starting qb

[garizzalies]

... he was a non-factor in the 3 games after that ...

getaclue, i know you think you're being "objective" with respect to your JJ analysis but you just claimed that JJ was a non-factor in the '11 MSU game....and with that you just lost all credibility, even with most MSU fans

 

[Grizmayor]

... he was a non-factor in the 3 games after that ...

getaclue, i know you think you're being "objective" with respect to your JJ analysis but you just claimed that JJ was a non-factor in the '11 MSU game....and with that you just lost all credibility, even with most MSU fans

Well... those maroon-colored bud-lite infested goggles come out again. If you throw out the Jump-ball 79-yard Sambrano TD (and the other score on 4th down when Middleton made the catch of his life on high lob), Johnson was 14-30 for 85 yards... I wouldn't call that being a factor. The "fact"-or that really counts is we RAN all over the Cats with Moore (116 yds) and Pete (123 yds), and Growler could have been the QB that day and did the same thing... :?

 

[garizzalies]

omg, i can't believe i'm arguing with the master of game-tape review. Remove the two best passes of the day? Okay. How does that help your position? Were those plays not a "factor" in the outcome?

If you or getaclue were actually at that game, you would not be calling JJ a "non-factor." When we needed a first down in that game, or a big play, JJ got it. Period. Do you remember his 1st down scramble. I do. It was right in front of me, and it might have been the most impressive play of the game. For christ sake, even Jerry Punch has commented that JJ looked impressive in that game. In fact, I talked to bunch cat fans after that game and they all said about the same thing: "wow, i did not know JJ was that good."

Ever consider that maybe we ran over them because JJ's passing (and scrambling) ability kept them honest?

 

[granitegriz]

wbtfg:Good point. Robin P. had a lot to do with the development of MM. He also helped JJ and the receivers greatly7 improve when he was HC. Though JJ mainly needed the experience and should have played over Nate Montana in 2010. One thing the coaches helped JJ learn was to live to play another down by throwing it away instead of into coverage. That said, the offense in 2012 got worse as the season progressed and the defense got better. Giving up totally on TM was not a good coaching move. Coaching lacked a little talent for sure. Good riddance to Timmy Rosenbach...hope that guy never comes back. Time will only tell how the vertical passing game works out in 2013.

 

[Grizo406]

... he was a non-factor in the 3 games after that ...

getaclue, i know you think you're being "objective" with respect to your JJ analysis but you just claimed that JJ was a non-factor in the '11 MSU game....and with that you just lost all credibility, even with most MSU fans

Well... those maroon-colored bud-lite infested goggles come out again. If you throw out the Jump-ball 79-yard Sambrano TD (and the other score on 4th down when Middleton made the catch of his life on high lob), Johnson was 14-30 for 85 yards... I wouldn't call that being a factor. The "fact"-or that really counts is we RAN all over the Cats with Moore (116 yds) and Pete (123 yds), and Growler could have been the QB that day and did the same thing... :?

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[EverettGriz]

I'm beginning to say this more and more on this board:

This is a strange thread.

 

[getgrizzy]

... he was a non-factor in the 3 games after that ...

getaclue, i know you think you're being "objective" with respect to your JJ analysis but you just claimed that JJ was a non-factor in the '11 MSU game....and with that you just lost all credibility, even with most MSU fans

sure that was a bit of hyperbole. i'll give you that, but he wasn't a factor to the extent we could've started our backup that game and the outcome wouldn't have been much different. our defense, run game, and special teams were all bigger factors than j.j. and the passing game. he played well vs. n.a.u. and w.s.u., but was mediocre the next three games with a q.b.r. around 110-120 in each game, then lit up no. iowa and played well against s.h.s.u. he was up and down throughout his sophomore season.

as for selle and bergy not being sophomores, that's true, but they also had the likes of future n.f.l. players marc mariani and chase reynolds at their disposal, not to mention ferriter for bergy and sambrano for selle. j.j. has henderson, warren, saylor, canada, and van. that's a big dropoff unless you think j.j. is that much better than bergy and selle that he'll make up the difference.

as for grizmayor's comment, you might want to give it a listen. look who caught those two passes. we don't have a w.r. that good or a t.e. that good unless someone steps up.

just being real here.

 

[mtgrizrule]

Aren't big plays part of every sport and the outcome? I guess if we take out 2 of Mariani's big plays against South Dakota State, in the playoffs, the GRIZ lose that one and Mariani is just another average FCS WR. I just don't see the logic in taking out big plays into the evaluation equation.

 

[narly]

... he was a non-factor in the 3 games after that ...

getaclue, i know you think you're being "objective" with respect to your JJ analysis but you just claimed that JJ was a non-factor in the '11 MSU game....and with that you just lost all credibility, even with most MSU fans

Well... those maroon-colored bud-lite infested goggles come out again. If you throw out the Jump-ball 79-yard Sambrano TD (and the other score on 4th down when Middleton made the catch of his life on high lob), Johnson was 14-30 for 85 yards... I wouldn't call that being a factor. The "fact"-or that really counts is we RAN all over the Cats with Moore (116 yds) and Pete (123 yds), and Growler could have been the QB that day and did the same thing... :?

What is this hard-on you have for JJ? This kid hardly played as a true frosh, should have been red-shirted then, and started only one season when he was 19 years old. He improved dramatically during that season and led the team into the playoffs.

Why are you so down him? What, do you expect him to be the second coming of Peyton Manning? He has only one year of starting behind him. Give him a break. He has two more seasons to develop into one of the best QBs this conference has ever seen, and personally I think he is up to the task. Please don't expose your cards too soon, only to eat significant crow when he becomes the premier QB in all of FCS football.

 

[RobGriz]

Aren't big plays part of every sport and the outcome? I guess if we take out 2 of Mariani's big plays against South Dakota State, in the playoffs, the GRIZ lose that one and Mariani is just another average FCS WR. I just don't see the logic in taking out big plays into the evaluation equation.

Yes, you are exactly correct. But big plays only count when they are against us. Any big plays going our way are complete luck and should not be counted. At least that is the feeling of some.

 

[NLGrizFan]

... he was a non-factor in the 3 games after that ...

getaclue, i know you think you're being "objective" with respect to your JJ analysis but you just claimed that JJ was a non-factor in the '11 MSU game....and with that you just lost all credibility, even with most MSU fans

Well... those maroon-colored bud-lite infested goggles come out again. If you throw out the Jump-ball 79-yard Sambrano TD (and the other score on 4th down when Middleton made the catch of his life on high lob), Johnson was 14-30 for 85 yards... I wouldn't call that being a factor. The "fact"-or that really counts is we RAN all over the Cats with Moore (116 yds) and Pete (123 yds), and Growler could have been the QB that day and did the same thing... :?

What is this hard-on you have for JJ? This kid hardly played as a true frosh, should have been red-shirted then, and started only one season when he was 19 years old. He improved dramatically during that season and led the team into the playoffs.

Why are you so down him? What, do you expect him to be the second coming of Peyton Manning? He has only one year of starting behind him. Give him a break. He has two more seasons to develop into one of the best QBs this conference has ever seen, and personally I think he is up to the task. Please don't expose your cards too soon, only to eat significant crow when he becomes the premier QB in all of FCS football.

+1
The funniest past about this is that he gives off the impression that TM is better than JJ. LoL!!
This thread is gettin old....

 

[getgrizzy]

Aren't big plays part of every sport and the outcome? I guess if we take out 2 of Mariani's big plays against South Dakota State, in the playoffs, the GRIZ lose that one and Mariani is just another average FCS WR. I just don't see the logic in taking out big plays into the evaluation equation.

definitely, but the point is that selle, bergy and j.j. had playmakers in those years. in fact, they had returning bona fide playmakers going into those years. maybe one or two rise up this year, but you can't say who. we knew combinations of mariani, sambrano, ferriter, reynolds, nygyen, could make plays going into 08, 09, 11. you can't point to one guy on this team that is a proven playmaker here. no one has shown that this spring either. i know no one likes to hear it, but it has to be said. and j.j. has been inconsistent. so an inconsistent qb with no proven playmakers behind a good offensive line is what we're looking at as of right now.

 

[grizfan95]

Aren't big plays part of every sport and the outcome? I guess if we take out 2 of Mariani's big plays against South Dakota State, in the playoffs, the GRIZ lose that one and Mariani is just another average FCS WR. I just don't see the logic in taking out big plays into the evaluation equation.

definitely, but the point is that selle, bergy and j.j. had playmakers in those years. in fact, they had returning bona fide playmakers going into those years. maybe one or two rise up this year, but you can't say who. we knew combinations of mariani, sambrano, ferriter, reynolds, nygyen, could make plays going into 08, 09, 11. you can't point to one guy on this team that is a proven playmaker here. no one has shown that this spring either. i know no one likes to hear it, but it has to be said. and j.j. has been inconsistent. so an inconsistent qb with no proven playmakers behind a good offensive line is what we're looking at as of right now.

Wrong. Just like your capitalization skills, that statement's credibility is missing. Van and Canada have absolutely been tearing up spring practices. Henderson and Walcott are molding into their own. To say no one has shown anything in spring is dead wrong.

 

[getgrizzy]

Aren't big plays part of every sport and the outcome? I guess if we take out 2 of Mariani's big plays against South Dakota State, in the playoffs, the GRIZ lose that one and Mariani is just another average FCS WR. I just don't see the logic in taking out big plays into the evaluation equation.

definitely, but the point is that selle, bergy and j.j. had playmakers in those years. in fact, they had returning bona fide playmakers going into those years. maybe one or two rise up this year, but you can't say who. we knew combinations of mariani, sambrano, ferriter, reynolds, nygyen, could make plays going into 08, 09, 11. you can't point to one guy on this team that is a proven playmaker here. no one has shown that this spring either. i know no one likes to hear it, but it has to be said. and j.j. has been inconsistent. so an inconsistent qb with no proven playmakers behind a good offensive line is what we're looking at as of right now.

Wrong. Just like your capitalization skills, that statement's credibility is missing. Van and Canada have absolutely been tearing up spring practices. Henderson and Walcott are molding into their own. To say no one has shown anything in spring is dead wrong.

van + henderson = reynolds + mariani?
canada + walcott = nygyen + sambrano?
i suppose you don't like my math now either.

 

[NLGrizFan]

Aren't big plays part of every sport and the outcome? I guess if we take out 2 of Mariani's big plays against South Dakota State, in the playoffs, the GRIZ lose that one and Mariani is just another average FCS WR. I just don't see the logic in taking out big plays into the evaluation equation.

definitely, but the point is that selle, bergy and j.j. had playmakers in those years. in fact, they had returning bona fide playmakers going into those years. maybe one or two rise up this year, but you can't say who. we knew combinations of mariani, sambrano, ferriter, reynolds, nygyen, could make plays going into 08, 09, 11. you can't point to one guy on this team that is a proven playmaker here. no one has shown that this spring either. i know no one likes to hear it, but it has to be said. and j.j. has been inconsistent. so an inconsistent qb with no proven playmakers behind a good offensive line is what we're looking at as of right now.

Wrong. Just like your capitalization skills, that statement's credibility is missing. Van and Canada have absolutely been tearing up spring practices. Henderson and Walcott are molding into their own. To say no one has shown anything in spring is dead wrong.

van + henderson = reynolds + mariani?
canada + walcott = nygyen + sambrano?
i suppose you don't like my math now either.

Honestly I don't think thats a very good comparison. Basically 2 different teams and two different styles of play. Canada was running guys over the other day in Ronan. Wolcott... well I'm not gonna make an excuse about the weather but it did play a factor...

 

[granitegriz]

The sky is falling, the sky is falling!

 

[BDizzle]

definitely, but the point is that selle, bergy and j.j. had playmakers in those years. in fact, they had returning bona fide playmakers going into those years. maybe one or two rise up this year, but you can't say who. we knew combinations of mariani, sambrano, ferriter, reynolds, nygyen, could make plays going into 08, 09, 11. you can't point to one guy on this team that is a proven playmaker here. no one has shown that this spring either. i know no one likes to hear it, but it has to be said. and j.j. has been inconsistent. so an inconsistent qb with no proven playmakers behind a good offensive line is what we're looking at as of right now.

Wrong. Just like your capitalization skills, that statement's credibility is missing. Van and Canada have absolutely been tearing up spring practices. Henderson and Walcott are molding into their own. To say no one has shown anything in spring is dead wrong.

van + henderson = reynolds + mariani?
canada + walcott = nygyen + sambrano?
i suppose you don't like my math now either.

Honestly I don't think thats a very good comparison. Basically 2 different teams and two different styles of play. Canada was running guys over the other day in Ronan. Wolcott... well I'm not gonna make an excuse about the weather but it did play a factor...

Plus its not fair to compare Sophomores and Juniors to Seniors. Mariani, Reynolds, Nyguyen, and Sambrano didn't do much till their Junior years and really broke out their Senior years. Lets see where the other four are at once they graduate.

 

[NLGrizFan]

Wrong. Just like your capitalization skills, that statement's credibility is missing. Van and Canada have absolutely been tearing up spring practices. Henderson and Walcott are molding into their own. To say no one has shown anything in spring is dead wrong.

van + henderson = reynolds + mariani?
canada + walcott = nygyen + sambrano?
i suppose you don't like my math now either.

Honestly I don't think thats a very good comparison. Basically 2 different teams and two different styles of play. Canada was running guys over the other day in Ronan. Wolcott... well I'm not gonna make an excuse about the weather but it did play a factor...

Plus its not fair to compare Sophomores and Juniors to Seniors. Mariani, Reynolds, Nyguyen, and Sambrano didn't do much till their Junior years and really broke out their Senior years. Lets see where the other four are at once they graduate.

+1

 

[getgrizzy]

true, these guys are young and haven't had a full opportunity to put their skills on full display. i'm just pointing out that in the past we could point to some tangible reasons why we would be good and that isn't the case now. that don't mean we don't have playmakers. just that they haven't been developed yet. we look good on defense and they look to be in better position to carry the load than the offense. you can save the d is always ahead of the o lecture.

 

[granitegriz]

One correction, Chase tore it up his sophomore season. Just took him a little while to get going. I agree though it takes a few years for these skill players to make it and make it they do. Sambrano and MM had excellent senior years.