What should UM D have done better in 2d half?

[talon38]

Been reading this entire thread, so I'll through my 2 cents in for whatever it's worth.
Yes, EWU QB did miss 2 wide open TD passes in the first half, that doesn't include the 2 he OVER threw that were caught in the end zone, but both were out of bounds. That was 14 points off the board, then the HAIL MARY after the 15 yard penalty by EWU right before half set that one up. So the score at half was 24-6, but could have easily been 20-17 in EWU's favor. I pointed this out to our fans at halftime. So I'm just guessing the UM coaches also pointed that out to the team(Griz) at the halftime.
Next, level of completion prior to this game. Eastern had played 2 very tough teams in Texas Tech (3-0) and NDSU(3-0), then once again traveled to NYC to knock off Fordham, yes without there star RB, but EWU was also down 5 starters in that game. So, EWU with an entirely new offensive coaching staff started to click and find their identity in that Fordham game and came away winners at 56-21. Next up is conference rival Griz, bus tip to Missoula. The first half should have yielded a better result than the score, but then after 3 1/2 games, the offense now found it's identity and started to click like EWU does.
I really believe this was a by product in the level of completion we'd faced in the previous weeks that the Griz HAD NOT! So what you saw in the 2nd half of the EWU/UM game was a combination of fall camp and 3 and a half game's of finally getting things rolling the way we could with a new WR corp., and offensive coaching staff and the storm was unleashed. No slight at all on the Griz on this one, but this was almost like a perfect storm brewing for EWU football.

 

[Mousegriz]

Been reading this entire thread, so I'll through my 2 cents in for whatever it's worth.
Yes, EWU QB did miss 2 wide open TD passes in the first half, that doesn't include the 2 he OVER threw that were caught in the end zone, but both were out of bounds. That was 14 points off the board, then the HAIL MARY after the 15 yard penalty by EWU right before half set that one up. So the score at half was 24-6, but could have easily been 20-17 in EWU's favor. I pointed this out to our fans at halftime. So I'm just guessing the UM coaches also pointed that out to the team(Griz) at the halftime.
Next, level of completion prior to this game. Eastern had played 2 very tough teams in Texas Tech (3-0) and NDSU(3-0), then once again traveled to NYC to knock off Fordham, yes without there star RB, but EWU was also down 5 starters in that game. So, EWU with an entirely new offensive coaching staff started to click and find their identity in that Fordham game and came away winners at 56-21. Next up is conference rival Griz, bus tip to Missoula. The first half should have yielded a better result than the score, but then after 3 1/2 games, the offense now found it's identity and started to click like EWU does.
I really believe this was a by product in the level of completion we'd faced in the previous weeks that the Griz HAD NOT! So what you saw in the 2nd half of the EWU/UM game was a combination of fall camp and 3 and a half game's of finally getting things rolling the way we could with a new WR corp., and offensive coaching staff and the storm was unleashed. No slight at all on the Griz on this one, but this was almost like a perfect storm brewing for EWU football.

You're not saying Eastern might be pretty good and some other DC's might have a hard time finding ways to stop them are you?

No way!! Couldn't be!! Keep that crap off our board!!

 

[PlayerRep]

While it's hard to defend a D that gives up so much TO and passing yards, and 6 TD's in a half, I still can put my finger on the big problems with the defense. Need inside info, I guess. Run game was pretty much shut down, except for a couple nice scrambles by qb in key situations. No really long passes for TD's. Didn't defend the swing pass well. Didn't get play calls in on about 8 or so plays. These things hurt. O could have helped out a bit more at times.

D didn't get hurt with quick passes, except for what I am calling the swing passes. QB often was able to find an open receiver late, whether the qb was standing in the pocket or on the run. Then, lots of YAC from those. Obviously, not enough pass rush at various times. But 5 sacks and some hurrys.

As I have said, EWU and Gabrud were better than I thought going in. The EWU O had a great second half, and their team showed a lot.

I still can't translate all of this into 6 TD's and a record passing day for EWU. I really don't think the D, the secondary, and Semore are that bad.

 

[AZGrizFan]

While it's hard to defend a D that gives up so much TO and passing yards, and 6 TD's in a half, I still can put my finger on the big problems with the defense. Need inside info, I guess. Run game was pretty much shut down, except for a couple nice scrambles by qb in key situations. No really long passes for TD's. Didn't defend the swing pass well. Didn't get play calls in on about 8 or so plays. These things hurt. O could have helped out a bit more at times.

D didn't get hurt with quick passes, except for what I am calling the swing passes. QB often was able to find an open receiver late, whether the qb was standing in the pocket or on the run. Then, lots of YAC from those. Obviously, not enough pass rush at various times. But 5 sacks and some hurrys.

PR, I think in the 2nd half you hit on a couple keys there:

* not getting play calls in on time and allowing a couple key scrambles extends drives and keeps the D on the field
* O could have helped a bit more--several quick 3 & outs gets the defense back on the field too quickly and they become tired
* A tired D can't generate a pass rush, which gives their QB more time, which allows the QB to find an open receiver late, again extending drives and exacerbating the situation

So, while the O did put up 40+ points, it's performance in the 3rd quarter may have helped lead to the problems experienced late in the game with all the TD's in the last 18 minutes. That doesn't excuse what happened right after half where they went right down the field and scored, but that D spent a LOT of time on the field in the 3rd quarter, some by their own failings, some by the O's.

 

[kemajic]

Didn't defend the swing pass well. Didn't get play calls in on about 8 or so plays.

Serious understatements.

 

[PlayerRep]

While it's hard to defend a D that gives up so much TO and passing yards, and 6 TD's in a half, I still can put my finger on the big problems with the defense. Need inside info, I guess. Run game was pretty much shut down, except for a couple nice scrambles by qb in key situations. No really long passes for TD's. Didn't defend the swing pass well. Didn't get play calls in on about 8 or so plays. These things hurt. O could have helped out a bit more at times.

D didn't get hurt with quick passes, except for what I am calling the swing passes. QB often was able to find an open receiver late, whether the qb was standing in the pocket or on the run. Then, lots of YAC from those. Obviously, not enough pass rush at various times. But 5 sacks and some hurrys.

PR, I think in the 2nd half you hit on a couple keys there:

* not getting play calls in on time and allowing a couple key scrambles extends drives and keeps the D on the field
* O could have helped a bit more--several quick 3 & outs gets the defense back on the field too quickly and they become tired
* A tired D can't generate a pass rush, which gives their QB more time, which allows the QB to find an open receiver late, again extending drives and exacerbating the situation

So, while the O did put up 40+ points, it's performance in the 3rd quarter may have helped lead to the problems experienced late in the game with all the TD's in the last 18 minutes. That doesn't excuse what happened right after half where they went right down the field and scored, but that D spent a LOT of time on the field in the 3rd quarter, some by their own failings, some by the O's.

Completely agree. Good summary.

 

[grizcountry420]

While it's hard to defend a D that gives up so much TO and passing yards, and 6 TD's in a half, I still can put my finger on the big problems with the defense. Need inside info, I guess. Run game was pretty much shut down, except for a couple nice scrambles by qb in key situations. No really long passes for TD's. Didn't defend the swing pass well. Didn't get play calls in on about 8 or so plays. These things hurt. O could have helped out a bit more at times.

D didn't get hurt with quick passes, except for what I am calling the swing passes. QB often was able to find an open receiver late, whether the qb was standing in the pocket or on the run. Then, lots of YAC from those. Obviously, not enough pass rush at various times. But 5 sacks and some hurrys.

PR, I think in the 2nd half you hit on a couple keys there:

* not getting play calls in on time and allowing a couple key scrambles extends drives and keeps the D on the field
* O could have helped a bit more--several quick 3 & outs gets the defense back on the field too quickly and they become tired
* A tired D can't generate a pass rush, which gives their QB more time, which allows the QB to find an open receiver late, again extending drives and exacerbating the situation

So, while the O did put up 40+ points, it's performance in the 3rd quarter may have helped lead to the problems experienced late in the game with all the TD's in the last 18 minutes. That doesn't excuse what happened right after half where they went right down the field and scored, but that D spent a LOT of time on the field in the 3rd quarter, some by their own failings, some by the O's.

Completely agree. Good summary.

That dropped TD pass in the 3rd quarter was when the wheels started to fall off. That would have put us up 31-13. Instead, we kick a field goal making it 27-13 and then Eags march down and score a TD making it 27-20. Then Gresch throws a pick and the next play they score again, making it 27-27

 

[kemajic]

That dropped TD pass in the 3rd quarter was when the wheels started to fall off. That would have put us up 31-13. Instead, we kick a field goal making it 27-13 and then Eags march down and score a TD making it 27-20. Then Gresch throws a pick and the next play they score again, making it 27-27

The last time I saw a Griz uncontested EZ drop as important as that was Talmage's in the '04 NC game.

 

[brewskis]

Tackling would be a good start. Doing anything to stop them burning us out on the perimeter with those quick outs and screens. Get Buss out there to help out.


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[cmtgrizzly]

I personally dont think lack of pass rush had anything to do with what happened in the second half. Gunrud stated in the press conference that we "loaded the box" so they knew the passes to the edge would be there. He said we did just what they expected and had what they had seen in film. You can try and get all the pressure you want but when the QB gets the ball out to the edge in about 1 second, no pass rush will get home. Feel bad for Schye as he played like his heart out on an unwinnable mission. Defending those passes with someone like Buss or anyone really gives Schye and the defense a chance.

 

[kemajic]

Tackling would be a good start. Doing anything to stop them burning us out on the perimeter with those quick outs and screens. Get Buss out there to help out.

Buss whiffed on one of them that went for a TD.

 

[mcg]

Tackling would be a good start. Doing anything to stop them burning us out on the perimeter with those quick outs and screens. Get Buss out there to help out.


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I think when an inside linebacker moved outside to help with the screen, there was usually an open receiver 7 yards downfield in the center of the field.

 

[kemajic]

Once EWU had a pattern breakdown and had two receivers right together on the sideline. Easiest situation to cover. Either of them could have caught the pass; one of them did and had YAC. If I recall correctly, they scored again on the next play.

 

[bgbigdog]

If you watch the replay, you’ll also note that many times Buss was the defender they isolated on slot guy, #7, leaving him alone to cover this kid all over the field. Buss is a great backer, but he not a safety/corner & WEWU took advantage of the mismatch. Semore may want to consider starting the game with a nickel or dime package, against the pass-happy teams like WEWU. But that may be an issue in & of, if he doesn’t think they can cover any better then having his base D out there on early downs.

Rather than the “jail break”, stand up line on obvious passing downs, maybe leave Shaw out there & blitz around him. He gets off quickly enough that he’s commanding double teams, which may allow for some cleaner lanes back to the QB.

 

[umwsufan]

Yeah, schematically EWU knew we weren't gonna be able to adjust to what they were doing in the second half. Gubrud said as much. Semore couldn't adjust, and it was painfully obvious.

But actually sustaining more than like 2 drives would've easily won us the game.

Don't agree with you. Gabrud said they knew those thing coming into the game. Why didn't EWU do whatever they did, and do it with success, in the first half? Also, Gabrud didn't say they knew Semore couldn't adjust. You just made that up.

Gabrud did say in his post game remarks that the Griz stayed in its base 4-3 defensive scheme the whole game. So maybe Semore needs to try changing looks with his front seven (3-4, 5-2, 4-4) and man up the perimeter with zone over the top or zone under, man over the top. Confusing Gubrud is difficult but confusing a young offensive line isn't. A 5-2 monster look, leaving one backer in the middle (Stram) and allowing the second backer (Buss) to freelance toward either perimeter works as long as you don't stay in it for too long. How about looping your front four every so often? Just some ideas from a former high school defensive coordinator.

Where did he say that? UM used multiple packages. They didn't just use the 4-3.

Maybe you need to listen to his post-game remarks. Are you kidding me? Multiple packages? What game were you watching? Wow!

 

[grizfan47]

While it's hard to defend a D that gives up so much TO and passing yards, and 6 TD's in a half, I still can put my finger on the big problems with the defense. Need inside info, I guess. Run game was pretty much shut down, except for a couple nice scrambles by qb in key situations. No really long passes for TD's. Didn't defend the swing pass well. Didn't get play calls in on about 8 or so plays. These things hurt. O could have helped out a bit more at times.

D didn't get hurt with quick passes, except for what I am calling the swing passes. QB often was able to find an open receiver late, whether the qb was standing in the pocket or on the run. Then, lots of YAC from those. Obviously, not enough pass rush at various times. But 5 sacks and some hurrys.

PR, I think in the 2nd half you hit on a couple keys there:

* not getting play calls in on time and allowing a couple key scrambles extends drives and keeps the D on the field
* O could have helped a bit more--several quick 3 & outs gets the defense back on the field too quickly and they become tired
* A tired D can't generate a pass rush, which gives their QB more time, which allows the QB to find an open receiver late, again extending drives and exacerbating the situation

So, while the O did put up 40+ points, it's performance in the 3rd quarter may have helped lead to the problems experienced late in the game with all the TD's in the last 18 minutes. That doesn't excuse what happened right after half where they went right down the field and scored, but that D spent a LOT of time on the field in the 3rd quarter, some by their own failings, some by the O's.

AZ, I watched the game last night on my DVR. I really should do that before posting on egriz. I was pretty hard on the defense. You see so much more then you see in the moment live with emotion riding on every play. After watching it I no longer place all the blame on the D. This was a team loss. The O left points on the field and put the D in bad positions several times. Dropped balls, poor throws, poor kickoff returns, missed assignments and much more. I have no idea what they should have done defensively. I'll leave that to the egriz experts but I do believe it was a total team loss to a good team.

 

[AZGrizFan]

While it's hard to defend a D that gives up so much TO and passing yards, and 6 TD's in a half, I still can put my finger on the big problems with the defense. Need inside info, I guess. Run game was pretty much shut down, except for a couple nice scrambles by qb in key situations. No really long passes for TD's. Didn't defend the swing pass well. Didn't get play calls in on about 8 or so plays. These things hurt. O could have helped out a bit more at times.

D didn't get hurt with quick passes, except for what I am calling the swing passes. QB often was able to find an open receiver late, whether the qb was standing in the pocket or on the run. Then, lots of YAC from those. Obviously, not enough pass rush at various times. But 5 sacks and some hurrys.

PR, I think in the 2nd half you hit on a couple keys there:

* not getting play calls in on time and allowing a couple key scrambles extends drives and keeps the D on the field
* O could have helped a bit more--several quick 3 & outs gets the defense back on the field too quickly and they become tired
* A tired D can't generate a pass rush, which gives their QB more time, which allows the QB to find an open receiver late, again extending drives and exacerbating the situation

So, while the O did put up 40+ points, it's performance in the 3rd quarter may have helped lead to the problems experienced late in the game with all the TD's in the last 18 minutes. That doesn't excuse what happened right after half where they went right down the field and scored, but that D spent a LOT of time on the field in the 3rd quarter, some by their own failings, some by the O's.

AZ, I watched the game last night on my DVR. I really should do that before posting on egriz. I was pretty hard on the defense. You see so much more then you see in the moment live with emotion riding on every play. After watching it I no longer place all the blame on the D. This was a team loss. The O left points on the field and put the D in bad positions several times. Dropped balls, poor throws, poor kickoff returns, missed assignments and much more. I have no idea what they should have done defensively. I'll leave that to the egriz experts but I do believe it was a total team loss to a good team.

Agreed...and Stitt's decision(s) to not punt the last two times, acting like it was the end of the game and we wouldn't see the ball again, directly contributed to EWU scoring twice more, and scoring quickly. Those did the team no favors either.

 

[PlayerRep]

While it's hard to defend a D that gives up so much TO and passing yards, and 6 TD's in a half, I still can put my finger on the big problems with the defense. Need inside info, I guess. Run game was pretty much shut down, except for a couple nice scrambles by qb in key situations. No really long passes for TD's. Didn't defend the swing pass well. Didn't get play calls in on about 8 or so plays. These things hurt. O could have helped out a bit more at times.

D didn't get hurt with quick passes, except for what I am calling the swing passes. QB often was able to find an open receiver late, whether the qb was standing in the pocket or on the run. Then, lots of YAC from those. Obviously, not enough pass rush at various times. But 5 sacks and some hurrys.

PR, I think in the 2nd half you hit on a couple keys there:

* not getting play calls in on time and allowing a couple key scrambles extends drives and keeps the D on the field
* O could have helped a bit more--several quick 3 & outs gets the defense back on the field too quickly and they become tired
* A tired D can't generate a pass rush, which gives their QB more time, which allows the QB to find an open receiver late, again extending drives and exacerbating the situation

So, while the O did put up 40+ points, it's performance in the 3rd quarter may have helped lead to the problems experienced late in the game with all the TD's in the last 18 minutes. That doesn't excuse what happened right after half where they went right down the field and scored, but that D spent a LOT of time on the field in the 3rd quarter, some by their own failings, some by the O's.

AZ, I watched the game last night on my DVR. I really should do that before posting on egriz. I was pretty hard on the defense. You see so much more then you see in the moment live with emotion riding on every play. After watching it I no longer place all the blame on the D. This was a team loss. The O left points on the field and put the D in bad positions several times. Dropped balls, poor throws, poor kickoff returns, missed assignments and much more. I have no idea what they should have done defensively. I'll leave that to the egriz experts but I do believe it was a total team loss to a good team.

47, I didn't watch the game on tape, but I pretty feel like you do.