Zac Crews Update?

[IdaGriz01]

I'm not pure and I have seen a lot of shit absolved under the banner of boys being boys to know that it is an absolutely incredible disservice to all parties involved. Watched in communities that I have coached in absolve sexual assaults, alcohol and drug abuse, violent conduct, and a crap ton of other things under the guise of age and athletics. Kids should absolutely get second or even third chances, but we have to stop pretending that age is the defense for them not learning real lessons and consequences.

I agree with about 95% of what you have written in your last two posts. I am a retired teacher and coach. And I have also seen things brushed under the table as you say under "the guise of age and athletics." But I have also seen administrations overreact in large part because of outside pressure. I think what he did was very serious and deserved losing his scholarship. The public scorning has been pretty brutal. But to deny even the opportunity to walk on is extreme in my opinion. I understand that we are in different times than 20, 30 and 40 years ago but completely shutting off his opportunity for redemption seems counter productive. I know as a high school teacher most of what stupid things high school students say is out of ignorance. How can the kid redeem himself? Does he carry this with him forever?

If present media/political behavior is any indication ... yes, it will haunt him forever. It's now common in social "discourse" to go back 20 or 30 (or more) years to dig up dirt on someone you want to vilify ... as though people cannot possibly "grow up," learn, and change as they live their lives. We talk a lot about "second chances," but there are many, many people, on every side of the political spectrum, who refuse to forget or forgive. It's sad, but if he is ever again "in the public eye" – as coach, commentator, or political figure – someone will throw this in his face. He may be forgiven in that hypothetical future, but he will have to deal with it all over again.

 

[Grizfan-24]

I'm not pure and I have seen a lot of shit absolved under the banner of boys being boys to know that it is an absolutely incredible disservice to all parties involved. Watched in communities that I have coached in absolve sexual assaults, alcohol and drug abuse, violent conduct, and a crap ton of other things under the guise of age and athletics. Kids should absolutely get second or even third chances, but we have to stop pretending that age is the defense for them not learning real lessons and consequences.

I agree with about 95% of what you have written in your last two posts. I am a retired teacher and coach. And I have also seen things brushed under the table as you say under "the guise of age and athletics." But I have also seen administrations overreact in large part because of outside pressure. I think what he did was very serious and deserved losing his scholarship. The public scorning has been pretty brutal. But to deny even the opportunity to walk on is extreme in my opinion. I understand that we are in different times than 20, 30 and 40 years ago but completely shutting off his opportunity for redemption seems counter productive. I know as a high school teacher most of what stupid things high school students say is out of ignorance. How can the kid redeem himself? Does he carry this with him forever?

I don't disagree. I do question the punishment and I think the program and athletic department was forced to overreact. This is isn't the first time they have waited for the court of public opinion to act, and Zac was made to suffer a bit more than he might have normally had they simply acted decisively.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

There’s never been a more correct post. Right on the nose, EG. Things like this:

“He’s put it all behind him. It’s a nothing burger at this point. I’m excited to see what he will add to the most stacked lineup ever in the history of football.”

-BobcatNation

The equivalent of playing the story in your head in the shower of you standing up to your bully. Just making shit up that’s not happening just to make yourself feel better. Fairy land we live in

"Great get for Brent and staff. I'm glad he chose our program over all others."

 

[astutegriz]

I'm not pure and I have seen a lot of shit absolved under the banner of boys being boys to know that it is an absolutely incredible disservice to all parties involved. Watched in communities that I have coached in absolve sexual assaults, alcohol and drug abuse, violent conduct, and a crap ton of other things under the guise of age and athletics. Kids should absolutely get second or even third chances, but we have to stop pretending that age is the defense for them not learning real lessons and consequences.

I understand and I have a lot of respect for you as a poster. Yes, consequences are necessary and sweeping things under the rug is bad. Prime examples are a high school basketball team this year in the state and an incident at a college in the state - both left unchecked. But equating wanting to sound outrageous and gangster to that of rape, violence, and drugs is a bit steep.

Second with kids - consequences yes! - but we should be looking for reformation with their consequences (unless you're a serial rapist where reformation is near impossible). Public humiliation is a STRONG consequence, something I'd venture none of us have ever had for what we have done.

 

[maroonandsilver]

I'm not pure and I have seen a lot of shit absolved under the banner of boys being boys to know that it is an absolutely incredible disservice to all parties involved. Watched in communities that I have coached in absolve sexual assaults, alcohol and drug abuse, violent conduct, and a crap ton of other things under the guise of age and athletics. Kids should absolutely get second or even third chances, but we have to stop pretending that age is the defense for them not learning real lessons and consequences.

I understand and I have a lot of respect for you as a poster. Yes, consequences are necessary and sweeping things under the rug is bad. Prime examples are a high school basketball team this year in the state and an incident at a college in the state - both left unchecked. But equating wanting to sound outrageous and gangster to that of rape, violence, and drugs is a bit steep.

Second with kids - consequences yes! - but we should be looking for reformation with their consequences (unless you're a serial rapist where reformation is near impossible). Public humiliation is a STRONG consequence, something I'd venture none of us have ever had for what we have done.

I just don't see how UM can afford to bring Zac into the football locker room. The risk of blowing up the locker room, and losing future recruits is not worth the gamble, and especially knowing that the Kaimin is poised and ready to make this a big issue.

 

[astutegriz]

I understand and I have a lot of respect for you as a poster. Yes, consequences are necessary and sweeping things under the rug is bad. Prime examples are a high school basketball team this year in the state and an incident at a college in the state - both left unchecked. But equating wanting to sound outrageous and gangster to that of rape, violence, and drugs is a bit steep.

Second with kids - consequences yes! - but we should be looking for reformation with their consequences (unless you're a serial rapist where reformation is near impossible). Public humiliation is a STRONG consequence, something I'd venture none of us have ever had for what we have done.

I just don't see how UM can afford to bring Zac into the football locker room. The risk of blowing up the locker room, and losing future recruits is not worth the gamble, and especially knowing that the Kaimin is poised and ready to make this a big issue.

I don’t disagree. I just think it should have been handled up front.

 

[Spanky2]

Unfortunate situation. UM wanted to quietly place him on the team and let the controversy die when he proved to be a good teammate not reflective of this comment. The Kaiman called this out. This forced UM to meet and they decided to pull the verbal scholarship promise last week rather than face blowback - consequences for Zac for an insensitive and tone-deaf Venmo comment born from wanting to sound outrageous and gangster to a friend at age 16. I heard Zac wanted this addressed in December as he had other offers and strong interest even after the Venmo was public. These opportunities have dried up given his continued commitment to UM. I understand the decision of UM to cover its ass, but not the timing.

A better approach would be for a team to be honest and address this head on. The background, the counseling, a mentor on the team, why he's a good kid who made a bad judgement, etc. I believe Zac is indeed a good kid, which is why this is the right narrative. The team who does this will get a good kid and teammate, a 4.0 student, a good representative of the university, a potential NFL talent, a tenacious competitor whom opponents hate (he's a trash talker, for good or for bad), and a redemption story when the whole team stands by him in the end.

I get he wasn't a fit for UM given UM doesn't have the presidential leadership or public relations ability to handle media scrutiny like this head on, as evidenced by the past decade or more. But there are plenty of colleges that do (I can see MSU handling this just fine). Who wants to get off their high horse, look at the situation in depth rather than the optics, and give the kid a second chance?

Rather than MSU or any Montana school, a change in environment might be best for him. One of the schools in the region……Washington, Idaho.

 

[MissoulaMarinerFan]

I agree with about 95% of what you have written in your last two posts. I am a retired teacher and coach. And I have also seen things brushed under the table as you say under "the guise of age and athletics." But I have also seen administrations overreact in large part because of outside pressure. I think what he did was very serious and deserved losing his scholarship. The public scorning has been pretty brutal. But to deny even the opportunity to walk on is extreme in my opinion. I understand that we are in different times than 20, 30 and 40 years ago but completely shutting off his opportunity for redemption seems counter productive. I know as a high school teacher most of what stupid things high school students say is out of ignorance. How can the kid redeem himself? Does he carry this with him forever?

I don't disagree. I do question the punishment and I think the program and athletic department was forced to overreact. This is isn't the first time they have waited for the court of public opinion to act, and Zac was made to suffer a bit more than he might have normally had they simply acted decisively.

How can the athletic department say or do anything when:
1. He's not a student at the university
2. Because of number 1, isn't on the team?
I'm curious what (if anything) the university could have done, especially when the coach(es) can't even comment about a recruit before they've signed or enrolled? FYI, I don't have a dog in the fight - I'm just asking questions. #gottagetthethreadto17pages

 

[uofmman1122]

I don't disagree. I do question the punishment and I think the program and athletic department was forced to overreact. This is isn't the first time they have waited for the court of public opinion to act, and Zac was made to suffer a bit more than he might have normally had they simply acted decisively.

How can the athletic department say or do anything when:
1. He's not a student at the university
2. Because of number 1, isn't on the team?
I'm curious what (if anything) the university could have done, especially when the coach(es) can't even comment about a recruit before they've signed or enrolled? FYI, I don't have a dog in the fight - I'm just asking questions. #gottagetthethreadto17pages

They can't, you're right, so not sure what constitutes "getting out in front of this".

 

[zengriz]

especially knowing that the Kaimin is poised and ready to make this a big issue.

...the kaimin can't make this a big issue...
...this is already a flipping big issue...
...the current events in buffalo...
...no winner..everybody loses...

... :shock: ...

 

[CatZag]

The equivalent of playing the story in your head in the shower of you standing up to your bully. Just making shit up that’s not happening just to make yourself feel better. Fairy land we live in

"Great get for Brent and staff. I'm glad he chose our program over all others."

Source: CDA’s daydream to which their pants were forced to be changed because of how totally hard they owned the bobcats before they woke up.

 

[mthoopsfan]

I understand and I have a lot of respect for you as a poster. Yes, consequences are necessary and sweeping things under the rug is bad. Prime examples are a high school basketball team this year in the state and an incident at a college in the state - both left unchecked. But equating wanting to sound outrageous and gangster to that of rape, violence, and drugs is a bit steep.

Second with kids - consequences yes! - but we should be looking for reformation with their consequences (unless you're a serial rapist where reformation is near impossible). Public humiliation is a STRONG consequence, something I'd venture none of us have ever had for what we have done.

I just don't see how UM can afford to bring Zac into the football locker room. The risk of blowing up the locker room, and losing future recruits is not worth the gamble, and especially knowing that the Kaimin is poised and ready to make this a big issue.

I don’t see how it would blow up the locker room or impact recruits. Did you play college sports or have any kids who played college sports?

Some of the comments in this thread are just plain stupid.

If he didn’t don’t more than what was in the one Venmo, he should be able to play, either with or without a scholarship the first year.

Jimmy Wilson killed a guy and served 2 years in jail, before he was acquitted. He was allowed to play, with a scholarship. Poole had a drug arrest and was allowed to come back to play. Both should have been allowed to play.

Is one Venmo post worse than the many other things that kids do?

If the guy has done more than the one bad Venmo, or is a bad apple, my view changes.

Not many on this board know more about racism than I do, or have been the subject of it as I have. This venmo was just plain not a big racist thing, based on what I can see. It just wasn’t.

As I said before, I find it odd and offensive when people who haven’t experienced racism, who aren’t POC, or aren’t big academic experts in it, try to tell POC what racism is and how we should react.

There must be more than meets the eye, If he is being sent away.

 

[EverettGriz]

Great post 24.

MMF is correct; UM or any of its staff cannot comment at all on this.

PR, how do you know it’s not the POC on the team who are in fact saying that this IS a big deal, that they wouldn’t welcome Zach as a member of their locker room? I certainly don’t know either way. But that’s certainly possible, and if it so, Hauck has the responsibility to do what’s best for the program. Zach isn’t owed anything.

 

[fanofzoo]

Send the kid on a mission, comes back after two years, probably all forgotten.

Serving the lord and help with his planet (or star).

 

[SoldierGriz]

I just don't see how UM can afford to bring Zac into the football locker room. The risk of blowing up the locker room, and losing future recruits is not worth the gamble, and especially knowing that the Kaimin is poised and ready to make this a big issue.

I don’t see how it would blow up the locker room or impact recruits. Did you play college sports or have any kids who played college sports?

Some of the comments in this thread are just plain stupid.

If he didn’t don’t more than what was in the one Venmo, he should be able to play, either with or without a scholarship the first year.

Jimmy Wilson killed a guy and served 2 years in jail, before he was acquitted. He was allowed to play, with a scholarship. Poole had a drug arrest and was allowed to come back to play. Both should have been allowed to play.

Is one Venmo post worse than the many other things that kids do?

If the guy has done more than the one bad Venmo, or is a bad apple, my view changes.

Not many on this board know more about racism than I do, or have been the subject of it as I have. This venmo was just plain not a big racist thing, based on what I can see. It just wasn’t.

As I said before, I find it odd and offensive when people who haven’t experienced racism, who aren’t POC, or aren’t big academic experts in it, try to tell POC what racism is and how we should react.

There must be more than meets the eye, If he is being sent away.

I agree...let the kid walk on. If the team doesn't accept him it will be a short stay for him. He has already learned this lesson...

But, it is reprehensible to think a non POC can see and understand racism. You are not elite in the field of racism. Anyone with common sense can see and understand it. Even a white dude born and raised in 406.

 

[EverettGriz]

Agree SG. Non people of color can see and recognize racism much in the same way men can see misogyny. In fact, I’d argue we have a responsibility to see it and call it out.

 

[alabamagrizzly]

I just don't see how UM can afford to bring Zac into the football locker room. The risk of blowing up the locker room, and losing future recruits is not worth the gamble, and especially knowing that the Kaimin is poised and ready to make this a big issue.

I don’t see how it would blow up the locker room or impact recruits. Did you play college sports or have any kids who played college sports?

Some of the comments in this thread are just plain stupid.

If he didn’t don’t more than what was in the one Venmo, he should be able to play, either with or without a scholarship the first year.

Jimmy Wilson killed a guy and served 2 years in jail, before he was acquitted. He was allowed to play, with a scholarship. Poole had a drug arrest and was allowed to come back to play. Both should have been allowed to play.

Is one Venmo post worse than the many other things that kids do?

If the guy has done more than the one bad Venmo, or is a bad apple, my view changes.

Not many on this board know more about racism than I do, or have been the subject of it as I have. This venmo was just plain not a big racist thing, based on what I can see. It just wasn’t.

As I said before, I find it odd and offensive when people who haven’t experienced racism, who aren’t POC, or aren’t big academic experts in it, try to tell POC what racism is and how we should react.

There must be more than meets the eye, If he is being sent away.

This is an extremely closed minded view point. You do know there is a word in the English language that is the definition of what you’re saying isn’t possible. It’s called empathy. Some of us are extremely good at it and some of you are extremely poor at it.

 

[mthoopsfan]

I don’t see how it would blow up the locker room or impact recruits. Did you play college sports or have any kids who played college sports?

Some of the comments in this thread are just plain stupid.

If he didn’t don’t more than what was in the one Venmo, he should be able to play, either with or without a scholarship the first year.

Jimmy Wilson killed a guy and served 2 years in jail, before he was acquitted. He was allowed to play, with a scholarship. Poole had a drug arrest and was allowed to come back to play. Both should have been allowed to play.

Is one Venmo post worse than the many other things that kids do?

If the guy has done more than the one bad Venmo, or is a bad apple, my view changes.

Not many on this board know more about racism than I do, or have been the subject of it as I have. This venmo was just plain not a big racist thing, based on what I can see. It just wasn’t.

As I said before, I find it odd and offensive when people who haven’t experienced racism, who aren’t POC, or aren’t big academic experts in it, try to tell POC what racism is and how we should react.

There must be more than meets the eye, If he is being sent away.

This is an extremely closed minded view point. You do know there is a word in the English language that is the definition of what you’re saying isn’t possible. It’s called empathy. Some of us are extremely good at it and some of you are extremely poor at it.

Empathy doesn’t involve “telling people what to do and how they should react”.

 

[EverettGriz]

So now I’m confused PR. Are you suggesting that because you’re Native you get to tell us whites what we should view as racist and what we shouldn’t, what language we should find racially offensive and that which we shouldn’t?

 

[mthoopsfan]

Great post 24.

MMF is correct; UM or any of its staff cannot comment at all on this.

PR, how do you know it’s not the POC on the team who are in fact saying that this IS a big deal, that they wouldn’t welcome Zach as a member of their locker room? I certainly don’t know either way. But that’s certainly possible, and if it so, Hauck has the responsibility to do what’s best for the program. Zach isn’t owed anything.

How do you know it is that?

I am commenting on what we all know occurred, from what has been posted here and in article(s). As I have said, if there is more, or more to the story, then the “more” might change my view.

It makes no sense to me that some black or other players would look at this one Venmo post, and tell the coaches they don’t want the guy. The guy who made all the noise hasn’t been on the team since since spring 2019, according to an article I found. As I have said, if he is not on the team, there must be more.

Giving the kid a chance to earn everyone’s respect makes a lot more sense to me. Jeez, this is football, not sensitivity training or woke training.

Also, I am not trying to tell the coaches or UM what to do. They know way more of the facts than we do, and it is their decision. My comments are directed at certain posts.

Has it been verified that he’s not being allowed on the team?