way gate at halftime, which would likely result in more food concessions as well. But more bathrooms needed... Other BSC venues like PSU and UNC seem to have it managed when their income is but a fraction of what we could expect.

I guess the only thing naive is my confidence in my math...

Would be interesting to know what an insurance policy for stadium booze on a college campus looks like... If an underage kid is overserved by alcohol purchased from a University beer vendor and falls and seriously hurts themselves, does a policy cover that? I'm just guessing the economic opportunity doesn't outweigh the liability.

Actually the naive goes far beyond your math. Your "guessing" and your assumptions are just as far off.

K.... which assumptions are off? Enlighten us

Assumptions that the liability exceeds the revenue, that the University cannot protect itself from liability, assumptions that other universities have been unable to deal with this. Then there is the arithmetic errored (of course) in the direction of your narrative. Quite an impressive package.

 

[goatcreekgriz]

Most colleges don't serve alcohol outside of private boxes. Maybe there are other factors...

Actually many do, including PSU in UNC in our own conference. At UNC, there is no beer garden, just a separate concession booth for beer and they do check IDs effectively. Then you are free to take your beer back to your seat like any other concession.

UNC has a stadium capacity of what 8500 and generally get only 3500-4500 seats filled. PSU even less. I think it would be much more difficult in WGS to monitor over consumption. There are some long steep stairs for drunks to fall down lol. some poor innocent 80 yoa lady at the bottom gets mowed down you can bet U of M's risk management would be sweating bullets.

Major concerts at UM, including in the stadium, have had alcohol sales for the last several years. The sky has not fallen. Prices are high, profit margin is handsome, easy to control with IDs/wrist bands/security. For those who like to piss and moan about tailgating impact on attendance at beginning of Third Quarter, it’s a two birds/one stone thing. Think MAGGGA - Make All Griz Games Great Again. Would be easy.

 

[PlayerRep]

Hmmm. (25,000)(2)($2)(6) = $600,000. The liability, of course, would be covered by an insurance policy, cost unknown. But can't be that different from the Pubs. Most plans consider this with a one-way gate at halftime, which would likely result in more food concessions as well. But more bathrooms needed... Other BSC venues like PSU and UNC seem to have it managed when their income is but a fraction of what we could expect.

I guess the only thing naive is my confidence in my math...

Would be interesting to know what an insurance policy for stadium booze on a college campus looks like... If an underage kid is overserved by alcohol purchased from a University beer vendor and falls and seriously hurts themselves, does a policy cover that? I'm just guessing the economic opportunity doesn't outweigh the liability.

Yes, a policy would cover that. However, the chance of UM over-serving and underage kid, is close to zero. UM checks id's way better than bars. They "over-check".

Can you point to one example in MT where anyone has won a claim against a bar or university for over-serving them, and then they fell down? People who get "over served" don't bring claims. People hit by them in cars occasionally bring claims, if they can show the bar or server over-served an obviously drunk person.

Anyway, that is what insurance is for.

My god, how do some of you even get through a day of life.

Thanks for answering the question. I get through daily life just fine.

https://www.alcohol.org/laws/over-serving/

There is liability for over serving and have been cases where people have sued for damages to an establishment that over served. I don't know if any claims have been successful. I'm not a lawyer and don't know how those cases work in Montana or anywhere else. Maybe a competent lawyer could enlighten us?

I don't think it's an easy task to regulate alcohol consumption in general seating of a large stadium. Checking ID's at the beer gardens hasn't stopped underaged drinking at concerts or other events I've been to. Doubt it would at a football stadium. Just my opinion.

However, if over serving or contributing to over intoxication is an insurable peril and it does in fact mitigate that risk, what are the reasons for not selling beer if it would net strong additional earnings? Most colleges don't serve alcohol outside of private boxes. Maybe there are other factors...

Professional sports alcohol sales seem to be fine.

Univ of Colo and Air Force sell alcohol.

How does the GSA do it at the football tailgate?

How do bars in the U.S do it?

 

[kemajic]

Most colleges don't serve alcohol outside of private boxes. Maybe there are other factors...

Actually many do, including PSU in UNC in our own conference. At UNC, there is no beer garden, just a separate concession booth for beer and they do check IDs effectively. Then you are free to take your beer back to your seat like any other concession.

UNC has a stadium capacity of what 8500 and generally get only 3500-4500 seats filled. PSU even less. I think it would be much more difficult in WGS to monitor over consumption. There are some long steep stairs for drunks to fall down lol. some poor innocent 80 yoa lady at the bottom gets mowed down you can bet U of M's risk management would be sweating bullets.

So you're implying that your accident scenario is more likely to happen with a guy who's had a relaxing couple within the stadium vs. the guy who runs up and down the stairs to rush to his tailgate and get back? That logic just jumps right off the page. Well done.

 

[GoldenEagle]

Most colleges don't serve alcohol outside of private boxes. Maybe there are other factors...

Actually many do, including PSU in UNC in our own conference. At UNC, there is no beer garden, just a separate concession booth for beer and they do check IDs effectively. Then you are free to take your beer back to your seat like any other concession.

UNC has a stadium capacity of what 8500 and generally get only 3500-4500 seats filled. PSU even less. I think it would be much more difficult in WGS to monitor over consumption. There are some long steep stairs for drunks to fall down lol. some poor innocent 80 yoa lady at the bottom gets mowed down you can bet U of M's risk management would be sweating bullets.

So you're implying that your accident scenario is more likely to happen with a guy who's had a relaxing couple within the stadium vs. the guy who runs up and down the stairs to rush to his tailgate and get back? That logic just jumps right off the page. Well done.

Both of these scenarios are equally plausible because the UM fan age demographic is ancient.

 

[Spanky2]

Eagle, we have more than your 300 fans!

 

[retiredpopo]

Most colleges don't serve alcohol outside of private boxes. Maybe there are other factors...

Actually many do, including PSU in UNC in our own conference. At UNC, there is no beer garden, just a separate concession booth for beer and they do check IDs effectively. Then you are free to take your beer back to your seat like any other concession.

UNC has a stadium capacity of what 8500 and generally get only 3500-4500 seats filled. PSU even less. I think it would be much more difficult in WGS to monitor over consumption. There are some long steep stairs for drunks to fall down lol. some poor innocent 80 yoa lady at the bottom gets mowed down you can bet U of M's risk management would be sweating bullets.

So you're implying that your accident scenario is more likely to happen with a guy who's had a relaxing couple within the stadium vs. the guy who runs up and down the stairs to rush to his tailgate and get back? That logic just jumps right off the page. Well done.

I am not implying that at all. both are likely to cause risk management to worry.