New transfer Matai Mata’afa DE Mississippi State

[mthoopsfan]

I sure wouldn't sub out our nickel back, Cotton. He's very fast and a good defender. I think he's one of the better players on the D.

 

[ElrodGrizzly]

Who's he gonna sub in? We have just 5 CB's on the roster, and 14 safeties. I wouldnt' hold my breath waiting for this change (as much as it's needed).

Actually they've converted a a couple guys to corners. Klucewich and Ronald Jackson are both corners now!

I feel like, as fans, we are trained on a certain language that does not apply to a lot of modern defenses. It seems like we are far behind, when you talk to people who actually coach and play a lot of modern defenses.

It used to be a position where "Cornerback covers the receivers." There is less pure man in this day and age. Now, I am reading that some defenses look for guys that are a sort of "tweener" between safety and corner that can cover inside routes, shade TE's, and also not be a liability vs the run.

I'm hoping that is the case here. I think a lot of us that have an understanding of other defenses just aren't understanding what this particular defense is looking for. I should have started diving into it before now, but it gets interesting.

 

[SoldierGriz]

Actually they've converted a a couple guys to corners. Klucewich and Ronald Jackson are both corners now!

I feel like, as fans, we are trained on a certain language that does not apply to a lot of modern defenses. It seems like we are far behind, when you talk to people who actually coach and play a lot of modern defenses.

It used to be a position where "Cornerback covers the receivers." There is less pure man in this day and age. Now, I am reading that some defenses look for guys that are a sort of "tweener" between safety and corner that can cover inside routes, shade TE's, and also not be a liability vs the run.

I'm hoping that is the case here. I think a lot of us that have an understanding of other defenses just aren't understanding what this particular defense is looking for. I should have started diving into it before now, but it gets interesting.

So many variations of the 3-3-5...but, in most - the base alignment "is a three-deep zone, with the corners and free safety playing deep thirds. As the scheme notes, there are five underneath zone defenders, so this defense is capable of providing maximum pass coverage. Eight defenders are allocated to play the pass and only three to rush the passer."

This is a good, easy read for all of us:

https://gbmwolverine.com/2010/02/24/coachs-corner-different-defenses-the-base-alignment-rules-and-personnel-3-3-5-odd-stack/

 

[AZGrizFan]

Actually they've converted a a couple guys to corners. Klucewich and Ronald Jackson are both corners now!

I feel like, as fans, we are trained on a certain language that does not apply to a lot of modern defenses. It seems like we are far behind, when you talk to people who actually coach and play a lot of modern defenses.

It used to be a position where "Cornerback covers the receivers." There is less pure man in this day and age. Now, I am reading that some defenses look for guys that are a sort of "tweener" between safety and corner that can cover inside routes, shade TE's, and also not be a liability vs the run.

I'm hoping that is the case here. I think a lot of us that have an understanding of other defenses just aren't understanding what this particular defense is looking for. I should have started diving into it before now, but it gets interesting.

and then you run up against an offense that has a Cooper Kupp AND a Kendrick Bourne and you give up 500 yards passing because your CB's are "tweeners".

 

[poorgriz]

I feel like, as fans, we are trained on a certain language that does not apply to a lot of modern defenses. It seems like we are far behind, when you talk to people who actually coach and play a lot of modern defenses.

It used to be a position where "Cornerback covers the receivers." There is less pure man in this day and age. Now, I am reading that some defenses look for guys that are a sort of "tweener" between safety and corner that can cover inside routes, shade TE's, and also not be a liability vs the run.

I'm hoping that is the case here. I think a lot of us that have an understanding of other defenses just aren't understanding what this particular defense is looking for. I should have started diving into it before now, but it gets interesting.

and then you run up against an offense that has a Cooper Kupp AND a Kendrick Bourne and you give up 500 yards passing because your CB's are "tweeners".

Aaaaaand, then when you run into an elite rushing game (Like the Cats) that can attack with inside AND outside zone schemes, with that dominant OL and very talented, big, physical TEs, and FBs, excellent blocking WRs, and then throw in the +1 with multiple elite QBs and RBs, and well.... we all know what happens.

 

[AZGrizFan]

and then you run up against an offense that has a Cooper Kupp AND a Kendrick Bourne and you give up 500 yards passing because your CB's are "tweeners".

Aaaaaand, then when you run into an elite rushing game (Like the Cats) that can attack with inside AND outside zone schemes, with that dominant OL and very talented, big, physical TEs, and FBs, excellent blocking WRs, and then throw in the +1 with multiple elite QBs and RBs, and well.... we all know what happens.

Yep. Where have you guy stashed all your NC trophies?

 

[SoldierGriz]

I feel like, as fans, we are trained on a certain language that does not apply to a lot of modern defenses. It seems like we are far behind, when you talk to people who actually coach and play a lot of modern defenses.

It used to be a position where "Cornerback covers the receivers." There is less pure man in this day and age. Now, I am reading that some defenses look for guys that are a sort of "tweener" between safety and corner that can cover inside routes, shade TE's, and also not be a liability vs the run.

I'm hoping that is the case here. I think a lot of us that have an understanding of other defenses just aren't understanding what this particular defense is looking for. I should have started diving into it before now, but it gets interesting.

and then you run up against an offense that has a Cooper Kupp AND a Kendrick Bourne and you give up 500 yards passing because your CB's are "tweeners".

Idaho presents this problem this year with their skilled receiver position group...

*not comparing Kupp and Bourne to spud dudes...

 

[ElrodGrizzly]

I feel like, as fans, we are trained on a certain language that does not apply to a lot of modern defenses. It seems like we are far behind, when you talk to people who actually coach and play a lot of modern defenses.

It used to be a position where "Cornerback covers the receivers." There is less pure man in this day and age. Now, I am reading that some defenses look for guys that are a sort of "tweener" between safety and corner that can cover inside routes, shade TE's, and also not be a liability vs the run.

I'm hoping that is the case here. I think a lot of us that have an understanding of other defenses just aren't understanding what this particular defense is looking for. I should have started diving into it before now, but it gets interesting.

So many variations of the 3-3-5...but, in most - the base alignment "is a three-deep zone, with the corners and free safety playing deep thirds. As the scheme notes, there are five underneath zone defenders, so this defense is capable of providing maximum pass coverage. Eight defenders are allocated to play the pass and only three to rush the passer."

This is a good, easy read for all of us:

https://gbmwolverine.com/2010/02/24/coachs-corner-different-defenses-the-base-alignment-rules-and-personnel-3-3-5-odd-stack/

That is a great link with a good, well simplified overview. Thanks for sharing!

 

[AZGrizFan]

and then you run up against an offense that has a Cooper Kupp AND a Kendrick Bourne and you give up 500 yards passing because your CB's are "tweeners".

Idaho presents this problem this year with their skilled receiver position group...

*not comparing Kupp and Bourne to spud dudes...

I just feel like the way this D is built it can't effectively stop EITHER type of offense (multiple skilled WR's and good QB or strong +1 running game) consistently. It depends on big plays, the requisite blitz getting home, and turnovers...when those don't happen they struggle to get off the field against average/above average teams...

 

[mthoopsfan]

Idaho presents this problem this year with their skilled receiver position group...

*not comparing Kupp and Bourne to spud dudes...

I just feel like the way this D is built it can't effectively stop EITHER type of offense (multiple skilled WR's and good QB or strong +1 running game) consistently. It depends on big plays, the requisite blitz getting home, and turnovers...when those don't happen they struggle to get off the field against average/above average teams...

I think the Griz D works very well most of the time. Obviously, was horrible against the Cats last fall. Stopped the Cats cold the prior season. Worked fairly well against NDSU, except for 3 or 4 big runs. Big runs had not been a problem with the D last season until that game. Don't know what the problem was that gave up so many long runs, but obviously those long runs killed us. Having a good or at least more consistent O, which the Griz didn't have when Johnson was hurt, helps with defense.

It will be interesting to see what the new DC, along with younger coaches at different positions, combined with Tim Hauck and the new young D-line coach from San Diego St, do to improve the D. I have heard generally, that the players like their new position coaches.

 

[mthoopsfan]

and then you run up against an offense that has a Cooper Kupp AND a Kendrick Bourne and you give up 500 yards passing because your CB's are "tweeners".

Idaho presents this problem this year with their skilled receiver position group...

*not comparing Kupp and Bourne to spud dudes...

Kupp and Bourne, and especially Kupp, were huge and unique problems. No wonder our good d-backs couldn't' stop Kupp. I had no idea Kupp was as good as he is.

 

[NavyBlue]

An $EC guy, nice pick up!

 

[SaskGriz]

Good offense beats good defense and vice versa.

 

[AZGrizFan]

I just feel like the way this D is built it can't effectively stop EITHER type of offense (multiple skilled WR's and good QB or strong +1 running game) consistently. It depends on big plays, the requisite blitz getting home, and turnovers...when those don't happen they struggle to get off the field against average/above average teams...

I think the Griz D works very well most of the time. Obviously, was horrible against the Cats last fall. Stopped the Cats cold the prior season. Worked fairly well against NDSU, except for 3 or 4 big runs. Big runs had not been a problem with the D last season until that game. Don't know what the problem was that gave up so many long runs, but obviously those long runs killed us. Having a good or at least more consistent O, which the Griz didn't have when Johnson was hurt, helps with defense.

It will be interesting to see what the new DC, along with younger coaches at different positions, combined with Tim Hauck and the new young D-line coach from San Diego St, do to improve the D. I have heard generally, that the players like their new position coaches.

Agreed on the bolded statement, and also on what the new DC will bring...hoping for some tweaks that address some of those more glaring issues against the top-shelf teams.

 

[SoldierGriz]

I just feel like the way this D is built it can't effectively stop EITHER type of offense (multiple skilled WR's and good QB or strong +1 running game) consistently. It depends on big plays, the requisite blitz getting home, and turnovers...when those don't happen they struggle to get off the field against average/above average teams...

I think the Griz D works very well most of the time. Obviously, was horrible against the Cats last fall. Stopped the Cats cold the prior season. Worked fairly well against NDSU, except for 3 or 4 big runs. Big runs had not been a problem with the D last season until that game. Don't know what the problem was that gave up so many long runs, but obviously those long runs killed us. Having a good or at least more consistent O, which the Griz didn't have when Johnson was hurt, helps with defense.

It will be interesting to see what the new DC, along with younger coaches at different positions, combined with Tim Hauck and the new young D-line coach from San Diego St, do to improve the D. I have heard generally, that the players like their new position coaches.

Couldn't get off the field vs Idaho...

 

[AZGrizFan]

I think the Griz D works very well most of the time. Obviously, was horrible against the Cats last fall. Stopped the Cats cold the prior season. Worked fairly well against NDSU, except for 3 or 4 big runs. Big runs had not been a problem with the D last season until that game. Don't know what the problem was that gave up so many long runs, but obviously those long runs killed us. Having a good or at least more consistent O, which the Griz didn't have when Johnson was hurt, helps with defense.

It will be interesting to see what the new DC, along with younger coaches at different positions, combined with Tim Hauck and the new young D-line coach from San Diego St, do to improve the D. I have heard generally, that the players like their new position coaches.

Couldn't get off the field vs Idaho...

Again, see my initial post he responded to. No blitz getting home, no bueno.

 

[Copper Griz]

and then you run up against an offense that has a Cooper Kupp AND a Kendrick Bourne and you give up 500 yards passing because your CB's are "tweeners".

Aaaaaand, then when you run into an elite rushing game (Like the Cats) that can attack with inside AND outside zone schemes, with that dominant OL and very talented, big, physical TEs, and FBs, excellent blocking WRs, and then throw in the +1 with multiple elite QBs and RBs, and well.... we all know what happens.

Annnd yet Weber should have beat you at home. Unbelievably lucky. The one dimensional nature of MSU’s offense will not get it done to win a natty. Proof being the past two years and getting smoked in big games. Won’t happen. Passing game is their Achilles. I predict between a tougher schedule this year, potential injuries to one or both QB’s because of so much running and MSU could have a sub par season. I say could because the Big Sky is a damn dumpster fire now. Three solid teams and maybe four. Weber is a dark horse. Grizzlies offense will be very tough.

 

[kemajic]

So many variations of the 3-3-5...but, in most - the base alignment "is a three-deep zone, with the corners and free safety playing deep thirds. As the scheme notes, there are five underneath zone defenders, so this defense is capable of providing maximum pass coverage. Eight defenders are allocated to play the pass and only three to rush the passer."

This is a good, easy read for all of us:

https://gbmwolverine.com/2010/02/24/coachs-corner-different-defenses-the-base-alignment-rules-and-personnel-3-3-5-odd-stack/

That is a great link with a good, well simplified overview. Thanks for sharing!

13 years old. Evolution on both sides of the ball since.

 

[SoldierGriz]

Couldn't get off the field vs Idaho...

Again, see my initial post he responded to. No blitz getting home, no bueno.

Yep. I think offensive coordinators with skilled analysts uncover tells and tendencies of the 3-3-5 which is deigned to cloak the Blitzer. Once that happens - the key component of the defensive scheme is neutralized and the advantage goes to the offense.

 

[ilovethecats]

Aaaaaand, then when you run into an elite rushing game (Like the Cats) that can attack with inside AND outside zone schemes, with that dominant OL and very talented, big, physical TEs, and FBs, excellent blocking WRs, and then throw in the +1 with multiple elite QBs and RBs, and well.... we all know what happens.

Annnd yet Weber should have beat you at home. Unbelievably lucky. The one dimensional nature of MSU’s offense will not get it done to win a natty. Proof being the past two years and getting smoked in big games. Won’t happen. Passing game is their Achilles. I predict between a tougher schedule this year, potential injuries to one or both QB’s because of so much running and MSU could have a sub par season. I say could because the Big Sky is a damn dumpster fire now. Three solid teams and maybe four. Weber is a dark horse. Grizzlies offense will be very tough.

I get what you're saying Copper. And I agree we need to take a step forward in the passing game for sure. I do think it's a little overblown though. Maybe because our rushing attack was SO good, it makes the passing game look worse? I'm not sure. But if you look at the numbers last season, it's not like we were miles away from what the Griz did throwing the ball. You guys passed for like 40 yards more per game than we did. Think you only passed for like 100 yards more than us for the season, though we obviously played a couple more games. We threw for a higher percentage than the Griz and also more yards per throw. We had less interceptions and had 21 TD's to your guys' 24 TD's through the air.

This isn't meant as any type of trash talk. I just don't think we're as terrible of a passing team as people make us out to be. But when you're running the ball for 310 yards a game, it's tough to want to air it out too much I'd assume. But I agree if we want to beat the Dakotas, the passing game needs to progress this season.