Central Washington to move to FCS?

[AZGrizFan]

Any team moving to FCS in the west just means that much greater chance of the BSC shrinking and not being such a cluster for football. We need 18 teams to split and CWU makes 14.

would love to see a school like CSU-Pueblo move up as well...USD offering athletic schollies...that would only leave a couple more slots and then we could get back to sanity in the conference(s).

 

[UNDfan]

Stated this before, but the Griz cant read.

New Summit FBS League

UND - NDSu
USD- SDSU
Omaha Denver both non fb
Weber St -Mont St
Montana - Idaho

New WAC -FBS
UC Davis - Sac St
Cal Poly - Cal BBaptist
GCU - NMSU
Sam Houston St - Lamar
UTRGV -SF Austin

New Big Sky - FCS
Seattle non fb - PSU
EWU -CWU
Idaho St - UVU no fb
SUU -Dixie st
NAU - Azusa Pacific

 

[CatGrad-UMGradStu]

Stated this before, but the Griz cant read.

New Summit FBS League

UND - NDSu
USD- SDSU
Omaha Denver both non fb
Weber St -Mont St
Montana - Idaho

New WAC -FBS
UC Davis - Sac St
Cal Poly - Cal BBaptist
GCU - NMSU
Sam Houston St - Lamar
UTRGV -SF Austin

New Big Sky - FCS
Seattle non fb - PSU
EWU -CWU
Idaho St - UVU no fb
SUU -Dixie st
NAU - Azusa Pacific

As much as you or I or anyone here would like to speculate, these alliances are probably not going away anytime soon.

Summit Basketball
Denver
Indiana Purdue-Fort Wayne
Omaha
NDSU
ND
Oral Roberts
SDSU
SD
Western Illinois

Missouri Valley Basketball
Bradley
Drake
Evansville
Illinois State
Missouri State
Northern Iowa
Southern Illinois
Valparaiso

Horizon
Cleveland
Detroit
Indiana Purdue-Indianapolis
Wisconsin-Milwaukee
Northern Kentucky
Chicago
Wright State
Youngstown

As you can see the MVFC is spread over three basketball conferences and common sense prevails in the midwest relative travel and basically taking care of the student-athletes. Just as the two Montana schools are joined at the hip and will forever and always be in the same league and competitive level, the two Idaho flagship universities are going to be placed on the same level again and whether Idaho's venture with Division I taught them anything, it ought to have provided them a lesson as to what ultimately happened to both athletic programs in Idaho when they lost their regional rivalry. They both crashed.

Politics in both Montana and Idaho will not allow these four schools to look toward the midwest as there are too many people in these two states now who feel their own athletic affiliations belong on the west coast. We'll never be able to share a conference affiliation out here with nonfootball playing private schools as the midwest is capable of doing. It is just a mindset that the folks have here. Look at all the nonrevenue sports the nonfootball private schools offer student-athletes and the midwest basketball conferences also.

 

[CatGrad-UMGradStu]

Stated this before, but the Griz cant read.

New Summit FBS League

UND - NDSu
USD- SDSU
Omaha Denver both non fb
Weber St -Mont St
Montana - Idaho

New WAC -FBS
UC Davis - Sac St
Cal Poly - Cal BBaptist
GCU - NMSU
Sam Houston St - Lamar
UTRGV -SF Austin

New Big Sky - FCS
Seattle non fb - PSU
EWU -CWU
Idaho St - UVU no fb
SUU -Dixie st
NAU - Azusa Pacific

As much as you or I or anyone here would like to speculate, these alliances are probably not going away anytime soon.

Summit Basketball
Denver
Indiana Purdue-Fort Wayne
Omaha
NDSU
ND
Oral Roberts
SDSU
SD
Western Illinois

Missouri Valley Basketball
Bradley
Drake
Evansville
Illinois State
Missouri State
Northern Iowa
Southern Illinois
Valparaiso

Horizon
Cleveland
Detroit
Indiana Purdue-Indianapolis
Wisconsin-Milwaukee
Northern Kentucky
Chicago
Wright State
Youngstown

As you can see the MVFC is spread over three basketball conferences and common sense prevails in the midwest relative travel and basically taking care of the student-athletes. Just as the two Montana schools are joined at the hip and will forever and always be in the same league and competitive level, the two Idaho flagship universities are going to be placed on the same level again and whether Idaho's venture with Division I taught them anything, it ought to have provided them a lesson as to what ultimately happened to both athletic programs in Idaho when they lost their regional rivalry. They both crashed.

Politics in both Montana and Idaho will not allow these four schools to look toward the midwest as there are too many people in these two states now who feel their own athletic affiliations belong on the west coast. We'll never be able to share a conference affiliation out here with nonfootball playing private schools as the midwest is capable of doing. It is just a mindset that the folks have here. Look at all the nonrevenue sports the nonfootball private schools offer student-athletes and the midwest basketball conferences also.

 

[grizzpaw]

the USF "dons" played at the NAIA level back in the 80s

 

[BadlandsGrizFan]

Its not great for us....

1. Just one more freaking school for this massive conference.
2. New school to compete with right in the heart of our recruiting territory.

 

[IdaGriz01]

the USF "dons" played at the NAIA level back in the 80s

Actually, Division II Independent, if Wikipedia is accurate. After you mentioned it, I looked them up. A famous football alum was Gino Marchetti, who played mostly for the Baltimore Colts as a pro ... and is in the Pro Football Hall of Fame. (And we go back far enough to have seen him play .)

 

[IdaGriz01]

Its not great for us....

1. Just one more freaking school for this massive conference.
2. New school to compete with right in the heart of our recruiting territory.

Bad news if the Big Sky actually does add them. Good news if they end up somewhere else, since they'd then be a D-I OOC opponent.

 

[kemajic]

Its not great for us....

1. Just one more freaking school for this massive conference.
2. New school to compete with right in the heart of our recruiting territory.

Bad news if the Big Sky actually does add them. Good news if they end up somewhere else, since they'd then be a D-I OOC opponent.

There is no somewhere else.

 

[kemajic]

Any team moving to FCS in the west just means that much greater chance of the BSC shrinking and not being such a cluster for football. We need 18 teams to split and CWU makes 14.

would love to see a school like CSU-Pueblo move up as well...USD offering athletic schollies...that would only leave a couple more slots and then we could get back to sanity in the conference(s).

The road back to sanity for the BSC is a very long one. Rough, too....

 

[AZGrizFan]

Stated this before, but the Griz cant read.

New Summit FBS League

UND - NDSu
USD- SDSU
Omaha Denver both non fb
Weber St -Mont St
Montana - Idaho

New WAC -FBS
UC Davis - Sac St
Cal Poly - Cal BBaptist
GCU - NMSU
Sam Houston St - Lamar
UTRGV -SF Austin

New Big Sky - FCS
Seattle non fb - PSU
EWU -CWU
Idaho St - UVU no fb
SUU -Dixie st
NAU - Azusa Pacific

It's not that we can't read...it's that these proposals are off-the-charts ridiculous.

 

[AZGrizFan]

Any team moving to FCS in the west just means that much greater chance of the BSC shrinking and not being such a cluster for football. We need 18 teams to split and CWU makes 14.

would love to see a school like CSU-Pueblo move up as well...USD offering athletic schollies...that would only leave a couple more slots and then we could get back to sanity in the conference(s).

The road back to sanity for the BSC is a very long one. Rough, too....

Sadly, that is correct. :| :|

 

[IdaGriz01]

Its not great for us....

1. Just one more freaking school for this massive conference.
2. New school to compete with right in the heart of our recruiting territory.

Bad news if the Big Sky actually does add them. Good news if they end up somewhere else, since they'd then be a D-I OOC opponent.

There is no somewhere else.

And that's the rub!

So many things would have to change, there really is no "light at the end of the tunnel" for an improved Big Sky.

What changes? Random thoughts: Central Washington up (successfully). San Diego goes to athletic scholarships. One or more West Coast Conference schools resume football. One or more weak western FBS schools follow Idaho in dropping down to FCS. Let's see, what else? Doesn't matter ... most of the changes one might think of are so unlikely that it's pretty hard to find any combination that would allow creation of another FCS conference in the mountain west.

 

[zootownrox]

I think it's a good thing if they pull it off, Ellensburg is a nice town. It could also allow some conference realignment.

For Football you could have two 7 team conferences each with an auto bid. We essentially have three regions of schools-

Montana
Mt State
Idaho
Idaho State
EWU
CWU

Northern Colorado
Southern Utah
Weber State
Northern Arizona

Sac State
Cal Poly
UC Davis
Portland State

Toss Northern Colorado (ugh) or one of the others (NAU preferrably) in with the MT-ID-WA schools for one football conference, and add the others in with the California schools for the second conference, and viola - a 6 game conference schedule with lots of western FCS OOC opportunities.

For basketball and Olympic sports it would be similar to what it is right now with ND leaving and CWU coming in. It's not ideal for basketball since not all teams play each other twice, but would be no worse than the existing schedule, but with shorter travel.

 

[NavyBlue]

This is going to be interesting to watch. The midwest has the Horizon, Missouri Valley, Summit and to a certain extent the American Athletic Conference. It appears to me that the West Coast Conference is forcing regional mid major football programs to make a decision, any decision lieutenant...the proverbial shit or get off the pot moment is going to arrive for all these schools who are geographical misfits in their mission, scope and vision as far as academic and athletic aspirations as institutions. The Big Sky just lost a superior academic institution and more will follow.

So far as I recall, out of the WCC schools, only BYU and San Diego have football as well as basketball. And BYU competes at the FBS level in football, while San Diego is non-scholarship for the sport. Gonzaga dropped FB a half-century ago. I think UOP (Pacific, in Stockton, CA) once had football but they don't now. Did schools like Pepperdine, USF, Loyola-Marymount, etc. ever have football? Point is, we need four more FCS football schools out here so there could be two separate conferences. I don't see any way that happens.

Look at the conference members, both football and basketball, of those four midwest conferences. Then look at the flagship institutions in the Big Sky, the independents in the west and ask yourself if this could be a viable mid major football and basketball conference with all the other nonrevenue sports the kids could and should be afforded the oplortunity to participate in. Think about this years Griz basketball team in isolation. They are in all probability going to run away with the Big Sky regular season championship. If they lose in the farce of a tournament we have, do they get an at large bid? Hell no! In the WCC, they get a 12 or 13 at large bid. Period. End of discussion. Align them where they have a reasonable chance to succeed and it's not in this conference. Instead of a Group of 5, it could and should be a Group of 6. The directional schools, the commuter schools of the conference can play FCS. You know the ones that get 600 too 800 people in the stands for a basketball game and most of them are Montana graduates. The LDS Church would help Weber with the move up. Anyway...Central Washington is movin on up...

What makes you think that? Weber State is a "state" school not a LDS school. The school the LDS Church only cares about BYU-Provo, (maybe a little bit about the University of Utah because of politics and because so many of the Mormon grand pubahs are alums). The LDS Church cares NOTHING about athletics at Utah State, Weber State, or Southern Utah. They look out for BYU. That is why Ricks College became 4 year BYU-Idaho the LDS Church made them drop athletics all together. BYU didn't want to have to compete with another Mormon university for recruits, donations, and fan support.

I have it on pretty good authority, (a friend's father-in-law that worked in the BYU athletic department) that when Ricks College became a 4 year school they originally said they wanted to join the Big Sky and be I-AA in football. The folks in Provo were having none of that, and their athletics were shut down. And then BYU-Hawaii had to drop their sports too.

 

[kemajic]

I think it's a good thing if they pull it off, Ellensburg is a nice town. It could also allow some conference realignment.

For Football you could have two 7 team conferences each with an auto bid. We essentially have three regions of schools-

Montana
Mt State
Idaho
Idaho State
EWU
CWU

Northern Colorado
Southern Utah
Weber State
Northern Arizona

Sac State
Cal Poly
UC Davis
Portland State

Toss Northern Colorado (ugh) or one of the others (NAU preferrably) in with the MT-ID-WA schools for one football conference, and add the others in with the California schools for the second conference, and viola - a 6 game conference schedule with lots of western FCS OOC opportunities.

For basketball and Olympic sports it would be similar to what it is right now with ND leaving and CWU coming in. It's not ideal for basketball since not all teams play each other twice, but would be no worse than the existing schedule, but with shorter travel.

A 14 team conference would be much simpler than that:
North
UM, MSU, EWU, CWU, UI, PSU, ISU
South
WSU, UNC, SacSt, UCD, CPSLO, USU, NAU

Play in section opponents every year in football (6) and the other conf. games (2 or 3) rotating from the other section. Play in section opponents twice every year in BBall (12) and the other section opponents once (7) for a 19 game schedule.

But they're not going to hand the conf. another autobid just because they separated into two sections. Since there's no way to have a conf. championship game, it would still be a mess to determine the autobid.

 

[IdaGriz01]

... The school the LDS Church only cares about BYU-Provo, (maybe a little bit about the University of Utah because of politics and because so many of the Mormon grand pubahs are alums). The LDS Church cares NOTHING about athletics at Utah State, Weber State, or Southern Utah. They look out for BYU. That is why Ricks College became 4 year BYU-Idaho the LDS Church made them drop athletics all together. BYU didn't want to have to compete with another Mormon university for recruits, donations, and fan support.

I have it on pretty good authority, (a friend's father-in-law that worked in the BYU athletic department) that when Ricks College became a 4 year school they originally said they wanted to join the Big Sky and be I-AA in football. The folks in Provo were having none of that, and their athletics were shut down. And then BYU-Hawaii had to drop their sports too.

As a two-year school, Ricks was a major power (most years) in the juco football ranks. Don't recall if they won a national juco title, but I know they won a bunch of conference championships and were highly rank almost every year. We knew a lot of alums who were very, very upset when the powers-that-be pulled the plug ... but Provo calls the tune and everyone else has to dance along.

 

[SeattleBobcat]

This is going to be interesting to watch. The midwest has the Horizon, Missouri Valley, Summit and to a certain extent the American Athletic Conference. It appears to me that the West Coast Conference is forcing regional mid major football programs to make a decision, any decision lieutenant...the proverbial shit or get off the pot moment is going to arrive for all these schools who are geographical misfits in their mission, scope and vision as far as academic and athletic aspirations as institutions. The Big Sky just lost a superior academic institution and more will follow.

So far as I recall, out of the WCC schools, only BYU and San Diego have football as well as basketball. And BYU competes at the FBS level in football, while San Diego is non-scholarship for the sport. Gonzaga dropped FB a half-century ago. I think UOP (Pacific, in Stockton, CA) once had football but they don't now. Did schools like Pepperdine, USF, Loyola-Marymount, etc. ever have football? Point is, we need four more FCS football schools out here so there could be two separate conferences. I don't see any way that happens.

Look at the conference members, both football and basketball, of those four midwest conferences. Then look at the flagship institutions in the Big Sky, the independents in the west and ask yourself if this could be a viable mid major football and basketball conference with all the other nonrevenue sports the kids could and should be afforded the oplortunity to participate in. Think about this years Griz basketball team in isolation. They are in all probability going to run away with the Big Sky regular season championship. If they lose in the farce of a tournament we have, do they get an at large bid? Hell no! In the WCC, they get a 12 or 13 at large bid. Period. End of discussion. Align them where they have a reasonable chance to succeed and it's not in this conference. Instead of a Group of 5, it could and should be a Group of 6. The directional schools, the commuter schools of the conference can play FCS. You know the ones that get 600 too 800 people in the stands for a basketball game and most of them are Montana graduates. The LDS Church would help Weber with the move up. Anyway...Central Washington is movin on up...

What makes you think that? Weber State is a "state" school not a LDS school. The school the LDS Church only cares about BYU-Provo, (maybe a little bit about the University of Utah because of politics and because so many of the Mormon grand pubahs are alums). The LDS Church cares NOTHING about athletics at Utah State, Weber State, or Southern Utah. They look out for BYU. That is why Ricks College became 4 year BYU-Idaho the LDS Church made them drop athletics all together. BYU didn't want to have to compete with another Mormon university for recruits, donations, and fan support.

I have it on pretty good authority, (a friend's father-in-law that worked in the BYU athletic department) that when Ricks College became a 4 year school they originally said they wanted to join the Big Sky and be I-AA in football. The folks in Provo were having none of that, and their athletics were shut down. And then BYU-Hawaii had to drop their sports too.

Hasa Diga Eebowai!

 

[CatGrad-UMGradStu]

... The school the LDS Church only cares about BYU-Provo, (maybe a little bit about the University of Utah because of politics and because so many of the Mormon grand pubahs are alums). The LDS Church cares NOTHING about athletics at Utah State, Weber State, or Southern Utah. They look out for BYU. That is why Ricks College became 4 year BYU-Idaho the LDS Church made them drop athletics all together. BYU didn't want to have to compete with another Mormon university for recruits, donations, and fan support.

I have it on pretty good authority, (a friend's father-in-law that worked in the BYU athletic department) that when Ricks College became a 4 year school they originally said they wanted to join the Big Sky and be I-AA in football. The folks in Provo were having none of that, and their athletics were shut down. And then BYU-Hawaii had to drop their sports too.

As a two-year school, Ricks was a major power (most years) in the juco football ranks. Don't recall if they won a national juco title, but I know they won a bunch of conference championships and were highly rank almost every year. We knew a lot of alums who were very, very upset when the powers-that-be pulled the plug ... but Provo calls the tune and everyone else has to dance along.

Poor choice of words on my part. Kind of like being able to drink caffeinated soft drinks now but hot coffee or tea still frowned upon. Ought to have used better words as you two also have many relatives and friends it appears with insight beyond my LDS relatives. Too much fighting within Montana, Idaho and obviously Utah also.

 

[zootownrox]

A 14 team conference would be much simpler than that:
North
UM, MSU, EWU, CWU, UI, PSU, ISU
South
WSU, UNC, SacSt, UCD, CPSLO, USU, NAU

Play in section opponents every year in football (6) and the other conf. games (2 or 3) rotating from the other section. Play in section opponents twice every year in BBall (12) and the other section opponents once (7) for a 19 game schedule.

But they're not going to hand the conf. another autobid just because they separated into two sections. Since there's no way to have a conf. championship game, it would still be a mess to determine the autobid.

Making the autobid straight forward was why I said 2 conferences, but yes it would be just like a 14 team conference. I don't know the politics behind splitting the football conference and getting an autobid but since they are handing out at large bids to the second teams in leagues that didn't even have one autobid a few years ago, it is ridiculous that 13-14 team Big Sky is barely getting 3 teams in each season, so another autobid for the current members seems like a worthwhile pursuit.