Why Rob Ash will not win a NC

[AZGrizFan]

I'm very happy with who our HC is... and I'm very happy with who is driving your ship as well.

This explains a lot. Ash is 2-5 against the Griz. The only Griz coach who lost 5 games to the Cats was Jack Swarthout who went 3-6 from '67 - '75. Of course 1/2 of Swarthout's losses came in a period when Montana was "de-emphasizing" football, and he still did manage to get UM to 2 National Championship games during that period.

But if Cat fans are happy with just being in the playoffs less than 1/2 the time, never going to a National Championship game, and losing to the Griz 3/4 times they play, then I suppose you are getting what you want.

Ash will also most likely be 2-6 against the Griz come the end of this season. As for any other "Big Games" that the cats have played in under Ash, they have really been terrible.

2013:
Montana State @ Eastern Washington - L 54-29
Montana State vs Montana - L 28-14

2012:
Montana State vs Eastern Washington - L 27-24
(Playoff) Montana State vs Sam Houston State - L 34-16

2011:
Montana State vs Montana - L 36-10
(Playoff) Montana State @ Sam Houston State - 49-13

2010:
(Playoff) Montana State vs North Dakota State - 42-17

2009:
Montana State @ Eastern Washington - L 35-24
Montana State vs Montana - L 33-19

2008:
Montana State vs Eastern Washington - L 34-17
Montana State @ Montana - L 35-3

2007:
Montana State @ Eastern Washington - L 35-17
Montana State vs Montana - L 41-20

I really dont see how cat fans can be content with that.. Whatever floats their boat i guess.

2-5 against the Griz
2-5 against EWU
3-3 against NAU
0-1 against NDSU
0-2 against SHSU

So, 7-16 against teams with a pulse....50-11 against the chum of the world.

 

[poorgriz]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

 

[horribilisfan8184]

"Re: Are Cats cursed with mediocrity?

Post by PlayerRep » Sun Nov 23, 2008 11:01 pm

Besides the things already mentioned, Ash is a not an inspirational coach. He's apparently one of the all-time worst in that regard."

ray: ray: ray:
That must have been one satisfying pat on the back...

That's not where his hand was...

 

[AllWeatherFan]

You guys are just jealous because you don't have your own radio show like Coach Ash does:

 

[NativeGriz]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

You have to agree, the poor boy finally made an accurate post.

 

[AZGrizFan]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

One key difference: Montana Grizzlies fans know that Mick Delaney is not the long term solution. Unfortunately Montana State Bobcats fans don't have the same luxury. Rob Ash IS the long term solution in Bozeman. Sucks to be you. As usual.

 

[Brock Landers]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

Yes, because this thread is so full of love of MD. You know, our short-term problem :thumb:

Should 2014 hold the same for Big Game Rob? 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced by 30+ in the first round if you make it?

 

[get'em_griz]

This explains a lot. Ash is 2-5 against the Griz. The only Griz coach who lost 5 games to the Cats was Jack Swarthout who went 3-6 from '67 - '75. Of course 1/2 of Swarthout's losses came in a period when Montana was "de-emphasizing" football, and he still did manage to get UM to 2 National Championship games during that period.

But if Cat fans are happy with just being in the playoffs less than 1/2 the time, never going to a National Championship game, and losing to the Griz 3/4 times they play, then I suppose you are getting what you want.

Ash will also most likely be 2-6 against the Griz come the end of this season. As for any other "Big Games" that the cats have played in under Ash, they have really been terrible.

2013:
Montana State @ Eastern Washington - L 54-29
Montana State vs Montana - L 28-14

2012:
Montana State vs Eastern Washington - L 27-24
(Playoff) Montana State vs Sam Houston State - L 34-16

2011:
Montana State vs Montana - L 36-10
(Playoff) Montana State @ Sam Houston State - 49-13

2010:
(Playoff) Montana State vs North Dakota State - 42-17

2009:
Montana State @ Eastern Washington - L 35-24
Montana State vs Montana - L 33-19

2008:
Montana State vs Eastern Washington - L 34-17
Montana State @ Montana - L 35-3

2007:
Montana State @ Eastern Washington - L 35-17
Montana State vs Montana - L 41-20

I really dont see how cat fans can be content with that.. Whatever floats their boat i guess.

2-5 against the Griz
2-5 against EWU
3-3 against NAU
0-1 against NDSU
0-2 against SHSU

So, 7-16 against teams with a pulse....50-11 against the chum of the world.

Adding to your post and going back to 2007 when Ash took over. (opponent record since 2007)
Rob Ash's Record: 57-27

2-5 vs the Griz (72-20, .783%)
0-1 vs NDSU (71-21, .772%)
2-5 vs EWU (65-26, .714%)
0-1 vs Michigan State (FBS) (64-29, .688%)
1-0 vs New Hampshire (61-29, .678%)
0-1 vs Utah (FBS) (60-29, .674%)
2-0 vs Drake (50-27, .649%)
0-2 vs SHSU (56-31, .644%)
0-1 vs Texas A&M (FBS) (53-37, .589%)
1-0 vs Stony Brook (47-34, .580%)
3-3 vs NAU (44-34, .564%)
0-1 vs Kansas State (FBS) (41-36, .532%)
2-0 vs UND (41-36, .532%)
0-1 vs SMU (FBS) (37-52, .416%)
0-1 vs Minnesota (FBS) (34-54, .386%)
0-1 vs Washington State (FBS) (23-63, .267%)
13-23 against teams over .500% (Including FBS teams)

1-0 vs Chadron State (DII)(69-21, .767%)
1-0 vs Adams State (DII) (38-39, .494%)
1-0 vs Colorado Mesa (DII) (37-39, .487%)
1-0 vs Monmouth (35-41, .461%)
1-0 vs Minot State (DII) (33-40, .452%)
5-1 vs Weber State (37-45, .451%)
1-1 vs SFA (37-45, .451%)
3-0 vs UC Davis (35-44, .443%)
6-0 vs Sacramento State (35-44, .436%)
2-1 vs Southern Utah (34-45, .430%)
2-0 vs South Dakota (32-45, .416%)
6-0 vs Portland State (27-51, .346%)
2-0 vs Dixie State (DII) (19-54, .260%)
1-0 vs Fort Lewis (DII) (14-59, .192%)
6-1 vs Northern Colorado (14-65, .177%)
5-0 vs Idaho State (12-67, .152%)
44-4 against teams under .500% (including DII teams)


Talk about an inflated record.

 

[PlayerRep]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

One key difference: Montana Grizzlies fans know that Mick Delaney is not the long term solution. Unfortunately Montana State Bobcats fans don't have the same luxury. Rob Ash IS the long term solution in Bozeman. Sucks to be you. As usual.

With JJ, Delaney would be 20-4 or so. The '13 season was much more indicative of how Delaney is as a coach at UM. UM has a very tough schedule this year, so that will impact results a bit.

 

[horribilisfan8184]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

One key difference: Montana Grizzlies fans know that Mick Delaney is not the long term solution. Unfortunately Montana State Bobcats fans don't have the same luxury. Rob Ash IS the long term solution in Bozeman. Sucks to be you. As usual.

With JJ, Delaney would be 20-4 or so. The '13 season was much more indicative of how Delaney is as a coach at UM. UM has a very tough schedule this year, so that will impact results a bit.

Accepting your premise, your statement says alot about JJ's abilities and little about Delaney's abilites. Had Delaney won only 2 or 3 of the games his coaching errors cost the team in 2012, and the CC playoff game in 2013, we wouldn't have a debate over his level of competence for this position. He was a fantastic coach on this team as a position coach, for all the attributes most see as a basis to excuse his poor HC decisions. Although not practical, I would love to see him stay as a position coach if he wanted to keep coaching. Not everybody who's a great department head has what it takes to make a great CEO.

 

[SaskGriz]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

One key difference: Montana Grizzlies fans know that Mick Delaney is not the long term solution. Unfortunately Montana State Bobcats fans don't have the same luxury. Rob Ash IS the long term solution in Bozeman. Sucks to be you. As usual.

With JJ, Delaney would be 20-4 or so. The '13 season was much more indicative of how Delaney is as a coach at UM. UM has a very tough schedule this year, so that will impact results a bit.

With balls my aunt would be my uncle.

 

[tnt]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

One key difference: Montana Grizzlies fans know that Mick Delaney is not the long term solution. Unfortunately Montana State Bobcats fans don't have the same luxury. Rob Ash IS the long term solution in Bozeman. Sucks to be you. As usual.

With JJ, Delaney would be 20-4 or so. The '13 season was much more indicative of how Delaney is as a coach at UM. UM has a very tough schedule this year, so that will impact results a bit.

Accepting your premise, your statement says alot about JJ's abilities and little about Delaney's abilites. Had Delaney won only 2 or 3 of the games his coaching errors cost the team in 2012, and the CC playoff game in 2013, we wouldn't have a debate over his level of competence for this position. He was a fantastic coach on this team as a position coach, for all the attributes most see as a basis to excuse his poor HC decisions. Although not practical, I would love to see him stay as a position coach if he wanted to keep coaching. Not everybody who's a great department head has what it takes to make a great CEO.

It says more about the replacements inabilities than either JJ's or MD's abilities

 

[AZGrizFan]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

One key difference: Montana Grizzlies fans know that Mick Delaney is not the long term solution. Unfortunately Montana State Bobcats fans don't have the same luxury. Rob Ash IS the long term solution in Bozeman. Sucks to be you. As usual.

With JJ, Delaney would be 20-4 or so. The '13 season was much more indicative of how Delaney is as a coach at UM. UM has a very tough schedule this year, so that will impact results a bit.

Accepting your premise, your statement says alot about JJ's abilities and little about Delaney's abilites. Had Delaney won only 2 or 3 of the games his coaching errors cost the team in 2012, and the CC playoff game in 2013, we wouldn't have a debate over his level of competence for this position. He was a fantastic coach on this team as a position coach, for all the attributes most see as a basis to excuse his poor HC decisions. Although not practical, I would love to see him stay as a position coach if he wanted to keep coaching. Not everybody who's a great department head has what it takes to make a great CEO.

While I agree with you in principle, let's be clear: IF (and yes, I realize it's a big if) Delaney HAD managed to win 2-3 more games (by eliminating the bonehead errors) and made the playoffs in 2012 after the shitstorm he inherited we'd be clearing a space for him on Mt. Griz next to Don Read and Jack Swarthout. I realize it's a moot point because it didn't happen, but is THAT really our threshold between idiots and heroes? 2-3 games?

 

[biga75]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

:lol:

 

[get'em_griz]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

:lol:

:lol: I'm gonna call it right now. EWU is going to throttle MSU in bozeman this year. The Cats will not have as good of a season as poorgriz wishes they will and the Griz will beat MSU soundly. It's only been proven that Ash can't win the big games.

 

[PlayerRep]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

One key difference: Montana Grizzlies fans know that Mick Delaney is not the long term solution. Unfortunately Montana State Bobcats fans don't have the same luxury. Rob Ash IS the long term solution in Bozeman. Sucks to be you. As usual.

With JJ, Delaney would be 20-4 or so. The '13 season was much more indicative of how Delaney is as a coach at UM. UM has a very tough schedule this year, so that will impact results a bit.

With balls my aunt would be my uncle.

Only a football idiot would evaluate Delaney's UM head coaching without taking into the account the huge difference of having JJ and not having JJ (and not having any other qb experience that year). I trust that you would agree.

 

[PlayerRep]

and... your head coach is 15 and 9 overall, 9 and 7 in league games. Made playoffs one of two years - where you promptly got bounced in the first round by a warm weather team. I remember the olden days when you guys would have absolutely crushed a team like that coming to play in below zero weather.

We can sit here and make coach comparisons all day long. If you all think your coach is better than Ash, knock yourselves out. In 2014 you'll see that 2013 was a dip, but our program is still on the rise.

2014 should hold about the same for MD... 7 and 5 ish or maybe 8 and 4. Bubble playoff team, bounced in the first round if you make it.

One key difference: Montana Grizzlies fans know that Mick Delaney is not the long term solution. Unfortunately Montana State Bobcats fans don't have the same luxury. Rob Ash IS the long term solution in Bozeman. Sucks to be you. As usual.

With JJ, Delaney would be 20-4 or so. The '13 season was much more indicative of how Delaney is as a coach at UM. UM has a very tough schedule this year, so that will impact results a bit.

Accepting your premise, your statement says alot about JJ's abilities and little about Delaney's abilites. Had Delaney won only 2 or 3 of the games his coaching errors cost the team in 2012, and the CC playoff game in 2013, we wouldn't have a debate over his level of competence for this position. He was a fantastic coach on this team as a position coach, for all the attributes most see as a basis to excuse his poor HC decisions. Although not practical, I would love to see him stay as a position coach if he wanted to keep coaching. Not everybody who's a great department head has what it takes to make a great CEO.

The 2012 team didn't lose 2 or 3 game because of Delaney's coaching errors. One game may have been lost because of a horrible call on special teams (punt defense). Feel free to identify and explain the other 1 or 2 you refer too. Had JJ been the qb in 2012, UM would have won the game with the bad special teams call too.

 

[CV Griz Fan]

One key difference: Montana Grizzlies fans know that Mick Delaney is not the long term solution. Unfortunately Montana State Bobcats fans don't have the same luxury. Rob Ash IS the long term solution in Bozeman. Sucks to be you. As usual.

With JJ, Delaney would be 20-4 or so. The '13 season was much more indicative of how Delaney is as a coach at UM. UM has a very tough schedule this year, so that will impact results a bit.

Accepting your premise, your statement says alot about JJ's abilities and little about Delaney's abilites. Had Delaney won only 2 or 3 of the games his coaching errors cost the team in 2012, and the CC playoff game in 2013, we wouldn't have a debate over his level of competence for this position. He was a fantastic coach on this team as a position coach, for all the attributes most see as a basis to excuse his poor HC decisions. Although not practical, I would love to see him stay as a position coach if he wanted to keep coaching. Not everybody who's a great department head has what it takes to make a great CEO.

The 2012 team didn't lose 2 or 3 game because of Delaney's coaching errors. One game may have been lost because of a horrible call on special teams (punt defense). Feel free to identify and explain the other 1 or 2 you refer too. Had JJ been the qb in 2012, UM would have won the game with the bad special teams call too.

JJ being gone in 2012 obviously hurt the Griz. I don't think that fact can be disputed. I think it was Brint that said after the 2013 season that, in his opinion, the 2012 Griz team was not as BAD as the record indicated. On the flip side, Brint felt that the 2013 was not as GOOD as the record indicated. I share that opinion. The 2015 team will basically be the same. The Griz are a 8 or 9 win team fighting for a conference title and a possible playoff birth. This would occur with or without Delaney at the helm IMO.

 

[Brock Landers]

I don't like to rag on players, but McKinney did a pretty good job of single-handedly losing the NAU game

 

[AZGrizFan]

I don't like to rag on players, but McKinney did a pretty good job of single-handedly losing the NAU game

You're not ragging on a player....he's gone.