'Voice of the Bobcats' resigned amidst sexual harassment investigation

[astutegriz]

This is the part I don't understand....

“The assaults and harassment are why I decided to pursue a new opportunity and leave Montana,” Just said. “I was prepared to leave the journalism industry altogether had I not found another job.”

This guy was obviously in the wrong and a huge dipshit, but why would she have to leave the state and possibly journalism all together? She did a fine job covering the Griz, but I never got the sense she liked being in Missoula anyway. Regardless, no one should have to endure what she did.

This thread is why she had to leave Montana. I read this when it was only one page and thought to myself, "Where are the anti-Hauck, anti-eGriz people now? They should see all of these regular posters standing up for this woman against the creeper. Why do they paint eGrizzers and Griz Nation as a bunch of victim-blamers and mysogynists when so many are good guys with an obvious sense of right from wrong?"

Today, I roll my eyes. Sure, not all of the evidence is exposed and there are two sides...yada yada. But, anyone with a hint of common sense can read those texts and understand the scenario. NO....men don't need to be afraid to compliment women. No...it's not unusual or suspect that Amie gave the guy her number. I've given my number to a multitude of contacts, male and female, for many reasons. Creepy is creepy. We all know it. We know when we are on the receiving end of it, and a "creeper" knows when they are doing it.

So, you have a creeper touching your ass, giving you looks, sending you texts and otherwise has you in his "sights" as a potential sexual conquest and won't take no or unending hints. Do you ignore it? Most of us HAVE ignored it time after time after time. Do you report it? Well, if so, you become the subject of this discussion and a hundred more. What did she do to deserve this? Liberal vs Conservative nonsense, why did she....give him her number? Talk to him at that party? Etc etc etc.

It's a tired comparison but, if a guy was walking down the street at night and the Voice of the Bobcats mugged him, would we pick it apart like this? Would we bring up past cases where there were false accusations of robbery? Would we say "why was he walking down the street so late? Why was he flashing that expensive Rolex if he didn't want someone to take it from him? He has always been very generous with his money. Suddenly he doesn't want someone to take it?

Most of us know right from wrong. Most of you are clear on the situation here but, damn. What would you do? This happens to women ALL OF THE TIME. What would you do? What would you advise your daughter to do? Suck it up or open herself up as a target of exhaustive scrutiny and character assassination? Politics aside, football aside.....it just sucks.

This

Exactly this. thank you GG

Nicely worded! And in my opinion obvious to those who treat women with respect. I feel for the children. They shouldn't be punished because of the sins of the father. His punishment is severe. This will follow him and perhaps ultimately define him. I love a good redemption story, so I hope he can get over being the victim, accept responsibility, make ammends, and have that be his defining moment. That said, at the end of the day, he has a wife and five kids to make it right with, not any of us.

 

[horribilisfan8184]

MSU athletics is a brand. This douche was the voice of that brand. There was enough evidence of behavior that would tarnish the brand that MSU had to act. This guy resigning was an olive branch to get rid of any possible future problems he could cause the brand. The only possible relevance of the JJ fiasco is even when proven a false accusation the whole sordid way it played out seriously hurt the UM brand.

While the business and law professionals want to nit-pick the hairs after splitting them, I'm confident the MSU-Learfield contract gave MSU the right to cancel if Learfield did nothing. The investigation, whether Title IX or not, provided the evidence to make that demand of Learfield. NO amount of publicity spin could knock the stink off this guy's actions and texts.

GG is right. Shame on all of you for gratuitous attacks on Amy chasing meaningless strawman issues. In the real world, if Amy was your sister and showed you his texts, you'd have all flattened this guy in a second if you had a chance. Let that sink in.

 

[AZGrizFan]

MSU athletics is a brand. This douche was the voice of that brand. There was enough evidence of behavior that would tarnish the brand that MSU had to act. This guy resigning was an olive branch to get rid of any possible future problems he could cause the brand. The only possible relevance of the JJ fiasco is even when proven a false accusation the whole sordid way it played out seriously hurt the UM brand.

While the business and law professionals want to nit-pick the hairs after splitting them, I'm confident the MSU-Learfield contract gave MSU the right to cancel if Learfield did nothing. The investigation, whether Title IX or not, provided the evidence to make that demand of Learfield. NO amount of publicity spin could knock the stink off this guy's actions and texts.

GG is right. Shame on all of you for gratuitous attacks on Amy chasing meaningless strawman issues. In the real world, if Amy was your sister and showed you his texts, you'd have all flattened this guy in a second if you had a chance. Let that sink in.

If Amy was my sister she wouldn't have waited months before filing her report/complaint. :x

 

[HookedonGriz]

This is the part I don't understand....

“The assaults and harassment are why I decided to pursue a new opportunity and leave Montana,” Just said. “I was prepared to leave the journalism industry altogether had I not found another job.”

This guy was obviously in the wrong and a huge dipshit, but why would she have to leave the state and possibly journalism all together? She did a fine job covering the Griz, but I never got the sense she liked being in Missoula anyway. Regardless, no one should have to endure what she did.

This thread is why she had to leave Montana. I read this when it was only one page and thought to myself, "Where are the anti-Hauck, anti-eGriz people now? They should see all of these regular posters standing up for this woman against the creeper. Why do they paint eGrizzers and Griz Nation as a bunch of victim-blamers and mysogynists when so many are good guys with an obvious sense of right from wrong?"

Today, I roll my eyes. Sure, not all of the evidence is exposed and there are two sides...yada yada. But, anyone with a hint of common sense can read those texts and understand the scenario. NO....men don't need to be afraid to compliment women. No...it's not unusual or suspect that Amie gave the guy her number. I've given my number to a multitude of contacts, male and female, for many reasons. Creepy is creepy. We all know it. We know when we are on the receiving end of it, and a "creeper" knows when they are doing it.

So, you have a creeper touching your ass, giving you looks, sending you texts and otherwise has you in his "sights" as a potential sexual conquest and won't take no or unending hints. Do you ignore it? Most of us HAVE ignored it time after time after time. Do you report it? Well, if so, you become the subject of this discussion and a hundred more. What did she do to deserve this? Liberal vs Conservative nonsense, why did she....give him her number? Talk to him at that party? Etc etc etc.

It's a tired comparison but, if a guy was walking down the street at night and the Voice of the Bobcats mugged him, would we pick it apart like this? Would we bring up past cases where there were false accusations of robbery? Would we say "why was he walking down the street so late? Why was he flashing that expensive Rolex if he didn't want someone to take it from him? He has always been very generous with his money. Suddenly he doesn't want someone to take it?

Most of us know right from wrong. Most of you are clear on the situation here but, damn. What would you do? This happens to women ALL OF THE TIME. What would you do? What would you advise your daughter to do? Suck it up or open herself up as a target of exhaustive scrutiny and character assassination? Politics aside, football aside.....it just sucks.

Another GGNez Grand Slam! Perfectly stated!

 

[PlayerRep]

I don't understand what jurisdiction that MSU Title IX department has over this situation. Unless there is some special provision in the Leerfield contract with MSU that requires Leerfield abide by and be governed by MSU's sexual harassment policies, I don't get the connection. From what I read, the guy worked for Leerfield, not MSU.

I can't imagine, for example, that every third party contractor that works with MSU--say a contruction company building a building, a catering company that supplies MSU events including at say the stadium during games, an accounting firm auditing MSU, a company providing janitorial services--is subject to the MSU Title IX policy. It just seems odd that MSU would have jurisdiction to start a proceeding regarding a construction worker, caterer, janitor, who sexually harasses a non-MSU employee, like a Bozeman Chronicle or Missoulian reporter.

The stuff doesn't appear to have occurred on the MSU campus, not that that would be necessary for jurisdiction if this involved a student or professor.

Some federal laws and contracts require compliance with a bunch of federal laws. However, even if something like that, I'm not aware that that would allow a federal agency to start an agency sexual harassment proceeding against an employee of a contractor.

There must be some law or contract provision that I'm not aware of.

Anyone have any ideas on this?

Yes. I think you are confusing the issues here. The application of Title IX is broadly construed and it can and does apply to “any person” tangentially involved with MSU in this case Amie as a reporter covering its athletic programs. Once she filed her complaint, MSU had a compliance obligation or duty under Title IX to immediately investigate and implement any action necessary to stop the sexual harassment if it found that there was any and to also implement measures to prevent its reoccurrence. Basically an educational institution has a duty to prevent a hostile sexual environment from being allowed to occur on its campus even if it is caused by a non-employee third party like the voice of the bobcats. Once MSU did that then it has met its obligation under the act and it is off the hook so to speak. Any damages Amie might have incurred, MSU and not the voice of the bobcats, would have been liable for them. Since the voice of the bobcats resigned due to a family medical issue then this issue is non-issue issue. Lol. Was never a jurisdictional issue but rather a compliance issue on the part of an educational institution recieving federal dollars. I don’t think the voice really has what would be considered traditional “due process rights” as a non employee third party. He would of course had the right to submit a response to her complaint which it sounded like he is or was going to. his only relief would be a civil action against Learfield, MSU and Amie had Learfield fired him and there wasn’t good cause. He potentially would have had a cause of action against Learfield for breach or wrongful discharge and MSU and possibly Amie for defamation or tortious interfence of his employment contract. I think this is about all we are ever going to hear about this whole thing unless the former voice of the bobcats decides to release MSU’s compliance report to prove his asseration that his texts were in no way sexual in nature. Lol.

MSU is currently being sued for sex discrimination by a former straight male student after a Title IX investigation found him to have created a hostile environment against a transgender student when he told their investigator that he would beat the shit out of her, the transgender woman, if she ever approached him in a class they had together. As a result of the investigation he was asked to leave and transferred to Northern. Lol. That’s all I got. Thanks.

I realize that Title IX has been construed broadly. That doesn't mean that it applies to this situation. Radio announcer working for Learfield, not MSU. Agree that we haven't reviewed the Learfield contract or know the exact employment relationship. Reporter who worked for Missoulian in Missoula, primarily covering UM football. Got anything else or anything to cite to?

 

[PlayerRep]

Perhaps true, but the Big Sky media day looks like it was on July 18 in Spokane, not August.

"During the Big Sky Conference Media Days at the DoubleTree Hotel, EWU quarterback Gage Gubrud, left and defensive back Mitch Fettig wait to speak to reporters, Mon., July 16, 2018. (Colin Mulvany / The Spokesman-Review)

So, if the last straw was the media days, then she waited over 2 months to file the formal complaint with MSU, and filed it 8 days prior to announcing her acceptance of a new job in NO.

With both parties now living out of state, is this a good use of MSU's Title IX resources? Don't think UM continued with its proceeding after the Saudi student went back to Saudi Arabia, but maybe UM did.

Also, I recall that at UM a number of years ago, both parties were required to keep the UM proceedings confidential. An accuser had complained about that. Don't know MSU's rules. Looks like the reporter must have given the draft report to the Gazette/Missoulian, or someone did. MSU obviously has no way to enforce any such rule against the reporter, even if they have such a rule.

Assume the federal privacy rules prevent MSU from releasing the report or any details, whether involving a student or employee. Note that ongoing legal action of Krakauer against UM, and UM's arguments to not make information public.

From the article:

"Asked if the information contained in the report generally would lead to the dismissal of an employee, MSU vice president of university communications Tracy Ellig noted that he can’t speak to the specifics of any case and that each case is handled on an individual basis.

“The question you’re asking is one I can’t answer because, one, I can’t speak to a specific case, and two, the case you’re asking about is not finalized, and three, it’s entirely speculative because he no longer works here, and four, the majority of his employment was with Learfield,” Ellig said."

Here's the person doing the investigation for MSU, according to the article:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/victor-maxson-78753418

Oh good, we're getting to the stage where we question the victim.

Next stop on this well worn trail is we question her mental health stability and motivation, a quick stop at character assassination and then our final destination of fully blaming the victim.

Fun

Accusers are questioned in ever single proceeding in courts and probably most Title IX proceedings. That's how it's done. Why should accusers get passes, and the accused not?

Or, are you just a liberal who goes with narrative on things like this? Try thinking for yourself. Try using some common sense.

I'm not talking about court proceedings or stripping defendants of their ability to defend themselves. I used the pronoun 'we' to describe the typical reaction on e- griz when a woman comes forward with an accusation about a man abusing them. This also applies to any UM football player accused of any wrongdoing. This is how we- mostly YOU-- react to these situations.

You said as much in the Urban Meyer thread last fall when you admitted that you tend to defend high profile men who are accused of abuse/assault. This is a bias of yours. It's usually against females, the police or prosecutors. It usually supports those who are with power or are high profile.

This pattern and bias of yours is easily identifiable to anyone who regularly reads this board. You start with questions that invariably lead to a character assassination of the accuser.

It backfired with Beau.

I have said nothing about court proceedings or the ability to defend oneself, so don't direct that at me.

I asked why you think that an accused should not be able to defend himself, generally, and why no one should be allowed to question the accuser or say anything about the accuser. Makes zero sense to me.

I have never said that I tend to defend high profile men who are accused of abuse/assault. I don't have a bias, but I know that people are falsely accused all the time, or that accusations are often exaggerated.

I didn't defend Beau. I merely said one time, after the first press, that I thought it would be fine for him.

I have never had any "character assassination" of any accuser. Not once. You either have a bad memory, are stupid, or are biased.

 

[horribilisfan8184]

MSU athletics is a brand. This douche was the voice of that brand. There was enough evidence of behavior that would tarnish the brand that MSU had to act. This guy resigning was an olive branch to get rid of any possible future problems he could cause the brand. The only possible relevance of the JJ fiasco is even when proven a false accusation the whole sordid way it played out seriously hurt the UM brand.

While the business and law professionals want to nit-pick the hairs after splitting them, I'm confident the MSU-Learfield contract gave MSU the right to cancel if Learfield did nothing. The investigation, whether Title IX or not, provided the evidence to make that demand of Learfield. NO amount of publicity spin could knock the stink off this guy's actions and texts.

GG is right. Shame on all of you for gratuitous attacks on Amy chasing meaningless strawman issues. In the real world, if Amy was your sister and showed you his texts, you'd have all flattened this guy in a second if you had a chance. Let that sink in.

If Amy was my sister she wouldn't have waited months before filing her report/complaint. :x

You obviously recognize little of the courage it takes for a woman who works in a "man's" profession to take on the good 'ol boy network by reporting this crap. Pretty obvious to me she took steps to get him to back off nicely, hoping he would take the hint, WHICH HE DIDN'T. Did you miss that her first thought when he didn't take the hint was to get out of the profession altogether? Do you think someone in this "man's" profession would hire her down the road with this complaint pending? Since you are implying she is unbelievable by waiting, tell us the date by which she should have filed her a complaint to be believable. Give us THE date.

 

[PlayerRep]

This is the part I don't understand....

“The assaults and harassment are why I decided to pursue a new opportunity and leave Montana,” Just said. “I was prepared to leave the journalism industry altogether had I not found another job.”

This guy was obviously in the wrong and a huge dipshit, but why would she have to leave the state and possibly journalism all together? She did a fine job covering the Griz, but I never got the sense she liked being in Missoula anyway. Regardless, no one should have to endure what she did.

This thread is why she had to leave Montana. I read this when it was only one page and thought to myself, "Where are the anti-Hauck, anti-eGriz people now? They should see all of these regular posters standing up for this woman against the creeper. Why do they paint eGrizzers and Griz Nation as a bunch of victim-blamers and mysogynists when so many are good guys with an obvious sense of right from wrong?"

Today, I roll my eyes. Sure, not all of the evidence is exposed and there are two sides...yada yada. But, anyone with a hint of common sense can read those texts and understand the scenario. NO....men don't need to be afraid to compliment women. No...it's not unusual or suspect that Amie gave the guy her number. I've given my number to a multitude of contacts, male and female, for many reasons. Creepy is creepy. We all know it. We know when we are on the receiving end of it, and a "creeper" knows when they are doing it.

So, you have a creeper touching your ass, giving you looks, sending you texts and otherwise has you in his "sights" as a potential sexual conquest and won't take no or unending hints. Do you ignore it? Most of us HAVE ignored it time after time after time. Do you report it? Well, if so, you become the subject of this discussion and a hundred more. What did she do to deserve this? Liberal vs Conservative nonsense, why did she....give him her number? Talk to him at that party? Etc etc etc.

It's a tired comparison but, if a guy was walking down the street at night and the Voice of the Bobcats mugged him, would we pick it apart like this? Would we bring up past cases where there were false accusations of robbery? Would we say "why was he walking down the street so late? Why was he flashing that expensive Rolex if he didn't want someone to take it from him? He has always been very generous with his money. Suddenly he doesn't want someone to take it?

Most of us know right from wrong. Most of you are clear on the situation here but, damn. What would you do? This happens to women ALL OF THE TIME. What would you do? What would you advise your daughter to do? Suck it up or open herself up as a target of exhaustive scrutiny and character assassination? Politics aside, football aside.....it just sucks.

I'll tell you what I would do. Unless I did in fact have a friendship with the announcer, I wouldn't continue texting that long. I would also tell him to stop, via text. If he did it again, I would immediately tell I didn't like it, it was inappropriate and he needs to stop. And, if he does it again, I'm going to report him. If it was too uncomfortable to do some of this, then I would have my supervisor at my employee do this on my behalf.

What I wouldn't do is wait until 8 days before I announced that I was taking a new job, to make a formal complaint and to cite a series of texts that occurred 7 months earlier. Since she didn't have to allow her name to be made public, but she did, I think she has invited attention and comments.

Some of this advice I have given to my kids, including my daughters. As I have said before, one daughter was taught by her Army Ranger brother how to defend herself. She has punched a couple guys who were doing things like grabbing butts, and even decked one guy with one punch.

It is tougher and uncomfortable in an employer-employee situation, but it shouldn't have been very hard in this situation to complain about the announcer sooner and better, in my view. This was not an employer-employee situation. The announcer had no control over her job or job security or advancement.

Obviously, I don't have all the facts. I wonder if there is a bit more to this than meets the eye at this point.

 

[uofmman1122]

We haven't had some good ol' mansplaining on here in a while.

Good work, fellas.

 

[PlayerRep]

MSU athletics is a brand. This douche was the voice of that brand. There was enough evidence of behavior that would tarnish the brand that MSU had to act. This guy resigning was an olive branch to get rid of any possible future problems he could cause the brand. The only possible relevance of the JJ fiasco is even when proven a false accusation the whole sordid way it played out seriously hurt the UM brand.

While the business and law professionals want to nit-pick the hairs after splitting them, I'm confident the MSU-Learfield contract gave MSU the right to cancel if Learfield did nothing. The investigation, whether Title IX or not, provided the evidence to make that demand of Learfield. NO amount of publicity spin could knock the stink off this guy's actions and texts.

GG is right. Shame on all of you for gratuitous attacks on Amy chasing meaningless strawman issues. In the real world, if Amy was your sister and showed you his texts, you'd have all flattened this guy in a second if you had a chance. Let that sink in.

If Amy was my sister she wouldn't have waited months before filing her report/complaint. :x

You obviously recognize little of the courage it takes for a woman who works in a "man's" profession to take on the good 'ol boy network by reporting this crap. Pretty obvious to me she took steps to get him to back off nicely, hoping he would take the hint, WHICH HE DIDN'T. Did you miss that her first thought when he didn't take the hint was to get out of the profession altogether? Do you think someone in this "man's" profession would hire her down the road with this complaint pending? Since you are implying she is unbelievable by waiting, tell us the date by which she should have filed her a complaint to be believable. Give us THE date.

He's not saying she had to file a report/complaint immediately. He said his sister wouldn't have waited 7 months. I think he's also saying, and if he isn't I am, that she should have taken more action, at least via text, on the evening of Feb. 24 (or the next days). If she didn't like it or it made her uncomfortable, why didn't she just clearly say that at the time

 

[SACCAT66]

MSU athletics is a brand. This douche was the voice of that brand. There was enough evidence of behavior that would tarnish the brand that MSU had to act. This guy resigning was an olive branch to get rid of any possible future problems he could cause the brand. The only possible relevance of the JJ fiasco is even when proven a false accusation the whole sordid way it played out seriously hurt the UM brand.

While the business and law professionals want to nit-pick the hairs after splitting them, I'm confident the MSU-Learfield contract gave MSU the right to cancel if Learfield did nothing. The investigation, whether Title IX or not, provided the evidence to make that demand of Learfield. NO amount of publicity spin could knock the stink off this guy's actions and texts.

GG is right. Shame on all of you for gratuitous attacks on Amy chasing meaningless strawman issues. In the real world, if Amy was your sister and showed you his texts, you'd have all flattened this guy in a second if you had a chance. Let that sink in.

If Amy was my sister she wouldn't have waited months before filing her report/complaint. :x

It took my wife YEARS before she could finally feel safe about coming forward with what her abuser did to her. She dropped out of school (was going to UM at the time). Only after the coward killed himself did she really even talk to me about what he did to her ( I met her about 3 years after they broke up for good)...Sure her friends all knew what was going on in High School and first year of college, but they would beat the hell out of him, and then tell her that "He had learned his lesson, and would never touch her again". After his death, these same people lashed out at her because she didn't go to his funeral, and called her heartless. She now speaks to large groups about what mental and physical violence is, and can do to someone....All I am saying is, we can't, and never should, judge someone for when they came forward...Instead, let's be happy that she is among the few that had the courage to do so.

 

[PlayerRep]

MSU athletics is a brand. This douche was the voice of that brand. There was enough evidence of behavior that would tarnish the brand that MSU had to act. This guy resigning was an olive branch to get rid of any possible future problems he could cause the brand. The only possible relevance of the JJ fiasco is even when proven a false accusation the whole sordid way it played out seriously hurt the UM brand.

While the business and law professionals want to nit-pick the hairs after splitting them, I'm confident the MSU-Learfield contract gave MSU the right to cancel if Learfield did nothing. The investigation, whether Title IX or not, provided the evidence to make that demand of Learfield. NO amount of publicity spin could knock the stink off this guy's actions and texts.

GG is right. Shame on all of you for gratuitous attacks on Amy chasing meaningless strawman issues. In the real world, if Amy was your sister and showed you his texts, you'd have all flattened this guy in a second if you had a chance. Let that sink in.

Almost all people with agree with all or most of your first para.

Asking about the announcer's employer and employment relationship, or how MSU has the jurisdiction to do a Title IX proceeding in this situation, is not nit-picking or splitting hairs. These are legitimate, and I think interesting, questions.

Had the reporter or her advocates contacted Learfield or MSU, this behavior could have been stopped then, in my view. A big investigation and Title IX investigation was not necessary. One call from the MSU AD to Learfield should have been able to fix this. Showing the one text chain and saying he grabbed her butt, would have been enough.

If my sister or daughter had shown me the text chain, I wouldn't have decked the guy. I would have provided some of the suggestions I mentioned in another recent post.

 

[SACCAT66]

We haven't had some good ol' mansplaining on here in a while.

Good work, fellas.

:lol: :lol: :lol: Right!!

 

[PlayerRep]

MSU athletics is a brand. This douche was the voice of that brand. There was enough evidence of behavior that would tarnish the brand that MSU had to act. This guy resigning was an olive branch to get rid of any possible future problems he could cause the brand. The only possible relevance of the JJ fiasco is even when proven a false accusation the whole sordid way it played out seriously hurt the UM brand.

While the business and law professionals want to nit-pick the hairs after splitting them, I'm confident the MSU-Learfield contract gave MSU the right to cancel if Learfield did nothing. The investigation, whether Title IX or not, provided the evidence to make that demand of Learfield. NO amount of publicity spin could knock the stink off this guy's actions and texts.

GG is right. Shame on all of you for gratuitous attacks on Amy chasing meaningless strawman issues. In the real world, if Amy was your sister and showed you his texts, you'd have all flattened this guy in a second if you had a chance. Let that sink in.

If Amy was my sister she wouldn't have waited months before filing her report/complaint. :x

It took my wife YEARS before she could finally feel safe about coming forward with what her abuser did to her. She dropped out of school (was going to UM at the time). Only after the coward killed himself did she really even talk to me about what he did to her ( I met her about 3 years after they broke up for good)...Sure her friends all knew what was going on in High School and first year of college, but they would beat the hell out of him, and then tell her that "He had learned his lesson, and would never touch her again". After his death, these same people lashed out at her because she didn't go to his funeral, and called her heartless. She now speaks to large groups about what mental and physical violence is, and can do to someone....All I am saying is, we can't, and never should, judge someone for when they came forward...Instead, let's be happy that she is among the few that had the courage to do so.

Too bad, obviously, but your wife's situation was very different from the reporter's.

 

[SACCAT66]

MSU athletics is a brand. This douche was the voice of that brand. There was enough evidence of behavior that would tarnish the brand that MSU had to act. This guy resigning was an olive branch to get rid of any possible future problems he could cause the brand. The only possible relevance of the JJ fiasco is even when proven a false accusation the whole sordid way it played out seriously hurt the UM brand.

While the business and law professionals want to nit-pick the hairs after splitting them, I'm confident the MSU-Learfield contract gave MSU the right to cancel if Learfield did nothing. The investigation, whether Title IX or not, provided the evidence to make that demand of Learfield. NO amount of publicity spin could knock the stink off this guy's actions and texts.

GG is right. Shame on all of you for gratuitous attacks on Amy chasing meaningless strawman issues. In the real world, if Amy was your sister and showed you his texts, you'd have all flattened this guy in a second if you had a chance. Let that sink in.

If Amy was my sister she wouldn't have waited months before filing her report/complaint. :x

It took my wife YEARS before she could finally feel safe about coming forward with what her abuser did to her. She dropped out of school (was going to UM at the time). Only after the coward killed himself did she really even talk to me about what he did to her ( I met her about 3 years after they broke up for good)...Sure her friends all knew what was going on in High School and first year of college, but they would beat the hell out of him, and then tell her that "He had learned his lesson, and would never touch her again". After his death, these same people lashed out at her because she didn't go to his funeral, and called her heartless. She now speaks to large groups about what mental and physical violence is, and can do to someone....All I am saying is, we can't, and never should, judge someone for when they came forward...Instead, let's be happy that she is among the few that had the courage to do so.

Too bad, obviously, but your wife's situation was very different from the reporter's.

Yes, it was. But coming forward for any women is not the easiest thing to do.

 

[Ursa Major]

We haven't had some good ol' mansplaining on here in a while.

Good work, fellas.

:lol: :lol: :clap:

 

[EverettGriz]

This is the part I don't understand....

“The assaults and harassment are why I decided to pursue a new opportunity and leave Montana,” Just said. “I was prepared to leave the journalism industry altogether had I not found another job.”

This guy was obviously in the wrong and a huge dipshit, but why would she have to leave the state and possibly journalism all together? She did a fine job covering the Griz, but I never got the sense she liked being in Missoula anyway. Regardless, no one should have to endure what she did.

This thread is why she had to leave Montana. I read this when it was only one page and thought to myself, "Where are the anti-Hauck, anti-eGriz people now? They should see all of these regular posters standing up for this woman against the creeper. Why do they paint eGrizzers and Griz Nation as a bunch of victim-blamers and mysogynists when so many are good guys with an obvious sense of right from wrong?"

Today, I roll my eyes. Sure, not all of the evidence is exposed and there are two sides...yada yada. But, anyone with a hint of common sense can read those texts and understand the scenario. NO....men don't need to be afraid to compliment women. No...it's not unusual or suspect that Amie gave the guy her number. I've given my number to a multitude of contacts, male and female, for many reasons. Creepy is creepy. We all know it. We know when we are on the receiving end of it, and a "creeper" knows when they are doing it.

So, you have a creeper touching your ass, giving you looks, sending you texts and otherwise has you in his "sights" as a potential sexual conquest and won't take no or unending hints. Do you ignore it? Most of us HAVE ignored it time after time after time. Do you report it? Well, if so, you become the subject of this discussion and a hundred more. What did she do to deserve this? Liberal vs Conservative nonsense, why did she....give him her number? Talk to him at that party? Etc etc etc.

It's a tired comparison but, if a guy was walking down the street at night and the Voice of the Bobcats mugged him, would we pick it apart like this? Would we bring up past cases where there were false accusations of robbery? Would we say "why was he walking down the street so late? Why was he flashing that expensive Rolex if he didn't want someone to take it from him? He has always been very generous with his money. Suddenly he doesn't want someone to take it?

Most of us know right from wrong. Most of you are clear on the situation here but, damn. What would you do? This happens to women ALL OF THE TIME. What would you do? What would you advise your daughter to do? Suck it up or open herself up as a target of exhaustive scrutiny and character assassination? Politics aside, football aside.....it just sucks.

I agree 100%.

And to be fair, there have been a rare few rare knuckle dragging posters-- well, really only one "representative" primarily -- who are victim blaming. And I'm pleased to see so many others call them out for it. Now if they'd just STFU and go back to their caves, the adults can continue a meaningful discussion.

 

[zengriz]

...these situations deserves our support...
...women know there's great risk in speaking up...
...making it difficult for them to stand up for themselves...

... :argue: ...

 

[Mousegriz]

Oh good, we're getting to the stage where we question the victim.

Next stop on this well worn trail is we question her mental health stability and motivation, a quick stop at character assassination and then our final destination of fully blaming the victim.

Fun

Accusers are questioned in ever single proceeding in courts and probably most Title IX proceedings. That's how it's done. Why should accusers get passes, and the accused not?

Or, are you just a liberal who goes with narrative on things like this? Try thinking for yourself. Try using some common sense.

I'm not talking about court proceedings or stripping defendants of their ability to defend themselves. I used the pronoun 'we' to describe the typical reaction on e- griz when a woman comes forward with an accusation about a man abusing them. This also applies to any UM football player accused of any wrongdoing. This is how we- mostly YOU-- react to these situations.

You said as much in the Urban Meyer thread last fall when you admitted that you tend to defend high profile men who are accused of abuse/assault. This is a bias of yours. It's usually against females, the police or prosecutors. It usually supports those who are with power or are high profile.

This pattern and bias of yours is easily identifiable to anyone who regularly reads this board. You start with questions that invariably lead to a character assassination of the accuser.

It backfired with Beau.

I have said nothing about court proceedings or the ability to defend oneself, so don't direct that at me.

I asked why you think that an accused should not be able to defend himself, generally, and why no one should be allowed to question the accuser or say anything about the accuser. Makes zero sense to me.

I have never said that I tend to defend high profile men who are accused of abuse/assault. I don't have a bias, but I know that people are falsely accused all the time, or that accusations are often exaggerated.

I didn't defend Beau. I merely said one time, after the first press, that I thought it would be fine for him.

I have never had any "character assignation" of any accuser. Not once. You either have a bad memory, are stupid, or are biased.

You either have a bad memory or are stupid.....

 

[PlayerRep]

This is the part I don't understand....

“The assaults and harassment are why I decided to pursue a new opportunity and leave Montana,” Just said. “I was prepared to leave the journalism industry altogether had I not found another job.”

This guy was obviously in the wrong and a huge dipshit, but why would she have to leave the state and possibly journalism all together? She did a fine job covering the Griz, but I never got the sense she liked being in Missoula anyway. Regardless, no one should have to endure what she did.

This thread is why she had to leave Montana. I read this when it was only one page and thought to myself, "Where are the anti-Hauck, anti-eGriz people now? They should see all of these regular posters standing up for this woman against the creeper. Why do they paint eGrizzers and Griz Nation as a bunch of victim-blamers and mysogynists when so many are good guys with an obvious sense of right from wrong?"

Today, I roll my eyes. Sure, not all of the evidence is exposed and there are two sides...yada yada. But, anyone with a hint of common sense can read those texts and understand the scenario. NO....men don't need to be afraid to compliment women. No...it's not unusual or suspect that Amie gave the guy her number. I've given my number to a multitude of contacts, male and female, for many reasons. Creepy is creepy. We all know it. We know when we are on the receiving end of it, and a "creeper" knows when they are doing it.

So, you have a creeper touching your ass, giving you looks, sending you texts and otherwise has you in his "sights" as a potential sexual conquest and won't take no or unending hints. Do you ignore it? Most of us HAVE ignored it time after time after time. Do you report it? Well, if so, you become the subject of this discussion and a hundred more. What did she do to deserve this? Liberal vs Conservative nonsense, why did she....give him her number? Talk to him at that party? Etc etc etc.

It's a tired comparison but, if a guy was walking down the street at night and the Voice of the Bobcats mugged him, would we pick it apart like this? Would we bring up past cases where there were false accusations of robbery? Would we say "why was he walking down the street so late? Why was he flashing that expensive Rolex if he didn't want someone to take it from him? He has always been very generous with his money. Suddenly he doesn't want someone to take it?

Most of us know right from wrong. Most of you are clear on the situation here but, damn. What would you do? This happens to women ALL OF THE TIME. What would you do? What would you advise your daughter to do? Suck it up or open herself up as a target of exhaustive scrutiny and character assassination? Politics aside, football aside.....it just sucks.

I agree 100%.

And to be fair, there have been a rare few rare knuckle dragging posters-- well, really only one "representative" primarily -- who are victim blaming. And I'm pleased to see so many others call them out for it. Now if they'd just STFU and go back to their caves, the adults can continue a meaningful discussion.

Why don't you ask GG who just helped her get a new job.