As a fan, I try to take the same approach that I'm sure JB drills into his team; respect every opponent. Cal is good enough to be in the tourney, was good enough to knock off well-regarded UNLV, and will play tomorrow night an hour from Berkeley. I can't think of any reason to expect them to be anything but a tough test.
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Post Mortem
- Thread starter DCOrange
- Start date
becker2117
Well-known member
Pac 12 isn't looking so weak come tourney time are they?indian-outlaw said:
First time poster here. I was raised in Missoula and I have been an avid Griz fan since my dad took me to my first game: The 1978 Big Sky Conference Championship hosted by Montana where we lost to Weber State in OT. I went to High School with Larry Krystkowiak. I now live in Texas and I don't follow Montana and the Big Sky Conference as closely as I used to.
I can not, for the life of me, figure out how is that Montana looked so bad last night. I have never seen a Big Sky Conference team look so poorly in all the years I have watched the tournament. Montana was 16-1 and the Big Sky regular season champ. The were also defending champions from last year. Has the quality of basketball in the Big Sky become so poor?
I saw the posts earlier from Syracuse fans, they are definitely good people. I was actually in Syracuse a few months ago and I will be back at the end of the year. That said, I used to be a Syracuse fan. I supported them during their run when they won the tournament in 2003. I am very dissappointed that Syracuse ran the score up to 47 point victory. I think this shows low class by coach Boehiem and his staff. My favorite team for the rest of the tournament will be "who ever plays the Orange Men",
I can not, for the life of me, figure out how is that Montana looked so bad last night. I have never seen a Big Sky Conference team look so poorly in all the years I have watched the tournament. Montana was 16-1 and the Big Sky regular season champ. The were also defending champions from last year. Has the quality of basketball in the Big Sky become so poor?
I saw the posts earlier from Syracuse fans, they are definitely good people. I was actually in Syracuse a few months ago and I will be back at the end of the year. That said, I used to be a Syracuse fan. I supported them during their run when they won the tournament in 2003. I am very dissappointed that Syracuse ran the score up to 47 point victory. I think this shows low class by coach Boehiem and his staff. My favorite team for the rest of the tournament will be "who ever plays the Orange Men",
I'm not sure you can do a post mortem if the body is dead before it hits the floor and all you do is kick it around for 40 minutes.
ALPHAGRIZ1
Well-known member
DCOrange said:
Cal has guards that you guys cant guard......they will take your zone apart at will. I unlike others on here will come back and admit if I am wrong........but I wont be.
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ALPHAGRIZ1
Well-known member
Cuse didnt run the score up. :roll:woodywar said:
Even if they did.....GOOD....you play for 40 mins and the object of the game is to score points and stop the other team from scoring points. We didnt hold up our end so we deserved to have a 50 point margin dropped on us
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BelierPeaux
Well-known member
woodywar said:
'Cuse didn't push the ball and look to run up the score. Our defense was out of position all night and cuse got easy dunks because of it. You have to shoot eventually so what would you like them to do? If the Griz didn't like the beat down, they should have done something about it. That was the big boy stage and you can't be there if you are going to get your feelings hurt. Syracuse and boheim are not to blame with the result. They were the dominant team, and that is an understatement. Had the Griz been able to hit the open shots that then normally do, then the score is maybe a 25 point game rather than a 47 point laugher.
I hope the Orangemen roll all the way through. That's the only way our loss looks remotely bareable. Go Orange!
mtgrizrule
Well-known member
Thank you Syracuse fans for the kind words and basketball talk all week.
As for me, I don't fault or blame Syracuse for anything. They did not run up the score. It is not their fault the GRIZ crappy play gave them so many more points. Hell they pulled their starters early in the 2nd half. The bench players deserve an earned opportunity to do the best they can in the time they get.
In my opinion, High School on the hand holding mentality has to stop. Coaches have obligations to their players, school, and parents of players. Syracuse did it perfectly right. They pulled their studs for their bench. I would never expect a coach from High School on to tell his players, "while you are out there, don't do anything, just run the clock." One as a player and parent of a player, I am pissed bench players not given an earned opportunity to shine, given valuable experience in the future, and valuable worthwhile playing time. Also this is much needed evaluation for coaches to gauge a player for future playing time, rather it be this season, or next. That is valuable development time.
Speaking of development, Wayne Tinkle did the right thing to by seeing what Wiley could do with some valuable trial minutes. Wiley proved to everyone the kid belongs at this level, and looked damn good in his time on the court, on both ends. It is nice to know, the coach and player now have some more confidence from that ass kicking. Kudos to Syracuse for still playing hard for both coaches being given an opportunity to develop and evaluate their young talent.
I have been on the end of a few thorough ass kickings by much better AAU and Varsity teams. It pissed me off more as a coach when the other coach had his players stop playing and giving effort. Nobody learns or improves by a team no longer giving it all. If anything, this ass kicking should serve as motivation to every player that was part of this annihilation. For Cherry, it should motivate himself to evaluate his game further, and work on what his weaknesses are, to better his chance to live his dream of making the NBA. For Jamar, he has just seen his game is not ready for the next level yet, and he too has a long way to go. He also knows how much more he has to push himself and his teammates for next season, the moment that game ended.
It looked to me the only players 100% accepted and willing to accept the pressure of this game were Gregory, Coleman , and Wiley. Granted, Gregory and Coleman also struggled statistically, at least they were looking to play their games and roles as they have all season. Unfortunately the results were not there for them either, but the right attitude was. Not sure what happened to the rest of the team, but they let themselves and their team down. Collectively, the GRIZ lost their identity of team ball, especially on offense. That started with Will Cherry and Kareem Jamar. I honestly believe they pressed too much and they let the results and pressure get to them. However, that was the time for them to remember team ball is what got us here, and let's play like we have all year. They did not do that. They lost their confidence, and became selfish in this game.
I hope every player learned from this game. I know damn well the coaches know all this, and more. They are ready to build on it. Wayne said it well on his radio show last week, we cannot be happy with just getting to the dance. We are aiming to win games. He said it during the game and after the game too. Wayne gets it. As to how the coaches pass that onto players, I don't know. It is time to have the attitude of "we belong here", verses "we dominated our conference and we are not expected to win, and we are the under dog."
That dog needs to show a lot more bite. I honestly wanted to see someone knock any player from Syracuse on their ass early to make a statement. I did not want to see a cheap shot, but at least hit them hard going to the hole. Jordan Gregory showed he was there to face them, win or lose by taking that elbow, and not backing down one damn bit. The whole team needs to learn the never back down mentality Jordan Gregory brings. It would do wonders if his mentality were to rub onto every player.
That kid is tough as nails, and so happy the GRIZ have him for 2 more years. I love every kid on this team, and know they all bring something good to the team. Let's see how much this ass kicking motivates them to their games, conditioning, and the weight room in the off season?
GO GRIZ!!!
As for me, I don't fault or blame Syracuse for anything. They did not run up the score. It is not their fault the GRIZ crappy play gave them so many more points. Hell they pulled their starters early in the 2nd half. The bench players deserve an earned opportunity to do the best they can in the time they get.
In my opinion, High School on the hand holding mentality has to stop. Coaches have obligations to their players, school, and parents of players. Syracuse did it perfectly right. They pulled their studs for their bench. I would never expect a coach from High School on to tell his players, "while you are out there, don't do anything, just run the clock." One as a player and parent of a player, I am pissed bench players not given an earned opportunity to shine, given valuable experience in the future, and valuable worthwhile playing time. Also this is much needed evaluation for coaches to gauge a player for future playing time, rather it be this season, or next. That is valuable development time.
Speaking of development, Wayne Tinkle did the right thing to by seeing what Wiley could do with some valuable trial minutes. Wiley proved to everyone the kid belongs at this level, and looked damn good in his time on the court, on both ends. It is nice to know, the coach and player now have some more confidence from that ass kicking. Kudos to Syracuse for still playing hard for both coaches being given an opportunity to develop and evaluate their young talent.
I have been on the end of a few thorough ass kickings by much better AAU and Varsity teams. It pissed me off more as a coach when the other coach had his players stop playing and giving effort. Nobody learns or improves by a team no longer giving it all. If anything, this ass kicking should serve as motivation to every player that was part of this annihilation. For Cherry, it should motivate himself to evaluate his game further, and work on what his weaknesses are, to better his chance to live his dream of making the NBA. For Jamar, he has just seen his game is not ready for the next level yet, and he too has a long way to go. He also knows how much more he has to push himself and his teammates for next season, the moment that game ended.
It looked to me the only players 100% accepted and willing to accept the pressure of this game were Gregory, Coleman , and Wiley. Granted, Gregory and Coleman also struggled statistically, at least they were looking to play their games and roles as they have all season. Unfortunately the results were not there for them either, but the right attitude was. Not sure what happened to the rest of the team, but they let themselves and their team down. Collectively, the GRIZ lost their identity of team ball, especially on offense. That started with Will Cherry and Kareem Jamar. I honestly believe they pressed too much and they let the results and pressure get to them. However, that was the time for them to remember team ball is what got us here, and let's play like we have all year. They did not do that. They lost their confidence, and became selfish in this game.
I hope every player learned from this game. I know damn well the coaches know all this, and more. They are ready to build on it. Wayne said it well on his radio show last week, we cannot be happy with just getting to the dance. We are aiming to win games. He said it during the game and after the game too. Wayne gets it. As to how the coaches pass that onto players, I don't know. It is time to have the attitude of "we belong here", verses "we dominated our conference and we are not expected to win, and we are the under dog."
That dog needs to show a lot more bite. I honestly wanted to see someone knock any player from Syracuse on their ass early to make a statement. I did not want to see a cheap shot, but at least hit them hard going to the hole. Jordan Gregory showed he was there to face them, win or lose by taking that elbow, and not backing down one damn bit. The whole team needs to learn the never back down mentality Jordan Gregory brings. It would do wonders if his mentality were to rub onto every player.
That kid is tough as nails, and so happy the GRIZ have him for 2 more years. I love every kid on this team, and know they all bring something good to the team. Let's see how much this ass kicking motivates them to their games, conditioning, and the weight room in the off season?
GO GRIZ!!!
Thanks for the informative posts. I am not able to watch the Griz play during the regular season. It did look like Cherry was trying to be a "one man show". I was curious how much losing Ward impacted the team. I would be OK with Syracuse winning by 25-30 pts, but I am not OK with them winning by 47 pts. I hope Wayne and the coaching staff learn from Thursday night's nightmare. I need to run... time to purchase a UC Berkley T-shirt... Go Bears!!
becker2117
Well-known member
Ward would have had a lot of fairly open easy free throw line jumpers...which are as close as automatic as it can get for him....if he would have been hitting that shot, the zone would have had to adjust and he could have distributed from that spot...but obviously it wouldn't have resulted in a win...but maybe a closer game.woodywar said:
Syracuse did not run up the score. Look at Louisville, they were up 20 and still had a full court press on Colorado St....that could cause a team to run up the score. Boeheim showed a lot of class by getting his starters enough playing time and putting in his reserves to get them enough time as well.
BelierPeaux
Well-known member
Syracuse was still fantastic on defense tonight but struggled shooting, particularly from the FT line. Shot a little bit better than 50%. They still beat the Golden bears. Not a good weekend to be a bear.
ALPHAGRIZ1
Well-known member
Yeah I was wrong about Cal, I though Crabbe and Cobbs would shred them and they both didnt have very good games.
Kudos to Cuse
Kudos to Cuse
Yukon said:My Dad taught me to root on however knocks you out. That way you know you got beat by the best.
With that said, I'll root on cuse unless they play the Zags. (I still want the Zags to win it all)
If at any point you believed the committee's judgment in seeding the Zags a 1, you didn't watch many games.
Just my opinion.
Hey again, Grizz fans. Well, if you watched SU and Cal last night you saw why SU is a four seed. It's just about the right average. The Orange defense is a 1, but I'm afraid that offense isn't much better than an 8. They can get away with poor shooting against Cal, but I'm afraid that won't fly against Indiana. Maybe Temple will do us a favor and ambush the Hoosiers. SU's first loss of the season was to the Owls, but it was a pretty flukey game, decided principally at the line (Temple went 29-36 while the Orange were something like 18-34). A rematch would suit me fine, although I imagine Indiana will deny me that wish. Which is ok, I guess. If SU shoots better they can beat the Hoosiers. If they don't, they won't.
I know a lot of you were pulling hard for Gonzaga. That was a tough loss and I hope it didn't set the Zags back too far. The MVC may not be as deep as some other leagues, but their top end seems to always be pretty damned good.
I know a lot of you were pulling hard for Gonzaga. That was a tough loss and I hope it didn't set the Zags back too far. The MVC may not be as deep as some other leagues, but their top end seems to always be pretty damned good.
Yukon
Well-known member
Wasn't rooting for the zags, because they were #1. Was rooting for them because I like them. Would still root for them if they were #16.CFallsGriz said:Yukon said:My Dad taught me to root on however knocks you out. That way you know you got beat by the best.
With that said, I'll root on cuse unless they play the Zags. (I still want the Zags to win it all)
If at any point you believed the committee's judgment in seeding the Zags a 1, you didn't watch many games.
Just my opinion.
becker2117
Well-known member
Nothing wrong with Gonzaga being a 1 seed this year in a season where NOBODY could hold on to that top spot....Its not the first time a 1 seed has lost on the first sat/sunday of the tourney and it sure wont be the last. Did you see how well WSU shot the 3 ball? They are a tough, very very sold team and the way that region is looking (totally trashed) they have a shot to make quite a run. Those boys in the MVC are no joke, and its not a surprise a 8/9 seed from that conf advanced to the sweet 16. Two years ago UNI had a similar amazing performance and beat Kansas...I don't remember any talk of how big of a joke it was that KU was a 1 seed, it was more about how great UNI played. So lets give the shockers some credit, they play an outstanding game.Yukon said:Wasn't rooting for the zags, because they were #1. Was rooting for them because I like them. Would still root for them if they were #16.CFallsGriz said:Yukon said:My Dad taught me to root on however knocks you out. That way you know you got beat by the best.
With that said, I'll root on cuse unless they play the Zags. (I still want the Zags to win it all)
If at any point you believed the committee's judgment in seeding the Zags a 1, you didn't watch many games.
Just my opinion.
becker2117
Well-known member
Why is somebody else posting on your account? haha jks, the cuse did a pretty solid job on those 2ALPHAGRIZ1 said:
here's a wild theory--montana may have been over-confident going into this game. i know, it sounds laughable, but here's my reasoning.
post-game, jamar said he thought they went in with an excellent game plan. of course, looking back on it, i have no idea what that plan was. to feed the ball jamar in the high post and let him drive, dish or shoot from there? didn't work. to whip the ball around and around the perimiter until somebody got a free look at a trey? didn't work either. and once it was clear nothing was working, it seemed montana had no contingency plan. i thought when we got down early we'd try some full-court pressure. bring in henderson, let cherry and him hawk the ball and hound their 6'6" point guard. try something! compete!
at the half, when my nephew wanted to leave, i told him, no, this is my team, i can't walk out on them, besides, i think you'll see some second half adjustments. and remember, syracuse did everything right and we did everything wrong, it can't go on like this.
but it did. i guess we thought our orignal game plan, whatever it was, would start working. no pressure, no adjustments. just another 15-40 half. and so much confidence in our team and our game plan, we didn't have an emergency backup plan. this is what rankles me. not that we lost, because most teams in the country will lose to syracuse. that we didn't adjust. didn't compete. didn't show off our athleticism in the full-court pressure game that louisville employed so effective against syracuse. i hope in future tournament games we're more aggressive. if we've learned this lesson, it will have been some consolation to a humiliating defeat.
post-game, jamar said he thought they went in with an excellent game plan. of course, looking back on it, i have no idea what that plan was. to feed the ball jamar in the high post and let him drive, dish or shoot from there? didn't work. to whip the ball around and around the perimiter until somebody got a free look at a trey? didn't work either. and once it was clear nothing was working, it seemed montana had no contingency plan. i thought when we got down early we'd try some full-court pressure. bring in henderson, let cherry and him hawk the ball and hound their 6'6" point guard. try something! compete!
at the half, when my nephew wanted to leave, i told him, no, this is my team, i can't walk out on them, besides, i think you'll see some second half adjustments. and remember, syracuse did everything right and we did everything wrong, it can't go on like this.
but it did. i guess we thought our orignal game plan, whatever it was, would start working. no pressure, no adjustments. just another 15-40 half. and so much confidence in our team and our game plan, we didn't have an emergency backup plan. this is what rankles me. not that we lost, because most teams in the country will lose to syracuse. that we didn't adjust. didn't compete. didn't show off our athleticism in the full-court pressure game that louisville employed so effective against syracuse. i hope in future tournament games we're more aggressive. if we've learned this lesson, it will have been some consolation to a humiliating defeat.
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