The Book

[UMGriz75]

Engstrom finally said something in the Kaimin today, that he should have said over 3 years ago when the Missoulian first started running what the Book says was over 100 stories on sexual assault.

“Truth be known, UM and Missoula are among the safest places in the country for students, and that’s historically been the case.” http://www.montanakaimin.com/news/article_4924f6dc-e8a4-11e4-b8f0-1fa95de2fa1c.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Perhaps he found out after he started reading "egriz" instead of the Missoulian. :twisted:

 

[statler & waldorf]

Those who have been wronged by the events so well documented on this site, and don't sue their tormentors, are in effect admItting they were wrong, and deserve no sympathy. The short list would include Pabst, Pflu, O'Day, and Johnson.

 

[UMGriz75]

The Book explains why UM's enrollment is down. This is a old quote from Van Valkenberg on p. 319. "Enrollment is way down. The university has a budget shortfall of $16 million this year.... [Donaldson] is one of the people principally responsible for that."

Ironic, considering MSU's recent "rape scandal."

The MSU News Service published an article December 9th on the sanctions handed down to the Montana State University chapter of Pi Kappa Alpha (ΠΚΑ), following an incident where a fraternity member allegedly raped an MSU student during a party in September. The article (as can be expected from the university's own news service) reads as an unfiltered PR statement from the office of Matt Caires, the Dean of Students, and while the subject of sexual assault is repeatedly broached, the conclusions utterly fail to address the true cause of rape: rapists. http://www.bozeman-magpie.com/perspective-full-article.php?article_id=1054" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And the claim by the Bozeman Police Department that MSU's current campus policies actively interfere with rape investigations and prevent prosecutions.
http://missoulian.com/news/state-and-regional/bozeman-police-msu-alert-may-have-interfered-with-rape-investigation/article_9e8e6ba4-7666-11e4-98c6-33205fdb2f16.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[UMGriz75]

Last week, Pabst said Krakauer had not agreed to her requests that he delay publication until he speak with "people who have actual knowledge of the events in his novel."

:clap:
http://missoulian.com/news/local/pabst-made-last-ditch-effort-to-delay-publication-of-missoula/article_ac41cc34-0b39-5381-9200-e70c39757e56.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[statler & waldorf]

Last week, Pabst said Krakauer had not agreed to her requests that he delay publication until he speak with "people who have actual knowledge of the events in his novel."

:clap:
http://missoulian.com/news/local/pabst-made-last-ditch-effort-to-delay-publication-of-missoula/article_ac41cc34-0b39-5381-9200-e70c39757e56.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If he was quoted correctly, he is admitting two things: 1) he didn't properly research his 'book,' and, 2) it is a novel, a writing of fiction. :lol:

 

[getgrizzy]

Last week, Pabst said Krakauer had not agreed to her requests that he delay publication until he speak with "people who have actual knowledge of the events in his novel."

:clap:
http://missoulian.com/news/local/pabst-made-last-ditch-effort-to-delay-publication-of-missoula/article_ac41cc34-0b39-5381-9200-e70c39757e56.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If he was quoted correctly, he is admitting two things: 1) he didn't properly research his 'book,' and, 2) it is a novel, a writing of fiction. :lol:

It's her birthday quote, not his. Maybe she doesn't know the difference. It wouldn't be a surprise.

 

[getgrizzy]

Those who have been wronged by the events so well documented on this site, and don't sue their tormentors, are in effect admItting they were wrong, and deserve no sympathy. The short list would include Pabst, Pflu, O'Day, and Johnson.

I agree. Hopefully some or all of them do.

 

[getgrizzy]

Engstrom finally said something in the Kaimin today, that he should have said over 3 years ago when the Missoulian first started running what the Book says was over 100 stories on sexual assault.

“Truth be known, UM and Missoula are among the safest places in the country for students, and that’s historically been the case.” http://www.montanakaimin.com/news/article_4924f6dc-e8a4-11e4-b8f0-1fa95de2fa1c.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Perhaps he started reading "egriz" instead of the Missoulian. :twisted:

Same thing Krakauer keeps saying.

 

[PlayerRep]

The below Newsweek review is better than I would give it, but it includes some of my criticisms. The book is also biased and unfair, jumps to a number of conclusions that have no support and are wrong, and has some outright mistakes.

"Krakauer tells a sad and infuriating story, but it is also a bit dull. Too often, the writing is uninspired and the chapters veer predictably between bits of quote, narrative and statistics or tertiary sources like psychologists and law enforcement experts. It’s not a bad book, but because this is Krakauer, expectations exceed what’s on offer."

Boring, boring.

 

[statler & waldorf]

No Pulitzer Prize for the Krak.

 

[EverettGriz]

I dropped by a large bookstore in Mill Creek this afternoon. I found two copies (evidently they aren't expecting a huge run on the thing) of the book in the Nonfiction section. I promptly carried them over to the table containing the new Fiction releases and set them down there.

 

[signedbewildered]

The below Newsweek review is better than I would give it, but it includes some of my criticisms. The book is also biased and unfair, jumps to a number of conclusions that have no support and are wrong, and has some outright mistakes.

"Krakauer tells a sad and infuriating story, but it is also a bit dull. Too often, the writing is uninspired and the chapters veer predictably between bits of quote, narrative and statistics or tertiary sources like psychologists and law enforcement experts. It’s not a bad book, but because this is Krakauer, expectations exceed what’s on offer."

Boring, boring.

Krakauer thought he had the makings of a great book. The further he got into it he found there wasn't a whole lot to see here but gosh darn, he was determined to make it something as he already had too much time and effort invested. Kind of like the DOJ and NCAA.

 

[PlayerRep]

No Pulitzer Prize for the Krak.

Florio would be in line for the PP ahead of him anyway. Krakauer basically just took her "reporting", half truths, insinuations and themes, and expanded on them. He lost me when he said that the Dean was the big hero, along with Florio and the Missoulian. When I read that, I sent a text to my friends: "OMG, I think I just got screwed (by paying $28.75 for this book).

And Pabst, Van Valkenberg, Paoli, Milt D. and the probably the police chief are the villins, and at times certain policeman and prosecutors are also the villians.

Several of the accusers who talked to Krakauer are the same people who previously talked to Florio, and which she and the Missoulian have written about numerous times. (The JJ accuser appears not to have talked to Krakauer. More power to her.) The Book says Florio and the Missoulian led to the DOJ investigation. It looks to me that this very small group of accusers, and Florio and her reporting, were probably the driving force for the DOJ investigation. Note that even the Book and Krakauer in his press are admitting that Missoula had/has a lower sexual assault complaint rate than comparable cities; and Pabst provided national statistics to the Missoulian showing that Missoula prosecuted sexual assaults complaints/cases at a higher rate than the national average.

Sure, no city or school ever investigates and prosecutes anything, including sexual assault, perfectly, and mistakes are made, and sure there is improvement in the investigation and prosecution of sexual assaults in Missoula now, and better cooperation between the school and the city. However, it is astounding how much damage a very small group of complainers (some of which was probably legitimate and some of which was probably just sour grapes), and an unfair and biased reporter and newspaper, can do and has done to Missoula and the University of Montana.

Another thing I noticed was the number of participants from the JJ case who were involved in the other case studies in the Book. The rape nurse, whom I thought was thoroughly discredited by the JJ expert and the defense lawyers, was involved in at least 3 of the case studies in the Book.

Football took a good beating. I don't know how many times Krakauer says football and players were "entitled". However, I kept thinking that of all the allegations and insinuations, from Florio and Krakauer in the past almost 3.5 years, the net result is: Donaldson, one player who didn't get a lawyer expelled, and, according to the Book, a couple players who were apparently not in school told not to return to UM. I have been told that no one player who got a lawyer to fight his UM case was expelled. Krakauer would want us to believe the low numbers was because of the bad investigation/prosecution in Missoula, but I know many of us on the board know a lot about many of these situations, including the JJ case, and it is just plain not true that poor investigation/prosecution led to these very low numbers. The incidents just didn't merit prosecution or conviction. And I don't remember any incidents or even rumors of football players involved in sexual assault in Missoula in the past several decades.

The treatment of JJ was very unfair in the Book. Krakauer just presents things favorable to the accuser and omits or barely mentions things favorable to JJ. My guess is that of the top dozen or so things favorable to JJ, Krakauer completely omits or significantly downplays about 10 of them. Jeez, after a two-week trial, I think the jury was out 138 minutes (for lunch, picking a foreman, deliberating and deciding) before the unanimous not-guilty verdict. The one juror who talked to him said she believe the jury reached the right decision, but Krakauer still had to discuss and try to make a big deal of the other things she told him.

After all the nasty and untrue stuff he said about Paoli and Pabst, I'd love to see either or both of them get a shot at him in court.

Van Valkenberg got his share of negative comments too. I don't really know Fred, but I liked how he stood up the DOJ, because I believe he was correct in asserting that they didn't have legal authority to investigation the County Attorneys office and saying that allowing them to overstep their authority would be dangerous precedent. A funny story from his retirement party. MT AG Fox spoke very positively of Fred. However, at the end, he wished Fred well in retirement but said he didn't think that Fred should run a PR firm.

 

[PlayerRep]

Here's an example of sexual assault thinking run amok.

An Iowa jury found Henry Rayhons not guilty of charges of sexually abusing his wife, an Alzheimer’s patient, by having sex with her in a nursing home after staff he was told she had become cognitively unable to give consent. In the highly unusual case, Mr. Rayhons, 78, a farmer and former state legislator who had a mutually loving relationship with his wife, faced a felony charge that could have resulted in up to 10 years in prison. He said that she would often initiate the sexual contact. Maybe Krakauer's next book can be on how this guy and people like him should be sent to prison for 10 years for taking advantage of women like this.

 

[PlayerRep]

I dropped by a large bookstore in Mill Creek this afternoon. I found two copies (evidently they aren't expecting a huge run on the thing) of the book in the Nonfiction section. I promptly carried them over to the table containing the new Fiction releases and set them down there.

Good job. Glad to see you getting with the program.

 

[statler & waldorf]

I dropped by a large bookstore in Mill Creek this afternoon. I found two copies (evidently they aren't expecting a huge run on the thing) of the book in the Nonfiction section. I promptly carried them over to the table containing the new Fiction releases and set them down there.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :thumb: :clap: :clap: :clap: You Lone Wolf insurgent you. Well done!

 

['68griz]

I dropped by a large bookstore in Mill Creek this afternoon. I found two copies (evidently they aren't expecting a huge run on the thing) of the book in the Nonfiction section. I promptly carried them over to the table containing the new Fiction releases and set them down there.

:clap: :clap:

 

[El Griz]

Wow. Scathing review from Independent Women's Forum ........ (dot Org)

http://www.iwf.org/news/2796914/Jon-Krakauer's-Campus-Rape-Crock" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[statler & waldorf]

Good find, El Griz. The articles title says it all.

 

[MrTitleist]

Jeez, after a two-week trial, I think the jury was out 138 minutes (for lunch, picking a foreman, deliberating and deciding) before the unanimous not-guilty verdict. The one juror who talked to him said she believe the jury reached the right decision, but Krakauer still had to discuss and try to make a big deal of the other things she told him.

Wasn't most of the jury made of women as well?