Stitt's Ego/Inflexibility

[Kodiak]

People, I'm sure 75, included, were flat out in love after the NDSU game. But, drop a few and you know how it goes. The major resentment towards Stitt comes from a few local kids that aren't seeing the field. Not saying that's 75's casein particular, but it's pretty obvious that two local players who aren't getting to play have really caused a stir, and that tone comes out here on Egriz, even though no one will admit that's why they don't like Stitt.

I have no idea who "two local players" are. The only one I'm familiar with, Ben Roberts, is getting good playing time, and so I'm not seeing how "resentment" would be part of it.

My skepticism about the "90 Play" strategy is as I have discussed it. It's basic statistics. The more you repeat complex tasks, the greater the accumulation of error. That was a statistical rule before the NDSU game, and it remains so to this day. I was anxious to see the strategy implemented. It is merely interesting to me how it has played out. Stitt may still "have something" there, in that "error" is also cumulative for the opposing team. But, so far, it has rushed the QB and the team, and may itself be responsible for the overthrows and "miscommunications" that, in particular, plagued Brady, even though he's supposed to be the one that has it all figured out.

What is more interesting, though, is how each successive QB has a great first game, and then goes downhill with the increased emphasis on many, short plays. There is a consistent pattern there.

And the stats definitively show the changes in game plan, by the results. And, when that plan is implemented even by an experienced QB, the results are the same. Perhaps Ash was trying to copy Stitt -- that would be interesting! -- but the fact is, both teams have gone to the shorter throw, faster pace, and it really hasn't worked well -- regardless of OL, regardless of QB experience, and regardless of Coach. To me, that illuminates the strategy itself.

I think Stitt is a great hire. He's undoubtedly smart, and if he's as smart as I think he is, or he thinks he is, this will all get figured out. I'd like to see the number of talent casualties kept to a minimum while that happens.

I will note, in that regard, that while some are taking offense at comments about the coach, apparently it has become open season on certain players; something that would be more appropriate at Wombat Nation.

Question....would you want a Dave Dickenson led offense run 60 plays a game or 90?

 

[UMGriz75]

Defensive Coordinator Ty Gregorak celebrated his 120th win in 12 seasons as a Grizzly Coach on Saturday!
Congrats Coach Gregorak!

 

[UMGriz75]

Question....would you want a Dave Dickenson led offense run 60 plays a game or 90?

60.

 

[Kodiak]

Question....would you want a Dave Dickenson led offense run 60 plays a game or 90?

60.

So you are claiming that offenses that run less plays per game are more efficient/score more points? Is this born out in historical averages of great offenses in the NCAA?

 

[UMGriz75]

Question....would you want a Dave Dickenson led offense run 60 plays a game or 90?

60.

So you are claiming that offenses that run less plays per game are more efficient/score more points? Is this born out in historical averages of great offenses in the NCAA?

No. You asked about Dave Dickenson.

 

[grizindabox]

Just to let everyone in on something....next season may not turn out to be much better than the current...I will let you all figure out why...


This change is going to take 3-4 seasons...

 

[Glendivegriz]

Are you sure it will not take 5 or 6 seasons?

 

[grizindabox]

Are you sure it will not take 5 or 6 seasons?

are you....

 

[grzz]

Many in this thread seem to downplay the reality that after the first game each QB played, the opposition had game film and was able to find their weakness.

Well, then everybody has a great win the first game of the season! Right?

And everybody loses the second game because ... game film.

Seriously? I know from reading your posts over the years you are not that dense. Ask your obvious preferred coach TG to evaluate Simis and Gus and I can guarantee he will point out the same defficiencies and more that have been highlighted in this thread.

For anyone interested in actually learning or understanding what some are talking about when they say the offense under Simis has been more basic, here is a good read:
http://smartfootball.com/grab-bag/smart-notes-defending-packaged-plays-baylors-lazy-offense-buck-sweep-murder

That guy is a great read and Twitter follow for knowledgeable analysis.

 

[Kodiak]

Question....would you want a Dave Dickenson led offense run 60 plays a game or 90?

60.

So you are claiming that offenses that run less plays per game are more efficient/score more points? Is this born out in historical averages of great offenses in the NCAA?

No. You asked about Dave Dickenson.

True. I am trying to understand. You think this offense in particular should not be trying to run 90 plays per game because their offense is inefficient due to it's complex tasks? I would take issue with your sample size of games per quarterback and definition of "experienced qb."

The reason for going with shorter throws that you are discrediting is two-fold. First is that many defenses can stop the Griz run game with 5 or fewer in the box letting the secondary play an umbrella cover scheme a good portion of the time and focusing on taking away the best Griz Offensive Threats (Jones, and Hendu). Second is that the Griz can only count on pass pro for a short time on most plays thus the need for shorter routes.

 

[UMGriz75]

True. I am trying to understand. You think this offense in particular should not be trying to run 90 plays per game because their offense is inefficient due to it's complex tasks?

It's not my theory, it is a statistical law: increase complexity arithmetically, and error increases geometrically. Our actual results confirm that.

Our best game this season had the fewest plays, the simplest, most straightforward strategy, and the most points with the least experienced QB. I'm not sure how to get the better test of a theory here; this is classic Karl Popper "falsification."

Is it that hard to see, or is confirmation bias obscuring real world data here?

 

[mcg]

True. I am trying to understand. You think this offense in particular should not be trying to run 90 plays per game because their offense is inefficient due to it's complex tasks?

It's not my theory, it is a statistical law: increase complexity arithmetically, and error increases geometrically. Our actual results confirm that.

Our best game this season had the fewest plays, the simplest, most straightforward strategy, and the most points with the least experienced QB. I'm not sure how to get the better test of a theory here; this is classic Karl Popper "falsification."

Is it that hard to see, or is confirmation bias obscuring real world data here?

If you think about Alabama and Ohio State, neither run particularly complex or sophisticated offenses, but what they do they do really really well.

 

[horribilisfan8184]

True. I am trying to understand. You think this offense in particular should not be trying to run 90 plays per game because their offense is inefficient due to it's complex tasks?

It's not my theory, it is a statistical law: increase complexity arithmetically, and error increases geometrically. Our actual results confirm that.

Our best game this season had the fewest plays, the simplest, most straightforward strategy, and the most points with the least experienced QB. I'm not sure how to get the better test of a theory here; this is classic Karl Popper "falsification."

Is it that hard to see, or is confirmation bias obscuring real world data here?

If you think about Alabama and Ohio State, neither run particularly complex or sophisticated offenses, but what they do they do really really well.

So now we get to the real bane of Griz offensive woes: lack of execution. I've watched linebackers run by 1 and even two o-linemen who miss their blocks so many times this year its downright routine. Poor route running by receivers and dropped passes only exacerbate less than stellar throwing. The talent is there, but there's a reason baseball teams carry 2-3 catchers, with some working with only one starting pitcher. That's how they stay on the same page. With 3 different QB's, its no wonder the long balls where receiver beats defender 1 on 1 worked better than timing routes. Execution comes from consistency and with all the injuries we've had that is tough to develop. Even with majority of first team reps I don't see Gus having a breakout game, even against EWU's crappy defense. Call it rust or whatever you like, its still lack of execution. Anybody remember the 60's Packers? They won Championships and Superbowls running 6 plays, but they executed them every time. (7 if you count the QB sneak)

 

[SoldierGriz]

Just to let everyone in on something....next season may not turn out to be much better than the current...I will let you all figure out why...


This change is going to take 3-4 seasons...

If this alludes to our current roster depth...don't we have the same guy coordinating our recruiting now? I ask because I am not sure. If so, what should make us confident that 3 or 4 years later we'll improve?

 

[Umista]

Last summer coach Stitt explained is coaching ideas to me and it made me believe it can work. Run many plays quickly and gain five yards or so and do it over and over again with and occasional long bomb thrown in. His key player needed to be a fast thinking/acting QB. He wanted to have about three RBs rotating in and out, all of whom could catch a pass. In the end he mentioned if our team could run many (90) plays we would wear the opposite team's defense down by the 4th quarter and we'd have a great chance of winning even though they had better players.
I liked the fact we Griz fans would see 90 plays on offense, go for it on fourth down, pass a bunch and we would add some excitement to our program. In fact I still love that style and idea. And yes I have complained about running "slow but quick Winn" up the gut for two yards. But when you think about it where else can he run? He is way to slow to run to the outside so it's about the only choice available and he plays his heart out. Our new back Calhoun can run any and everywhere. We will see him more the next two games.
We have played 4 QBs and are using our 3rd string man right now and he has done a good job. Watch for Gus to come strolling in during the next game and Lucas is still getting ready for a surprise play.
As much as I have complained about our team this season we still have a chance to beat EWU and msu and that will make up for all the complaints I and others have made.
If we live through this season I see a much better offense coming out next year. First year for coach Stitt I still give him a "B" for his coaching this year and the man has a ton of up-side potential so I expect an "A" for him next year. I like him.

 

[grizindabox]

Just to let everyone in on something....next season may not turn out to be much better than the current...I will let you all figure out why...


This change is going to take 3-4 seasons...

If this alludes to our current roster depth...don't we have the same guy coordinating our recruiting now? I ask because I am not sure. If so, what should make us confident that 3 or 4 years later we'll improve?

Not sure I really said that it would improve...more that 3-4 seasons for it to have a chance to be better...and coordinating recruiting under 2 different coaches does not mean everything will be the same...I get the feeling that Stitt is in total control of the direction of recruiting...the coordinator just keeps the process moving while making sure not rules are broken...

 

[Glendivegriz]

True. I am trying to understand. You think this offense in particular should not be trying to run 90 plays per game because their offense is inefficient due to it's complex tasks?

It's not my theory, it is a statistical law: increase complexity arithmetically, and error increases geometrically. Our actual results confirm that.

Our best game this season had the fewest plays, the simplest, most straightforward strategy, and the most points with the least experienced QB. I'm not sure how to get the better test of a theory here; this is classic Karl Popper "falsification."

Is it that hard to see, or is confirmation bias obscuring real world data here?

If you think about Alabama and Ohio State, neither run particularly complex or sophisticated offenses, but what they do they do really really well.

So now we get to the real bane of Griz offensive woes: lack of execution. I've watched linebackers run by 1 and even two o-linemen who miss their blocks so many times this year its downright routine. Poor route running by receivers and dropped passes only exacerbate less than stellar throwing. The talent is there, but there's a reason baseball teams carry 2-3 catchers, with some working with only one starting pitcher. That's how they stay on the same page. With 3 different QB's, its no wonder the long balls where receiver beats defender 1 on 1 worked better than timing routes. Execution comes from consistency and with all the injuries we've had that is tough to develop. Even with majority of first team reps I don't see Gus having a breakout game, even against EWU's crappy defense. Call it rust or whatever you like, its still lack of execution. Anybody remember the 60's Packers? They won Championships and Superbowls running 6 plays, but they executed them every time. (7 if you count the QB sneak)

:clap:

 

[mcg]

Last summer coach Stitt explained is coaching ideas to me and it made me believe it can work. Run many plays quickly and gain five yards or so and do it over and over again with and occasional long bomb thrown in.

The problem seems to be that if you get two fast one-yard runs and an incomplete pass repeatedly the Griz are in a bad place.

 

[grizindabox]

Offensive tempo is a fickle thing

 

[Grizbeer]

Just thought I would throw this one out there from 2007 - the year Griz went 11-0 then lost in the first round to Wofford. Griz O sucks. Coaches suck. O-line sucks. QB is terrible. Coaches are mean to the players. Griz have no talent, they are never going to get better, etc. At least we are consistent.

http://www.egriz.com/grizboard/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=26473