Watering down of FCS

[grizfan95]

If winning the 2011 BEEF 'O' BRADY'S BOWL is your definition of success then we aren't even talking the same language.

I was at that game because I live near Tropicana Field and a good friend of mine down here is a Marshall alum. I wore a Griz shirt to have some fun with the Marshall fans. I was stunned that I didn't get any ribbing over it. So I initiated some friendly banter. Again, I was shocked.....of the nearly 100 or so fans I talked to......only one even knew about the '95 and '96 "title games" (he used finger quotes when he said it) that Marshall played in. They laughed at the idea of moving down to play lower competition for higher accolades in the lower division? Who wouldn't?

The reason universities don't move down is that there is a lot of shifting and funding issues involved, for example compliance with Title IX. Who was saying the Griz should move down to DII?

"Title game" ?! Please :roll:

 

[tampa_griz]

If winning the 2011 BEEF 'O' BRADY'S BOWL is your definition of success then we aren't even talking the same language.

I was at that game because I live near Tropicana Field and a good friend of mine down here is a Marshall alum. I wore a Griz shirt to have some fun with the Marshall fans. I was stunned that I didn't get any ribbing over it. So I initiated some friendly banter. Again, I was shocked.....of the nearly 100 or so fans I talked to......only one even knew about the '95 and '96 "title games" (he used finger quotes when he said it) that Marshall played in. They laughed at the idea of moving down to play lower competition for higher accolades in the lower division? Who wouldn't?

boy if that doesn't deserve a "cool story bro" nothing does. the part about how he used finger quotes was especially riveting. you should have your own talk show.

Lets talk about me.

 

[tampa_griz]

If winning the 2011 BEEF 'O' BRADY'S BOWL is your definition of success then we aren't even talking the same language.

I was at that game because I live near Tropicana Field and a good friend of mine down here is a Marshall alum. I wore a Griz shirt to have some fun with the Marshall fans. I was stunned that I didn't get any ribbing over it. So I initiated some friendly banter. Again, I was shocked.....of the nearly 100 or so fans I talked to......only one even knew about the '95 and '96 "title games" (he used finger quotes when he said it) that Marshall played in. They laughed at the idea of moving down to play lower competition for higher accolades in the lower division? Who wouldn't?

The reason universities don't move down is that there is a lot of shifting and funding issues involved, for example compliance with Title IX. Who was saying the Griz should move down to DII?

"Title game" ?! Please :roll:

We'd have a great shot at winning national titles if we moved to D-II. Why not then?

 

[getgrizzy]

If winning the 2011 BEEF 'O' BRADY'S BOWL is your definition of success then we aren't even talking the same language.

I was at that game because I live near Tropicana Field and a good friend of mine down here is a Marshall alum. I wore a Griz shirt to have some fun with the Marshall fans. I was stunned that I didn't get any ribbing over it. So I initiated some friendly banter. Again, I was shocked.....of the nearly 100 or so fans I talked to......only one even knew about the '95 and '96 "title games" (he used finger quotes when he said it) that Marshall played in. They laughed at the idea of moving down to play lower competition for higher accolades in the lower division? Who wouldn't?

boy if that doesn't deserve a "cool story bro" nothing does. the part about how he used finger quotes was especially riveting. you should have your own talk show.

Lets talk about me.

please tell me you went because your "friend" paid your way or was a gwenyth paltrow lookalike.

 

[PlayerRep]

Why do some mover-uppers like to respond to those who don't want to move up, by saying that UM should or will play at the D-II level? Do they really think that, do they think that's a bonafide argument in support of moving up, do they think they are being funny, or are they just being dicks?

 

[ewueagle2010]

The main benefit from the Griz moving up that I see happening is that then Griz fans can say "well at least we're losing to bigger name schools that down at the FCS level" :thumb:

As an outsider looking at the conversation that seems to happen 24/7 on this board, I just don't think those who want the Griz to move up care about anything more than the brand that comes with FBS programs. U of M will never be a power house program at that level. Sure, maybe become a Nevada, Wyoming, or MAYBE even a Boise State, but really? Boise will never be respected with the schools from PAC 12, BIG 10, BIG 12, SEC. Everyone outside of the Northwest looks at them as a cute little program that wins one big game a year. If that's what U of M wants, great, move up and best of luck. Montana will NEVER be able to compete with USC, UCLA, Stanford, Oregon, or even Washington! Is a recruit going to ever choose Missoula over any other Pac 12 city? Hell no.

And of course programs that moved up to FBS aren't going to admit they made a mistake. EVEN IDAHO WON'T ADMIT THAT AND LOOK AT THEM!! :shock: Be proud of being one of the be best at the FCS level. If the time comes where there is no choice but to move up, then move up with along with several other power FCS programs. But moving up now will not propel U of M to the national spotlight. It'll just be another FBS program out west that no one ever talks about. It's better to be the one of the best at something and than nothing at all.

 

[tampa_griz]

I was at that game because I live near Tropicana Field and a good friend of mine down here is a Marshall alum. I wore a Griz shirt to have some fun with the Marshall fans. I was stunned that I didn't get any ribbing over it. So I initiated some friendly banter. Again, I was shocked.....of the nearly 100 or so fans I talked to......only one even knew about the '95 and '96 "title games" (he used finger quotes when he said it) that Marshall played in. They laughed at the idea of moving down to play lower competition for higher accolades in the lower division? Who wouldn't?

boy if that doesn't deserve a "cool story bro" nothing does. the part about how he used finger quotes was especially riveting. you should have your own talk show.

Lets talk about me.

please tell me you went because your "friend" paid your way or was a gwenyth paltrow lookalike.

You hate The Trop?

 

[Copper Griz]

If winning the 2011 BEEF 'O' BRADY'S BOWL is your definition of success then we aren't even talking the same language.

I was at that game because I live near Tropicana Field and a good friend of mine down here is a Marshall alum. I wore a Griz shirt to have some fun with the Marshall fans. I was stunned that I didn't get any ribbing over it. So I initiated some friendly banter. Again, I was shocked.....of the nearly 100 or so fans I talked to......only one even knew about the '95 and '96 "title games" (he used finger quotes when he said it) that Marshall played in. They laughed at the idea of moving down to play lower competition for higher accolades in the lower division? Who wouldn't?

So if I am reading your post correctly, Marshall's fan base has changed dramatically since the 90's and their faithful fans left after they moved up? Or do they just have amnesia/dementia? Oh wait - the NC was so inconsequential they just forgot about it. Hmmm. This is just what the Griz need. Move up and lose your faithful fans or just forget the past successful tradition. That will work well since we have such a huge fan base to draw from in a state with 1 million people who are spread across a huge geography. I just changed my mind - let's move up.

 

[tampa_griz]

If winning the 2011 BEEF 'O' BRADY'S BOWL is your definition of success then we aren't even talking the same language.

I was at that game because I live near Tropicana Field and a good friend of mine down here is a Marshall alum. I wore a Griz shirt to have some fun with the Marshall fans. I was stunned that I didn't get any ribbing over it. So I initiated some friendly banter. Again, I was shocked.....of the nearly 100 or so fans I talked to......only one even knew about the '95 and '96 "title games" (he used finger quotes when he said it) that Marshall played in. They laughed at the idea of moving down to play lower competition for higher accolades in the lower division? Who wouldn't?

So if I am reading your post correctly, Marshall's fan base has changed dramatically since the 90's and their faithful fans left after they moved up? Or do they just have amnesia/dementia? Oh wait - the NC was so inconsequential they just forgot about it. Hmmm. This is just what the Griz need. Move up and lose your faithful fans or just forget the past successful tradition. That will work well since we have such a huge fan base to draw from in a state with 1 million people who are spread across a huge geography. I just changed my mind - let's move up.

They have a larger fan base than they did before. They just don't care about their lower division accolades. Who would?

 

[Copper Griz]

If winning the 2011 BEEF 'O' BRADY'S BOWL is your definition of success then we aren't even talking the same language.

I was at that game because I live near Tropicana Field and a good friend of mine down here is a Marshall alum. I wore a Griz shirt to have some fun with the Marshall fans. I was stunned that I didn't get any ribbing over it. So I initiated some friendly banter. Again, I was shocked.....of the nearly 100 or so fans I talked to......only one even knew about the '95 and '96 "title games" (he used finger quotes when he said it) that Marshall played in. They laughed at the idea of moving down to play lower competition for higher accolades in the lower division? Who wouldn't?

So if I am reading your post correctly, Marshall's fan base has changed dramatically since the 90's and their faithful fans left after they moved up? Or do they just have amnesia/dementia? Oh wait - the NC was so inconsequential they just forgot about it. Hmmm. This is just what the Griz need. Move up and lose your faithful fans or just forget the past successful tradition. That will work well since we have such a huge fan base to draw from in a state with 1 million people who are spread across a huge geography. I just changed my mind - let's move up.

They have a larger fan base than they did before. They just don't care about their lower division accolades. Who would?

Where do you think the Griz are going to get their larger fan base. All of those Ronan or Stevensville folks who have been on the fence about attending? The population of the east coast can likely support growth. Montana - doubtful.

 

[tampa_griz]

They have a larger fan base than they did before. They just don't care about their lower division accolades. Who would?

Where do you think the Griz are going to get their larger fan base. All of those Ronan or Stevensville folks who have been on the fence about attending? The population of the east coast can likely support growth. Montana - doubtful.

Montana is having trouble selling tickets? Interesting. I'd heard otherwise.

 

[grizfan95]

The main benefit from the Griz moving up that I see happening is that then Griz fans can say "well at least we're losing to bigger name schools that down at the FCS level" :thumb:

As an outsider looking at the conversation that seems to happen 24/7 on this board, I just don't think those who want the Griz to move up care about anything more than the brand that comes with FBS programs. U of M will never be a power house program at that level. Sure, maybe become a Nevada, Wyoming, or MAYBE even a Boise State, but really? Boise will never be respected with the schools from PAC 12, BIG 10, BIG 12, SEC. Everyone outside of the Northwest looks at them as a cute little program that wins one big game a year. If that's what U of M wants, great, move up and best of luck. Montana will NEVER be able to compete with USC, UCLA, Stanford, Oregon, or even Washington! Is a recruit going to ever choose Missoula over any other Pac 12 city? Hell no.

And of course programs that moved up to FBS aren't going to admit they made a mistake. EVEN IDAHO WON'T ADMIT THAT AND LOOK AT THEM!! :shock: Be proud of being one of the be best at the FCS level. If the time comes where there is no choice but to move up, then move up with along with several other power FCS programs. But moving up now will not propel U of M to the national spotlight. It'll just be another FBS program out west that no one ever talks about. It's better to be the one of the best at something and than nothing at all.

Spot on.

 

[Copper Griz]

They have a larger fan base than they did before. They just don't care about their lower division accolades. Who would?

Where do you think the Griz are going to get their larger fan base. All of those Ronan or Stevensville folks who have been on the fence about attending? The population of the east coast can likely support growth. Montana - doubtful.

Montana is having trouble selling tickets? Interesting. I'd heard otherwise.

The question should not be, "are they having trouble selling tickets now." Instead, can they sell them if they move up? Increased stadium size and facilities. Expense for travel and bowl games (if they ever get into one). How many fans will be pissed and lose interest if the team is losing? How do you replace them? I guess I am a realist. This is a big decision that better be well vetted financially.

 

[tampa_griz]

They have a larger fan base than they did before. They just don't care about their lower division accolades. Who would?

Where do you think the Griz are going to get their larger fan base. All of those Ronan or Stevensville folks who have been on the fence about attending? The population of the east coast can likely support growth. Montana - doubtful.

Montana is having trouble selling tickets? Interesting. I'd heard otherwise.

It is not if they are having trouble selling tickets now - can they sell them if they move up? Increased stadium size and facilities. Expense for travel and bowl games (if they ever get into one). How many fans will be pissed and lose interest if the team is losing. How do you replace them? I guess I am a realist. This is a big decision that better be well vetted financially.

Your arguments for staying put make for an even better argument to move down. Do you think it's a good idea?

 

[Copper Griz]

Where do you think the Griz are going to get their larger fan base. All of those Ronan or Stevensville folks who have been on the fence about attending? The population of the east coast can likely support growth. Montana - doubtful.

Montana is having trouble selling tickets? Interesting. I'd heard otherwise.

It is not if they are having trouble selling tickets now - can they sell them if they move up? Increased stadium size and facilities. Expense for travel and bowl games (if they ever get into one). How many fans will be pissed and lose interest if the team is losing. How do you replace them? I guess I am a realist. This is a big decision that better be well vetted financially.

Your arguments for staying put make for an even better argument to move down. Do you think it's a good idea?

Your argument is flawed. You are dating a beautiful women currently. You are proposing an upgrade to a Victoria Secret super model. Can you afford her and the high maintenance BS that goes with her? Moving down has no benefit and I never proposed that. Moving down you lose scholies and fans. Help me understand how this crept into the discussion.

 

[grizfan95]

Montana is having trouble selling tickets? Interesting. I'd heard otherwise.

It is not if they are having trouble selling tickets now - can they sell them if they move up? Increased stadium size and facilities. Expense for travel and bowl games (if they ever get into one). How many fans will be pissed and lose interest if the team is losing. How do you replace them? I guess I am a realist. This is a big decision that better be well vetted financially.

Your arguments for staying put make for an even better argument to move down. Do you think it's a good idea?

Your argument is flawed. You are dating a beautiful women currently. You are proposing an upgrade to a Victoria Secret super model. Can you afford her and the high maintenance BS that goes with her? Moving down has no benefit and I never proposed that. Moving down you lose scholies and fans. Help me understand how this crept into the discussion.

It crept into the discussion because Tampa has no substance and is flinging anything that seems to stick. All that humidity must wear on the brain cells.

 

[tampa_griz]

Montana is having trouble selling tickets? Interesting. I'd heard otherwise.

It is not if they are having trouble selling tickets now - can they sell them if they move up? Increased stadium size and facilities. Expense for travel and bowl games (if they ever get into one). How many fans will be pissed and lose interest if the team is losing. How do you replace them? I guess I am a realist. This is a big decision that better be well vetted financially.

Your arguments for staying put make for an even better argument to move down. Do you think it's a good idea?

Your argument is flawed. You are dating a beautiful women currently. You are proposing an upgrade to a Victoria Secret super model. Can you afford her and the high maintenance BS that goes with her? Moving down has no benefit and I never proposed that. Moving down you lose scholies and fans. Help me understand how this crept into the discussion.

But you save lots of money with less schollies, easier travel, etc. Saving money was a good reason to NOT move up before. Why is that no longer the case? If we moved down, we'd win more games. So far, I've been told that winning more games equals more fans. Again, why would winning less in FBS be a bad thing but winning more in D-II be a bad thing? You can't have it both ways.

 

[kemajic]

But you save lots of money with less schollies, easier travel, etc. Saving money was a good reason to NOT move up before. Why is that no longer the case? If we moved down, we'd win more games. So far, I've been told that winning more games equals more fans. Again, why would winning less in FBS be a bad thing but winning more in D-II be a bad thing? You can't have it both ways.

Right on. And inch by inch we are moving to closer to DII all the time. Many are just in denial about it.

 

[PlayerRep]

It is not if they are having trouble selling tickets now - can they sell them if they move up? Increased stadium size and facilities. Expense for travel and bowl games (if they ever get into one). How many fans will be pissed and lose interest if the team is losing. How do you replace them? I guess I am a realist. This is a big decision that better be well vetted financially.

Your arguments for staying put make for an even better argument to move down. Do you think it's a good idea?

Your argument is flawed. You are dating a beautiful women currently. You are proposing an upgrade to a Victoria Secret super model. Can you afford her and the high maintenance BS that goes with her? Moving down has no benefit and I never proposed that. Moving down you lose scholies and fans. Help me understand how this crept into the discussion.

But you save lots of money with less schollies, easier travel, etc. Saving money was a good reason to NOT move up before. Why is that no longer the case? If we moved down, we'd win more games. So far, I've been told that winning more games equals more fans. Again, why would winning less in FBS be a bad thing but winning more in D-II be a bad thing? You can't have it both ways.

However, at D-II, you would also lose lots of revenue, and there may not be any net savings at all for a school like UM, which has a good fan base and lots of ticket revenue. And, basketball and all other sports would be at the D-II level. Most people would prefer to keep basketball and other sports at D-I.

Saving money is not necessarily a reason not to move up. However, the cost of moving up is a big factor. If you don't have enough money to move up, and the teams are not as successful as they otherwise would be, then you have a double financial whammy. More costs, and declining revenues.

The arguments that some of you use make me laugh.

 

[PlayerRep]

But you save lots of money with less schollies, easier travel, etc. Saving money was a good reason to NOT move up before. Why is that no longer the case? If we moved down, we'd win more games. So far, I've been told that winning more games equals more fans. Again, why would winning less in FBS be a bad thing but winning more in D-II be a bad thing? You can't have it both ways.

Right on. And inch by inch we are moving to closer to DII all the time. Many are just in denial about it.

Your is not correct. You are just blinded by your view, which rejects reality if it doesn't support your view. Many others have made this comment about you.