2023-24 Expectations

[SoldierGriz]

How many people know that the Griz were in the top 10 in total wins in the last decade, ending in 2010? For FCS teams. Some egriz posters seem to think the Griz were in the bottom 10 during that decade.

For the love of all things maroon...the FCS has a bracketed playoff. The ONLY meaningful measurement of excellence is championships.

I'd be happy if the Griz could get to a semi-final game to at least sniff a championship.

 

[HelenaHandBasket]

This was a serious question directed to you. I look forward to your reply.

Answer your own question. I'm sure you have an opinion on the matter.

Typical soldier.

 

[mthoopsfan]

How many people know that the Griz were in the top 10 in total wins in the last decade, ending in 2010? For FCS teams. Some egriz posters seem to think the Griz were in the bottom 10 during that decade.

For the love of all things maroon...the FCS has a bracketed playoff. The ONLY meaningful measurement of excellence is championships.

I'd be happy if the Griz could get to a semi-final game to at least sniff a championship.

What are you talking about. The original topic was whether FCS is watered down.

There is much more to measuring excellence than championships.

I can see that you've been in an area, the military, where things are rigid and there's a chain of command. Not based nearly as much on competition and excellence as some parts of the real world or sports. Are you a desk clerk or a shooter? I assume a desk clerk.

 

[mthoopsfan]

Answer your own question. I'm sure you have an opinion on the matter.

Typical soldier.

He likes to state his opinion and make assertions. Almost never can back up what he says. Just goes to his emoji's. Thinks everyone should agree with him and not challenge his views. Doesn't realize that he's a private on egriz.

 

[SoldierGriz]

Typical soldier.

He likes to state his opinion and make assertions. Almost never can back up what he says. Just goes to his emoji's. Thinks everyone should agree with him and not challenge his views. Doesn't realize that he's a private on egriz.

It would be nice to actually be challenged on here. You certainly don't do it.

 

[SoldierGriz]

Answer your own question. I'm sure you have an opinion on the matter.

Typical soldier.

Typical handbasket.

 

[SoldierGriz]

For the love of all things maroon...the FCS has a bracketed playoff. The ONLY meaningful measurement of excellence is championships.

I'd be happy if the Griz could get to a semi-final game to at least sniff a championship.

What are you talking about. The original topic was whether FCS is watered down.

There is much more to measuring excellence than championships.

I can see that you've been in an area, the military, where things are rigid and there's a chain of command. Not based nearly as much on competition and excellence as some parts of the real world or sports. Are you a desk clerk or a shooter? I assume a desk clerk.

:lol:

 

[Mousegriz]

Beat the neighbors and quarterfinals ceiling are leading this poll thus far...

How can we expect more in the super tough BSC absent Boise and Nevada. And with those 3 super tough fcs programs like NDSU and SDSU (was that 3?) even harder to expect to make final four. Winning records, playoff wins in the round of 24 and 3rd or 4th in this tough BSc is really good! And if the fumbecsix qb didn't get hurt maybe a final 4 someday.

 

[AZGrizFan]

For the love of all things maroon...the FCS has a bracketed playoff. The ONLY meaningful measurement of excellence is championships.

I'd be happy if the Griz could get to a semi-final game to at least sniff a championship.

What are you talking about. The original topic was whether FCS is watered down.

There is much more to measuring excellence than championships.

I can see that you've been in an area, the military, where things are rigid and there's a chain of command. Not based nearly as much on competition and excellence as some parts of the real world or sports. Are you a desk clerk or a shooter? I assume a desk clerk.

:lol: :lol: And I can see by this comment you know very little about the military, despite your protestations to the contrary.

 

[horribilisfan8184]

I literally could not have put it better. I'm on the same page as you with your reasons for FCS not being watered down. Great explanation.

Of course a cat fan wants to preserve the myth that the FCS is not watered down because it would dilute their recent successes. Shocking.

If I remember the watered down Griz beat a ranked PAC 12 team on the road a year and a half ago.

 

[SoldierGriz]

Of course a cat fan wants to preserve the myth that the FCS is not watered down because it would dilute their recent successes. Shocking.

If I remember the watered down Griz beat a ranked PAC 12 team on the road a year and a half ago.

What does this have to do with a watered down FCS...it has been happening forever.

Teams that have departed:

Marshall, Western Kentucky, Georgia State, Appy State, JMU, Sam Houston, Georgia Southern, Coastal Carolina, Liberty, Jacksonville State...among others.

If you don't believe the FCS is watered down relative to the past, I don't think you're paying attention.

 

[horribilisfan8184]

If I remember the watered down Griz beat a ranked PAC 12 team on the road a year and a half ago.

What does this have to do with a watered down FCS...it has been happening forever.

Teams that have departed:

Marshall, Western Kentucky, Georgia State, Appy State, JMU, Sam Houston, Georgia Southern, Coastal Carolina, Liberty, Jacksonville State...among others.

If you don't believe the FCS is watered down relative to the past, I don't think you're paying attention.

If you think the FCS is watered down I don't think you are using the correct adjective.

Here's the tally and the upsets continue as FBS teams pull back from playing FCS teams.

https://www.ncaa.com/news/football/article/fcs-wins-vs-fbs-teams-all-time-victories-upsets

This would suggest it is the FBS that is getting "watered down" from FCS teams transferring in.

 

[mthoopsfan]

What does this have to do with a watered down FCS...it has been happening forever.

Teams that have departed:

Marshall, Western Kentucky, Georgia State, Appy State, JMU, Sam Houston, Georgia Southern, Coastal Carolina, Liberty, Jacksonville State...among others.

If you don't believe the FCS is watered down relative to the past, I don't think you're paying attention.

If you think the FCS is watered down I don't think you are using the correct adjective.

Here's the tally and the upsets continue as FBS teams pull back from playing FCS teams.

https://www.ncaa.com/news/football/article/fcs-wins-vs-fbs-teams-all-time-victories-upsets

This would suggest it is the FBS that is getting "watered down" from FCS teams transferring in.

NDSU is better than any of those teams. SDS, this year, was as good as the best of those teams.

Marshall, which won 2 championships, left in 1997, so has been gone over 25 years.

App St and Georgia So were very good, and losses, but App St was only good for a relatively short number of years. JMU and SH were good, but only in certain periods. SH's only championship was the covid year. These 2 teams just left. Coastal and Liberty came to FCS and made FCS better. They never won a championship. Jacksonville St. just left; they won 1 championship; and made 1 other final. West Ken won 1 championship 20 years ago.

The MW is strong every year. No. Iowa for a long time. Ill St. The CAA is still around and often strong. DE, which won 4 championships, Richmond, Villanova, Towson. EWU, Sac, Weber all came on in the recent decade or two. Idaho is back, and who knows. Montana and Mont. St. MSU is stronger than ever. Teams like Incarnate Word. Jackson St. The Patriot league produces several top 20 teams in most years. Colgate made the finals about 20 years ago. The Ivies produce top 20 teams in most years. Furman and McNeese have dropped back in recent decades.

I think the overall FCS may be stronger now than it was in the past. It is certainly not "watered down".

As others have said, look at the number of wins over FBS teams.

 

[SoldierGriz]

If you think the FCS is watered down I don't think you are using the correct adjective.

Here's the tally and the upsets continue as FBS teams pull back from playing FCS teams.

https://www.ncaa.com/news/football/article/fcs-wins-vs-fbs-teams-all-time-victories-upsets

This would suggest it is the FBS that is getting "watered down" from FCS teams transferring in.

NDSU is better than any of those teams. SDS, this year, was as good as the best of those teams.

Marshall, which won 2 championships, left in 1997, so has been gone over 25 years.

App St and Georgia So were very good, and losses, but App St was only good for a relatively short number of years. JMU and SH were good, but only in certain periods. SH's only championship was the covid year. These 2 teams just left. Coastal and Liberty came to FCS and made FCS better. They never won a championship. Jacksonville St. just left; they won 1 championship; and made 1 other final. West Ken won 1 championship 20 years ago.

The MW is strong every year. No. Iowa for a long time. Ill St. The CAA is still around and often strong. DE, which won 4 championships, Richmond, Villanova, Towson. EWU, Sac, Weber all came on in the recent decade or two. Idaho is back, and who knows. Montana and Mont. St. MSU is stronger than ever. Teams like Incarnate Word. Jackson St. The Patriot league produces several top 20 teams in most years. Colgate made the finals about 20 years ago. The Ivies produce top 20 teams in most years. Furman and McNeese have dropped back in recent decades.

I think the overall FCS may be stronger now than it was in the past. It is certainly not "watered down".

As others have said, look at the number of wins over FBS teams.

Hot garbage.

 

[mthoopsfan]

NDSU is better than any of those teams. SDS, this year, was as good as the best of those teams.

Marshall, which won 2 championships, left in 1997, so has been gone over 25 years.

App St and Georgia So were very good, and losses, but App St was only good for a relatively short number of years. JMU and SH were good, but only in certain periods. SH's only championship was the covid year. These 2 teams just left. Coastal and Liberty came to FCS and made FCS better. They never won a championship. Jacksonville St. just left; they won 1 championship; and made 1 other final. West Ken won 1 championship 20 years ago.

The MW is strong every year. No. Iowa for a long time. Ill St. The CAA is still around and often strong. DE, which won 4 championships, Richmond, Villanova, Towson. EWU, Sac, Weber all came on in the recent decade or two. Idaho is back, and who knows. Montana and Mont. St. MSU is stronger than ever. Teams like Incarnate Word. Jackson St. The Patriot league produces several top 20 teams in most years. Colgate made the finals about 20 years ago. The Ivies produce top 20 teams in most years. Furman and McNeese have dropped back in recent decades.

I think the overall FCS may be stronger now than it was in the past. It is certainly not "watered down".

As others have said, look at the number of wins over FBS teams.

Hot garbage.

Just admit that you are wrong.

 

[SoldierGriz]

Hot garbage.

Just admit that you are wrong.

I'm not wrong. The FCS was stronger with Marshall, Appy, SHSU, Georgia Southern, JMU.

These departures coupled with expanded playoffs = weaker league.

Facts. Swallow them whole Playa.

 

[mthoopsfan]

Just admit that you are wrong.

I'm not wrong. The FCS was stronger with Marshall, Appy, SHSU, Georgia Southern, JMU.

These departures coupled with expanded playoffs = weaker league.

Facts. Swallow them whole Playa.

The FCS was weaker when it didn't have NDSU, SDS, other MW teams, EWU, Weber, SS, MSU, Davis, Incarnate Word, and other teams like Coastal and Liberty who came and went. The Colonial is still fairly strong. Teams like Jackson St. Again, Marshal won 2 championships and had been gone over 25 years. App St won 3 only championships.

 

[SoldierGriz]

I'm not wrong. The FCS was stronger with Marshall, Appy, SHSU, Georgia Southern, JMU.

These departures coupled with expanded playoffs = weaker league.

Facts. Swallow them whole Playa.

The FCS was weaker when it didn't have NDSU, SDS, other MW teams, EWU, Weber, SS, MSU, Davis, Incarnate Word, and other teams like Coastal and Liberty who came and went. The Colonial is still fairly strong. Teams like Jackson St. Again, Marshal won 2 championships and had been gone over 25 years. App St won 3 only championships.

"Only 3 championships..." :lol:

 

[CDAGRIZ]

Just admit that you are wrong.

I'm not wrong. The FCS was stronger with Marshall, Appy, SHSU, Georgia Southern, JMU.

These departures coupled with expanded playoffs = weaker league.

Facts. Swallow them whole Playa.

Counterpoint: I look at it differently. I truly believe there are many more great HS FB players than there were 25+ years ago. The youth coaching has improved and the focus on FB only has increased in that timeframe. Camps, 7on7 tournaments, summer workouts, etc. The larger/better talent pool has allowed for more good programs to emerge in both FBS and FCS. I'm not saying the best aren't still the best; I'm saying the worst are better relative to the best than they were. Perhaps this is why the playoffs were expanded in the FCS and created in the FBS. Maybe this is what allowed the former DI-AA/FCS schools to move up recently and not be an Idaho.

Put another way, the relative "talent" that would have filled out DI (now FBS) rosters in 1995 might now have to play FCS or lower. There are just more good players now, and thus, more good teams. A Trey Lance type guy probably wouldn't have landed at an FCS program in 1995.

Last point: In the 1995 playoffs, we beat playoff teams 48-0, 45-0, and then 70-14 on our way to the final. We don't see that as much today because, I believe, the competition wasn't what it is now.

 

[SoldierGriz]

I'm not wrong. The FCS was stronger with Marshall, Appy, SHSU, Georgia Southern, JMU.

These departures coupled with expanded playoffs = weaker league.

Facts. Swallow them whole Playa.

Counterpoint: I look at it differently. I truly believe there are many more great HS FB players than there were 25+ years ago. The youth coaching has improved and the focus on FB only has increased in that timeframe. Camps, 7on7 tournaments, summer workouts, etc. The larger/better talent pool has allowed for more good programs to emerge in both FBS and FCS. I'm not saying the best aren't still the best; I'm saying the worst are better relative to the best than they were. Perhaps this is why the playoffs were expanded in the FCS and created in the FBS. Maybe this is what allowed the former DI-AA/FCS schools to move up recently and not be an Idaho.

Put another way, the relative "talent" that would have filled out DI (now FBS) rosters in 1995 might now have to play FCS or lower. There are just more good players now, and thus, more good teams. A Trey Lance type guy probably wouldn't have landed at an FCS program in 1995.

Last point: In the 1995 playoffs, we beat playoff teams 48-0, 45-0, and then 70-14 on our way to the final. We don't see that as much today because, I believe, the competition wasn't what it is now.

That was the most dominant team in Griz history...which also might have something to do with it.

Skill improvement is not unique to the FCS either. There are a bunch of good teams no longer in the league that gave the Griz fits over the years.