Good luck getting to games...

[CentralMontanan]

LOL. Missoula has a lot of "Writers and Poets"?

GTFO. Missoula is an overbuilt town that is basically Billings with less industry, worse traffic, and mountains. Quit making it seem like it's the left bank of the Seine.

 

[Iowagriz]

I just read the Missoulian article on this proposal last night. The way I read it, it sounds like the neighborhood association wants to make it safer. No one else has a problem with it as is.

My suspicion; someone bought a house on a busy street and now wants it quiet. Bring the cyclist to the table under the "safety" issue and narrow it to one lane. All in the name of safety (but now much quieter for my backyard picnics).

 

[hm.grwn.grizfan]

LOL. Missoula has a lot of "Writers and Poets"?

GTFO. Missoula is an overbuilt town that is basically Billings with less industry, worse traffic, and mountains. Quit making it seem like it's the left bank of the Seine.

I have to disagree. Missoula is no Billings, by any stretch of the imagination. The towns may share an area code, but that's about the extent of their similarities. Billings boasts a conservative cowboy culture, that is literally polar opposite of Missoula's art culture.

 

[hm.grwn.grizfan]

LOL. Missoula has a lot of "Writers and Poets"?

GTFO. Missoula is an overbuilt town that is basically Billings with less industry, worse traffic, and mountains. Quit making it seem like it's the left bank of the Seine.

I have to disagree. Missoula is no Billings, by any stretch of the imagination. The towns may share an area code, but that's about the extent of their similarities. Billings boasts a conservative cowboy culture, that is literally polar opposite of Missoula's art culture.

It's a bit of a generalization on my part to say that all of billings shares a cowboy culture, however, my point is that in terms of the cultural demographic, the towns could not be more different.

 

[octiparan]

It sounds like what is going on in Missoula is called "Traffic Calming". The idea is to slow down traffic by reducing the number of lanes and since there is only one lane where there were two most urban planners tack on a bike lane with the extra room. Other traffic calming devices are rotaries/roundabouts and pinching the width of an intersection by extending the cross walk area into the street - kind of a concrete bulge on each side of the street.

Traffic Calming was originally for residential streets that had problems with traffic cutting through them to bypass congestion and such. However, it has evolved into a tool to force people out of their cars to produce a cough, cough, sustainable environment. I've seen this in a number of cities around the country. It's always pitched as a safety act. You know - for the children

In my observations of places that use these devices, the traffic stacks up causing more local pollution, frustrated drivers, and more people cutting through residential areas to bypass the new choke point.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

As far as local and state governments go, all of you who live in MT have it soooooo good. I think CA might legalize robbery one day as long as the perp was an underprivileged person who "had no choice."

Isn't Missoula now in CA?

Not even close. Not even on the same planet.
Think about this: The California transplants that Montana gets, and everyone hates, are the ones who are FED UP with California. They have had it with California. Now, imagine what the Californians who think California is perfect are like. Then imagine them in charge.

 

[stubbins]

I think it's a great, progressive idea.... Makes driving less convenient and walking or biking more convenient. It encourages alternative transportation.

That is bullshit. Bicyclists are some of the worst people in this town. They feel entitled to do as they please and everyone else to get out of their way. When was the last time you saw one of these scumbags get a ticket?

You, sir, can presently go f*** yourself.

Go talk to Dave the fuckwad strohmeir....that dude is the worlds dumbest human/monkey.

 

[garizzalies]

As far as local and state governments go, all of you who live in MT have it soooooo good. I think CA might legalize robbery one day as long as the perp was an underprivileged person who "had no choice."

Isn't Missoula now in CA?

Not even close. Not even on the same planet.
Think about this: The California transplants that Montana gets, and everyone hates, are the ones who are FED UP with California. They have had it with California. Now, imagine what the Californians who think California is perfect are like. Then imagine them in charge.

I had a professor once that had a similar theory. He was convinced that "the california transplats that MT gets" are the weakest of the weak. He based this theory on his belief that CA was originally settled by those who weren't tough enuf to make it in the dust bowl. Fast foward to today and now we're getting the ones that aren't even tough enuf for CA.

 

[kemajic]

As far as local and state governments go, all of you who live in MT have it soooooo good. I think CA might legalize robbery one day as long as the perp was an underprivileged person who "had no choice."

Isn't Missoula now in CA?

Not even close. Not even on the same planet.
Think about this: The California transplants that Montana gets, and everyone hates, are the ones who are FED UP with California. They have had it with California. Now, imagine what the Californians who think California is perfect are like. Then imagine them in charge.

I had a professor once that had a similar theory. He was convinced that "the california transplats that MT gets" are the weakest of the weak. He based this theory on his belief that CA was originally settled by those who weren't tough enuf to make it in the dust bowl. Fast foward to today and now we're getting the ones that aren't even tough enuf for CA.

That is good; I love it. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

 

[garizzalies]

To bring this full circle:
the same professor also believed we all have a pre-determined, set number of heart beats and he always laughed at bikers as he passed them in his car because they were just killing themselves faster by speeding up their heart beat.

 

[JBS]

I think it's a great, progressive idea.... Makes driving less convenient and walking or biking more convenient. It encourages alternative transportation.

Walking and biking are "progressive"? That is what people did before the invention of the automobile therefore it is by definition "regressive". Or is the progressive agenda just the next episode of "Back to the Future"?

A progressive concept in my opinion would be one that accommodates the reality that people need jobs and so businesses need customers with reasonable access to them while doing its best to limit the impact on he environment, i.e., promotes sustainability. I think the progressives would like to turn Missoula into a big park where everyone works for the government and walks or bikes to their jobs. All of the greedy capitalists can just take their degenerate businesses elsewhere. Now THAT is a vision of Missoula's future and why I will not have a realistic chance to live there again until after I retire.

Any time the word "progressive" is used to describe something, it means that the person or movement is rooted in idiocy, and caters only to minorities. It is time that mainstream Americans stop this mindless B.S., and take back our country. This 5th-6th street thing does not surprise me, considering Missoula has become California North.

I always laugh when these threads about Missoula become political. You have a host of shithole cities to live in in Montana. By all means live there. You have a conservative city with a university 204 miles to the Southeast. By all means, go root for them. Missoula has been a liberal bastion since at least the early 70's. That covers the adult lives of most posters on this board. It's a town with lots of poets and writers and it is a town that embraces the arts. It's liberal and progressive. That's what makes it unique and special and gives it character (see also: Butte). If you want to live in a city like Great Falls or Billings, good for you, but why try and tear down something that makes another community stand out and the reason why many people want to live in that community?

Ursa, I like reading your posts but I have a big problem with this one. I love this town, was born and raised here, moved away for about 10 years in 1980 and came back. You are wrong about Missoula being like it is now since the early 70s. Sure, some hippies were around then, but they did have jobs, and most of them were loggers and mill workers. They weren't the crunchy bunch we have now. They had long hair, smoked some weed, enjoyed nature, and listened to rock and roll. They were not San Franciso hippies. Missoula at it's core is a logging town. When logging was run out about 20 years ago, the University, and the folks that it entails, got it's stranglehold on this town. That is when the crunchy bunch showed up. Non partisan elections, Dan Kemmis, in-fill, etc... This town is nothing like it was in the early 70s. I do believe that there is a conscious effort to turn it into nothing but a University town with the crunchies running everything. This is not the town of my youth, and I believe sanity will prevail. If not, then say goodbye, because if this continues it will be a ghost town.

 

[Ursa Major]

Walking and biking are "progressive"? That is what people did before the invention of the automobile therefore it is by definition "regressive". Or is the progressive agenda just the next episode of "Back to the Future"?

A progressive concept in my opinion would be one that accommodates the reality that people need jobs and so businesses need customers with reasonable access to them while doing its best to limit the impact on he environment, i.e., promotes sustainability. I think the progressives would like to turn Missoula into a big park where everyone works for the government and walks or bikes to their jobs. All of the greedy capitalists can just take their degenerate businesses elsewhere. Now THAT is a vision of Missoula's future and why I will not have a realistic chance to live there again until after I retire.

Any time the word "progressive" is used to describe something, it means that the person or movement is rooted in idiocy, and caters only to minorities. It is time that mainstream Americans stop this mindless B.S., and take back our country. This 5th-6th street thing does not surprise me, considering Missoula has become California North.

I always laugh when these threads about Missoula become political. You have a host of shithole cities to live in in Montana. By all means live there. You have a conservative city with a university 204 miles to the Southeast. By all means, go root for them. Missoula has been a liberal bastion since at least the early 70's. That covers the adult lives of most posters on this board. It's a town with lots of poets and writers and it is a town that embraces the arts. It's liberal and progressive. That's what makes it unique and special and gives it character (see also: Butte). If you want to live in a city like Great Falls or Billings, good for you, but why try and tear down something that makes another community stand out and the reason why many people want to live in that community?

Ursa, I like reading your posts but I have a big problem with this one. I love this town, was born and raised here, moved away for about 10 years in 1980 and came back. You are wrong about Missoula being like it is now since the early 70s. Sure, some hippies were around then, but they did have jobs, and most of them were loggers and mill workers. They weren't the crunchy bunch we have now. They had long hair, smoked some weed, enjoyed nature, and listened to rock and roll. They were not San Franciso hippies. Missoula at it's core is a logging town. When logging was run out about 20 years ago, the University, and the folks that it entails, got it's stranglehold on this town. That is when the crunchy bunch showed up. Non partisan elections, Dan Kemmis, in-fill, etc... This town is nothing like it was in the early 70s. I do believe that there is a conscious effort to turn it into nothing but a University town with the crunchies running everything. This is not the town of my youth, and I believe sanity will prevail. If not, then say goodbye, because if this continues it will be a ghost town.

Fair enough, JBS. I was painting with a rather broad brush to make the point that conservatives have been bashing the city of Missoula for decades. It seems ridiculous to me to tell another community how to live. I like that Missoula is unique and has its own character. With my one or two trips to Missoula a year, I don't know or pretend to know what has been going on there, in any detail, for the past 25 years. This is especially true if there have been changes in Missoula beyond the roughly 6-block radius of the Rhino that I usually inhabit...

 

[kemajic]

I always laugh when these threads about Missoula become political. You have a host of shithole cities to live in in Montana. By all means live there. You have a conservative city with a university 204 miles to the Southeast. By all means, go root for them. Missoula has been a liberal bastion since at least the early 70's. That covers the adult lives of most posters on this board. It's a town with lots of poets and writers and it is a town that embraces the arts. It's liberal and progressive. That's what makes it unique and special and gives it character (see also: Butte). If you want to live in a city like Great Falls or Billings, good for you, but why try and tear down something that makes another community stand out and the reason why many people want to live in that community?

Ursa, I like reading your posts but I have a big problem with this one. I love this town, was born and raised here, moved away for about 10 years in 1980 and came back. You are wrong about Missoula being like it is now since the early 70s. Sure, some hippies were around then, but they did have jobs, and most of them were loggers and mill workers. They weren't the crunchy bunch we have now. They had long hair, smoked some weed, enjoyed nature, and listened to rock and roll. They were not San Franciso hippies. Missoula at it's core is a logging town. When logging was run out about 20 years ago, the University, and the folks that it entails, got it's stranglehold on this town. That is when the crunchy bunch showed up. Non partisan elections, Dan Kemmis, in-fill, etc... This town is nothing like it was in the early 70s. I do believe that there is a conscious effort to turn it into nothing but a University town with the crunchies running everything. This is not the town of my youth, and I believe sanity will prevail. If not, then say goodbye, because if this continues it will be a ghost town.

Great post; you're not the only one who dislikes Ursa's post. "Shithole cities?" Really mature.

 

[snap]

I always laugh when these threads about Missoula become political. You have a host of shithole cities to live in in Montana. By all means live there. You have a conservative city with a university 204 miles to the Southeast. By all means, go root for them. Missoula has been a liberal bastion since at least the early 70's. That covers the adult lives of most posters on this board. It's a town with lots of poets and writers and it is a town that embraces the arts. It's liberal and progressive. That's what makes it unique and special and gives it character (see also: Butte). If you want to live in a city like Great Falls or Billings, good for you, but why try and tear down something that makes another community stand out and the reason why many people want to live in that community?

Ursa, I like reading your posts but I have a big problem with this one. I love this town, was born and raised here, moved away for about 10 years in 1980 and came back. You are wrong about Missoula being like it is now since the early 70s. Sure, some hippies were around then, but they did have jobs, and most of them were loggers and mill workers. They weren't the crunchy bunch we have now. They had long hair, smoked some weed, enjoyed nature, and listened to rock and roll. They were not San Franciso hippies. Missoula at it's core is a logging town. When logging was run out about 20 years ago, the University, and the folks that it entails, got it's stranglehold on this town. That is when the crunchy bunch showed up. Non partisan elections, Dan Kemmis, in-fill, etc... This town is nothing like it was in the early 70s. I do believe that there is a conscious effort to turn it into nothing but a University town with the crunchies running everything. This is not the town of my youth, and I believe sanity will prevail. If not, then say goodbye, because if this continues it will be a ghost town.

Great post; you're not the only one who dislikes Ursa's post. "Shithole cities?" Really mature.

I'm with you Kem. I've sent numerous PMs to the mods imploring them to ban Ursa. Haven't managed to gain much traction yet. It appears he's one of the "protected" posters on this board and can just spew his malevolent BS with impunity.

 

[Ursa Major]

I always laugh when these threads about Missoula become political. You have a host of shithole cities to live in in Montana. By all means live there. You have a conservative city with a university 204 miles to the Southeast. By all means, go root for them. Missoula has been a liberal bastion since at least the early 70's. That covers the adult lives of most posters on this board. It's a town with lots of poets and writers and it is a town that embraces the arts. It's liberal and progressive. That's what makes it unique and special and gives it character (see also: Butte). If you want to live in a city like Great Falls or Billings, good for you, but why try and tear down something that makes another community stand out and the reason why many people want to live in that community?

Ursa, I like reading your posts but I have a big problem with this one. I love this town, was born and raised here, moved away for about 10 years in 1980 and came back. You are wrong about Missoula being like it is now since the early 70s. Sure, some hippies were around then, but they did have jobs, and most of them were loggers and mill workers. They weren't the crunchy bunch we have now. They had long hair, smoked some weed, enjoyed nature, and listened to rock and roll. They were not San Franciso hippies. Missoula at it's core is a logging town. When logging was run out about 20 years ago, the University, and the folks that it entails, got it's stranglehold on this town. That is when the crunchy bunch showed up. Non partisan elections, Dan Kemmis, in-fill, etc... This town is nothing like it was in the early 70s. I do believe that there is a conscious effort to turn it into nothing but a University town with the crunchies running everything. This is not the town of my youth, and I believe sanity will prevail. If not, then say goodbye, because if this continues it will be a ghost town.

Great post; you're not the only one who dislikes Ursa's post. "Shithole cities?" Really mature.

I'm with you Kem. I've sent numerous PMs to the mods imploring them to ban Ursa. Haven't managed to gain much traction yet. It appears he's one of the "protected" posters on this board and can just spew his malevolent BS with impunity.

:lol:

 

[Skookum-Jim]

Missoula at it's core is a logging town.

Oh gawd! Missoula a logging town? You and Kem are a real pair. Missoula is not now nor has it ever been a logging town. The hippies in the 70's were certainly not loggers or mill workers. Some of them may have had forest service jobs piling brush, clearing trails or fire crews but that aint logging. The only reason the tiny logging industry was ever run out of town is because what little timber you had in yellow pine and small tamarack was mismanaged and taken. You are now left with jack pine thickets, brush fires and smoke. If you want to see timber go to forks Washington or better yet come visit Williams Lake British Columbia.
What's left of Montana is essentially a bunch of people running around posing as fly fisherman and hobby ranchers. You all need a hunting season on real estate developers.

 

[MrTitleist]

For not being a logging town there sure are a lot of empty logging mills around here.

 

[Ursa Major]

Sounds like it might be a good time for a musical break...

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mL7n5mEmXJo[/youtube]

 

[EverettGriz]

I agree with Ursa. Missoula prospers because it is the way it is. You may not like it, but thousands of Montanans wouldn't live anywhere else, and hundreds of thousands of visitors wouldn't spend their time and money anywhere else in Montana. A state shouldn't be homogenized. Ask nearly any non-Texan what the best city in Texas is, and I bet that an overwhelming majority of them choose Austin. Guess what? Austin couldn't be ANY more different from the rest of Texas if they all spoke Russian and wore parkas in July. It's the differences that make places great. And Missoula IS great.

That said, I'm not certain I support the idea as outlined. But Missoula needs to be more bike and pedestrian friendly, in my mind.

 

[BelierPeaux]

I think it's a great, progressive idea.... Makes driving less convenient and walking or biking more convenient. It encourages alternative transportation.

Makes road rage more prevalent.