MVC

[logicfan]

Since 2010 against MVC:

Cal Poly: 3-2
Sac State: 0-0
UC Davis: 1-2
EWU: 3-2
ISU: 0-0
UM: 4-1
MSU: 0-2
UND: 1-3
NAU: 1-2
UNC: 0-3
PSU: 0-0
SUU: 1-4
WSU: 0-1

That's 14-22 over the past 5 years (and that includes the 7-1 trainwreck THIS year)...and the vast majority of those 36 games were against NDSU (2-1), SDSU (7-3), USD (7-8) or UNI (3-1) --three of the four who would be considered the cream of the MVFC crop over the past 5 years.

So, did MVFC own the BSC this year? Yep. Are they light years ahead of the BSC? Only time will tell. One year does not a trend make, especially when many of their wins (with the exception of NDSU's win over Montana and Illinois State's playoff win over EWU) were against the absolute bottom feeders of the BSC--UNC, SUU, WSU, Davis, etc.

They're king of the current hill, but that doesn't mean they've created some permanent gap. This could just as easily be a one-year anomaly. We shall see...

USD in that timeframe has more wins over Big Sky teams than MVFC teams. In 2 of the last 3 years they have been winless in the MVFC yet had multiple victories over Big Sky teams

 

[BadlandsGrizFan]

Right you were! I honestly think Ill. St. is the only team that has any chance against NDSU. Guess we'll find out in about three weeks. For sure, I will be watching.

Illinois St will beat the Bizon!!! Mark my words!!!

 

[AZGrizFan]

Since 2010 against MVC:

Cal Poly: 3-2
Sac State: 0-0
UC Davis: 1-2
EWU: 3-2
ISU: 0-0
UM: 4-1
MSU: 0-2
UND: 1-3
NAU: 1-2
UNC: 0-3
PSU: 0-0
SUU: 1-4
WSU: 0-1

That's 14-22 over the past 5 years (and that includes the 7-1 trainwreck THIS year)...and the vast majority of those 36 games were against NDSU (2-1), SDSU (7-3), USD (7-8) or UNI (3-1) --three of the four who would be considered the cream of the MVFC crop over the past 5 years.

So, did MVFC own the BSC this year? Yep. Are they light years ahead of the BSC? Only time will tell. One year does not a trend make, especially when many of their wins (with the exception of NDSU's win over Montana and Illinois State's playoff win over EWU) were against the absolute bottom feeders of the BSC--UNC, SUU, WSU, Davis, etc.

They're king of the current hill, but that doesn't mean they've created some permanent gap. This could just as easily be a one-year anomaly. We shall see...

USD in that timeframe has more wins over Big Sky teams than MVFC teams. In 2 of the last 3 years they have been winless in the MVFC yet had multiple victories over Big Sky teams

Nice spin. Not even remotely factual. In only ONE of those years that they went winless in the MVFC did they have A win over a BSC team and that was THIS year over NAU. In fact, just LAST year, when they (USD) beat UNI, NAU beat THEM. Their only other win is against one of our perpetual doormats, UC-Davis. So they're 1-1 against NAU, 1-0 against UCD and 0-3 against UM in the last 3 years.

Oh, and they won three conference games last year, so your statement that they have more wins over BSC teams than MVFC teams is false as well.

 

[logicfan]

You said since 2010. Against Teams currently in the Big sky USD has wins,

2010- UNC, UND
2011-SUU, UCD
2012- 0
2013 - UC DAVIS
2014 -UNA

 

[Umista]

Yawn.......................Yawn.........................Yawn................................Yawn

...YAWN....

 

[2011BisonAlumni]

Everything goes in cycles as far as conference play goes. CAA was king for years, Southern Conference for a few years etc.

One thing that benefits the Missouri Valley conference is the fact that their are several major state institutions in the conference, NDSU, Illinois State, Indiana State, SDSU, USD, and Missouri State on top of some perennial FCS power programs Youngstown State, UNI, Southern Illinois. You are always bound to have decent strength bottom to top. With the exception of Western Illinois, there is not a lot of Portland State or Northern Colorado type programs.

 

[AZGrizFan]

You said since 2010. Against Teams currently in the Big sky USD has wins,

2010- UNC, UND
2011-SUU, UCD
2012- 0
2013 - UC DAVIS
2014 -UNA

OMG!! USD is better than UNC, SUU and UC-Davis!!

The horror! :|

 

[AZGrizFan]

You said since 2010. Against Teams currently in the Big sky USD has wins,

2010- UNC, UND
2011-SUU, UCD
2012- 0
2013 - UC DAVIS
2014 -UNA

And maybe that's because they were IN a conference with most of those teams until 2012?

And you forgot a win against EWU in 2011.

 

[griz5700]

To compete with the MVC and to compete for NC's you have to have be strong up front. Griz have to step it up on the o-line. Nice to throw it around, but championship teams dominate the LOS. The Griz should focus on what those MVC teams are doing rather than trying to out score Big Sky opponents.

 

[yellowstone60]

well anyway, here are a pair of past BSC guys !

https://twitter.com/BigSkyConf/status/547105922687172610" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Big Sky Conference
‏@BigSkyConf deshawnshead & bcoyle52 Turning up with the #12thman ! Both Repping the #BigSkyFB! #GoHawks #GoViks… http://instagram.com/p/w641VfmGTw/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
































11:06 AM - 22 Dec 2014

 

[Grizzlies1982]

Everything goes in cycles...
With the exception of Western Illinois, there is not a lot of Portland State or Northern Colorado type programs.

Yes it certainly does cycle around. I remember how Montana got absolutely pounded in the playoffs by Western Illinois. Losing is one thing, getting destroyed is another. Dislike that school to this day.

In the Big Sky, Portland State is an interesting case. Decades ago they were a perennial DII contender, and there is no reason they couldn't be a contender today. Even now it seems they have several superior athletes year in and year out. However, they never seem to consistently get it together as a team. They are notorious for being undisciplined. They look great one week then just awful the next. It's easy to see why they lost their fan base. They will shut down that program unless they can find a coach to pull them back from the brink.

Northern Colorado was another past DII Champion who fell hard when they moved to FCS. However in their case they lack all the advantages PSU has. It is a minor school, in a modest town, with very poor facilities. It is understandable how they struggle and I see little reason to believe that will change anytime soon. :ugeek:

 

[AZGrizFan]

Everything goes in cycles...
With the exception of Western Illinois, there is not a lot of Portland State or Northern Colorado type programs.

The only difference is that in the (much) smaller MVFC it's a different team or two each year....we just have stability in the BSC.

 

[G-BEARS]

I used to really respect you as a poster. But, do you really believe yourself when you said this? No one is saying things can't change for the better soon, but right now the MVFC is way ahead of us.

What measuring stick are you using for that?

The best team in the BSC, Eastern, probably takes 4th or 5th place in that conference. Third at best.

Really? Because OUR third place team took their conference champ to the wire to open the season....Granted EWU doesn't play defense, but I think they finish no worse than 3rd in that conference...and besides, regular season don't mean shit. 95% of their teams fold like cheap pianos (I'm looking at YOU, Northern Iowa) in the playoffs year after year after year. They're actually set up a lot like the BSC in the 2000's. NDSU and then everybody else...just like the BSC spent 15 years being UM and everybody else. Illinois State is just this year's flash-in-the-pan. Book it.

Sagarin Conference Ranking
Code:


ConfCat Conference CMean ConfMax NDSU Rank
P5 SEC 86.07 100.02 12
P5 PAC-12 78.74 96.31 8
P5 BIG 12 78.59 96.71 6
P5 ACC 74.19 85.90 5
P5 BIG TEN 73.80 95.94 5
NA I-A INDEPENDENTS 67.62 77.01 1
FCS MISSOURI VALLEY 63.38 79.02 1
G5 MWC 62.66 77.43 1
G5 AMERICAN ATHLETIC 60.49 75.19 1
G5 CONFERENCE USA 60.10 79.11 2
G5 SUN BELT 55.97 68.69 1
G5 MAC 55.48 68.81 1
FCS BIG SOUTH 51.29 66.92 1
FCS SOUTHERN 49.38 67.34 1
FCS COLONIAL 46.25 65.88 1
FCS SOUTHLAND 46.16 62.57 1
FCS BIG SKY 45.88 63.22 1
FCS OHIO VALLEY 44.37 64.30 1
FCS I-AA INDEPENDENTS 42.63 42.63 1
FCS PATRIOT 42.15 58.17 1
FCS NORTHEAST 40.63 50.72 1
FCS IVY LEAGUE 37.34 60.82 1
FCS MID-EASTERN 34.07 47.86 1
FCS SWAC 29.43 48.73 1
FCS PIONEER 21.66 40.97 1

 

[G-BEARS]

I don't know that the big sky was ever ranked above that many FBS conferences.

 

[IdaGriz01]

Agree completely. I've watched a lot of FCS ball this year, and I think Illinois St is the only team who can give the Bison a run for their money. They have to get by New Hampshire first which I think they should. Imagine that, an all MVFC national title. That further solidifies this discussion.

That's what I thought too, until I started watching today's UNH-Ill St. game. Compared with last weekend's games, UNH looks much better and Ill. St. doesn't look anywhere near as good. Match-ups are interesting, aren't they?

You're spot on....it's all about the match up. Illinois st has been in the red zone 5 times I believe with only two FGs. So they aren't playing great but still getting into good position to score. I think with some half time adjustments they'll be just fine.

Had to go back ways to find this, but it applies.

Just re-watched the Illinois State at UNH game (recorded ... snoozer for the first bowel game). In the end, ISU, as a team, played basically one quarter of football. Yet that was enough to beat UNH. Will that be enough to beat NDSU? Somehow, I doubt it? :lol:

 

[AZGrizFan]

What measuring stick are you using for that?

The best team in the BSC, Eastern, probably takes 4th or 5th place in that conference. Third at best.

Really? Because OUR third place team took their conference champ to the wire to open the season....Granted EWU doesn't play defense, but I think they finish no worse than 3rd in that conference...and besides, regular season don't mean shit. 95% of their teams fold like cheap pianos (I'm looking at YOU, Northern Iowa) in the playoffs year after year after year. They're actually set up a lot like the BSC in the 2000's. NDSU and then everybody else...just like the BSC spent 15 years being UM and everybody else. Illinois State is just this year's flash-in-the-pan. Book it.

Sagarin Conference Ranking
Code:


ConfCat Conference CMean ConfMax NDSU Rank
P5 SEC 86.07 100.02 12
P5 PAC-12 78.74 96.31 8
P5 BIG 12 78.59 96.71 6
P5 ACC 74.19 85.90 5
P5 BIG TEN 73.80 95.94 5
NA I-A INDEPENDENTS 67.62 77.01 1
FCS MISSOURI VALLEY 63.38 79.02 1
G5 MWC 62.66 77.43 1
G5 AMERICAN ATHLETIC 60.49 75.19 1
G5 CONFERENCE USA 60.10 79.11 2
G5 SUN BELT 55.97 68.69 1
G5 MAC 55.48 68.81 1
FCS BIG SOUTH 51.29 66.92 1
FCS SOUTHERN 49.38 67.34 1
FCS COLONIAL 46.25 65.88 1
FCS SOUTHLAND 46.16 62.57 1
FCS BIG SKY 45.88 63.22 1
FCS OHIO VALLEY 44.37 64.30 1
FCS I-AA INDEPENDENTS 42.63 42.63 1
FCS PATRIOT 42.15 58.17 1
FCS NORTHEAST 40.63 50.72 1
FCS IVY LEAGUE 37.34 60.82 1
FCS MID-EASTERN 34.07 47.86 1
FCS SWAC 29.43 48.73 1
FCS PIONEER 21.66 40.97 1

Well, that explains it. :lol: :lol:

Computers are good a lots of things. But they don't play football.

 

[G-BEARS]

The best team in the BSC, Eastern, probably takes 4th or 5th place in that conference. Third at best.

Really? Because OUR third place team took their conference champ to the wire to open the season....Granted EWU doesn't play defense, but I think they finish no worse than 3rd in that conference...and besides, regular season don't mean shit. 95% of their teams fold like cheap pianos (I'm looking at YOU, Northern Iowa) in the playoffs year after year after year. They're actually set up a lot like the BSC in the 2000's. NDSU and then everybody else...just like the BSC spent 15 years being UM and everybody else. Illinois State is just this year's flash-in-the-pan. Book it.

Sagarin Conference Ranking
Code:


ConfCat Conference CMean ConfMax NDSU Rank
P5 SEC 86.07 100.02 12
P5 PAC-12 78.74 96.31 8
P5 BIG 12 78.59 96.71 6
P5 ACC 74.19 85.90 5
P5 BIG TEN 73.80 95.94 5
NA I-A INDEPENDENTS 67.62 77.01 1
FCS MISSOURI VALLEY 63.38 79.02 1
G5 MWC 62.66 77.43 1
G5 AMERICAN ATHLETIC 60.49 75.19 1
G5 CONFERENCE USA 60.10 79.11 2
G5 SUN BELT 55.97 68.69 1
G5 MAC 55.48 68.81 1
FCS BIG SOUTH 51.29 66.92 1
FCS SOUTHERN 49.38 67.34 1
FCS COLONIAL 46.25 65.88 1
FCS SOUTHLAND 46.16 62.57 1
FCS BIG SKY 45.88 63.22 1
FCS OHIO VALLEY 44.37 64.30 1
FCS I-AA INDEPENDENTS 42.63 42.63 1
FCS PATRIOT 42.15 58.17 1
FCS NORTHEAST 40.63 50.72 1
FCS IVY LEAGUE 37.34 60.82 1
FCS MID-EASTERN 34.07 47.86 1
FCS SWAC 29.43 48.73 1
FCS PIONEER 21.66 40.97 1

Well, that explains it. :lol: :lol:

Computers are good a lots of things. But they don't play football.

You're the one who started to use game to game scenarios as a comparison (even though I'm not quite sure what game you're talking about here). And you're right, to an extent, when comparing head to head match ups computers are pretty worthless. But when evaluating conferences as a whole, with that much data involved, I think it paints a pretty clear picture.

 

[AZGrizFan]

Really? Because OUR third place team took their conference champ to the wire to open the season....Granted EWU doesn't play defense, but I think they finish no worse than 3rd in that conference...and besides, regular season don't mean shit. 95% of their teams fold like cheap pianos (I'm looking at YOU, Northern Iowa) in the playoffs year after year after year. They're actually set up a lot like the BSC in the 2000's. NDSU and then everybody else...just like the BSC spent 15 years being UM and everybody else. Illinois State is just this year's flash-in-the-pan. Book it.

Sagarin Conference Ranking
Code:


ConfCat Conference CMean ConfMax NDSU Rank
P5 SEC 86.07 100.02 12
P5 PAC-12 78.74 96.31 8
P5 BIG 12 78.59 96.71 6
P5 ACC 74.19 85.90 5
P5 BIG TEN 73.80 95.94 5
NA I-A INDEPENDENTS 67.62 77.01 1
FCS MISSOURI VALLEY 63.38 79.02 1
G5 MWC 62.66 77.43 1
G5 AMERICAN ATHLETIC 60.49 75.19 1
G5 CONFERENCE USA 60.10 79.11 2
G5 SUN BELT 55.97 68.69 1
G5 MAC 55.48 68.81 1
FCS BIG SOUTH 51.29 66.92 1
FCS SOUTHERN 49.38 67.34 1
FCS COLONIAL 46.25 65.88 1
FCS SOUTHLAND 46.16 62.57 1
FCS BIG SKY 45.88 63.22 1
FCS OHIO VALLEY 44.37 64.30 1
FCS I-AA INDEPENDENTS 42.63 42.63 1
FCS PATRIOT 42.15 58.17 1
FCS NORTHEAST 40.63 50.72 1
FCS IVY LEAGUE 37.34 60.82 1
FCS MID-EASTERN 34.07 47.86 1
FCS SWAC 29.43 48.73 1
FCS PIONEER 21.66 40.97 1

Well, that explains it. :lol: :lol:

Computers are good a lots of things. But they don't play football.

You're the one who started to use game to game scenarios as a comparison (even though I'm not quite sure what game you're talking about here). And you're right, to an extent, when comparing head to head match ups computers are pretty worthless. But when evaluating conferences as a whole, with that much data involved, I think it paints a pretty clear picture.

About the closest you can come is head-to-head competition. MVFC owned us THIS year. The argument is whether they're "light years ahead" of us, or if it's a one-year anomaly. NDSU, on the other hand, IS light years ahead of FCS, given their potential for their fourth consecutive championship. And we took them to the wire, in THEIR house, with our worst offensive line in 25 years.

I think the jury is still out on this.

 

[statler & waldorf]

These are the teams in my opinion that can hang with the top of the MVFC:

Montana
Eastern Washington
Montana State
Cal Poly
Idaho State (with their recent resurgence)

Other than that, the rest of the BSC is a crapshoot, really.

Watch Idaho State next year. If they get a QB anywhere near Arias's ability, Kramer could get his NC. Or, don't watch them, and feign shock.

 

[Umista]

Idaho State is coming on and even though we are not fans it is neat to see some lower schools move up. I agree if they get a QB they will be hard to beat. Old Kramer doing what he does best.