$9 Million More Budget Cuts for UM

[PlayerRep]

Engstrom appears to be severely lacking in leadership skills, as well as vision. UM appears to be on the verge of spinning out of control in a downward spiral. Reversing the large downward enrollment trend and significant budget problems will be very hard to accomplish--and would be even for a strong leader with good vision.

Engstrom must have completely missed and misjudged the enrollment problems. UM seems to have not taken any corrective action until last year, and even that was too little too late.

Engstrom contributed to the enrollment problems with his statements, mistakes and missteps, including assisting in blowing the sexual assault stuff out of proportion and helping put in the mainstream national press. He unfairly and incorrectly pointed the finger at athletics, by his statements and actions--yet nothing came of any of the investigations and reports, other than Donaldson's matter. He hitched his wagon to the wrong people, including Pat Williams.

The Board of Regents had better take notice. UM needs strong leadership and some correct and tough actions need to be taken, both by UM and the Regents.

 

[GrizzGriz]

Just a simple observation..I live in Idaho, I have a daughter who is a sophomore at UM and another daughter who is a sophomore in high school . Yesterday my daughter in high school received a letter from MSU...ironically my daughter in Missoula is a marketing major. Hmmmmm.

 

[Silvertip]

While the gnashing of teeth and rending of garments continue over the sorry mess that is the University of Montana one undeniable truth, acknowledged by most, rings clear. without BOR intervention Royce Engstrom stands to be on the road to what may become the longest lame duck presidency in UM history. Fact: He is devoid of credibility and that is the single most attribute of any leader. Engstrom is academia's poster child for the Peter Principle, having been elevated form the chemistry lab and a junior provost slot to the ultimate responsibility for the university system's Missoula campus - for which he has neither the ability nor the temperment.

Governor Bullock (whose namesake is after all a gelded bull) has shown no compunction to reorder the Board of Regents into a hard nosed body that demands and implements positive action. Their stewardship, most recently noted, was to busy themselves tinkering with name changes reflecting perceptions of UM's humanities curriculum.... more rearranging of deck chairs on a campus that looks increasingly like the Titanic.

Helena, in its witless guile, continues to place the declining future of UM to an apparently decent man who can neither inspire nor lead. The university is in a crisis mode that those most central to changing the descending arc either don't see or simply choose to ignore...

 

[Washgrizfan1]

Rumors of big enrollment problems for the upcoming semester.

 

[statler & waldorf]

Under Engstroms 'leadership' UM has taken a freefall to depths previously thought impossible. Now that parachuting into WGS has been effectively eliminated, perhaps he could use "Free Fallin'" as his theme song, though Tom Petty might object.

...so easy to simplify years of malfeasance and dump all on engstrom....how about the many years that dennison reigned supreme....this stuff took a while to play out. Surely current administration has bungled but it took a village to conjure up this building fiasco.

Stop the hemorrhaging before anything else. He, and all his bootlicking lackeys need to go, and now!

 

[argh!]

regarding recruits being influenced by the allegations of sexual misconduct, firings, etc, greenie sez:
Postby PlayerRep » Thu Jan 16, 2014 11:36 pm
Is this supposed to be surprising? I have friends who are friends of families of 2 recruits, and they said the prior goings on in Missoula haven't influenced them at all.

regarding to the rest of the student populace, greenie sez:

Engstrom contributed to the enrollment problems with his statements, mistakes and missteps, including assisting in blowing the sexual assault stuff out of proportion and helping put in the mainstream national press. .

nice try, greenie.

 

[Proud Griz Man]

I am a U of M grad Last fall my niece asked me to take her to Bozeman and show her MSU (her interests were in engineering). So I agreed.
She is going to be a Bobcat next fall. My sister (her mother) has implored her to at least look at other options just to be sure. She won't even look anywhere else. They totally won her over and I have to say they looked great. The dorms are being remodeled, there's a new multi million dollar business school an alumni donated, on and on and on.

Hey Mich Griz; Please have Griz Granny sit down with this niece and have a little heart-to-heart discussion, then She will see the light!

 

[PlayerRep]

regarding recruits being influenced by the allegations of sexual misconduct, firings, etc, greenie sez:
Postby PlayerRep » Thu Jan 16, 2014 11:36 pm
Is this supposed to be surprising? I have friends who are friends of families of 2 recruits, and they said the prior goings on in Missoula haven't influenced them at all.

regarding to the rest of the student populace, greenie sez:

Engstrom contributed to the enrollment problems with his statements, mistakes and missteps, including assisting in blowing the sexual assault stuff out of proportion and helping put in the mainstream national press. .

nice try, greenie.

You obviously aren't smart enough to realize that the first comment was a joke in response to a poster starting a thread saying he knows a recruit who didn't go to UM because if the prior goings on stuff. And the goings-on stuff was much broader than sexual assault.

 

[Spanky]

Excellent posts by Player and Tip about the primary problem at UM....Engstrom.

 

[PlayerRep]

Excellent posts by Player and Tip about the primary problem at UM....Engstrom.

I chuckled at this earlier post:

Postby Pater_Ursus_Arctos » Thu Jan 23, 2014 10:30 am
The only thing that needs to be cut is President Engstrom.

 

[kemajic]

Everyone kept talking about "Their President" (an Asian woman) and what a dynamic person she was and how much she's done for the students the campus and facilities. Everyone loved her.

There is nothing Asian about Waded Cruzado, president of MSU. She is Puerto Rican. She is also kicking our as$; she is the real deal. Can't believe they will be able to keep her much longer. Contrast her track record to he level of performance we have in our president's office.

http://www.montana.edu/president/biography.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[griz4life]

This is going to be a very tough trend to turn around and will probably drive the selection of the next president --once the regents decide Royce has done enough damage, probably not until the net loss of Engstrom's tenure hits $30 million. maybe in another year.
I'll bet the next president is a crisis manager more than a builder. Montana won't get back to advancing its mission for several years.
Kind of make me wonder if Royce was looking over the edge of this enrollment sinkhole when he decided to self impose scholarship cuts for football. Probably didn't want to spend the money on scholarships anyway. great excuse to hide behind.

 

[billings_poke]

wait you guys actually cut football scholarships? or was it overall athletic scholarships? Did I read that right?

 

[wbtfg]

wait you guys actually cut football scholarships? or was it overall athletic scholarships? Did I read that right?

I think he's talking about self imposed ncaa penalties.

 

[griz4life]

The scholarships cut were a self imposed penalty and the are sport specific. football. 63 to 59 for three years starting in 2014-2015.

 

[garizzalies]

Another big issue with "keeping grads in state after graduation" is that MT really has an issue with "hey, you live in MT, that's a perk in itself, so here's less money." Granted, there isn't much to go around (money), but with the cost of tuition going up and up (even in-state), why stay in a state that will pay you crap, after graduation (I'm not saying you should be "entitled" to getting a high paying salary) when you can move a state or two away and get your loans paid off faster, because you can do the same job in a different state and make more right off the bat?

As they say, "You can't eat the scenery."

Sure you can. Oh wait, you mean like trees and stuff. nm.

 

[AZGrizFan]

Another big issue with "keeping grads in state after graduation" is that MT really has an issue with "hey, you live in MT, that's a perk in itself, so here's less money." Granted, there isn't much to go around (money), but with the cost of tuition going up and up (even in-state), why stay in a state that will pay you crap, after graduation (I'm not saying you should be "entitled" to getting a high paying salary) when you can move a state or two away and get your loans paid off faster, because you can do the same job in a different state and make more right off the bat?

Yep....and that remains a problem for those of us trying to get BACK to Montana as well....I was asked to take (what amounted to) an almost 25% pay cut to do essentially the exact same job in Missoula that I was doing in a similar-sized town in Arizona. I want to get back to Montana, but not that badly. :twisted: :twisted:

 

[cclarkblues]

Another big issue with "keeping grads in state after graduation" is that MT really has an issue with "hey, you live in MT, that's a perk in itself, so here's less money." Granted, there isn't much to go around (money), but with the cost of tuition going up and up (even in-state), why stay in a state that will pay you crap, after graduation (I'm not saying you should be "entitled" to getting a high paying salary) when you can move a state or two away and get your loans paid off faster, because you can do the same job in a different state and make more right off the bat?

As they say, "You can't eat the scenery."

That's not what Bear Grilz says.

 

[grizonbob]

This discussion reminds me of a conversation I had two months ago with a couple of college professors (not in Missoula or Bozeman). We were talking about how students' aspirations/expectations have changed over the years, and the professors told me that most of today's students are much more practical in their approach to picking a school and determining a major. Because of the nation's economic struggles, they said, most students look hard at what college programs will jibe with their interests but also give them the basis for a secure economic future. They also are more aware of the dangers of amassing big student loan debt while being in majors that won't pay off that debt after they graduate.

With its heavy emphasis on liberal arts and majors like history, education, languages, communication, arts, and so on, UM is at a disadvantage in that environment. Especially when the other big draw in Montana, where students also benefit from relatively cheap tuition fees, is a school that focuses much more on science and tech, and just generally the sorts of fields where a student knows he has a decent chance of finding a good-paying job once he graduates.

I've seen this phenomenon with young acquaintances who graduated from UM with liberal arts degrees, only to find that the piece of paper they earned after years of study just isn't that marketable. One returned to school to train in a computer-related field, the other isn't sure at all what they will do next. I've also seen this first-hand in my own family, as my wife and I both graduated from UM, but our kids picked MSU for the reasons I spelled out. I also noticed this recently in reading through some of the profiles of the new recruits MSU football has picked up. I recall reading, for example, the one on the Collins' kid from Bozeman, who was attracting interest from a number of schools. He said his first reaction was to get out of Bozeman so he could have some new life experiences. But after looking at academic programs, he decided he couldn't do any better than the engineering program at MSU.

This won't be an easy problem to fix. A lot of colleges that focus heavily on liberal arts are struggling. Maybe these latest budget cutbacks will even help by forcing those who work at UM to rethink their priorities, including folks who have resisted change for decades.

 

[PlayerRep]

This discussion reminds me of a conversation I had two months ago with a couple of college professors (not in Missoula or Bozeman). We were talking about how students' aspirations/expectations have changed over the years, and the professors told me that most of today's students are much more practical in their approach to picking a school and determining a major. Because of the nation's economic struggles, they said, most students look hard at what college programs will jibe with their interests but also give them the basis for a secure economic future. They also are more aware of the dangers of amassing big student loan debt while being in majors that won't pay off that debt after they graduate.

With its heavy emphasis on liberal arts and majors like history, education, languages, communication, arts, and so on, UM is at a disadvantage in that environment. Especially when the other big draw in Montana, where students also benefit from relatively cheap tuition fees, is a school that focuses much more on science and tech, and just generally the sorts of fields where a student knows he has a decent chance of finding a good-paying job once he graduates.

I've seen this phenomenon with young acquaintances who graduated from UM with liberal arts degrees, only to find that the piece of paper they earned after years of study just isn't that marketable. One returned to school to train in a computer-related field, the other isn't sure at all what they will do next. I've also seen this first-hand in my own family, as my wife and I both graduated from UM, but our kids picked MSU for the reasons I spelled out. I also noticed this recently in reading through some of the profiles of the new recruits MSU football has picked up. I recall reading, for example, the one on the Collins' kid from Bozeman, who was attracting interest from a number of schools. He said his first reaction was to get out of Bozeman so he could have some new life experiences. But after looking at academic programs, he decided he couldn't do any better than the engineering program at MSU.

This won't be an easy problem to fix. A lot of colleges that focus heavily on liberal arts are struggling. Maybe these latest budget cutbacks will even help by forcing those who work at UM to rethink their priorities, including folks who have resisted change for decades.

While I agree with this to some extent, I don't think that most kids entering college are looking that carefully at what courses/programs are offered, what they will go into, and what types of jobs they will be able to get upon graduation. More probably are now, but not the majority. More are paying attention to payment/loans/debt, and that is probably a good thing.

Given what you stated, how does that fit with the recent press that MSU's ag program is booming, or at least that was my impression. Ag is not growing and booming, and there are fewer opportunities in ag than there used to be--or am I not right on that?

I'm still a big believer in the value of a liberal education. Generally, I believe that makes students more well-rounded, more able to adapt in and to the future, more likely to be tolerant, etc. It's not the only way to achieve those things, but it's a good and proven way.

On the other hand, UM seems to be suffering now from too much emphasis, or press, on things that don't seem to be as useful. Also, too much emphasis or press on global warming or extreme environmental stuff/classes. Also, the word is that UM's course offerings have been reduced, or made less frequent, so that it's hard to get certain degrees, or get them in 4 years.