Draining the lifeblood of the department (Move-up thread)

[PlayerRep]

So we couldn't come up with an additional mill through other means? Trust me, our "guarantee" games would increase markedly as an FBS program. No more 400k to go to Tennessee. More like two and half to three times that.

And I would guess that that $6 million figure included both the Academic Center and the LR/WR improvements. Since those are already funded, it's reasonable to assume that five mill would be fully sufficient.

The almost $5 million figure for annual budget expenses didn't include anything for new facilities. Facilities are a separate and additional costs. The annual budget needs would be larger now, not smaller. Probably much larger.

Guarantee games away from Missoula result in a lost home game, obviously. Big home games at UM make almost $1 million. Less home games result in huge economic losses for Missoula area businesses, which then have less money to donate to UM athletics. Even the loss of playoff games would impact the athletic budget negatively, as well as the economy of Missoula.

You really are a Windmill Chaser.

 

[EverettGriz]

Guarantee games away from Missoula result in a lost home game, obviously.

We're playing those games anyway. Net loss to Missoula: Zero.

You really are a Windmill Chaser.

Well, I do enjoy Holland.

 

[AZGrizFan]

Actually, Everett, if you read my original post, the entire point of it was the that moving up is NOT just a football issue. I was pointing out that that's all most people look at, like the Griz can move up in football, but those fans don't consider everything that comes with it.

Here's more research I did today. Boise State's 2013 budget for men's and women's tennis was just $825,000. Wyoming's wrestling budget for 2013 was over $800,000. Montana doesn't even carry a wrestling program, and I know for a fact, the men's and women's tennis budgets aren't even half of what Boise State spends. BUT, IF UM were to move up to the MWC, those budgets would HAVE to increase, and I would like to know where that funding will come from.

Again, my entire point is, Montana CAN'T move its football team up and have everything else in the athletic department be as it is today. It just doesn't work that way. Hell, I even posted about how some GSA members are mad about the fact that their money doesn't necessarily go to a football scholarship, and BOOM, one of them posted those feelings in this thread. LOL.

That's kind of my point proven right there.

WHY do those budgets automatically have to increase? Those teams are already flying to godawful places like Flagstaff, St. George, NoDak, etc. What, exactly, in their budgets would cause this dramatic increase you keep referring to?

 

[George Ferguson]

actually, the way the Big Sky tennis schedule is set up, there aren't home and home series. Montana doesn't go to Flagstaff every year or UND every year or Portland every year. It's every other year. That isn't the way the MWC does their schedule for one. Budgets would also increase because of competitive coaching salaries, a larger recruiting budget to recruit MWC tennis level tennis players vs Big Sky Conference tennis players, ect. It's absolutely NO DIFFERENT than why the football budget would increase.

Again, AZ is making my point for me. You are wanting the football program to increase its budget and expenses in a move up to compete against better competition, but you are expecting sports many fans don't care about to stay as is. That isn't and SHOULDN'T be the reality of it.

 

[AZGrizFan]

actually, the way the Big Sky tennis schedule is set up, there aren't home and home series. Montana doesn't go to Flagstaff every year or UND every year or Portland every year. It's every other year. That isn't the way the MWC does their schedule for one. Budgets would also increase because of competitive coaching salaries, a larger recruiting budget to recruit MWC tennis level tennis players vs Big Sky Conference tennis players, ect. It's absolutely NO DIFFERENT than why the football budget would increase.

Again, AZ is making my point for me. You are wanting the football program to increase its budget and expenses in a move up to compete against better competition, but you are expecting sports many fans don't care about to stay as is. That isn't and SHOULDN'T be the reality of it.

I'm not "expecting" anything? Just asked a question. And you answered it.

Serious question: In 90% of the sports, if we're competitive (and even win titles) do we make any additional money? I mean, does it really MATTER if we're competitive in womens tennis, softball, or whatever money-sucking mens sports we'd have to add? Every sport except football loses money anyway, so what difference would it really make?

 

[George Ferguson]

Ummmm, I suppose it makes a difference to the STUDENT-ATHLETES who are asked to come here to compete in all of those sports. I'm pretty sure it matters to them. You know, the kids who practice, bust their ass night and day, travel to those god-for-saken places like Flagstaff, play when they're hurt, sick and have spent all night studying for a test just like the football players do. Yes, I'm pretty sure being competitive matters to them. I also know for a fact it matters to current Athletic Director Kent Haslam.

 

[AZGrizFan]

Ummmm, I suppose it makes a difference to the STUDENT-ATHLETES who are asked to come here to compete in all of those sports. I'm pretty sure it matters to them. You know, the kids who practice, bust their ass night and day, travel to those god-for-saken places like Flagstaff, play when they're hurt, sick and have spent all night studying for a test just like the football players do. Yes, I'm pretty sure being competitive matters to them. I also know for a fact it matters to current Athletic Director Kent Haslam.

Yet somehow they attract student athletes to play in places like Moscow, Idaho. Huh. Wonder how they do that?

 

[PlayerRep]

Guarantee games away from Missoula result in a lost home game, obviously.

We're playing those games anyway. Net loss to Missoula: Zero.

You really are a Windmill Chaser.

Well, I do enjoy Holland.

UM probably play more home games than any other FCS school. Probably isn't even close in the past 20 years.

UM does not play guarantee games every year. More like every 4 years.

Doesn't surprise me that you like the Red Light District.

 

[RobGriz]

Ummmm, I suppose it makes a difference to the STUDENT-ATHLETES who are asked to come here to compete in all of those sports. I'm pretty sure it matters to them. You know, the kids who practice, bust their ass night and day, travel to those god-for-saken places like Flagstaff, play when they're hurt, sick and have spent all night studying for a test just like the football players do. Yes, I'm pretty sure being competitive matters to them. I also know for a fact it matters to current Athletic Director Kent Haslam.

Oh No!!!! Their opinion doesn't count. Besides they should be THRILLED at the prospect of getting butt stumped in the MWC as opposed to playing for national championships in the FCS. Besides, haven't you heard? We're the next Boise State! I mean we might get to play Fresno.....FRESNO!!!!! :jack: :jack: :jack:

 

[George Ferguson]

You don't think the kids that go to play tennis and softball at Idaho believe they and their teams are going to be competitive when they are recruited? You think they go there to willingly lose?I I do not. Again, not trying to argue with any poster, but AZ, you're proving my point of why I started this thread, besides boredom from staying home on NYE. It's NOT just the football program moving up. It's a much, much larger issue. It's an entire athletic department, and in Montana's case, it's sports that the UM doesn't even have right now. It's about Title9 and scholarship equity. You simply cannot have just the ONE piece of the pie you care about (football) and call it a day.

And since Boise State is ALWAYS the comparison, I'll add that from what I can see, BSU in fact DOES care about ALL of its sports being competitive and successful. The Bronco wrestling program has become a power in the NCAA West Region, they just built a brand new 11 million dollar indoor tennis facility, they also built a brand new indoor track facility not long ago. Do a youtube search of their facilites. Their men's and women's tennis lockerrooms are 10x as nice as the current Griz football and basketball lockerrooms. While football is king in Boise, it's plainly obvious that they want ALL of their sports to be as competitive and successful as possible, and they spend large amounts of money on them, right down to tennis, golf and wrestling.

 

[AZGrizFan]

Ummmm, I suppose it makes a difference to the STUDENT-ATHLETES who are asked to come here to compete in all of those sports. I'm pretty sure it matters to them. You know, the kids who practice, bust their ass night and day, travel to those god-for-saken places like Flagstaff, play when they're hurt, sick and have spent all night studying for a test just like the football players do. Yes, I'm pretty sure being competitive matters to them. I also know for a fact it matters to current Athletic Director Kent Haslam.

Oh No!!!! Their opinion doesn't count. Besides they should be THRILLED at the prospect of getting butt stumped in the MWC as opposed to playing for national championships in the FCS. Besides, haven't you heard? We're the next Boise State! I mean we might get to play Fresno.....FRESNO!!!!! :jack: :jack: :jack:

Beats Central Washington or Oklahoma State-Panhandle. At least to me...

 

[RobGriz]

Ummmm, I suppose it makes a difference to the STUDENT-ATHLETES who are asked to come here to compete in all of those sports. I'm pretty sure it matters to them. You know, the kids who practice, bust their ass night and day, travel to those god-for-saken places like Flagstaff, play when they're hurt, sick and have spent all night studying for a test just like the football players do. Yes, I'm pretty sure being competitive matters to them. I also know for a fact it matters to current Athletic Director Kent Haslam.

Oh No!!!! Their opinion doesn't count. Besides they should be THRILLED at the prospect of getting butt stumped in the MWC as opposed to playing for national championships in the FCS. Besides, haven't you heard? We're the next Boise State! I mean we might get to play Fresno.....FRESNO!!!!! :jack: :jack: :jack:

Beats Central Washington or Oklahoma State-Panhandle. At least to me...

Yep, that's all we play. NO ONE else plays down...ever. Just us.

 

[AZGrizFan]

Ummmm, I suppose it makes a difference to the STUDENT-ATHLETES who are asked to come here to compete in all of those sports. I'm pretty sure it matters to them. You know, the kids who practice, bust their ass night and day, travel to those god-for-saken places like Flagstaff, play when they're hurt, sick and have spent all night studying for a test just like the football players do. Yes, I'm pretty sure being competitive matters to them. I also know for a fact it matters to current Athletic Director Kent Haslam.

Oh No!!!! Their opinion doesn't count. Besides they should be THRILLED at the prospect of getting butt stumped in the MWC as opposed to playing for national championships in the FCS. Besides, haven't you heard? We're the next Boise State! I mean we might get to play Fresno.....FRESNO!!!!! :jack: :jack: :jack:

Beats Central Washington or Oklahoma State-Panhandle. At least to me...

Yep, that's all we play. NO ONE else plays down...ever. Just us.

Come on, man. We wouldn't fucking play FRESNO every weekend either. See, that argument works both ways. But when FRESNO is the SHITTY game that's quite a step up from Oklahoma-Panhandle State. Surely even you can see that, can't you?

 

[RobGriz]

Oh No!!!! Their opinion doesn't count. Besides they should be THRILLED at the prospect of getting butt stumped in the MWC as opposed to playing for national championships in the FCS. Besides, haven't you heard? We're the next Boise State! I mean we might get to play Fresno.....FRESNO!!!!! :jack: :jack: :jack:

Beats Central Washington or Oklahoma State-Panhandle. At least to me...

Yep, that's all we play. NO ONE else plays down...ever. Just us.

Come on, man. We wouldn't f***[*] play FRESNO every weekend either. See, that argument works both ways. But when FRESNO is the SHITTY game that's quite a step up from Oklahoma-Panhandle State. Surely even you can see that, can't you?

No, and we don't play Central Washington or Oklahoma Panhandle St every weekend either. So yes, the argument does work both ways.

 

[AZGrizFan]

Beats Central Washington or Oklahoma State-Panhandle. At least to me...

Yep, that's all we play. NO ONE else plays down...ever. Just us.

Come on, man. We wouldn't f***[*] play FRESNO every weekend either. See, that argument works both ways. But when FRESNO is the SHITTY game that's quite a step up from Oklahoma-Panhandle State. Surely even you can see that, can't you?

No, and we don't play Central Washington or Oklahoma Panhandle St every weekend either. So yes, the argument does work both ways.

So we're in agreement. The argument works both ways. We both support Fresno being the shitty game and not OK Panhandle State...with Boise St. and Utah State & Air Force and Idaho and Colorado State being the other home games instead of Cal Davis, Sacramento State, South Dakota, Northern Colorado and whatever other backwater school we played this year at home.

 

[RobGriz]

Yep, that's all we play. NO ONE else plays down...ever. Just us.

Come on, man. We wouldn't f***[*] play FRESNO every weekend either. See, that argument works both ways. But when FRESNO is the SHITTY game that's quite a step up from Oklahoma-Panhandle State. Surely even you can see that, can't you?

No, and we don't play Central Washington or Oklahoma Panhandle St every weekend either. So yes, the argument does work both ways.

So we're in agreement. The argument works both ways. We both support Fresno being the shitty game and not OK Panhandle State...with Boise St. and Utah State & Air Force and Idaho and Colorado State being the other home games instead of Cal Davis, Sacramento State, South Dakota, Northern Colorado and whatever other backwater school we played this year at home.

So once we move up won't we consider Fresno and Utah backwater teams? If we start with some success won't people be saying "why play Fresno, we should be playing Stanford and USC?"

 

[CDAGRIZ]

I would rather go to a home game against Fresno State than one against any team we played at home this year except for MSU. Fresno is not a shitty program.

 

[RobGriz]

I would rather go to a home game against Fresno State than one against any team we played at home this year except for MSU. Fresno is not a shitty program.

Not saying they are. Actually I believe they'd whip the shit out of us. I guess that's what I'm having problems with. We are in a conference that we are competitive in some would say better than, though we've not won it in a few years, and I truly believe some of you'd rather watch the GRIZ get destroyed by teams like Utah St and Fresno than be competitive against MSU and EWU.

 

[George Ferguson]

Rob, it's a moot point. No need to even argue your point. The MWC doesn't want Montana. It's an indisputable fact. And those that say they'd rather watch Montana get rocked by 20-30 points by Boise State, Utah State, Nevada, Fresno State, Colorado State and Air Force are either lying, or are only looking at it short-term. If Montana were in the MWC, the I'd rather watch us get rocked by better schools Mantra would last about three games before the same people would want Stitt fired and Egriz would implode. If Egriz has taught us all one thing since its inception, NOTHING is EVER good enough for a select group of fans of the Montana Grizzly football program, and a move-up to the MWC wouldn't be good enough for long either.

 

[RobGriz]

Rob, it's a moot point. No need to even argue your point. The MWC doesn't want Montana. It's an indisputable fact. And those that say they'd rather watch Montana get rocked by 20-30 points by Boise State, Utah State, Nevada, Fresno State, Colorado State and Air Force are either lying, or are only looking at it short-term. If Montana were in the MWC, the I'd rather watch us get rocked by better schools Mantra would last about three games before the same people would want Stitt fired and Egriz would implode. If Egriz has taught us all one thing since its inception, NOTHING is EVER good enough for a select group of fans of the Montana Grizzly football program, and a move-up to the MWC wouldn't be good enough for long either.

Perfectly said sir!