TOP FCS Returning O-linemen

[uofmman1122]

So do you see how raw number of sacks as a measure of skill doesn’t make any sense?

Huh? All I stated was they need to throw infrequently based on their exceptional run game. That's it

Then why were you responding to me? I was responding to AZ's claim that judging our OL vs. theirs based on rushing yards and sacks given up being apples to oranges, not making any claims about their O being bad.

 

[AZGrizFan]

Noted. MSU one sack allowed per 17.11 attempts. UM one sack allowed per 20.05 attempts. They also scored 75 TD's to UM's 54...and averaged 42.9 ppg to UM's 33.9.

If Griz scored 42 points per game, we'd be national champions. ZERO doubt in my mind.

Yeah, because their offense was just better than ours, and it wasn't strictly because they ran the ball 50 times per game.

My point this whole time was that fixating on things like raw rushing yards and lack of raw sack numbers is how you get Cal Poly going 4-7 while leading the conference in both stats because they ran the triple option. We all want a better offense, but "run the ball as much as MSU" isn't necessarily going to make that happen. Our OL isn't built for that right now, anyways.

As for the NC stuff, MSU averaged that much and still got pasted by SDSU. I'm not sure anyone was beating them last season. If there's any team's offense we should try to emulate, to me it'd be SDSU over MSU 7 days a week.

I, in no way shape or form, am advocating to "emulate MSU's offense". Still trying to get from PR how he'd objectively measure UM's line as "better" than MSU's at the end of the year...

But I stand by my premise that if we averaged 43 ppg, we'd be national champs.

 

[uofmman1122]

Yeah, because their offense was just better than ours, and it wasn't strictly because they ran the ball 50 times per game.

My point this whole time was that fixating on things like raw rushing yards and lack of raw sack numbers is how you get Cal Poly going 4-7 while leading the conference in both stats because they ran the triple option. We all want a better offense, but "run the ball as much as MSU" isn't necessarily going to make that happen. Our OL isn't built for that right now, anyways.

As for the NC stuff, MSU averaged that much and still got pasted by SDSU. I'm not sure anyone was beating them last season. If there's any team's offense we should try to emulate, to me it'd be SDSU over MSU 7 days a week.

I, in no way shape or form, am advocating to "emulate MSU's offense". Still trying to get from PR how he'd objectively measure UM's line as "better" than MSU's at the end of the year...

But I stand by my premise that if we averaged 43 ppg, we'd be national champs.

Yeah that's fair. I just don't think there is an objective method to compare our lines when our offenses are so different. Our guys are better at pass protection, but theirs are clearly better run blockers.

 

[SoldierGriz]

Huh? All I stated was they need to throw infrequently based on their exceptional run game. That's it

Then why were you responding to me? I was responding to AZ's claim that judging our OL vs. theirs based on rushing yards and sacks given up being apples to oranges, not making any claims about their O being bad.

Look back...you responded to my post.

 

[bgbigdog]

I would have taken a fully healthy Johnson and the Griz o-line over the Cats. So, speak for yourself. The Cats had a good gimmickry offense. The Griz didn't defend it even remotely well last season.Other teams did. You don't have clue what Bobby would have done or was thinking.

A) I agree. I’d take a HEALTHY Johnson and the Griz O-line over the ‘Scats. Problem was, we didn’t really see a healthy Johnson after the break.
B) Cole Sain wasn’t a “Griz reject”. He left of his own accord.

Not one damn thing about their offense "gimmicky." They ran some inside but a mostly outside zone scheme, which has been around for decades and is even run by current professional teams like the LA Rams. Their passing game was mostly sideline fades, but regardless of where it went, they completed 60% of their throws.

I did misspeak when I said everyone though, because I didn't account for you being a the consumate narcissist. SDSU was the only team to shut them down, and most of that was having both of the QB's out. You don't average more than 300 a game if your o-line can't block their assess off. They had a wide receiver run for more than 200 in a game when they didn't have someone from the normal running back room to trot out there. They're not maulers in terms of size, they get to a spot, cut off the other guy and hold a block long enough for the runner to get by them. In fact, if you watched them play, you noted that their receivers actually blocked very well, which made that even easier in terms of gaining yards.

Everyone would have loved a healthy Johnson. But as has been said on multiple occasions here, its been two seasons in the last fifteen or sixteen that a QB made it the distance. 2021 wasnt an aberation. Runnng QB's get dinged up or worse. That they spent all their time trying to get an injured QB ready post the idaho game is what it is. QB's are good passers without their legs, and he was a streak passer at best. Johnson's absence wasn't any more of an impact on the season than the whole team coming out flat against Weebs, bozeman, (two of the four that mattered most before the post season) and the Semo. Regardless of Johnson's performance, they would have lost the Semo game without the heroics of 19 and 5.

bozeman played fourteen games last season because it didnt matter which of their QB's were playing, it was the o-line that paved the way for their offense to be successful enough to win. No one was going to beat SDSU last season. I'd put money on them to repeat that feat this season.

And finally, If you'd like to DM me, I'd be happy to explain when and from whom I heard that Sain wasn't all that and bag of chips. And it wasn't anyone who spends any time on the message board.

 

[Wolf777]

A) I agree. I’d take a HEALTHY Johnson and the Griz O-line over the ‘Scats. Problem was, we didn’t really see a healthy Johnson after the break.
B) Cole Sain wasn’t a “Griz reject”. He left of his own accord.

Not one damn thing about their offense "gimmicky." They ran some inside but a mostly outside zone scheme, which has been around for decades and is even run by current professional teams like the LA Rams. Their passing game was mostly sideline fades, but regardless of where it went, they completed 60% of their throws.

I did misspeak when I said everyone though, because I didn't account for you being a the consumate narcissist. SDSU was the only team to shut them down, and most of that was having both of the QB's out. You don't average more than 300 a game if your o-line can't block their assess off. They had a wide receiver run for more than 200 in a game when they didn't have someone from the normal running back room to trot out there. They're not maulers in terms of size, they get to a spot, cut off the other guy and hold a block long enough for the runner to get by them. In fact, if you watched them play, you noted that their receivers actually blocked very well, which made that even easier in terms of gaining yards.

Everyone would have loved a healthy Johnson. But as has been said on multiple occasions here, its been two seasons in the last fifteen or sixteen that a QB made it the distance. 2021 wasnt an aberation. Runnng QB's get dinged up or worse. That they spent all their time trying to get an injured QB ready post the idaho game is what it is. QB's are good passers without their legs, and he was a streak passer at best. Johnson's absence wasn't any more of an impact on the season than the whole team coming out flat against Weebs, bozeman, (two of the four that mattered most before the post season) and the Semo. Regardless of Johnson's performance, they would have lost the Semo game without the heroics of 19 and 5.

bozeman played fourteen games last season because it didnt matter which of their QB's were playing, it was the o-line that paved the way for their offense to be successful enough to win. No one was going to beat SDSU last season. I'd put money on them to repeat that feat this season.

And finally, If you'd like to DM me, I'd be happy to explain when and from whom I heard that Sain wasn't all that and bag of chips. And it wasn't anyone who spends any time on the message board.

There offense isn’t gimmicky per se, but saying they ran an outside zone concept and that it’s been around in the form they ran it for decades is disingenuous. The +1 running game with an outside zone makes the defense be much more accountable for an additional player. Just as when you have a running capable qb with the spread system, it comes down to discipline and run lanes which we did not do a good job of last year. I liken it to the winged t or wishbone of the past. They are perceived as gimmicky now though they were seen as novel and innovative in their time.

They have also benefited from years of strong o-line play, coaching and development and paired with true running qb’s that are tough and interchangeable is a great decision for offensive strategy. Even though they have a lot of returners, I see teams being much more prepared for their scheme this year than last. With a tougher schedule, if they start to get banged up, it might be a different season for them this year.

 

[AZGrizFan]

A) I agree. I’d take a HEALTHY Johnson and the Griz O-line over the ‘Scats. Problem was, we didn’t really see a healthy Johnson after the break.
B) Cole Sain wasn’t a “Griz reject”. He left of his own accord.

Not one damn thing about their offense "gimmicky." They ran some inside but a mostly outside zone scheme, which has been around for decades and is even run by current professional teams like the LA Rams. Their passing game was mostly sideline fades, but regardless of where it went, they completed 60% of their throws.

I did misspeak when I said everyone though, because I didn't account for you being a the consumate narcissist. SDSU was the only team to shut them down, and most of that was having both of the QB's out. You don't average more than 300 a game if your o-line can't block their assess off. They had a wide receiver run for more than 200 in a game when they didn't have someone from the normal running back room to trot out there. They're not maulers in terms of size, they get to a spot, cut off the other guy and hold a block long enough for the runner to get by them. In fact, if you watched them play, you noted that their receivers actually blocked very well, which made that even easier in terms of gaining yards.

Everyone would have loved a healthy Johnson. But as has been said on multiple occasions here, its been two seasons in the last fifteen or sixteen that a QB made it the distance. 2021 wasnt an aberation. Runnng QB's get dinged up or worse. That they spent all their time trying to get an injured QB ready post the idaho game is what it is. QB's are good passers without their legs, and he was a streak passer at best. Johnson's absence wasn't any more of an impact on the season than the whole team coming out flat against Weebs, bozeman, (two of the four that mattered most before the post season) and the Semo. Regardless of Johnson's performance, they would have lost the Semo game without the heroics of 19 and 5.

bozeman played fourteen games last season because it didnt matter which of their QB's were playing, it was the o-line that paved the way for their offense to be successful enough to win. No one was going to beat SDSU last season. I'd put money on them to repeat that feat this season.

And finally, If you'd like to DM me, I'd be happy to explain when and from whom I heard that Sain wasn't all that and bag of chips. And it wasn't anyone who spends any time on the message board.

Was all that vitriol aimed at me? Or PR?

 

[uofmman1122]

Then why were you responding to me? I was responding to AZ's claim that judging our OL vs. theirs based on rushing yards and sacks given up being apples to oranges, not making any claims about their O being bad.

Look back...you responded to my post.

Are you trolling? :lol:

Based on what objective measure?

My guess is they open up holes for more running yards than the Griz, give up fewer sacks than the Griz, and end up with higher accolades at the end of the year…If the Griz can win 2/3 of THOSE categories, I’ll agree with you.

They could be objectively worse across the board and still do that because of their pass-never offense.

 

[mthoopsfan]

Not one damn thing about their offense "gimmicky." They ran some inside but a mostly outside zone scheme, which has been around for decades and is even run by current professional teams like the LA Rams. Their passing game was mostly sideline fades, but regardless of where it went, they completed 60% of their throws.

I did misspeak when I said everyone though, because I didn't account for you being a the consumate narcissist. SDSU was the only team to shut them down, and most of that was having both of the QB's out. You don't average more than 300 a game if your o-line can't block their assess off. They had a wide receiver run for more than 200 in a game when they didn't have someone from the normal running back room to trot out there. They're not maulers in terms of size, they get to a spot, cut off the other guy and hold a block long enough for the runner to get by them. In fact, if you watched them play, you noted that their receivers actually blocked very well, which made that even easier in terms of gaining yards.

Everyone would have loved a healthy Johnson. But as has been said on multiple occasions here, its been two seasons in the last fifteen or sixteen that a QB made it the distance. 2021 wasnt an aberation. Runnng QB's get dinged up or worse. That they spent all their time trying to get an injured QB ready post the idaho game is what it is. QB's are good passers without their legs, and he was a streak passer at best. Johnson's absence wasn't any more of an impact on the season than the whole team coming out flat against Weebs, bozeman, (two of the four that mattered most before the post season) and the Semo. Regardless of Johnson's performance, they would have lost the Semo game without the heroics of 19 and 5.

bozeman played fourteen games last season because it didnt matter which of their QB's were playing, it was the o-line that paved the way for their offense to be successful enough to win. No one was going to beat SDSU last season. I'd put money on them to repeat that feat this season.

And finally, If you'd like to DM me, I'd be happy to explain when and from whom I heard that Sain wasn't all that and bag of chips. And it wasn't anyone who spends any time on the message board.

Was all that vitriol aimed at me? Or PR?

It was all directed at you. He responded to your post. He is an idiot.

 

[mthoopsfan]

A) I agree. I’d take a HEALTHY Johnson and the Griz O-line over the ‘Scats. Problem was, we didn’t really see a healthy Johnson after the break.
B) Cole Sain wasn’t a “Griz reject”. He left of his own accord.

Not one damn thing about their offense "gimmicky." They ran some inside but a mostly outside zone scheme, which has been around for decades and is even run by current professional teams like the LA Rams. Their passing game was mostly sideline fades, but regardless of where it went, they completed 60% of their throws.

I did misspeak when I said everyone though, because I didn't account for you being a the consumate narcissist. SDSU was the only team to shut them down, and most of that was having both of the QB's out. You don't average more than 300 a game if your o-line can't block their assess off. They had a wide receiver run for more than 200 in a game when they didn't have someone from the normal running back room to trot out there. They're not maulers in terms of size, they get to a spot, cut off the other guy and hold a block long enough for the runner to get by them. In fact, if you watched them play, you noted that their receivers actually blocked very well, which made that even easier in terms of gaining yards.

Everyone would have loved a healthy Johnson. But as has been said on multiple occasions here, its been two seasons in the last fifteen or sixteen that a QB made it the distance. 2021 wasnt an aberation. Runnng QB's get dinged up or worse. That they spent all their time trying to get an injured QB ready post the idaho game is what it is. QB's are good passers without their legs, and he was a streak passer at best. Johnson's absence wasn't any more of an impact on the season than the whole team coming out flat against Weebs, bozeman, (two of the four that mattered most before the post season) and the Semo. Regardless of Johnson's performance, they would have lost the Semo game without the heroics of 19 and 5.

bozeman played fourteen games last season because it didnt matter which of their QB's were playing, it was the o-line that paved the way for their offense to be successful enough to win. No one was going to beat SDSU last season. I'd put money on them to repeat that feat this season.

And finally, If you'd like to DM me, I'd be happy to explain when and from whom I heard that Sain wasn't all that and bag of chips. And it wasn't anyone who spends any time on the message board.

Okay. How many team frequently have 2 QB’s on field at the same time? Please name the teams.

How many teams have so many of the rushing yards from their QB’s?

How many teams run so much wildcat?

How many teams have so much so much of their pass game with jump ball fades?

Name all the teams with a similar offense.

You proved my point on healthy QB’s. UM offense was great with its qb healthy. MSU had 2 very good qb’s and at least one was healthy every game, except maybe SDS game. Then the Cat offense sucked.

You are a narcissist.

 

[SoldierGriz]

They won't need to throw it...

So do you see how raw number of sacks as a measure of skill doesn’t make any sense?

Are you trolling?

 

[uofmman1122]

So do you see how raw number of sacks as a measure of skill doesn’t make any sense?

Are you trolling?

This is so stupid. :lol:

You replied to me first, dude. And then got lost because I assumed you were addressing what we were talking about. This was weird, even for you.

 

[kemajic]

They could be objectively worse across the board and still do that because of their pass-never offense.

They won't need to throw it...

Everyone needs to throw it, sooner or later.

 

[SoldierGriz]

They won't need to throw it...

Everyone needs to throw it, sooner or later.

...not often when yards per carry is exceptional. Their formula works for them.

 

[SoldierGriz]

Are you trolling?

This is so stupid. :lol:

You replied to me first, dude. And then got lost because I assumed you were addressing what we were talking about. This was weird, even for you.

You responded directly to my post. You got lost, which is common for you.

Sheesh - it's not that hard. Do I need to mentor you as well?

 

[uofmman1122]

This is so stupid. :lol:

You replied to me first, dude. And then got lost because I assumed you were addressing what we were talking about. This was weird, even for you.

You responded directly to my post. You got lost, which is common for you.

Sheesh - it's not that hard. Do I need to mentor you as well?

Only if I get to take up more space in your mind and signature. :lol:

 

[SoldierGriz]

You responded directly to my post. You got lost, which is common for you.

Sheesh - it's not that hard. Do I need to mentor you as well?

Only if I get to take up more space in your mind and signature. :lol:

Ha. If you want in the signature, just ask. It's free. :lol:

 

[AZGrizFan]

Not one damn thing about their offense "gimmicky." They ran some inside but a mostly outside zone scheme, which has been around for decades and is even run by current professional teams like the LA Rams. Their passing game was mostly sideline fades, but regardless of where it went, they completed 60% of their throws.

I did misspeak when I said everyone though, because I didn't account for you being a the consumate narcissist. SDSU was the only team to shut them down, and most of that was having both of the QB's out. You don't average more than 300 a game if your o-line can't block their assess off. They had a wide receiver run for more than 200 in a game when they didn't have someone from the normal running back room to trot out there. They're not maulers in terms of size, they get to a spot, cut off the other guy and hold a block long enough for the runner to get by them. In fact, if you watched them play, you noted that their receivers actually blocked very well, which made that even easier in terms of gaining yards.

Everyone would have loved a healthy Johnson. But as has been said on multiple occasions here, its been two seasons in the last fifteen or sixteen that a QB made it the distance. 2021 wasnt an aberation. Runnng QB's get dinged up or worse. That they spent all their time trying to get an injured QB ready post the idaho game is what it is. QB's are good passers without their legs, and he was a streak passer at best. Johnson's absence wasn't any more of an impact on the season than the whole team coming out flat against Weebs, bozeman, (two of the four that mattered most before the post season) and the Semo. Regardless of Johnson's performance, they would have lost the Semo game without the heroics of 19 and 5.

bozeman played fourteen games last season because it didnt matter which of their QB's were playing, it was the o-line that paved the way for their offense to be successful enough to win. No one was going to beat SDSU last season. I'd put money on them to repeat that feat this season.

And finally, If you'd like to DM me, I'd be happy to explain when and from whom I heard that Sain wasn't all that and bag of chips. And it wasn't anyone who spends any time on the message board.

Okay. How many team frequently have 2 QB’s on field at the same time? Please name the teams.

How many teams have so many of the rushing yards from their QB’s?

How many teams run so much wildcat?

How many teams have so much so much of their pass game with jump ball fades?

Name all the teams with a similar offense.

You proved my point on healthy QB’s. UM offense was great with its qb healthy. MSU had 2 very good qb’s and at least one was healthy every game, except maybe SDS game. Then the Cat offense sucked.

You are a narcissist.

And FYI, I DO have a healthy Johnson....but as I get older....well, never mind.

 

[bgbigdog]

Not one damn thing about their offense "gimmicky." They ran some inside but a mostly outside zone scheme, which has been around for decades and is even run by current professional teams like the LA Rams. Their passing game was mostly sideline fades, but regardless of where it went, they completed 60% of their throws.

I did misspeak when I said everyone though, because I didn't account for you being a the consumate narcissist. SDSU was the only team to shut them down, and most of that was having both of the QB's out. You don't average more than 300 a game if your o-line can't block their assess off. They had a wide receiver run for more than 200 in a game when they didn't have someone from the normal running back room to trot out there. They're not maulers in terms of size, they get to a spot, cut off the other guy and hold a block long enough for the runner to get by them. In fact, if you watched them play, you noted that their receivers actually blocked very well, which made that even easier in terms of gaining yards.

Everyone would have loved a healthy Johnson. But as has been said on multiple occasions here, its been two seasons in the last fifteen or sixteen that a QB made it the distance. 2021 wasnt an aberation. Runnng QB's get dinged up or worse. That they spent all their time trying to get an injured QB ready post the idaho game is what it is. QB's are good passers without their legs, and he was a streak passer at best. Johnson's absence wasn't any more of an impact on the season than the whole team coming out flat against Weebs, bozeman, (two of the four that mattered most before the post season) and the Semo. Regardless of Johnson's performance, they would have lost the Semo game without the heroics of 19 and 5.

bozeman played fourteen games last season because it didnt matter which of their QB's were playing, it was the o-line that paved the way for their offense to be successful enough to win. No one was going to beat SDSU last season. I'd put money on them to repeat that feat this season.

And finally, If you'd like to DM me, I'd be happy to explain when and from whom I heard that Sain wasn't all that and bag of chips. And it wasn't anyone who spends any time on the message board.

Was all that vitriol aimed at me? Or PR?

Not at all. I take an incredibly dim view of the narcissist these days. And from here on out won’t be engaging.

 

[HookedonGriz]

Herder just made a list of the top returning lineman. Mayginnes was #15. Not sure who these blue bloods are but their lists suck and aren’t even close to reality. Herder isn’t perfect but much better. He has Grossman too 5 on his TE list too.