Dog Day Massacre: Butler Best in Show

[Swillbury]

That's the type of thing thing that makes everyone so annoyed with Gonzaga fans. Being proud is one thing and being delusional is another. I would compare Zags fans to Griz football fans that think the Griz could move up and still contend. It's just not happening.

You are going to compare Zags fans with Griz football fans that think they would compete in I-A? I know you are just saying this to get a rise out of me because nobody could be stupid enough to believe that. First of all when the Zags compete against big name schools i.e. UCLA, UNC, etc. they do compete and often win (like this year). On the other hand however, (no offense to Griz football fans) the Griz get smoked by big name schools. For example, Iowa, they lost 41 to 7. And Iowa isn't that good of a team this year.
Are you serious? Do you not look at cold hard facts and evidence before you go spouting off at the mouth. The fact of the matter is-is that the Zags compete with anyone anywhere. So don't say that Zag fans are "delusional" because the facts are right in front of you.

Football is alittle different from basketball buddy. Dont even try to compare mid-major basketball to 1-AA football :naughty:

Dick Vitale is quoted as saying that the only reason that college basketball is better than college football is because the little guy always has a shot. Any Given night can a basketball team beat another basketball team (of course, exceptions, I know)

Football is a game of power and speed, and quite frankly those are traits that you cannot coach no matter how good of a coach you are. The Griz, as a 1-AA team, would never beat a upper BSC team because team speed, and overall strength is so much that they would never even have a chance

 

[Lou]

Cdagriz- I'm on here to talk basketball not get spelling lessons from a guy who spells while with an 'st' on the end and before...berore. ( I.E.-I wouldn't make such a big deal about it if you could refrain from calling people ignorant whilst misspelling the word berore ignorant). Oh and like I told louise and thank god he listened for the time being...save your corny jokes for the Zag board. Funny fuse? Wow that's hilarious! Go ahead pick my posts apart, if you think pointing out grammatical errors makes me feel dumb think again. Maybe start by picking yours apart.

Umdeez you are a moron.
whilst (hwlst, wlst) Pronunciation Key
conj. Chiefly Britis.
def. = While.
I'm gonna buy you a dictionary for Christmas.

 

[Swillbury]

Thats enough kiddies, lets not turn this into a grammer lesson.


STICK TO BASKETBALL

 

[IamYou]

umdeez, there is nothing wrong with taking a look at the talent levels of 2 different schools. It was merely done to show that Gonzaga does have a lot of talent on their team. I think it's fair to compare and contrast the talent level of a school that has had top 5 success the past 2 years to a school that people often question their success. I never made any outrageous claims about how gonzaga and ucla are about the same in program legacy, so just chill.

in hindsight, the point of my post was to show those who claim that gonzaga does not have high-major talent are wrong, and as proof showing them what a high-major program's talent does look like as to gonzagas. If I hadn't put up UCLA's ratings, there would be no basis for how good gonzaga's talent is and the numbers would have no meaning to them. Don't be so quick to jump to conclusions that i never stated. You should use some CSI to analyze why I say certain things.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

Cdagriz- I'm on here to talk basketball not get spelling lessons from a guy who spells while with an 'st' on the end and before...berore. ( I.E.-I wouldn't make such a big deal about it if you could refrain from calling people ignorant whilst misspelling the word berore ignorant). Oh and like I told louise and thank god he listened for the time being...save your corny jokes for the Zag board. Funny fuse? Wow that's hilarious! Go ahead pick my posts apart, if you think pointing out grammatical errors makes me feel dumb think again. Maybe start by picking yours apart.

Wow, you make it easy.

http://www.dictionary.com

As for berore. That was just one of my "corny jokes" that you missed. The word berore (before) ignorant is the one that you always misspell, so I did the same. Get it? HAHA!

1) If you do indeed attend UofM, please don't graduate. You will only cheapen my and everyone else's degree.

2) As a very general rule of thumb: If I misspell a word, it's usually on purpose.

Oh, and Swilly, c'mon man, he started it

 

[Lou]

That's the type of thing thing that makes everyone so annoyed with Gonzaga fans. Being proud is one thing and being delusional is another. I would compare Zags fans to Griz football fans that think the Griz could move up and still contend. It's just not happening.

You are going to compare Zags fans with Griz football fans that think they would compete in I-A? I know you are just saying this to get a rise out of me because nobody could be stupid enough to believe that. First of all when the Zags compete against big name schools i.e. UCLA, UNC, etc. they do compete and often win (like this year). On the other hand however, (no offense to Griz football fans) the Griz get smoked by big name schools. For example, Iowa, they lost 41 to 7. And Iowa isn't that good of a team this year.
Are you serious? Do you not look at cold hard facts and evidence before you go spouting off at the mouth. The fact of the matter is-is that the Zags compete with anyone anywhere. So don't say that Zag fans are "delusional" because the facts are right in front of you.

Football is alittle different from basketball buddy. Dont even try to compare mid-major basketball to 1-AA football :naughty:

Dick Vitale is quoted as saying that the only reason that college basketball is better than college football is because the little guy always has a shot. Any Given night can a basketball team beat another basketball team (of course, exceptions, I know)

Football is a game of power and speed, and quite frankly those are traits that you cannot coach no matter how good of a coach you are. The Griz, as a 1-AA team, would never beat a upper BSC team because team speed, and overall strength is so much that they would never even have a chance

Young Swilly, you have so much to learn. For example, you should read what I was responding to before you refute what I wrote. Not once did I compare mid-major basketball to I-AA football. I did, however, compare the fans of each. Please read, and try to understand, what I am talking about before you respond to my posts. Read what Umdeez said about comparing Griz football fans that think they compare with big time teams to Zag fans that think they compare to big time teams.
Follow my directions and you won't look so foolish next time.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

Thats enough kiddies, lets not turn this into a grammer lesson.


STICK TO BASKETBALL

Oh my god, I just noticed this! Ok, I'm done, I promise.... :dance:

 

[Swillbury]

That's the type of thing thing that makes everyone so annoyed with Gonzaga fans. Being proud is one thing and being delusional is another. I would compare Zags fans to Griz football fans that think the Griz could move up and still contend. It's just not happening.

You are going to compare Zags fans with Griz football fans that think they would compete in I-A? I know you are just saying this to get a rise out of me because nobody could be stupid enough to believe that. First of all when the Zags compete against big name schools i.e. UCLA, UNC, etc. they do compete and often win (like this year). On the other hand however, (no offense to Griz football fans) the Griz get smoked by big name schools. For example, Iowa, they lost 41 to 7. And Iowa isn't that good of a team this year.
Are you serious? Do you not look at cold hard facts and evidence before you go spouting off at the mouth. The fact of the matter is-is that the Zags compete with anyone anywhere. So don't say that Zag fans are "delusional" because the facts are right in front of you.

Football is alittle different from basketball buddy. Dont even try to compare mid-major basketball to 1-AA football :naughty:

Dick Vitale is quoted as saying that the only reason that college basketball is better than college football is because the little guy always has a shot. Any Given night can a basketball team beat another basketball team (of course, exceptions, I know)

Football is a game of power and speed, and quite frankly those are traits that you cannot coach no matter how good of a coach you are. The Griz, as a 1-AA team, would never beat a upper BSC team because team speed, and overall strength is so much that they would never even have a chance

Young Swilly, you have so much to learn. For example, you should read what I was responding to before you refute what I wrote. Not once did I compare mid-major basketball to I-AA football. I did, however, compare the fans of each. Please read, and try to understand, what I am talking about before you respond to my posts. Read what Umdeez said about comparing Griz football fans that think they compare with big time teams to Zag fans that think they compare to big time teams.
Follow my directions and you won't look so foolish next time.

First of all when the Zags compete against big name schools i.e. UCLA, UNC, etc. they do compete and often win (like this year). On the other hand however, (no offense to Griz football fans) the Griz get smoked by big name schools. For example, Iowa, they lost 41 to 7. And Iowa isn't that good of a team this year.

That is comparing 1-AA football to Mid-Major basketball. I know what you meant to say but this is what you said and it is completely ludicrous to think that losing to Iowa as a 1-AA team and beating UNC as a basketball team is comparable. Its just not, two different games, two different leagues, and I guess...two different opinions

 

[Swillbury]

Thats enough kiddies, lets not turn this into a grammer lesson.


STICK TO BASKETBALL

Oh my god, I just noticed this! Ok, I'm done, I promise.... :dance:

Ahhh.....you win

(SHIT!)

 

[copper&gold]

I've been reading this thread for a while, don't ask me why. As far as I can tell people are arguing similar topics on both this thread and ZAGS DOMNINATION BEGINS.
From what I can tell Zags fans are very excited, and possibly should be-only time will tell.
umdeez posted that he sees some similarities between Griz fb and Zags hoop fans. I took this to mean that fans of each respective squad believe their team is the be all and end all of their respective sport, and in turn inflate their importance, stature and status. Meaning that griz fb fans think a jump to 1-a would be no problem, and zags hoops fans think the bulldogs would have little problem playing in a power conference. Maybe umdeez needs to clarify, but thats what I got.
The other bone of contention seems to be that some are arguing about GU's potential (lou, Iamyou, Cdagriz) and some about what GU has accomplished (umdeez, and swilly-although to a lesser extent).
As far as this is concerned umdeez has a point. Gonzaga had a great run from 1999-2001, three straight sweet 16's and one elite 8. But from 2002-06 only one sweet 16. Now that is very respectable, but their great run came as underdogs (10,10, and 12 seeds). From 2003-06 they've had the 9, 2, 3, and 3 seeds and really haven't "pissed a drop." That's not even mentioning an embarrassing loss to Wyoming in 2002 when the Zags were bitching because they deserved better than a six seed, or when at #2 seed they got their shorts dropped by #10 nevada in Seattle-virtually a home game. Point being the zags have played the underdog well, but when the favorite they fold up like a lawn chair.

People also want to speculate as to how the zags would fair in a big time conference. Well Wake Forest is generally a middle of the pack ACC team, since 2001 both Wake and GU have each made 4 round of 32's and one sweet 16. In the same time Boston College (not all that respected in the Big East until recently and the jury is out on how they'll fair year in year out in the ACC) has made 3 sweet 16's. It seems with similar seeding GU does similarly well in the tourney as middle of the road ACC teams. But as swilly points out playing an ACC or Big East conference schedule is a different story than playing the cupcakes of the WCC. Also keep in mind the Both the Big East and ACC conference tourney's are considerably more gruelling than the WCC's, meaning the Zags have tuneup's going into the NCAA's while other teams are in dogfights.

Iamyou want's to argue that the Zags have the talent to compete with the best teams, and admittedly the zags do compete well. He listed the STAR ratings of each player from both the Zags and UCLA. The Zags average star rating (according to Iamyou) is 3.4 while UCLA's is 3.9. That's 0.5 star rating difference, doesn't seem like alot but over the course of the season it really is. I didn't count Downs for GU because he won't play this year, but if you add him to the 2007 class GU's average player is 3.75 while UCLA's is 4.5, now thats a big difference in incoming talent.
For all the info/opinion spewed on this thread the point remains: GU has a nice program going up there, played better than expected from 1999-01. Ever since they've been given a high seed-and the expectations that accompany it they haven't done a damn thing. So until GU gets a high seed and advances further than the sweet 16 it doesn't behoove anyone to get overly excited about a non-conference win-even it is NC

 

[CDAGRIZ]

Now that is the first well reasoned argument I've ever heard against the ZAGS being a better than middle of the road team in a major conference over the last four years. Two things are for certain: the ZAGS are a good team, and GU has the best altogether program in the PNW for for the last decade or so. Not bad for a little school from Spocompton.

 

[Swillbury]

Now that is the first well reasoned argument I've ever heard against the ZAGS being a better than middle of the road team in a major conference over the last four years. Two things are for certain: the ZAGS are a good team, and GU has the best altogether program in the PNW for for the last decade or so. Not bad for a little school from Spocompton.

Nobody is argueing that, the argument comes when Zag fans think they are "Big Time" without even makeing a final four....EVER. Hell George Mason has one more final four than them! But really, they had their best shot last year with probably the best team they have ever fielded and choked against UCLA. Facts are facts and as they have had a great run, they are just not BIG Time yet....

 

[CDAGRIZ]

Now that is the first well reasoned argument I've ever heard against the ZAGS being a better than middle of the road team in a major conference over the last four years. Two things are for certain: the ZAGS are a good team, and GU has the best altogether program in the PNW for for the last decade or so. Not bad for a little school from Spocompton.

Nobody is argueing that...

Swilly, look at the choices in this thread's poll. I think somebody IS arguing this (poorly). I agree with almost everything you think about the ZAGS. I am a realist. They haven't reached the big-time yet. Every ZAG fan I know will agree that GU is not quite on par with the elite teams. I just can't stand it when somebody is so ridiculously naive (not you) that he thinks the ZAGS suck.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

BTW, Swill. I think Lou was trying to say that he wasn't comparing the two sports. He was comparing the fans of UM FB who think they would have a shot if they moved up (umdeez's words, not his) and the fans of GU BB who think they are big-time. Neither one of these hypothetical fans is well-grounded in fact, but Lou's point was that the GU BB fan can make a lot better case than the UM FB fan in this regard. So, umdeez's likening of the GU BB fan to the UM FB fan is weak, at best.

UM FB gets trounced by 1A
GU goes 9-1 vs. ACC
etc.
etc.
etc.

He's not comparing the two sports, just the fans of the two sports.

 

[Lou]

BTW, Swill. I think Lou was trying to say that he wasn't comparing the two sports. He was comparing the fans of UM FB who think they would have a shot if they moved up (umdeez's words, not his) and the fans of GU BB who think they are big-time. Neither one of these hypothetical fans is well-grounded in fact, but Lou's point was that the GU BB fan can make a lot better case than the UM FB fan in this regard. So, umdeez's likening of the GU BB fan to the UM FB fan is weak, at best.

UM FB gets trounced by 1A
GU goes 9-1 vs. ACC
etc.
etc.
etc.

He's not comparing the two sports, just the fans of the two sports.

Thanks CDA, but it's no use. Swilly just doesn't understand the argument that umdeez and I were having. He likes to jump in to conversations without knowing what he's talking about. It's ok, I'm getting used to it on this site.

 

[umdeez]

Cdagriz- I never said the Griz football team is comparable to Gonzaga basketball. What I was merely saying was that there are Grizfans that think the football team would compete at 1A which they would not as evidence by the Iowa game who was a middle of the pack Big 10 team this year. I am just as annoyed by those griz fans as I am by many Zag fans. How is that a weak argument?? And please do everyone a favor and give it up with the grammar crap, it's more annoying than anything and a waste of time to read. Evidence of how much time you have on your hands I guess.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

Cdagriz- I never said the Griz football team is comparable to Gonzaga basketball. What I was merely saying was that there are Grizfans that think the football team would compete at 1A which they would not as evidence by the Iowa game who was a middle of the pack Big 10 team this year. I am just as annoyed by those griz fans as I am by many Zag fans. How is that a weak argument?? And please do everyone a favor and give it up with the grammar crap, it's more annoying than anything and a waste of time to read. Evidence of how much time you have on your hands I guess.

Did you even read my last post? Honestly?

I affirmed that I understand your argument. So did Lou. I even think Swilly now gets it. Again, here's how it's weak: Us Griz fans have no indication that we can compete in big time FB (1-A) as indicated by our huge losses. The fans who believe any different are delusional (Oregon, Iowa,you're right!). The Zag BB fans, on the other hand, who think the ZAGS can compete with the big boys have somewhat of a case due to the ZAGS's record against said "Big Boys". Thus, they are not as delusional.

When you said that Zag BB fans anGriz FB fans annoy you for the same reason, and then stated that reason, you compared the fans of the two teams in that regard.

I never ONCE said you compared the two teams. Apples and Oranges....

 

[CDAGRIZ]

I would compare Zags fans to Griz football fans that think the Griz could move up and still contend. It's just not happening.

Just a little reminder...

 

[CDAGRIZ]

And please do everyone a favor and give it up with the grammar crap, it's more annoying than anything and a waste of time to read. Evidence of how much time you have on your hands I guess.

When you tell me my writing skills are inferior to yours, and you can't even stay in the same tense, I'm awed by your absolute and unrelenting stupidity regarding pretty much everything we've ever discussed.

If you are really in college, you must major in something completely quantitative not to have flunked out by now.

Oh, and save the corny jokes (jimmy dykes, CSI, et al) for the board that rhymes with Zag. They really get old and they expose your simple-mindedness Have a nice day corn.

 

[umdeez]

Cdagriz- Are you on this board to talk about basketball or critique my writing skills. I'm sorry I don't use this as a forum do display my ENEX 101 learnings. Who are you to question what my major is? How old are you honestly?