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Williams: UM has recruited 'thugs' for football team

As an avid sports fan, a Grizzly Alum, and a full blooded Montana; what bothers me is his generalization that the University has purposely recruited thugs and gone out of it's way to put our friends, families, children, and neighbors in harms way. I would like to see some form of reprimand for his statements considering the fact that he is a Board of Regent member. My children and I have had dozens of positive experiences with players and coaches alike and Mr. Williams comments are far to general in nature. Disgraceful and disrespectful to the players and coaches alike that have gone out of their way on game day to spend time with the younger generation. True accusations or not, Pat has generalized that the program is placing our communities in harm's way.
 
does it ever occur to ANYONE here that they have no fricking clue what goes on with our programs?! the amount of jibberish that gets spewed all over this board and bobcatnation...you'd think a couple of you just follow around ash and delaney making notes of their every move...

free advice. if you don't know what the fuck you are talking about, don't make assumptions, make up stories, offer predictions, or bash other people. just sit back. relax. and keep your uninformed opinions to yourself.

and this isn't for anyone in particular. just comical how many of you pretend you have any idea what goes on with our programs. :lol:
 
poorgriz said:
Nope. Don't worry about facts getting in the way of your story. Go ahead and look up the number of MSU FB players arrested over the past 5 years, and what the arrests were for... And compare that to the griz. Then compare it to all other NCAA teams. We are in the top 3% for clean programs. You are near the bottom.
Click to expand...
Where do I look that up? Could you point me in the direction of the database that has all the statistics for all team nationwide? That would be interesting. Or do we just go from impressions, news reports or anecdotal examples? Oh, and also I will need all the information on the crimes that were committed bur not prosecuted because:

Allezchat said:
Difference here is Cat players were kicked off the team. Didn't wait for a court date. BN didn't erupt with excuses. Good bye, don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya. Did Tru commit mutiple crimes? The consensus is yes. But he wasn't charged. Doesn't mean it didn't happen. Swept under the rug. I don't pretend that Cat players are perfect. But so many on egriz like to pretend that if there wasn't a conviction, it didn't happen.
Click to expand...
Apparently the Cat's also kicked kids off the team that were just accused (not by the courts, but somewhere in the consensus of public opinion) so we will also need to include all players that were never actually charged with a crime but we all know they happened and they were swept under the rug in your database for all team nationwide.

Or we could accept this:
ilovethecats said:
does it ever occur to ANYONE here that they have no fricking clue what goes on with our programs?! the amount of jibberish that gets spewed all over this board and bobcatnation...you'd think a couple of you just follow around ash and delaney making notes of their every move...

free advice. if you don't know what the f*** you are talking about, don't make assumptions, make up stories, offer predictions, or bash other people. just sit back. relax. and keep your uninformed opinions to yourself.

and this isn't for anyone in particular. just comical how many of you pretend you have any idea what goes on with our programs. :lol:
Click to expand...

Because it is spot on and exactly right. none of us know all the things these kids do and don't do. But I would hope that we could all agree that most 18 - 23 year males that play violent games will make a few mistakes along the way, but there is no reason to believe the color of their uniform will make a difference in their propensity to make mistakes. By the way, Rob Ash heavily recruited Beau Donaldson, so there is at least 1 thug rapist that Ash recruited.
 
JonErude said:
As an avid sports fan, a Grizzly Alum, and a full blooded Montana; what bothers me is his generalization that the University has purposely recruited thugs and gone out of it's way to put our friends, families, children, and neighbors in harms way. I would like to see some form of reprimand for his statements considering the fact that he is a Board of Regent member. My children and I have had dozens of positive experiences with players and coaches alike and Mr. Williams comments are far to general in nature. Disgraceful and disrespectful to the players and coaches alike that have gone out of their way on game day to spend time with the younger generation. True accusations or not, Pat has generalized that the program is placing our communities in harm's way.
Click to expand...


What I stated in my email to the governor and Mr. Williams. Not appropriate given he is still serving the public.
 
Grizbeer said:
poorgriz said:
Nope. Don't worry about facts getting in the way of your story. Go ahead and look up the number of MSU FB players arrested over the past 5 years, and what the arrests were for... And compare that to the griz. Then compare it to all other NCAA teams. We are in the top 3% for clean programs. You are near the bottom.
Click to expand...
Where do I look that up? Could you point me in the direction of the database that has all the statistics for all team nationwide? That would be interesting. Or do we just go from impressions, news reports or anecdotal examples? Oh, and also I will need all the information on the crimes that were committed bur not prosecuted because:

Allezchat said:
Difference here is Cat players were kicked off the team. Didn't wait for a court date. BN didn't erupt with excuses. Good bye, don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya. Did Tru commit mutiple crimes? The consensus is yes. But he wasn't charged. Doesn't mean it didn't happen. Swept under the rug. I don't pretend that Cat players are perfect. But so many on egriz like to pretend that if there wasn't a conviction, it didn't happen.
Click to expand...
Apparently the Cat's also kicked kids off the team that were just accused (not by the courts, but somewhere in the consensus of public opinion) so we will also need to include all players that were never actually charged with a crime but we all know they happened and they were swept under the rug in your database for all team nationwide.

Or we could accept this:
ilovethecats said:
does it ever occur to ANYONE here that they have no fricking clue what goes on with our programs?! the amount of jibberish that gets spewed all over this board and bobcatnation...you'd think a couple of you just follow around ash and delaney making notes of their every move...

free advice. if you don't know what the f*** you are talking about, don't make assumptions, make up stories, offer predictions, or bash other people. just sit back. relax. and keep your uninformed opinions to yourself.

and this isn't for anyone in particular. just comical how many of you pretend you have any idea what goes on with our programs. :lol:
Click to expand...

Because it is spot on and exactly right. none of us know all the things these kids do and don't do. But I would hope that we could all agree that most 18 - 23 year males that play violent games will make a few mistakes along the way, but there is no reason to believe the color of their uniform will make a difference in their propensity to make mistakes. By the way, Rob Ash heavily recruited Beau Donaldson, so there is at least 1 thug rapist that Ash recruited.
Click to expand...


Beau would have never been in a rape situation if he went to MSU..... the girls are too ugly.
 
"By the way, Rob Ash heavily recruited Beau Donaldson, so there is at least 1 thug rapist that Ash recruited."

Word. I wonder if Beau's fate would be the same had he gone to MSU? Would the leadership and culture at MSU have made a difference vs what he encountered at UM? Maybe, maybe not.
 
Bear Spray said:
"By the way, Rob Ash heavily recruited Beau Donaldson, so there is at least 1 thug rapist that Ash recruited."

Word. I wonder if Beau's fate would be the same had he gone to MSU? Would the leadership and culture at MSU have made a difference vs what he encountered at UM? Maybe, maybe not.
Click to expand...

It probably wouldn't have happened at MSU because MSU doesn't have a rape culture.
 
Grizbeer said:
poorgriz said:
Nope. Don't worry about facts getting in the way of your story. Go ahead and look up the number of MSU FB players arrested over the past 5 years, and what the arrests were for... And compare that to the griz. Then compare it to all other NCAA teams. We are in the top 3% for clean programs. You are near the bottom.
Click to expand...
Where do I look that up? Could you point me in the direction of the database that has all the statistics for all team nationwide? That would be interesting. Or do we just go from impressions, news reports or anecdotal examples? Oh, and also I will need all the information on the crimes that were committed bur not prosecuted because:
Click to expand...
UM (49) on team (59) individual incidents (10) not on team yet; or off team
Badger II* Tampering with evidence (2013)
Pate II* Assault/robbery (2013)
Poole Arrested for possession of dangerous drugs (2012)
Kanagata'a Suspended/undisclosed (2012)
Oiland Suspended/undisclosed (2012)
Holt Suspended/undisclosed (2012)
NCAA# Investigation/Rape (2012)
DOE# Investigation/Title IX (2012)
DOJ# Investigation/Improper benefits (2012)
Bruno* DUI arrest (2012)
Liccardi Possession of marijuana paraphenalia (2012)
Johnson Rape arrest (2012)
Roots Assualt (2012)
Maus DUI arrest (2012)
Donaldson Rape conviction (2012)
Unknown Reported for rape; DA didn't file charge (2011)
Unknown Reported for rape; DA didn't file charge (2011)
Unknown Reported for rape; DA didn't file charge (2011)
Unknown Reported for rape; DA didn't file charge (2011)
Unknown Reported for rape to UM (2011)
Unknown Reported for rape to UM (2011)
Kemp II Urinating in public (2011)
Johnson II Misdemeanor assault of police officer; resisting arrest; disorderly conduct (2011)
Kemp Misdemeanor resisting arrest; disorderly conduct (2011)
Middleton DUI arrest (2011)
Montana DUI arrest (2011); reckless driving
Duncan DUI per se (2011)
Badger Disorderly conduct/assault (2010)
Lisowski Disorderly conduct/assualt (2010)
Stuberg II DUI (2010)
Wilson II Assault (2010)
Petek* Cocaine (2010)
Raynock* Cocaine (2010)
Middleton**Marijuana - dismissed from team/Felony (2009)
Frank** Theft (2009)
Stuberg Assault (dropped) (2009)
Johnson Assault (2009)
Swink Assault (2009)
Montelius Assault (2009)
Von Appen Assault (2009)
Douglass Assault (2009)
Kazmiecsak DUI (2009)
Quinn II DUI (dropped) (2009)
Freeman IIIConspiracy to commit robbery, aggravated burglary (2008)
Freeman IIAssault (2008)
Freeman Fled scene of killing w/Wilson (2008)
Quinn DUI per se (2008)
Wilson Fled scene of killing w/Freeman (2008)
Coleman Robbery, kidnapping, assault (2008)
Pate Robbery, kidnapping, assault (2008)
Shelton Robbery, kidnapping, assault (2008)
Stapp DUI (2008)
Joyce DUI (2007)
Parks Assault - Pointed gun at woman's head over a debt (2007)
Freeman**Assualt (2006)
V. Smith Assault - Pointed gun out car window at someone to intimidate (2006)
JR Waller Abetting Smith (2006)
Russum** Pornography w/o consent - Class 5 felony (2005)
Segars Assault (2005)
Walden Trespassing (2005)
Peeples* Cocaine (2005)
Hilliard Partner assault (2004)
*No longer on the team at the time
**Not enrolled at the time

MSU (11) on team (15) players (18) incidents
Tudahl Assault (2012)
Trammell Assault (2012)
Minter Gave driver's license to underage Wilson (2012)
C. ThomasDistribution of marijuana (2011)
Flores* Cocaine (2010)
T. Thomas**Criminal trespass, criminal mischief and resisting arrest (2010).
Daly II DUI (2009)
Daly Shoplifting, resisting arrest (2009)
Gazzerro Assault (2008)
Bignell Trespassing (2007)
Ogden Trespassing (2007)
Davis II Assault (2007)
Fuller Cocaine (2006)
Gatewood*Cocaine (2006)
Williams* Cocaine (2006)
Davis* Marijuana distribution (2006)
Sullivan* Marijuana distribution (2005)
Lebrum* Robbery (2005)

*No longer on the team at the time
**Not enrolled at the time
(Not all issues led to convictions)
 
Nice work getgrizzy - can you point me to the database you pulled this from, or is this just a list that someone on a bb compiled, maybe from media reports and memory?
 
Grizbeer said:
Nice work getgrizzy - can you point me to the database you pulled this from, or is this just a list that someone on a bb compiled, maybe from media reports and memory?
Click to expand...
nothing to it. i just started it back in 2006 and add the names as they come in. they don't come in that fast although sometimes it seems like it.
 
getgrizzy said:
Grizbeer said:
Nice work getgrizzy - can you point me to the database you pulled this from, or is this just a list that someone on a bb compiled, maybe from media reports and memory?
Click to expand...
nothing to it. i just started it back in 2006 and add the names as they come in. they don't come in that fast although sometimes it seems like it.
Click to expand...
Well it is a nice list anyways. I would have thought someone anti-athlete organization would keep a complete database like this, that is what I was hoping someone could point me to. The only downside of course is it only covers the issues you know about, which of course rewards a program for sweeping things under the rug when possible through "internal discipline". But your list looks pretty complete, be nice to sort it in different ways - minor, major, violent offenses for example, or charged/convicted/rumored.
 
Since you are throwing stones Savage, why don't you describe to us everything wrong you have done in the your past life? If not, STFU.
 
granitegriz said:
Since you are throwing stones Savage, why don't you describe to us everything wrong you have done in the your past life? If not, STFU.
Click to expand...


Go f-yourself granite. I can agree with Williams if I want. We went from having 1 or maybe 2 athletes arrested every 4 or 5 years to 4 or 5 arrested EVERY YEAR.
 
granitegriz said:
Must be that time of the month Savage Girl...how many times have been arrested or should have been?
Click to expand...
ummmm....how about NONE!! I live a darn clean life. I have had extensive background checks done on me by the Federal Government because I have NFA class firearms. Believe it or not I've never deserved to be arrested. Oh sorry a speeding ticket once every 5 or more years..................
 
granitegriz said:
You're perfect so keep throwing stones. Good question Hav. Not many but I can think of Maus and Poole.
Click to expand...


I will. Wow you must be a pretty dumb guy if you can't follow the laws Granite.
 
I didn't say I was a smart man, but I have a lesser criminal/traffic record than you. The point is we have all done stupid stuff and not been caught.
 
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