As a Cats fan watching the last couple games I will say that Kanangota is a beast and the Cats better be ready for him...And while you have some studs at running back, I'm glad Dan Moore isn't playing this year. The big difference I see between the Cats and Griz are the style of play. The Griz are more of a punch you in the mouth kind of team while the Cats aren't. This game will come down to how the Cats like being punched in the mouth. If they fight back we will have a game...if they don't, and just try to make it out alive...the Griz will blow them out. I hope there is still some fight left in the team.
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What's your realistic expectations Saturday?
- Thread starter BigSexyGriz
- Start date
AZGrizFan said:In what few positions do you see the Griz having the edge?Big G said:
If I were to look at this objectively (just my opinion here):
QB: slight advantage Griz, I think a healthy-ish JJ is better than the current banged up McGhee. If McGhee were at or near full health I'd give him the slight advantage.
RB: slight advantage Griz IF Van is back. Both teams are banged up at running back, Kirk and Johnson did not look healthy against SUU, meanwhile Canada had a nice rebound but we've not seen Van in 3 weeks now. If all were healthy I'd say it's maybe a wash Canada/Van vs Kirk/Johnson... tough call there, but for now a Canada/Van mix vs a dinged up Kirk/Johnson is slight strength.
WR: Toss up. Hear me out on this. Henderson is the best WR on the field, IMO, but I think the group of Bleskin/Floetkotter/Ellis are a more diverse and consistent group than Henderson/Jones/Warren. While the Griz WRs have the most talent in a single player I believe MSU holds the better mix of "top 3" WRs.
TE: Tough to say. UM's TEs are used in the offense as pass-catchers where MSU's are largely for blocking.
OL: Not sure. On paper the Griz have the better O-line but we've seen such inconsistency here I'm just not sure who holds the advantage.
DL: Either a toss up or slight Griz advantage. Just like the WRs discussion, I think the Griz have the better unit across the board but the Cats clearly have the best single player (Daly).
LBs: Griz. That ones fairly easy, however the current Cat LBs have done a pretty good job overall.
Secondary: Griz, slightly. Mostly due to the Cats secondary being so banged up.
Kicker: Uh... none of the above? Ha, probably even here
Punter: I think Griz, don't have the stats in front of me but I think Shaw has a better average than MSU's punter
KR/PR: Again overall health has me leaning to saying the Griz have an advantage, Ellis Henderson should be full speed and ready to go, Shawn Johnson... just not sure. If both were fully healthy I'd say it's a toss-up.
Coaching: This one is a tough call. Ash is under fire of course for continually struggling in big games, however his staff carries much more experience and familiarity with this big of a game. His got some new coordinators that aren't being held in the best regards. On the other side the Griz have coaches that for the most part are very new to their jobs. Additionally under Mick Delaney the Griz have not beat a team with winning record when they faced off. Based on just experience and stability I'd give a slight edge to MSU.
Intangibles: Slight edge to MSU again. Home game, backs against the wall, senior day. Lots to play for. Griz are presumably in the playoffs although I doubt anyone is over-looking the Cats because there's a lot riding on a Griz win as well. Griz on the road have had more defensive struggles as well.
BWahlberg said:AZGrizFan said:In what few positions do you see the Griz having the edge?Big G said:
If I were to look at this objectively (just my opinion here):
QB: slight advantage Griz, I think a healthy-ish JJ is better than the current banged up McGhee. If McGhee were at or near full health I'd give him the slight advantage.
RB: slight advantage Griz IF Van is back. Both teams are banged up at running back, Kirk and Johnson did not look healthy against SUU, meanwhile Canada had a nice rebound but we've not seen Van in 3 weeks now. If all were healthy I'd say it's maybe a wash Canada/Van vs Kirk/Johnson... tough call there, but for now a Canada/Van mix vs a dinged up Kirk/Johnson is slight strength.
WR: Toss up. Hear me out on this. Henderson is the best WR on the field, IMO, but I think the group of Bleskin/Floetkotter/Ellis are a more diverse and consistent group than Henderson/Jones/Warren. While the Griz WRs have the most talent in a single player I believe MSU holds the better mix of "top 3" WRs.
TE: Tough to say. UM's TEs are used in the offense as pass-catchers where MSU's are largely for blocking.
OL: Not sure. On paper the Griz have the better O-line but we've seen such inconsistency here I'm just not sure who holds the advantage.
DL: Either a toss up or slight Griz advantage. Just like the WRs discussion, I think the Griz have the better unit across the board but the Cats clearly have the best single player (Daly).
LBs: Griz. That ones fairly easy, however the current Cat LBs have done a pretty good job overall.
Secondary: Griz, slightly. Mostly due to the Cats secondary being so banged up.
Kicker: Uh... none of the above? Ha, probably even here
Punter: I think Griz, don't have the stats in front of me but I think Shaw has a better average than MSU's punter
KR/PR: Again overall health has me leaning to saying the Griz have an advantage, Ellis Henderson should be full speed and ready to go, Shawn Johnson... just not sure. If both were fully healthy I'd say it's a toss-up.
Coaching: This one is a tough call. Ash is under fire of course for continually struggling in big games, however his staff carries much more experience and familiarity with this big of a game. His got some new coordinators that aren't being held in the best regards. On the other side the Griz have coaches that for the most part are very new to their jobs. Additionally under Mick Delaney the Griz have not beat a team with winning record when they faced off. Based on just experience and stability I'd give a slight edge to MSU.
Intangibles: Slight edge to MSU again. Home game, backs against the wall, senior day. Lots to play for. Griz are presumably in the playoffs although I doubt anyone is over-looking the Cats because there's a lot riding on a Griz win as well. Griz on the road have had more defensive struggles as well.
I agree here with brint. Only thing is you could break up the secondary. Corners favoring griz and safeties favoring cats, even with the cats banged up. It's going to be a close one! My realistic expectation is that it will either be a close game coming down to the wire or a griz blowout due to all the injuries on the cats side.
Brint,
Aside from all that Denarius McGhee has accomplished and done for the MSU program, would you really take him over JJ, assuming he were healthy. Take all the emotion and fear of being called a "homer" out of it, can you really get there?
I cannot, and have been a bigger proponent of DM than most.
Aside from all that Denarius McGhee has accomplished and done for the MSU program, would you really take him over JJ, assuming he were healthy. Take all the emotion and fear of being called a "homer" out of it, can you really get there?
I cannot, and have been a bigger proponent of DM than most.
Raider said:
DMG has done a lot for the MSU program, and seems to be a standup person both on and off the field, but in the end, unless the Cats suddenly get white hot the next few weeks, he will leave MSU without anything more than a quarterfinal loss in the playoffs, and that has to be disappointing for those who knew they would have their best team in 20 years the last 4.
grizophile
Well-known member
BigPawzSharpClawz said:
I almost agree with your assessment but you need to replace Trayvon Van with John Ngyen.
Van a great back but high ankel sprains tend to linger.
Raider said:
What has McGhee done more than jj? If I recall right jj has won the only head to head they faced, which was at msu, and jj has taken them farther in the playoffs. I'm not sure on this but I'd be willin to guess that jj also has a better winnin %. You can look at mcghees stats and that's great and all but what really has McGhee done?
Grizzlies1982
Well-known member
PlayerRep said:
I'd prefer to have both.
Eriul said:
Absolutely valid points
All I am saying is that there is a sentimental effect when talking about McGhee. He is often credited with “resurrecting” the Bobcat program, and is undoubtedly one of the two best MSU quarterbacks in the last three decades. He’s a four-year starter who has re-written some of their record books. For that reason, he is put on a pedestal, fairly or unfairly. Whatever your opinion, he has been a great player for the cats.
That is why I said “taking the emotion out of it” in my question to Walberg. If you just took it at face value, right now, I cannot see taking DM over JJ, healthy or not.
The defensive fronts will determine which quarterback is most effective. I like our chances.
I expect a Griz win in a close, hard-fought game.
I also have a realistic expectation that I'll drink too much.
arty:
I also have a realistic expectation that I'll drink too much.
arty:I expect the Cats to get beaten and beaten badly. DM has been the best QB in number of years (if not ever) they have had. But the fact is, he has played for lucky team, not a great team. Their luck has run out. Not only do they loose Sat, They won't see the playoffs for a long time except on TV. Ash retires.
George Ferguson
Well-known member
Bottom Line" BOTH TEAMS ARE LOADED WITH GREAT TALENT. For all the football experts on this board, and the bashing against people who don't claim to be, the maroon colored glasses sure come on a lot when talking about individual MSU players. For instance, ANYONE who doesn't think Brad Daly is the single best defensive player in the Big Sky Conference is way too involved in their own Cat hatred. Is Brock Coyle a close second? Hell Yes. Should Brock be a finalist for the Buck award? Hell yes. But Daly has had an unforgettable season and has played like the best player in the league on every snap of the season, and honestly, what is even more amazing, and what a lot of people don't know, is that Daly has essentially played hurt for the last two seasons. As someone mentioned above, I would love to see Daly and Wags on the same team. Sorry Tyrone Holmes.
Another instance: Yes, the Griz linebacker trio is star studded. Yes, we all love Tripp, and if it were not for Daly's monster season, Brock would win Big Sky POY hands down. However, Alex Singleton, will be a first-team all-conference linebacker and he's quickly become one of the best in the country. He has 100 tackles, including 65 solo, and a remarkable 16.5 TFL's from his backer position. He's a MONSTER TALENT. Griz fans who choose to knock that are out of their minds.
I disagree with Brint in a few other areas. I think MSU's corners are actually better than Montana's when healthy, but I wouldn't trade Hermy and Tully for MSU's safeties, including Bethley. I also wouldn't include Jon Ellis in a list of quality receivers. If you had to put together a quality trio from both teams it would be 1. Ellis Henderson, 2. Tanner Bleskin, 3. Jamaal Jones. I will take the Griz' receiving corps over MSU's at this point simply because while fast, Ellis makes a ton of mistakes and drops balls and hates to be hit, and TRod has never been able to get going this season. However, I am amazed at the career Tanner Bleskin has had. He is a remarkable player and one of the most dependable possession receivers MSU has ever had. For the last three years, the guy seems to ALWAYS runt he perfect route, ALWAYS get open, ALWAYS catch the ball, and IS Never afraid to take the big hit.
I agree with the most on the QB comparison. I'm probably the single biggest DeNarius McGhee Griz fan there is, but he seems to have a confidence problem right now, which shocks me. So I too give a very SLIGHT edge to JJ. I think with all of the health issues, RB is a wash. I have a healthy respect for Cody Kirk, but even when he's 100 percent, he never seems to play well against the Griz, while Montana clearly has its own injury issues to deal with at RB. Joey Counts WILL NOT play Saturday. I have no idea on Travon. But, when looking at overall talent when healthy, I think it's hard to compare UM and MSU's RB's simply because the style of all of them is so different. Canada, Van and Nyguen are in the mold of the spread-option scat back, and what's ironic is, Kirk is built perfectly for the offense the Griz now run. In the end, when healthy, they're all good.
Oh yeah, and back to the OP of this thread, my expectation is this game will finish me off. I've been close to having a heart attack from Griz' games all season long, and I fully expect this game to give me the big one.
Another instance: Yes, the Griz linebacker trio is star studded. Yes, we all love Tripp, and if it were not for Daly's monster season, Brock would win Big Sky POY hands down. However, Alex Singleton, will be a first-team all-conference linebacker and he's quickly become one of the best in the country. He has 100 tackles, including 65 solo, and a remarkable 16.5 TFL's from his backer position. He's a MONSTER TALENT. Griz fans who choose to knock that are out of their minds.
I disagree with Brint in a few other areas. I think MSU's corners are actually better than Montana's when healthy, but I wouldn't trade Hermy and Tully for MSU's safeties, including Bethley. I also wouldn't include Jon Ellis in a list of quality receivers. If you had to put together a quality trio from both teams it would be 1. Ellis Henderson, 2. Tanner Bleskin, 3. Jamaal Jones. I will take the Griz' receiving corps over MSU's at this point simply because while fast, Ellis makes a ton of mistakes and drops balls and hates to be hit, and TRod has never been able to get going this season. However, I am amazed at the career Tanner Bleskin has had. He is a remarkable player and one of the most dependable possession receivers MSU has ever had. For the last three years, the guy seems to ALWAYS runt he perfect route, ALWAYS get open, ALWAYS catch the ball, and IS Never afraid to take the big hit.
I agree with the most on the QB comparison. I'm probably the single biggest DeNarius McGhee Griz fan there is, but he seems to have a confidence problem right now, which shocks me. So I too give a very SLIGHT edge to JJ. I think with all of the health issues, RB is a wash. I have a healthy respect for Cody Kirk, but even when he's 100 percent, he never seems to play well against the Griz, while Montana clearly has its own injury issues to deal with at RB. Joey Counts WILL NOT play Saturday. I have no idea on Travon. But, when looking at overall talent when healthy, I think it's hard to compare UM and MSU's RB's simply because the style of all of them is so different. Canada, Van and Nyguen are in the mold of the spread-option scat back, and what's ironic is, Kirk is built perfectly for the offense the Griz now run. In the end, when healthy, they're all good.
Oh yeah, and back to the OP of this thread, my expectation is this game will finish me off. I've been close to having a heart attack from Griz' games all season long, and I fully expect this game to give me the big one.
George Ferguson
Well-known member
Luckily, I will be on the sidelines Saturday, so there will be lots of medical staff to assist me if I go down :thumb:
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