"tough" versus "dumb"

[Grizzoola]

Well, ccu's investment in cold weather gear will serve them well when they play northern teams outdoors in the playoffs, next year.

 

[LakGriz]

The game of "Macho Men" clearly blew up in our faces. Did we have any "heat retention" experts talk to anyone?

If we had taken the approach of what's the easiest way to lose body heat, we would have done what we did.

the target of macho men should be some thing other than sub-zero temps...

 

[griz5700]

Our coaches and players had a terrible approach and attitude for this game. Preparation falls on the coaches. It was a mistake to take the extra time off for Thanksgiving. A mistake to assume CCU would freeze or not be prepared for the elements. A major mistake by the coaches and trainers to allow players to decide what gear to wear - the Griz were missing ordinary tackles and dropping routine passes. Hmmm.

I watched their press conference then immediately went and watched the Griz with Delaney and Bienemann. They were serious and honest about every aspect of the game. We were joking about their mascot, questioning their ability to handle the cold, and excited to play a team that will run right at us, because that's what we're built for. ha! "Coach has been joking all week how there's only one Rooster in South Carolina..." Whoops. Atta boy, Delanaey.

 

[stubbins]

This is the most ridiculous thread this week....if it doesn't bother the players, who the fuck are you.

I have a friend who gets cold when it's below 40 degrees, the cold doesn't bother me, should I wear the same shit he does? I'd die of overheating in about 3.4 seconds...

 

[AllWeatherFan]

Well, lack of trust in science, in favor of myth, is fairly prevalent in society. We saw how that worked on Saturday.

 

[UMAlum]

This is the most ridiculous thread this week....if it doesn't bother the players, who the f*** are you.

I have a friend who gets cold when it's below 40 degrees, the cold doesn't bother me, should I wear the same shit he does? I'd die of overheating in about 3.4 seconds...

Well, it’s true for some people they can handle lower temperatures better than others. However, they are very much the exception when it comes to below zero temps. As an example, wasn’t it Hammer that was going to go to the game in shorts? I know for a fact if I had done that they would have had to carry out my carcass from Washington-Griz … probably before half time.

In any event, at the very least … the majority of our players were likely cold standing there on the sidelines … without the proper gear, etc.. That was a coaching mistake plain and simple. BTW, I support Mick overall … however all of us, including Mick, need to learn from our mistakes.

 

[stubbins]

This is the most ridiculous thread this week....if it doesn't bother the players, who the f*** are you.

I have a friend who gets cold when it's below 40 degrees, the cold doesn't bother me, should I wear the same shit he does? I'd die of overheating in about 3.4 seconds...

Well, it’s true for some people they can handle lower temperatures better than others. However, they are very much the exception when it comes to below zero temps. As an example, wasn’t it Hammer that was going to go to the game in shorts? I know for a fact if I had done that they would have had to carry out my carcass from Washington-Griz … probably before half time.

In any event, at the very least … the majority of our players were likely cold standing there on the sidelines … without the proper gear, etc.. That was a coaching mistake plain and simple. BTW, I support Mick overall … however all of us, including Mick, need to learn from our mistakes.

Out of all of the mickster's flaws as a football coach, not making his players wear long sleeves is the one that concerns you?

This has been going on since the dawn of time, and will continue to happen with football players in the cold.

 

[UMAlum]

This is the most ridiculous thread this week....if it doesn't bother the players, who the f*** are you.

I have a friend who gets cold when it's below 40 degrees, the cold doesn't bother me, should I wear the same shit he does? I'd die of overheating in about 3.4 seconds...

Well, it’s true for some people they can handle lower temperatures better than others. However, they are very much the exception when it comes to below zero temps. As an example, wasn’t it Hammer that was going to go to the game in shorts? I know for a fact if I had done that they would have had to carry out my carcass from Washington-Griz … probably before half time.

In any event, at the very least … the majority of our players were likely cold standing there on the sidelines … without the proper gear, etc.. That was a coaching mistake plain and simple. BTW, I support Mick overall … however all of us, including Mick, need to learn from our mistakes.

Out of all of the mickster's flaws as a football coach, not making his players wear long sleeves is the one that concerns you?

This has been going on since the dawn of time, and will continue to happen with football players in the cold.

This thread is about our approach to the sub-zero temps. There are other threads to discuss whatever else.

Did you watch any of the cold weather pro games this last weekend and notice that even for the players without sleeves ... when going back to the sidelines that put on their heavy duty ponchos. And, those games weren't sub-zero temps.

 

[stubbins]

This is the most ridiculous thread this week....if it doesn't bother the players, who the f*** are you.

I have a friend who gets cold when it's below 40 degrees, the cold doesn't bother me, should I wear the same shit he does? I'd die of overheating in about 3.4 seconds...

Well, it’s true for some people they can handle lower temperatures better than others. However, they are very much the exception when it comes to below zero temps. As an example, wasn’t it Hammer that was going to go to the game in shorts? I know for a fact if I had done that they would have had to carry out my carcass from Washington-Griz … probably before half time.

In any event, at the very least … the majority of our players were likely cold standing there on the sidelines … without the proper gear, etc.. That was a coaching mistake plain and simple. BTW, I support Mick overall … however all of us, including Mick, need to learn from our mistakes.

Out of all of the mickster's flaws as a football coach, not making his players wear long sleeves is the one that concerns you?

This has been going on since the dawn of time, and will continue to happen with football players in the cold.

This thread is about our approach to the sub-zero temps. There are other threads to discuss whatever else.

Did you watch any of the cold weather pro games this last weekend and notice that even for the players without sleeves ... when going back to the sidelines that put on their heavy duty ponchos. And, those games weren't sub-zero temps.

Perhaps those players wanted that? You think they were being forced to?

 

[horribilisfan8184]

This is the most ridiculous thread this week....if it doesn't bother the players, who the f*** are you.

I have a friend who gets cold when it's below 40 degrees, the cold doesn't bother me, should I wear the same shit he does? I'd die of overheating in about 3.4 seconds...

Well, it’s true for some people they can handle lower temperatures better than others. However, they are very much the exception when it comes to below zero temps. As an example, wasn’t it Hammer that was going to go to the game in shorts? I know for a fact if I had done that they would have had to carry out my carcass from Washington-Griz … probably before half time.

In any event, at the very least … the majority of our players were likely cold standing there on the sidelines … without the proper gear, etc.. That was a coaching mistake plain and simple. BTW, I support Mick overall … however all of us, including Mick, need to learn from our mistakes.

Out of all of the mickster's flaws as a football coach, not making his players wear long sleeves is the one that concerns you?

This has been going on since the dawn of time, and will continue to happen with football players in the cold.

The larger point is and should be, a guy who is 71 years old and who has been in coaching 50 years shuold not have the flaws or make rudimentary mistakes that MD makes. He got schooled by an exceptional coach on Saturday and the "aw shucks" routine from MD just shows how much he doesn't get it. I saw on Saturday a team that was well prepred for us, and a team that was not prepared for CCU. I saw a coach and team that took advantage of openings in the 2nd quarter and virtually put the game out of reach when they had the chance. I saw our team give up an 86 yard touchdown pass when they had the opportunity to demoralize CCU in the first quarter. Is it too much to expect your head coach has a modicum of understanding of stragtegy and "combat" tactics?

 

[mcg]

Well, lack of trust in science, in favor of myth, is fairly prevalent in society. We saw how that worked on Saturday.

The CCU coach said he was interested in the "science of the cold" and wanted to develop a "systematic approach" to dealing with it. Seems like science and systems won.

 

[UMAlum]

Well, it’s true for some people they can handle lower temperatures better than others. However, they are very much the exception when it comes to below zero temps. As an example, wasn’t it Hammer that was going to go to the game in shorts? I know for a fact if I had done that they would have had to carry out my carcass from Washington-Griz … probably before half time.

In any event, at the very least … the majority of our players were likely cold standing there on the sidelines … without the proper gear, etc.. That was a coaching mistake plain and simple. BTW, I support Mick overall … however all of us, including Mick, need to learn from our mistakes.

Out of all of the mickster's flaws as a football coach, not making his players wear long sleeves is the one that concerns you?

This has been going on since the dawn of time, and will continue to happen with football players in the cold.

This thread is about our approach to the sub-zero temps. There are other threads to discuss whatever else.

Did you watch any of the cold weather pro games this last weekend and notice that even for the players without sleeves ... when going back to the sidelines that put on their heavy duty ponchos. And, those games weren't sub-zero temps.

Perhaps those players wanted that? You think they were being forced to?

I understand our players can “take the cold” and yes, they are tough … that’s a given. The point is when you are cold your body does not operate optimally like it does when its not cold. The CC players were not cold on the sidelines so when they were on the field their bodies were running smoothly. For example, it might seem ironic but the CC QB didn’t need gloves because he had blood flowing properly in his extremities … due to being warm while on the sidelines.

So to really answer your question. I don’t care what the players thought they could handle in sub-zero temps ... its up to the coaches to bring common sense back into the teams thought processes.

 

[NLGrizFan]

This is the most ridiculous thread this week....if it doesn't bother the players, who the f*** are you.

I have a friend who gets cold when it's below 40 degrees, the cold doesn't bother me, should I wear the same shit he does? I'd die of overheating in about 3.4 seconds...

I agree with everything you said. Different stokes for different folks but good god man, it was -25° on their skin! You can't tell me that anyone can stand that for 3 hours. I've worked outside my entire life and I can not think of anytime that it was below zero that someone was running around with no coat for more than 10 mins. But then again, different strokes...
If someone were to show up on my crew not prepared for the weather like that, they'd be going back to the house.

 

[GrizPony]

I grew up on a farm north of Havre and there is a huge difference between 25-35 degrees and -5. I was out in that cold all day growing up and no one can handle it without burning massive energy. And then you can't handle it very long at all anyway. The players don't want to be called sissies by the past Griz players for the most part, so it was up to Mick to make them wear ponchos at a minimum in my opinion. Take the decision away from youngsters and let an experienced man (Mick) educate them. I have worn a coat on no more than five occasions in Missoula in the past 30 years as it is way, way more moderate here than Havre. I wore a t-shirt, sweater, coat and Griz windbreaker on Saturday and stayed toasty. A man uses his brain, and a fool uses his ego, to combat extreme weather.

 

[NLGrizFan]

I grew up on a farm north of Havre and there is a huge difference between 25-35 degrees and -5. I was out in that cold all day growing up and no one can handle it without burning massive energy. And then you can't handle it very long at all anyway. The players don't want to be called sissies by the past Griz players for the most part, so it was up to Mick to make them wear ponchos at a minimum in my opinion. Take the decision away from youngsters and let an experienced man (Mick) educate them. I have worn a coat on no more than five occasions in Missoula in the past 30 years as it is way, way more moderate here than Havre. I wore a t-shirt, sweater, coat and Griz windbreaker on Saturday and stayed toasty. A man uses his brain, and a fool uses his ego, to combat extreme weather.

Well put. In Nov-Feb of 2010 we did a pipeline south of Chester near Tiber Resivour and I had never seen weather like that in my entire life!! The wind, snow, and cold was insane!! After we got back to our rooms that night I watched the Great Falls news and they said it got down to -50° to -75° with the wind. It would take your breath away and make your eyes water so bad that you couldnt see now matter how much you manned up to get something done. There wasnt anyone running around in short sleeves that day. The human body isn't designed to fight off the cold and wind of that magnitude or what the temp in Wa-Griz was last Saturday.

 

[OrgonGriz]

I seem to recall seeing JJ even at the MSU game wear a parka as well as other team members. Does anyone else recall that? If that game warranted wearing them, then why not this game for craps sake???

Heck they still could have played sleeveless to "look" tuff. But come on wear the parka!!

To not wear a parka is just plain stupid! Another reason this coaching staff frustrates me. The coaches should have had enough common sense to say "Fellas time to put on some parkas".

I know they had to just be trembling on the sidelines. That takes a huge amount of energy.

I know I have up the Montana macho I can take it cold attitude years ago. Would much rather be comfortable than freeze ass cold.

I would like to think lesson learned by the Griz and coaches.... However I just don't know. I do not its just F'n stupid.

 

[mcg]

Out of all of the mickster's flaws as a football coach, not making his players wear long sleeves is the one that concerns you?

This has been going on since the dawn of time, and will continue to happen with football players in the cold.

This thread is about our approach to the sub-zero temps. There are other threads to discuss whatever else.

Did you watch any of the cold weather pro games this last weekend and notice that even for the players without sleeves ... when going back to the sidelines that put on their heavy duty ponchos. And, those games weren't sub-zero temps.

Perhaps those players wanted that? You think they were being forced to?

I understand our players can “take the cold” and yes, they are tough … that’s a given. The point is when you are cold your body does not operate optimally like it does when its not cold. The CC players were not cold on the sidelines so when they were on the field their bodies were running smoothly. For example, it might seem ironic but the CC QB didn’t need gloves because he had blood flowing properly in his extremities … due to being warm while on the sidelines.

So to really answer your question. I don’t care what the players thought they could handle in sub-zero temps ... its up to the coaches to bring common sense back into the teams thought processes.

The CCU coach gave his players the tools to deal with the cold, that's the difference. It made a huge difference in their overall approach to the game. The chicken soup was genius, it was less important whether it really made a difference, what mattered was the CCU players believed it made a difference.

 

[Grizbacker1]

I hope this puts to bed once and for all the stupid thinking such as...

...nobody but a northern team can win in the cold
...our guys don't have to dress differently for it, we're tough and used to it
...they'll fold up like accordions after a few hits in that weather

There's a reason that Moglia is successful in business...he saw the problem, analyzed it, came up with the best plan he could to deal with it, and gave his players the tools they needed to deal with it and win the game.

We jumped in the Clark Fork and stood on the sidelines freezing our nuts off.

Weather did play a factor, against us.

Weather didn't affect us, but our crappy coaching did as well as the fact the CC was prepared for the weather and outcoached the Griz

 

[PlayerRep]

This is an interesting discussion. My view is that CC handled the weather conditions very well. My impression is that UM handled the weather conditions fairly well too. I suppose, as this discussion points out, it is possible that UM didn't address the cold properly. The cold appeared to be impact JJ's throwing in that he wore gloves. My guess is that the gloves did impact his throwing. I think the ball slipped out of his hand when he threw the pick, and the gloves probably impacted that.

However, the biggest difference in the game was the 5.5 minutes near the end of the 2q when CC scored 3 TD's and UM didn't score. I supposed this could have been influenced by weather, but it certainly wasn't caused primarily the cold. The wind had some influence, but no more than is often the case in football.

The sequence of the 2d q went like this. UM finishes a 7-46 by turning it over on 4th down on the CC 27. CC goes 3 and out and punts. UM has a 7-36 drive and turns it over on 4th down at the CC 36. CC drive 69 yards in 12 play with 6:06 to go in half. UM goes 9 yards in 3 plays, and has a 34 yard punt. CC takes over on its 44 goes 56 yards in 4 plays. The CC qb has 2 runs and a TD pass. TD at 3:08 left in half. CC kicks off to 2, Henderson has short return, and he gets an unsportsmanlike penalty. UM starts from its 8. UM gets minus 2 yards in 3 plays, and has a 33 yard punt. CC starts on UM's 35. CC scores in 5 plays.

That barrage by CC put UM in a hole that it couldn't get out of. The wind held up several of the longer JJ passes and shortened several of Shaw's punts, but I don't think the weather or cold was the primary cause, or even much of the cause, of what occurred in this short period of time. It was more the good play of CC, the good field position of CC, and the inability of UM to convert on 4th downs and move the ball from closer to their goal line.

 

[grizindabox]

thought this was an "Alpha" versus "PlayerRep" thread