Weekly Position Discussion: Week 1, QBs

[wbtfg]

I'm really interested to see how Jordan Johnson looks this coming year. He's really only played one full season, and the first half of the season he looked pretty average, and the second half he looked like a superstar.

The two biggest things that stick out to me from Jordan's 2011 season is that he threw 6 picks in the first 5 games and 0 picks during the final 5 regular season games. The other thing that really stuck is that he was only sacked three times during the regular season. Much of that was due to his suburb scrambling ability, but he was also playing behind a pretty badass offensive line.

I assume he'll pick up where he left off, but with a totally new offensive system and new guys around him, it's difficult to say.

 

[BWahlberg]

I'm really interested to see how Jordan Johnson looks this coming year. He's really only played one full season, and the first half of the season he looked pretty average, and the second half he looked like a superstar.

The two biggest things that stick out to me from Jordan's 2011 season is that he threw 6 picks in the first 5 games and 0 picks during the final 5 regular season games. The other thing that really stuck is that he was only sacked three times during the regular season. Much of that was due to his suburb scrambling ability, but he was also playing behind a pretty badass offensive line.

I assume he'll pick up where he left off, but with a totally new offensive system and new guys around him, it's difficult to say.

Add in that I think 4 of those 6 interceptions he threw were in one game, the Sac St loss. The coaches thought they could air it out in that game and it backfired. Jordy had a quote a few weeks after that game which he learned from it (as did Pflu) about doing too much and playing within the gameplan, etc.

 

[getgrizzy]

Here is my two-cents worth of analysis on the QBs, for what its worth.

Johnson is a very special QB. People forget that he was really only a one-year starter with no real previous playing time the one year we enjoyed him. Was Dave Dickinson any better in his first season of starting? I do not think so. JJ has the talent to be the best QB in America by his senior year.

well, i'm not quite ready to start comparing j.j. to d.d. yet, but i'll listen to you make a case for that. first season-only. go ahead. d.d. threw for 3,640 yards and 32 tds his first year as a starter and hit on 67.2% of his passes. j.j. had 2,400/21/59.8.

 

[BWahlberg]

Here is my two-cents worth of analysis on the QBs, for what its worth.

Johnson is a very special QB. People forget that he was really only a one-year starter with no real previous playing time the one year we enjoyed him. Was Dave Dickinson any better in his first season of starting? I do not think so. JJ has the talent to be the best QB in America by his senior year.

well, i'm not quite ready to start comparing j.j. to d.d. yet, but i'll listen to you make a case for that. first season-only. go ahead. d.d. threw for 3,640 yards and 32 tds his first year as a starter and hit on 67.2% of his passes. j.j. had 2,400/21/59.8.

Add in that DD's 1st year stats in 1993 didn't include a shoot-out of a playoff game against Delaware and didn't he not play until the SDSU game which I think was the 2nd or 3rd game of the year?

On the other hand you've got JJ's rushing yards and rushing TDs to factor in as well. Dave wasn't a runner like Jordy was, especially after the ankle injury in 1994.

One thing I will say that I see a lot of similarity between Dave and Jordy is accuracy under pressure. With all due respect to the guys that started from 1996 to 2010 I think Dave and Jordy are the two most accurate QBs when under pressure. I recall Dave taking a lot of monster hits just as he was releasing the ball, he'd still be dead on. JJ is the same way. He took a ton of hits in 2011 but his passes were usually dialed in.

 

[NLGrizFan]

I'd like to see Jordy as starter and Gus right behind him. We've already seen what TM & SS-H can do. And hopefully we won't ever have to witness that again.

 

[PlayerRep]

Drew Miller was very accurate, including under pressure. He's the most accurate UM qb, at all distances, that I ever saw. And he was often under pressure, in part because he wasn't mobile and just had to stand in the pocket to release at the latest possible moment.

 

[brian s]

Here is my two-cents worth of analysis on the QBs, for what its worth.

Johnson is a very special QB. People forget that he was really only a one-year starter with no real previous playing time the one year we enjoyed him. Was Dave Dickinson any better in his first season of starting? I do not think so. JJ has the talent to be the best QB in America by his senior year.

well, i'm not quite ready to start comparing j.j. to d.d. yet, but i'll listen to you make a case for that. first season-only. go ahead. d.d. threw for 3,640 yards and 32 tds his first year as a starter and hit on 67.2% of his passes. j.j. had 2,400/21/59.8.

Totally invalid comparison. There is no way that you can compare the passing stats from the Don Read run-n-gun offense to the offense JJ played under his only year. Remember David Klingler, from the University of Houston? He threw for about six miles his senior season under the run-n-shoot offense, was a high first round draft pick, and was a total flop in the NFL. The run-n-shoot gives a jaded look at passing ability. DD obviously would have flourished in any offense, as he did in Canada. But would he have thrown for more yardage than JJ if he had played on the team JJ played on? We will never know.

 

[griz4life]

The words Don Read offense and Run don't belong in the same sentence.

 

[grizhunter]

I'd like to see Jordy as starter and Gus right behind him. We've already seen what TM & SS-H can do. And hopefully we won't ever have to witness that again.

TomCat88 on BN posted this and thought it was interesting:

The JJ factor is an interesting one to look at.

Do people think UM had better, the same, or worse talent around their QBs last year as it did in 2011?
Is JJ slightly or significantly better skills-wise or as a leader or both than last year's QBs?

I tend to think UM had less talent overall last year and that JJ was significantly better skills-wise. So it wasn't just JJ that made UM an 11-3 team in 2011. The only problem I have with my thinking on this is that the stats don't offer much support, because if JJ was on a better overall team and if he's a significantly better QB, then his stats should've been significantly better. I can't figure out why they weren't.

JJ had a QB rating of 133.5, while the UM QBs last year were at 130.9. JJ was 7.0 ypa and 59.8 completion pct., the 2011 QBs were 6.9 and 63.4. JJ ran for 506 on 89 carries (5.7 ypc) for 4 TDs in 13 games, while the QBs last year had 428 on 114 carries (3.9 ypc) for 7 TDs in 11 games. The only category he was significantly better statistically was ypc.

Could it be that JJ is similar to McKinney and Smithwick-Hann? If so, would that mean either his leadership skills carried the team or that it was a matter of UM having much more talent in 2011?

 

[kemajic]

I'd like to see Jordy as starter and Gus right behind him. We've already seen what TM & SS-H can do. And hopefully we won't ever have to witness that again.

TomCat88 on BN posted this and thought it was interesting:

The JJ factor is an interesting one to look at.

Do people think UM had better, the same, or worse talent around their QBs last year as it did in 2011?
Is JJ slightly or significantly better skills-wise or as a leader or both than last year's QBs?

I tend to think UM had less talent overall last year and that JJ was significantly better skills-wise. So it wasn't just JJ that made UM an 11-3 team in 2011. The only problem I have with my thinking on this is that the stats don't offer much support, because if JJ was on a better overall team and if he's a significantly better QB, then his stats should've been significantly better. I can't figure out why they weren't.

JJ had a QB rating of 133.5, while the UM QBs last year were at 130.9. JJ was 7.0 ypa and 59.8 completion pct., the 2011 QBs were 6.9 and 63.4. JJ ran for 506 on 89 carries (5.7 ypc) for 4 TDs in 13 games, while the QBs last year had 428 on 114 carries (3.9 ypc) for 7 TDs in 11 games. The only category he was significantly better statistically was ypc.

Could it be that JJ is similar to McKinney and Smithwick-Hann? If so, would that mean either his leadership skills carried the team or that it was a matter of UM having much more talent in 2011?

What your 2011 season stats don't show is that UM started poorly and improved throughout the year and was very good the last half - with outstanding QB play AND leadership from the young developing true soph, JJ. He is still developing and will be even better this year.

 

[go96griz]

I'd like to see Jordy as starter and Gus right behind him. We've already seen what TM & SS-H can do. And hopefully we won't ever have to witness that again.

TomCat88 on BN posted this and thought it was interesting:

The JJ factor is an interesting one to look at.

Do people think UM had better, the same, or worse talent around their QBs last year as it did in 2011?
Is JJ slightly or significantly better skills-wise or as a leader or both than last year's QBs?

I tend to think UM had less talent overall last year and that JJ was significantly better skills-wise. So it wasn't just JJ that made UM an 11-3 team in 2011. The only problem I have with my thinking on this is that the stats don't offer much support, because if JJ was on a better overall team and if he's a significantly better QB, then his stats should've been significantly better. I can't figure out why they weren't.

JJ had a QB rating of 133.5, while the UM QBs last year were at 130.9. JJ was 7.0 ypa and 59.8 completion pct., the 2011 QBs were 6.9 and 63.4. JJ ran for 506 on 89 carries (5.7 ypc) for 4 TDs in 13 games, while the QBs last year had 428 on 114 carries (3.9 ypc) for 7 TDs in 11 games. The only category he was significantly better statistically was ypc.

Could it be that JJ is similar to McKinney and Smithwick-Hann? If so, would that mean either his leadership skills carried the team or that it was a matter of UM having much more talent in 2011?

What your 2011 season stats don't show is that UM started poorly and improved throughout the year and was very good the last half - with outstanding QB play AND leadership from the young developing true soph, JJ. He is still developing and will be even better this year.

Great information. I would reiterate that Tom's analysis doesn't look at JJ's growth by the end of the season. Anybody that watched the 2012 GSA spring game in Missoula saw how far JJ has come. I believe he was 14 for 14 passing and made a ton of incredible plays. JJ may not have the best skills in any one area, but he ranks highly across the board. In many respects he reminds me of DD with his ability to just get it done. He is a great leader and he finds a way to win. The griz sorely missed him in 2012. The 2013 team will go along way with him at the helm. Anybody who thinks otherwise hasn't watched football to understand that some quarterbacks have the intangibles and some just don't.

 

[retiredfan]

JJ is going to be the starter no question. After last year I would think that Gus should be 2nd. SH is way to slow, no feet at all. Trent is by far the fastest but in my opinion, but his arm is questionable. I would think that the coaching staff could find a good use for his speed. He is a very good athlete and could help the team in more ways than one.

 

[bigkid]

JJ has the ability to make plays when their needed the most. He keeps momentum in our favor and extends drives. This improves our TOP, field position and finishes drives. JJ is a playmaker. :thumb:

 

[EverettGriz]

Could it be that JJ is similar to McKinney and Smithwick-Hann?

No.

 

[getgrizzy]

Here is my two-cents worth of analysis on the QBs, for what its worth.

Johnson is a very special QB. People forget that he was really only a one-year starter with no real previous playing time the one year we enjoyed him. Was Dave Dickinson any better in his first season of starting? I do not think so. JJ has the talent to be the best QB in America by his senior year.

well, i'm not quite ready to start comparing j.j. to d.d. yet, but i'll listen to you make a case for that. first season-only. go ahead. d.d. threw for 3,640 yards and 32 tds his first year as a starter and hit on 67.2% of his passes. j.j. had 2,400/21/59.8.

Totally invalid comparison. There is no way that you can compare the passing stats from the Don Read run-n-gun offense to the offense JJ played under his only year. Remember David Klingler, from the University of Houston? He threw for about six miles his senior season under the run-n-shoot offense, was a high first round draft pick, and was a total flop in the NFL. The run-n-shoot gives a jaded look at passing ability. DD obviously would have flourished in any offense, as he did in Canada. But would he have thrown for more yardage than JJ if he had played on the team JJ played on? We will never know.

if its a "totally" invalid comparison then why did you try to make the comparison? you made it, so lets hear your support for it. also d.d. ran for 21 tds in his career. j.j. has four so far. in games started by d.d. in his first season we were 9-1 and averaged 42 points per game. we were 10-3 in games j.j. started and scored 32 a game.

 

[AllWeatherFan]

I think McKinney will back up JJ and will be ready to step in if needed. New offensive coordinators will hopefully rectify last year's screw-ups. Gustafson may be in the mix also, but it's a little too early to tell.

Is Mayor McCheese is a redshirt senior this year? Does anybody know?

 

[Gaeilge1]

I agree with BW in terms of 1 & 2. The clear #1 is and should be JJ.

After watching Trent both last year and again this spring I think he has shown good improvement. He was in a very difficult position last year with all the uncertainty surrounding the team a month before the season started and I'm not sure he ever developed the confidence he needed throughout the year. From what I saw this spring his decision making is more precise and he is not throwing into coverage quite as much. His long ball accuracy certainly needs work and he certainly will never be the second coming of Jim Plunkett, but with everything else he does pretty well I think he should be the #2. Another aspect to consider is that the offense needs to play more ball control this year than it did last year. I think Trent would be better at that than anyone other than JJ.

I like what I have seen of Brady Gustafson but I still think he still needs more experience in actual game situations. Going into this year I would think he is a close #3.

SSH is not a good fit for this offensive system. He simply is not mobile enough and I don't think his mid range accuracy is as good as it could be. He was good last year on the 30+ routes, but he also had accuracy problems in the 15-30 yard range. If we have a number of games with SSH at QB we will be in trouble. However I think he could be utilized very effectively as a thrower not lined up as qb.

I haven't seen enough of Mr. Simis to realistically comment on strengths and weaknesses. From what I have observed I think he has a great upside. I do not see him figuring in to this season and agree that he should be redshirted.

 

[krammer]

I was only able to see the final scrimmage in the stadium. I do not mean to be cruel or single players out but I don't know any other way to say this, but it looked to me that the two QBs we had playing last year are not in the top two QBs we have available this season. I thought Brady looked to be the second best QB on the field on that particular night.

this is what I saw as well, I think this summary is right on the money,,,no disrespect to any kid who plays for the griz, but these two stand out imo above their peers...

 

[PlayerRep]

I was only able to see the final scrimmage in the stadium. I do not mean to be cruel or single players out but I don't know any other way to say this, but it looked to me that the two QBs we had playing last year are not in the top two QBs we have available this season. I thought Brady looked to be the second best QB on the field on that particular night.

this is what I saw as well, I think this summary is right on the money,,,no disrespect to any kid who plays for the griz, but these two stand out imo above their peers...

JJ looked very good in this last spring scrimmage and showed a stronger and more accurate arm than in the past. Guftason did look good. However, note that he was geneally playing against 3rd/4th teamers on defense, and the defense wasn't supposed to blitz against the lower offenses. Recall that most of us thought the Stanford transfer was going to be a player after his first scrimmage, when he looked good running and throwing, but that didn't turn out. Judgments like this really can't be made after watching one scrimmage.

 

[grizfan47]

Good point PR. It was hard to keep up with who was on the field at all times. I did like the way BG looked and I still think he will be #2 or #3. I did point out that I was basing that assessment on that nights performance only. It will be fun to see how they all develop in the fall.