What should UM D have done better in 2d half?

[GoldenEagle]

I just think the defense should've faked injuries to slow them down...much like they did...

egrizzies always turn into victims when they lose. So EAGS players were the only players shaken up/injured on the field Saturday?

 

[PlayerRep]

It is the fans job to bitch and complain about the defense. It is not the fans job to decide what should have been done different. The DC and Head Coach need to figure it out. Obviously they didn't, AGAIN!

All I can say is, playing 20 feet off your man over and over and over doesn't work...jus sayin!

No one played 20 yards off "their receiver", nor did they in zone coverage either. In zone coverage, you don't have a receiver. Assume you know that.

My post states 20 feet, not yards. There is a difference between yards and feet, assume you know that.

Oops, my bad. I have never seen or heard anyone refer the depth of the secondary in feet. 20 feet is about 7 yards. A common place to line up in man coverage is 7 yards for a corner, and maybe 8 or deeper in zone. Safeties line up deeper than that. In press, corners line up right on the line of scrimmage, and usually slightly inside the receiver. In cover 3/zone, corners are back. In cover 2, with 2 deep zone, corners can be in various positions including in press position. You may know all of this.

 

[PlayerRep]

From a GeorgeF post in another thread:

"Tucker Scheye said that he didn't think EWU did a damn thing different in the second half. He said they went a little faster is all. He said the reason for the success in the second half was, the d-ends didn't get home like they did in the first half. He praised Gubrud and then said "at the end of the day, we still have to get home and we didn't."

If this is true, and EWU didn't do anything different on O in the second half, then it doesn't look like the Griz got outreached at halftime.

I don't think the defensive coaches get off the hook that easily...in game adjustments are a thing.

But, if it's not coaching...then it is the athletes themselves? Did they get beat in their individual assignments in the second half? I think most believe the Griz players match up pretty well. At least I thought they did.

I wasn't intending to let the D coaches off the hook for anything, but people who thought Semore didn't make the right adjustments at halftime, or got out coached at halftime, are probably not correct.

What should the defense have done in the second half?

 

[PlayerRep]

I just think the defense should've faked injuries to slow them down...much like they did...

egrizzies always turn into victims when they lose. So EAGS players were the only players shaken up/injured on the field Saturday?

To my recollection, only EWU defensive players, and not any UM defensive players, had "injuries" during the game that slowed down play. EWU had at least 4 of them, and perhaps 5 or 6. Every single time, after a minute or two, the player got up and walked off just fine. It was obvious that the coaches had told them to fake injury to slow down UM's hurry-up offense. Did you even watch the game?

 

[reinell30]

It is the fans job to bitch and complain about the defense. It is not the fans job to decide what should have been done different. The DC and Head Coach need to figure it out. Obviously they didn't, AGAIN!

All I can say is, playing 20 feet off your man over and over and over doesn't work...jus sayin!

No one played 20 yards off "their receiver", nor did they in zone coverage either. In zone coverage, you don't have a receiver. Assume you know that.

My post states 20 feet, not yards. There is a difference between yards and feet, assume you know that.

Oops, my bad. I have never seen or heard anyone refer the depth of the secondary in feet. 20 feet is about 7 yards. A common place to line up in man coverage is 7 yards for a corner, and maybe 8 or deeper in zone. Safeties line up deeper than that. In press, corners line up right on the line of scrimmage, and usually slightly inside the receiver. In cover 3/zone, corners are back. In cover 2, with 2 deep zone, corners can be in various positions including in press position. You may know all of this.

Yes, believe it or not, I do know football. Coverage at 5 or more yds is way to much. I know that standard lineup position is 5-7 yds, but when it ain't working, change! This second half demonstrated our guys needed to be on them at the line. Each receiver should have been checked within 5 each time to slow them just ever so slightly to allow the defensive pass rushers a chance to get closer to the QB. I didn't see one check on the line. # 5 and #7 for EW ran freely whenever and wherever they wanted. 149 and 189 yds apiece I believe. I realize we are young at these defensive positions and we had guys hurt, but Sandry was injured and still giving 100%
in a position not comfortable to him. Sanders still needs work.

 

[SoldierGriz]

From a GeorgeF post in another thread:

"Tucker Scheye said that he didn't think EWU did a damn thing different in the second half. He said they went a little faster is all. He said the reason for the success in the second half was, the d-ends didn't get home like they did in the first half. He praised Gubrud and then said "at the end of the day, we still have to get home and we didn't."

If this is true, and EWU didn't do anything different on O in the second half, then it doesn't look like the Griz got outreached at halftime.

I don't think the defensive coaches get off the hook that easily...in game adjustments are a thing.

But, if it's not coaching...then it is the athletes themselves? Did they get beat in their individual assignments in the second half? I think most believe the Griz players match up pretty well. At least I thought they did.

I wasn't intending to let the D coaches off the hook for anything, but people who thought Semore didn't make the right adjustments at halftime, or got out coached at halftime, are probably not correct.

What should the defense have done in the second half?

Apparently, Semore made zero in-game adjustments. They kept doing the same thing - only slower as fatigue set in if you believe Schye.

If the WR screens were the issue - then Semore should have put the LBs in better positions - at least occasionally - to support. The defense needs to drive the offense to make adjustments.

I'm not sure if a better mix of man vs zone would have had a positive effect?...anyone know proportion being played in both halves?

 

[AZDoc]

I just think the defense should've faked injuries to slow them down...much like they did...

egrizzies always turn into victims when they lose. So EAGS players were the only players shaken up/injured on the field Saturday?

Oh that was a smart azz remark...excuses are just that...excuses. I'm sure it happened, as it's commonplace since Cal did to Oregon some years ago, hence the penalty if the officials feel like they are doing it. I certainly don't think that was an ACTUAL thing the defense should've done, just throwing gas on the fire.

 

[PlayerRep]

No one played 20 yards off "their receiver", nor did they in zone coverage either. In zone coverage, you don't have a receiver. Assume you know that.

My post states 20 feet, not yards. There is a difference between yards and feet, assume you know that.

Oops, my bad. I have never seen or heard anyone refer the depth of the secondary in feet. 20 feet is about 7 yards. A common place to line up in man coverage is 7 yards for a corner, and maybe 8 or deeper in zone. Safeties line up deeper than that. In press, corners line up right on the line of scrimmage, and usually slightly inside the receiver. In cover 3/zone, corners are back. In cover 2, with 2 deep zone, corners can be in various positions including in press position. You may know all of this.

Yes, believe it or not, I do know football. Coverage at 5 or more yds is way to much. I know that standard lineup position is 5-7 yds, but when it ain't working, change! This second half demonstrated our guys needed to be on them at the line. Each receiver should have been checked within 5 each time to slow them just ever so slightly to allow the defensive pass rushers a chance to get closer to the QB. I didn't see one check on the line. # 5 and #7 for EW ran freely whenever and wherever they wanted. 149 and 189 yds apiece I believe. I realize we are young at these defensive positions and we had guys hurt, but Sandry was injured and still giving 100%
in a position not comfortable to him. Sanders still needs work.

The standard line up position in zone in college is not 5-7 yards, although in cover 2 the corners can start in various positions.

 

[go96griz]

As the players got tired, the number of missed tackles increased significantly in the second half. As was mentioned by PR earlier, the DEs didn't get home in the second half very often either. The defense got gassed and our offense had several bad possessions in the 3rd which contributed to the defense being even more tired. The landslide was on and there were a few significant dropped balls that would have changed the outcome as well. Overall, it was a pretty poor second half overall by both sides of the ball that doomed the team. It started in the 3rd with a long kick return and it all went down hill pretty quickly.

 

[tnt]

From a GeorgeF post in another thread:

"Tucker Scheye said that he didn't think EWU did a damn thing different in the second half. He said they went a little faster is all. He said the reason for the success in the second half was, the d-ends didn't get home like they did in the first half. He praised Gubrud and then said "at the end of the day, we still have to get home and we didn't."

If this is true, and EWU didn't do anything different on O in the second half, then it doesn't look like the Griz got outreached at halftime.

I don't think the defensive coaches get off the hook that easily...in game adjustments are a thing.

But, if it's not coaching...then it is the athletes themselves? Did they get beat in their individual assignments in the second half? I think most believe the Griz players match up pretty well. At least I thought they did.

I wasn't intending to let the D coaches off the hook for anything, but people who thought Semore didn't make the right adjustments at halftime, or got out coached at halftime, are probably not correct.

What should the defense have done in the second half?

Nothing, typically you don't fix what ain't broke. Whats broke ware some key players and a lack of depth in in their position. NEITHER of those problems can or could be fixed by "adjustments" We lost a game by 7 to a nationally ranked team who just about everybody thought we would lose to and lose by a lot more. The only thing that concerns me at this point are the folks melting down and claiming its because they are "fans" what utter bullshit. For the first time in a LOT of Years Mick and now Stitt have developed a team that we can be proud to have represent our university. Rightly or wrongly (mostly wrongly) that wasn't the case for a while. Its a lot easier to be a fan now than an other time in the recent past. Success will come as we are able to develop and recuruit depth in the D. I have to agree with PRs assessment

 

[umwsufan]

Yeah, schematically EWU knew we weren't gonna be able to adjust to what they were doing in the second half. Gubrud said as much. Semore couldn't adjust, and it was painfully obvious.

But actually sustaining more than like 2 drives would've easily won us the game.

Don't agree with you. Gabrud said they knew those thing coming into the game. Why didn't EWU do whatever they did, and do it with success, in the first half? Also, Gabrud didn't say they knew Semore couldn't adjust. You just made that up.

Gabrud did say in his post game remarks that the Griz stayed in its base 4-3 defensive scheme the whole game. So maybe Semore needs to try changing looks with his front seven (3-4, 5-2, 4-4) and man up the perimeter with zone over the top or zone under, man over the top. Confusing Gubrud is difficult but confusing a young offensive line isn't. A 5-2 monster look, leaving one backer in the middle (Stram) and allowing the second backer (Buss) to freelance toward either perimeter works as long as you don't stay in it for too long. How about looping your front four every so often? Just some ideas from a former high school defensive coordinator.

 

[SoldierGriz]

Yeah, schematically EWU knew we weren't gonna be able to adjust to what they were doing in the second half. Gubrud said as much. Semore couldn't adjust, and it was painfully obvious.

But actually sustaining more than like 2 drives would've easily won us the game.

Don't agree with you. Gabrud said they knew those thing coming into the game. Why didn't EWU do whatever they did, and do it with success, in the first half? Also, Gabrud didn't say they knew Semore couldn't adjust. You just made that up.

Gabrud did say in his post game remarks that the Griz stayed in its base 4-3 defensive scheme the whole game. So maybe Semore needs to try changing looks with his front seven (3-4, 5-2, 4-4) and man up the perimeter with zone over the top or zone under, man over the top. Confusing Gubrud is difficult but confusing a young offensive line isn't. A 5-2 monster look, leaving one backer in the middle (Stram) and allowing the second backer (Buss) to freelance toward either perimeter works as long as you don't stay in it for too long. How about looping your front four every so often? Just some ideas from a former high school defensive coordinator.

So you are looking for work?

 

[AZGrizFan]

The $64,000 question: Is EWU's offense really that good, or is UM's D really that bad?

Because if EWU starts clicking like it did in the 2nd half Saturday, I can say with conviction we won't see another offense like THAT in conference play.

 

[AZGrizFan]

I just think the defense should've faked injuries to slow them down...much like they did...

egrizzies always turn into victims when they lose. So EAGS players were the only players shaken up/injured on the field Saturday?

To my recollection, only EWU defensive players, and not any UM defensive players, had "injuries" during the game that slowed down play. EWU had at least 4 of them, and perhaps 5 or 6. Every single time, after a minute or two, the player got up and walked off just fine. It was obvious that the coaches had told them to fake injury to slow down UM's hurry-up offense. Did you even watch the game?

Sandry at least once was lying on the field and had to be helped off. As did Buss at one point.

 

[reinell30]

The $64,000 question: Is EWU's offense really that good, or is UM's D really that bad?

Because if EWU starts clicking like it did in the 2nd half Saturday, I can say with conviction we won't see another offense like THAT in conference play.

Apparently NDSU didn't have any issues with EW offense. I bet it is because they play physical!

 

[Ursus1]

The $64,000 question: Is EWU's offense really that good, or is UM's D really that bad?

Because if EWU starts clicking like it did in the 2nd half Saturday, I can say with conviction we won't see another offense like THAT in conference play.

Apparently NDSU didn't have any issues with EW offense. I bet it is because they play physical!

And a good D coordinator and a head coach knows there is often an advantage to run fewer plays

 

[PlayerRep]

Yeah, schematically EWU knew we weren't gonna be able to adjust to what they were doing in the second half. Gubrud said as much. Semore couldn't adjust, and it was painfully obvious.

But actually sustaining more than like 2 drives would've easily won us the game.

Don't agree with you. Gabrud said they knew those thing coming into the game. Why didn't EWU do whatever they did, and do it with success, in the first half? Also, Gabrud didn't say they knew Semore couldn't adjust. You just made that up.

Gabrud did say in his post game remarks that the Griz stayed in its base 4-3 defensive scheme the whole game. So maybe Semore needs to try changing looks with his front seven (3-4, 5-2, 4-4) and man up the perimeter with zone over the top or zone under, man over the top. Confusing Gubrud is difficult but confusing a young offensive line isn't. A 5-2 monster look, leaving one backer in the middle (Stram) and allowing the second backer (Buss) to freelance toward either perimeter works as long as you don't stay in it for too long. How about looping your front four every so often? Just some ideas from a former high school defensive coordinator.

Where did he say that? UM used multiple packages. They didn't just use the 4-3.

 

[Ursus1]

From a GeorgeF post in another thread:

"Tucker Scheye said that he didn't think EWU did a damn thing different in the second half. He said they went a little faster is all. He said the reason for the success in the second half was, the d-ends didn't get home like they did in the first half. He praised Gubrud and then said "at the end of the day, we still have to get home and we didn't."

If this is true, and EWU didn't do anything different on O in the second half, then it doesn't look like the Griz got outreached at halftime.

I don't think the defensive coaches get off the hook that easily...in game adjustments are a thing.

But, if it's not coaching...then it is the athletes themselves? Did they get beat in their individual assignments in the second half? I think most believe the Griz players match up pretty well. At least I thought they did.

I wasn't intending to let the D coaches off the hook for anything, but people who thought Semore didn't make the right adjustments at halftime, or got out coached at halftime, are probably not correct.

What should the defense have done in the second half?

Nothing, typically you don't fix what ain't broke. Whats broke ware some key players and a lack of depth in in their position. NEITHER of those problems can or could be fixed by "adjustments" We lost a game by 7 to a nationally ranked team who just about everybody thought we would lose to and lose by a lot more. The only thing that concerns me at this point are the folks melting down and claiming its because they are "fans" what utter bullshit. For the first time in a LOT of Years Mick and now Stitt have developed a team that we can be proud to have represent our university. Rightly or wrongly (mostly wrongly) that wasn't the case for a while. Its a lot easier to be a fan now than an other time in the recent past. Success will come as we are able to develop and recuruit depth in the D. I have to agree with PRs assessment

Didn't you think 3 open receivers in endzone that the passes that were just a hair too long or would have been 21 points as something that needed fixing? Or if fatigue was setting in tell the damn OC your defense needs some rest so cut the hurry up and quit the going on 4th down setting up short field.

 

[PlayerRep]

I don't think the defensive coaches get off the hook that easily...in game adjustments are a thing.

But, if it's not coaching...then it is the athletes themselves? Did they get beat in their individual assignments in the second half? I think most believe the Griz players match up pretty well. At least I thought they did.

I wasn't intending to let the D coaches off the hook for anything, but people who thought Semore didn't make the right adjustments at halftime, or got out coached at halftime, are probably not correct.

What should the defense have done in the second half?

Nothing, typically you don't fix what ain't broke. Whats broke ware some key players and a lack of depth in in their position. NEITHER of those problems can or could be fixed by "adjustments" We lost a game by 7 to a nationally ranked team who just about everybody thought we would lose to and lose by a lot more. The only thing that concerns me at this point are the folks melting down and claiming its because they are "fans" what utter bullshit. For the first time in a LOT of Years Mick and now Stitt have developed a team that we can be proud to have represent our university. Rightly or wrongly (mostly wrongly) that wasn't the case for a while. Its a lot easier to be a fan now than an other time in the recent past. Success will come as we are able to develop and recuruit depth in the D. I have to agree with PRs assessment

Didn't you think 3 open receivers in endzone that the passes that were just a hair too long or would have been 21 points as something that needed fixing? Or if fatigue was setting in tell the damn OC your defense needs some rest so cut the hurry up and quit the going on 4th down setting up short field.

If you are talking about the passes "completed" out of the end zone, then I don't understand your point. Passes need to be completed in bounds. When out of bounds, they are incompletions.

 

[tnt]

I don't think the defensive coaches get off the hook that easily...in game adjustments are a thing.

But, if it's not coaching...then it is the athletes themselves? Did they get beat in their individual assignments in the second half? I think most believe the Griz players match up pretty well. At least I thought they did.

I wasn't intending to let the D coaches off the hook for anything, but people who thought Semore didn't make the right adjustments at halftime, or got out coached at halftime, are probably not correct.

What should the defense have done in the second half?

Nothing, typically you don't fix what ain't broke. Whats broke ware some key players and a lack of depth in in their position. NEITHER of those problems can or could be fixed by "adjustments" We lost a game by 7 to a nationally ranked team who just about everybody thought we would lose to and lose by a lot more. The only thing that concerns me at this point are the folks melting down and claiming its because they are "fans" what utter bullshit. For the first time in a LOT of Years Mick and now Stitt have developed a team that we can be proud to have represent our university. Rightly or wrongly (mostly wrongly) that wasn't the case for a while. Its a lot easier to be a fan now than an other time in the recent past. Success will come as we are able to develop and recuruit depth in the D. I have to agree with PRs assessment

Didn't you think 3 open receivers in endzone that the passes that were just a hair too long or would have been 21 points as something that needed fixing? Or if fatigue was setting in tell the damn OC your defense needs some rest so cut the hurry up and quit the going on 4th down setting up short field.

To the best of my knowledge no one on the griz defense was expected to throw or receive a pass.

By all means turning the ball over on punt as opposed to extending the drive is an adjustment a stupid one considering the sucess the team has going for it. Not to mention they were behind and running out of time. But I fail to see what either of those things had to do with defensive adjustments.....