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It happenin

College Football Realignment: Pac-12 Officially Adding Mountain West Teams, ACC Facing Issues​

Hero Sports, Sept. 24

"The Mountain West agreed to a $270 million media rights deal in 2020 with CBS and FOX, according to The Athletic. It would end after the 2025-26 season. Teams are scheduled to be paid $4 million per year."

herosports.com

College Football Realignment: Pac-12 Officially Adding Mountain West Teams, ACC Facing Issues

Plenty has changed in college sports the past year. Read about how it all impacts Group of Five football programs.
herosports.com herosports.com
 
mthoopsfan said:
Informative articles.

UNLV reconsidering MW commitment after Utah State bolts for Pac-12​


www.reviewjournal.com

UNLV reconsidering MW commitment after Utah State bolts for Pac-12

UNLV appeared ready to commit to the Mountain West on Monday after a brief flirtation with the rebuilding Pac-12, but another defection has created uncertainty for both leagues.
www.reviewjournal.com www.reviewjournal.com

Pac-12 sues Mountain West over ‘invalid and unenforceable’ fees​


www.reviewjournal.com

Pac-12 sues Mountain West over ‘invalid and unenforceable’ fees

The Pac-12 filed a lawsuit against the Mountain West in federal court in California amid a flurry of realignment activity.
www.reviewjournal.com www.reviewjournal.com

Pac-12 files a federal lawsuit against Mountain West over $43 million in 'poaching' penalties​

The Pac-12 is suing the Mountain West over what it calls unlawful and unenforceable fees that could cost the rebuilding conference more than $40 million for adding Boise State, Fresno State, Colorado State and San Diego State​


www.columbiamissourian.com

Pac-12 files a federal lawsuit against Mountain West over $43 million in 'poaching' penalties

The Pac-12 currently owes over $43 million dollars in "poaching" penalties to the Mountain West for adding Boise State, Fresno State, Colorado State and San Diego State to the rebuilding
www.columbiamissourian.com www.columbiamissourian.com
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The PAC doesn't have a case, you don't agree and sign a contract and then turn around and cry when it's enforced. The duress claims are also bullshit, they didn't have to agree to the MWC scheduling agreement when they could have scheduled multiple FCS schools, paid individual teams, etc.
 
I’m going to be silly and recap some older Pac issues for reference.

(1) I saw whispers 6-7 years ago about USC considering independence. Started with bloggers, but then the AD gave an ominous non-commital “we’re keeping our options open” answer when a question was posed about this talk, which by then was exposed by a columnist or two down in LA. So when USC and UCLA bolted, it was a shock, but I wasn’t completely surprised. But don’t forget the whole ESPN vs Fox dynamic to that.

(2) The Pac tries to regroup in the wake of this. Within two weeks, some noise drops about a partnership with the ACC. More than one person intrinsically knew this came from Stanford. Let me put it this way… ASU was rah rah Pac staying together. Colorado started being a little weird. Arizona- kind of quiet. The University of Oregon, from which I have a degree, a school whose athletic department learned to be freaking loud- STONE SILENT on the subject. UW kind of followed their lead, though their president was in charge of the Pac’s media contract relations at that point and seemed picky and choosy. OSU and WSU were trying to reassure their bases that everything would be alright. There’s no way ANY of them were thinking “wait, let’s talk to the ACC.” That was a Stanford operation and Cal stuck with them. Of course, c’mon, Stanford and Notre Dame have a relationship.

(3) While Oregon was dead silent, pretty much everyone knew when Phil Knight himself paid a visit to Chicago, clearly to talk with B1G officials. That did speak volumes.

(4) At this point is when the infamous Utah professor was like “hey, this conference can still get B1G money.” Unbridled Utah optimism. SMH.

I could go a little further, with the timeline… but the vectors are all set right there, as long as I add the thoughts that Arizona may have coveted an association with Kansas basketball and ASU theoretically had to keep an eye out. In hindsight, that breakup was destiny. Just understand that the only way OSU and WSU can keep 9 digits of Pac money and assets is to create a functioning conference by hook or by crook, and that’s where we are now.

As for Stanford and Cal… it’s really hard for me to see Stanford backtracking from their position… unless their recruiting for all the sports goes to crap. It’s way too soon, really. But they’re the school that makes sure to put in bold print on their billboard on El Camino Real when they’ve won a Sears Cup. It’s their gig. California does their best to keep up with Stanford, plays most of the same sports, and both would be in several other conferences for other sports if they jump back to the Pac to face schools Stanford all but swore they’d never associate with. The debt at Memorial Stadium, however, has to give Cal some pause.
 
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Ut-Grizfan said:
The PAC doesn't have a case, you don't agree and sign a contract and then turn around and cry when it's enforced. The duress claims are also bullshit, they didn't have to agree to the MWC scheduling agreement when they could have scheduled multiple FCS schools, paid individual teams, etc.
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I didn’t realize that you were a big time contracts, antitrust and sports lawyer. Ha.
 
mthoopsfan said:
I played, started and was all-conference on an undefeated team that was ranked no.14 at the end of the season, and was ranked as the top team in the East ahead of Penn St. I am in an athletic hall of fame (not high school). I made my school's all 50-year team. Did you start? Were you all-conference? What was your team's top ranking at the end of a season? Who many athletic hall of fames are you in?
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Let me ask again - did you play on a P5 team? A simple yes or no will do.
 
mthoopsfan said:
Hey kid, you are flailing.

Yes, you said Stanford/Cal won't consider coming back. I said this (below) and you said I was wrong. Neither you, nor even the boards of trustees, could possibly know that at this time. Things will change over time. "If the new PAC-12 gets going, I think Stanford and Cal would look at returning."

Now, you admit that it's possible that Stanford/Cal would look at coming back under some circumstances. You just admitted my point.

I assume you are a typical phd who doesn't write English very well, and isn't precise in everyday conversation. Sorry, but I know very few phd's who are strong on English.

You weren't talking about "medals" earlier. You said "competitors". Bad English? Bad memory. Changing the goalposts. This is what you said: "Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but I think at this prior Olympics Stanford and Berkeley were #1 and #2 most represented universities by the competitors." Competitors are not medals.

Some of my friends and acquaintances know the members of the Stanford board of trustees. That's who would make decisions like this. Not your young mover and shaker friends.

And you admitted that you have no special knowledge. That is your problem, not mine.

So, despite having no special knowledge on the subject, you assert that your friends know more than my "old" friends. How could you possibly know that. You don't know who I know. I don't mind arrogant people who know a lot, but I'm not much for arrogant people who act like they know more than they do. I put you in the category. Again, there is something strange about you and your supposed story.

I am not worked out about anything. I just enjoy proving youngsters like yourself wrong. A number of people in your age group think they know way more than they do. That's in my experience, and you can google for articles.
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Hey old guy, you are flailing, and both your senility and insecurity are showing. Thanks for admitting you're not directly connected to the people making decisions on this. At least you're finally being honest.

My English is good enough that all of my academic contributions landed in Q1 journals, which is plenty good for me. You want more, too bad.

The Olympic medals and competitors - that's great, an off hand comment that I didn't even care enough to look up, and openly invited anyone to correct me on. Thanks for taking the time.

Hoops, at your age, just lay back and take a rest. If you need to continue this convo, feel free to do so in PM. We've now spent dozens of posts on this thread circling the drain just because you always get your panties in a twist when someone disagrees with you. It's ridiculous.
 
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Ut-Grizfan said:
Worst case scenario the MWC will be left with 6 teams. Backfill with UTEP, NMSU and make Hawaii a full member. Then add both Montanas along with SAC, Idaho and maybe the Dakota States you have a solid Conference:

SJSU.............Wyoming
Nevada.........Montana
Sac State......MSU
Hawaii..........Air Force
Idaho............UTEP
UNM.............NMSU
*NDSU..........*SDSU

* = Football Only
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I could go either way on the move up/ don't move up thing, but what matters more to me is what I think always made college football the best sport in the country - regionality and regional rivalries. Whether it's FCS or FBS, any scenario that puts us in a conference with MSU, Idaho, Wyoming and the Dakota schools is my dream scenario.
 
Berkeley_Griz said:
I could go either way on the move up/ don't move up thing, but what matters more to me is what I think always made college football the best sport in the country - regionality and regional rivalries. Whether it's FCS or FBS, any scenario that puts us in a conference with MSU, Idaho, Wyoming and the Dakota schools is my dream scenario.
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I agree with the regional rivalries being important. That would be awesome scenario. I think college football as the best sport in the country overall now is questionable especially with the break up of these regional rivalries etc. The NCAA Basketball tournament is the best sporting event in the nation by far. Unfortunately this power grab by conferences has harmed college basketball also. The MWC Conference was an excellent basketball conference the last couple years. The PAC 12 was historically a great basketball conference. It was always a fun basketball weekend in Las Vegas when these conference tournaments were being played. I think these decisions are short sighted by these universities. The big money football programs are benefiting and the rest are not really going to see much increased interest in their football programs. Outside of Griz football and the FCS my interest is waning in P5 football. I prefer the NFL it is more honest about what it is.
 
Berkeley_Griz said:
Let me ask again - did you play on a P5 team? A simple yes or no will do.
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Nope, and never said I did. But I achieved more in football than you did. I see you are not answering the questions I asked about your supposed career. That’s tells us a lot.
 
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Berkeley_Griz said:
Hey old guy, you are flailing, and both your senility and insecurity are showing. Thanks for admitting you're not directly connected to the people making decisions on this. At least you're finally being honest.

My English is good enough that all of my academic contributions landed in Q1 journals, which is plenty good for me. You want more, too bad.

The Olympic medals and competitors - that's great, an off hand comment that I didn't even care enough to look up, and openly invited anyone to correct me on. Thanks for taking the time.

Hoops, at your age, just lay back and take a rest. If you need to continue this convo, feel free to do so in PM. We've now spent dozens of posts on this thread circling the drain just because you always get your panties in a twist when someone disagrees with you. It's ridiculous.
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You got proven wrong. And got shown to shown to be borderline dishonest and immature.
 
UncleRico said:
I agree with the regional rivalries being important. That would be awesome scenario. I think college football as the best sport in the country overall now is questionable especially with the break up of these regional rivalries etc. The NCAA Basketball tournament is the best sporting event in the nation by far. Unfortunately this power grab by conferences has harmed college basketball also. The MWC Conference was an excellent basketball conference the last couple years. The PAC 12 was historically a great basketball conference. It was always a fun basketball weekend in Las Vegas when these conference tournaments were being played. I think these decisions are short sighted by these universities. The big money football programs are benefiting and the rest are not really going to see much increased interest in their football programs. Outside of Griz football and the FCS my interest is waning in P5 football. I prefer the NFL it is more honest about what it is.
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I agree. FBS football is now P2.
 
Ut-Grizfan said:
The PAC doesn't have a case, you don't agree and sign a contract and then turn around and cry when it's enforced. The duress claims are also bullshit, they didn't have to agree to the MWC scheduling agreement when they could have scheduled multiple FCS schools, paid individual teams, etc.
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Duress will be hard to explain when they had 2-300 million in the coffers between the 2 schools and don’t want to pony up 1/3 to half of it.
 
I find all this conference realignment fascinating (in a watching a car wreck way) for the big schools. Unless the state of montana starts paying more for sports, its not gonna happen for UM. The Griz are poised to ride out the fcs until it is no more
 
Wolf777 said:
Duress will be hard to explain when they had 2-300 million in the coffers between the 2 schools and don’t want to pony up 1/3 to half of it.
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The suit is not about the departure fees. The suit is about the separate and unusual/unique agreement that the MW forced on MW in order for the P2 to schedule 6 games, which has a "pouching penalty". I have no idea about the merits or prospects of the suit, but there was considerable pressure and duress.

"The two sides will play the 2024 season as pseudo-partners with each MW team playing at least one game against Oregon State or Washington State with the MW getting $14 million to play 12 games against the Pac-2." The MW said their teams will only play you, if you pay us $14 million and agree not to pouch any of our teams. Now a bunch of MW teams want to depart the MW and join the Pac-2. I see the argument that they should be allowed to do that, especially if their departure fee is paid.

""The MWC’s excessive and punitive Poaching Penalty violates federal and state antitrust law, California’s Unfair Competition Law (UCL) and basic principles of contract law,"the lawsuit reads. "First, the Poaching Penalty is a per se violation of antitrust law because it is a naked, horizontal agreement in restraint of trade. The Poaching Penalty weakens the Pac-12 in competition with other conferences for MWC member schools, diminishes the compensation available for schools interested in joining the Pac-12, and reduces MWC member schools’ options for mobility. On the flip side of the coin, the Poaching Penalty does nothing to increase the amount of college football played, which was the purpose of the Scheduling Agreement."

nevadasportsnet.com

Inside the Pac-12's lawsuit against the Mountain West that claims 'poaching fees' invalid

In addition to poaching five of its top schools, the Pac-12 also wants to take the Mountain West to court. The Pac-12 has filed a lawsuit against the MW in fed
nevadasportsnet.com nevadasportsnet.com
 
Wolf777 said:
Duress will be hard to explain when they had 2-300 million in the coffers between the 2 schools and don’t want to pony up 1/3 to half of it.
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The duress was that the MW said they wouldn't play the P2 this year, if the P2 didn't agree to this agreement. The P2 needed to schedule games to continue to exist. I suspect the case will be decided, if to settled, under federal and state antitrust laws and perhaps other state statues. Antitrust law and lawyers will have a big say. While not the same, antitrust laws have not been kind to the ncaa.
 
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