UM has top players transferring in, Cats have top players transferring out

[mthoopsfan]

Of course, there are some exceptions at both schools, but the title of the thread tells me that the UM program is stronger and better now, than the Cats' program. I assume the "program" is the program overall, but also the players, the coaches, the recruiting coaches and players are doing, and the loyalty of the players, or most players. Perhaps the window of observation is not long enough (I'm using the past 2 years or so, and especially this last year and now).

I find it interesting that 3 top lineman for the Cats, didn't want to stay to play with their team and friends and try to get back to Frisco, compared to wanting to do something that would benefit them (but not the Cat team). Some level of individual over team, and a high level of selfishness. To each his own, but give me a Bergen, a Grossman, and various other very good Griz players. Generally speaking, I believe they will go further in life.

 

[argh!]

i think you are making a lot of assumptions in your statement. as for long-term future success for those who stay compared to those who go, there are too many independent variables for each player to generalize. c'mon greenie, make the green proud, and write something that makes sense.

 

[mthoopsfan]

i think you are making a lot of assumptions in your statement. as for long-term future success for those who stay compared to those who go, there are too many independent variables for each player to generalize. c'mon greenie, make the green proud, and write something that makes sense.

What I wrote makes sense. Happy to debate any of it with you.

 

[UncleRico]

Of course, there are some exceptions at both schools, but the title of the thread tells me that the UM program is stronger and better now, than the Cats' program. I assume the "program" is the program overall, but also the players, the coaches, the recruiting coaches and players are doing, and the loyalty of the players, or most players. Perhaps the window of observation is not long enough (I'm using the past 2 years or so, and especially this last year and now).

I find it interesting that 3 top lineman for the Cats, didn't want to stay to play with their team and friends and try to get back to Frisco, compared to wanting to do something that would benefit them (but not the Cat team). Some level of individual over team, and a high level of selfishness. To each his own, but give me a Bergen, a Grossman, and various other very good Griz players. Generally speaking, I believe they will go further in life.

I think the Griz added some great players in the portal and overall got better with it. Edwards was a tough loss. I’m most disappointed losing Genatone. I think potentially he would have been a great one. Cats lost some good O Lineman but I think they have done a good job developing depth there. Watch Burke Mastel for them this year. Very talented. I still think Vigen is a good coach and they will be top FCS team most years if he stays. With that being said the Griz I think do appear to have the upper hand between the two schools in the portal this year.

 

[alabamagrizzly]

A lot more info is needed to make this argument. We need a complete list of who’s in/out for both teams the last 2 years, and honestly, we need the results of their seasons. Truthfully this argument can’t be made for a year or two except for pure speculation. But now if we’re posting this just to rial the feathers of the scat trolls then yes, the Griz are kicking the scats a** in the portal.

 

[mthoopsfan]

A lot more info is needed to make this argument. We need a complete list of who’s in/out for both teams the last 2 years, and honestly, we need the results of their seasons. Truthfully this argument can’t be made for a year or two except for pure speculation. But now if we’re posting this just to rial the feathers of the scat trolls then yes, the Griz are kicking the scats a** in the portal.

The argument can be made and has been made. I have the general info on players, in and out, in my head. I follow things like this, and remember it generally.

UM lost one current starter in the period to the portal, plus McDowel (I wished he'd stayed, but I think we're now better at qb without him). The Cats have lost at least 4 starters, all more important than UM's starter, in the past 2 years. They were all-conference players; ours were not.

"MSU has lost 10 starters/significant backups to the portal since 2021: Aigbedion, Ifanse, Glessner, Kettels, Reimer, Session, Smith, Valdez, Wood and fullback/running back Jaharie Martin. None are from Montana."

I was ahead of most of egriz on the Griz last year and appear to be ahead again now. Feel free to do your own lists and try to catch up. Ha.

If you want to follow argh on this subject, go for it. Ha, again.

 

[mthoopsfan]

For Bama, to help him catch up. https://406mtsports.com/college/big...cle_9df28e8a-f68d-11ee-8902-ab97c7fab6e0.html

 

[ElrodGrizzly]

I know there are lists of who we brought in else where. They lost some studs lately.

-----------------------------
Omar Aigbedion and Rush Reimer announced their entrances into the transfer portal. Two days after that, All-Big Sky Conference defensive tackle Sebastian Valdez entered the portal. Backups Kendric Bailey, Jace Fitzgerald and Jacob Kettels made the same decisions that week as well.....

“If these guys are truly getting six-figure opportunities, that's not something we're going to be about,” Vancleeve said.

He also preached patience. Losing three key players didn’t mean other starters would leave. Five months later, the number of Bobcats who’ve entered the portal since the end of last season is eight: the six who left during the week of Dec. 4 plus reserves Garrett Coon and Kade Cutler.

“You can't be blind to the fact that when your season ends, you might lose some guys,” Vigen said. “So you're trying to work ahead, you're trying to retain those guys and do everything you can to make our experience impactful, that it's not one that guys are willing to leave."
___________________________________________________________

I really enjoyed the tone in that article of "we are losing such great guys, and we have no idea what we are supposed to do."

Also not mentioned, you lost one promising young Safety to the Griz across the hill..... perhaps don't blame "we can't pay six figures" as the only reason kids are leaving. We didn't offer Cutler a penny in guaranteed NIL.

I know I have said it before, but I cannot freaking believe that Hauck and co. are some of the best early adapters of the portal. It was not my expectation, but I am so thankful for it.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

The argument can be made and has been made. I have the general info on players, in and out, in my head. I follow things like this, and remember it generally.

UM lost one current starter in the period to the portal, plus McDowel (I wished he'd stayed, but I think we're now better at qb without him). The Cats have lost at least 4 starters, all more important than UM's starter, in the past 2 years. They were all-conference players; ours were not.

"MSU has lost 10 starters/significant backups to the portal since 2021: Aigbedion, Ifanse, Glessner, Kettels, Reimer, Session, Smith, Valdez, Wood and fullback/running back Jaharie Martin. None are from Montana."

I was ahead of most of egriz on the Griz last year and appear to be ahead again now. Feel free to do your own lists and try to catch up. Ha.

If you want to follow argh on this subject, go for it. Ha, again.

Well, if they aren’t from Montana, they are all selfish quitters. If they were from Montana, I’d understand if they wanted to pursue other beneficial opportunities.

 

[3-7-77]

Says the guy from North Idaho, now living in the San Diego metroplex. Give the Montana angle a rest.
Here's an all encompassing theory with the same amount of facts to back it up: Scat transfers just wanted to get the hell out of Bozo.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

Says the guy from North Idaho, now living in the San Diego metroplex. Give the Montana angle a rest.
Here's an all encompassing theory with the same amount of facts to back it up: Scat transfers just wanted to get the hell out of Bozo.

I think most know it’s true if they’re honest with themselves. You have no facts to back up your theory. I have many posts from others on this very board during this calendar year to back up mine, so…

A good question could be: Why is it even mentioned in the article?

 

[3-7-77]

Well, I like my  THEORY better. I'll use the Mac Davis tune with slightly different lyrics: Happiness is Bozeman, Montana in your rear view mirror.

 

[alabamagrizzly]

For Bama, to help him catch up. https://406mtsports.com/college/big...cle_9df28e8a-f68d-11ee-8902-ab97c7fab6e0.html

Oh I agree with you and I’m definitely familiar with who’s in and out but that doesn’t change the fact that this is an opinionated argument. W/out results from the season, you can’t factually say who’s winning/losing in the portal. It’s possible(not likely) that none of our transfers will make an impact. It’s possible that the scat out transfers could have awful seasons for their new teams and the replacements could be better(ask any scat fan and they’ll tell ya about their backups). It would be fun to track this info though. I wish I could get complete lists for the last 3 years of both schools transfer movements and come up with a formula to measure portal success. I think that would be a fun project.

 

[ElrodGrizzly]

Oh I agree with you and I’m definitely familiar with who’s in and out but that doesn’t change the fact that this is an opinionated argument. W/out results from the season, you can’t factually say who’s winning/losing in the portal. It’s possible(not likely) that none of our transfers will make an impact. It’s possible that the scat out transfers could have awful seasons for their new teams and the replacements could be better(ask any scat fan and they’ll tell ya about their backups). It would be fun to track this info though. I wish I could get complete lists for the last 3 years of both schools transfer movements and come up with a formula to measure portal success. I think that would be a fun project.

....I'd be down for that project with you...

I'm sure we could dig deep enough on the boards to compile a list.

After that, it is just coming up with success metrics. Maybe x amount of play time gets a point, x amount of starts, and find a way to weight statistics. Might be fun to talk about.

 

[alabamagrizzly]

....I'd be down for that project with you...

I'm sure we could dig deep enough on the boards to compile a list.

After that, it is just coming up with success metrics. Maybe x amount of play time gets a point, x amount of starts, and find a way to weight statistics. Might be fun to talk about.

I’d be down. Playing time would be a hard stat to measure though since most statistics pages don’t give snaps played stats, only games played and started. Offensive lineman success would be the hardest to measure statistically cus most of their stats like sacks allowed and pancakes are only kept internally. That would make the comparison even more difficult since the scat O lineman seem to be their biggest losses. We could definitely give it a go though. I’m gonna try to start compiling a list but I’m not the best internet sleuth. Are there websites that’s give complete lists of FCS teams?

 

[ElrodGrizzly]

I’d be down. Playing time would be a hard stat to measure though since most statistics pages don’t give snaps played stats, only games played and started. Offensive lineman success would be the hardest to measure statistically cus most of their stats like sacks allowed and pancakes are only kept internally. That would make the comparison even more difficult since the scat O lineman seem to be their biggest losses. We could definitely give it a go though. I’m gonna try to start compiling a list but I’m not the best internet sleuth. Are there websites that’s give complete lists of FCS teams?

Just the rosters, but both the griz and cats keep their rosters archived by year. We could split the teams and take some time to run through the last few years, searching by "montana grizzlies roster 2022" and then compiling who on their bios says they transferred in, checked against the archived threads on the two forums.

You're right, the playing time and stats might be a tough gauge. I hesitate to rely just on starts. Let's take the chat offline, I'm sure we don't need to monopolize this thread too much.

Maybe they need to make 3rd team in the conference to get a point in favor? Some combination of starts and all conference teams. Chambers would be a tough one to categorize, though, since obviously he was a successful transfer, but wouldn't show up strong in some ways on paper.

 

[garizzalies]

Guys, this has been proven by Mr hoops and the link. Plus, we all know it already because it’s obvious anyone would want out of bozo town. Don’t waste your time; and for heavens sake going thru the roster to build a weighted spreadsheet?
bubbies are hemorrhaging “top” players. The key word is “top”. Mr hoops used it twice in the thread title and even the bub beat writer wrote an article about it

 

[Monymony]

MSU TRANSFERS IN LAST 3 YEARS
Bolded players who were successful (in my eyes)
2023-4
In
Dylan Rollins (ol- BYU)
Alec Eckert (dt- Wash st)
Samora Ezekiel (ol- North Texas)
Rohan Jones (te- Maine)

Out
Christian Anaya (wr- Western Illinios)
Aiden Parks (safety- Mt Tech)
Garrett Coon (rb- SouthD)
Kade Cutler (db- Montana)
Sebastian Valdez (dt- Washington)
Kendric Bailey (safety-?)
Jace Fitzgerald (lb- Western)
Rush Reimer (ol- Cal)
Jacob Kettels (ol- Kennesaw St)
Omar Aigbedion (ol- Baylor)

2022-3
In
Ty McCullouch (wr- Colorado St)
Blake Stilllwell (db- Navarro Juco)
Garrett Walchli (wr- Utah St0
Cole Bullock (lb- Canyons Juco)
Lonyatta Alexander (wr- UW)
Jon Johnson (cb- El Camino Juco)
Brenden Hall (kicker/punter- SMU)
Julius Davis (rb- Wisconsin)

Out
Eric Zambrano (db- ?)
Aaron Gerle (dt- NAU)
Isaiah Ifanse (rb- Cal)
Trey Yates (dl- MT Tech)
Blake Glessner (kicker- UCLA)
Dylan Snyder (wr- MT Tech)
Jaharie Martin (fb- Maine)
Malik Mullins (wr- ?)
Sean Austin (qb- ?)
Noah Smith (wr- ?)

2021-2
In
Dru Polidore (db- Air Force)
Sean Chambers (qb- Wyoming)
Ravi Alston (wr- St Johns)
Omarrian Aigbedion (ol- Army)
Kaegun Williams (rb- San Diego St)
Malik Mullins (wr- Indepnedence CC)
Clevan Thomas (wr- Kentucky)
Rhedi Short (s- Arizona)

Out
Mathew McKay (qb- Elon)
Luke Pawlak (kicker- U Toledo)
Casey Bauman (qb- Augustans)
Cole Snyder (ol- Delaware)
Charles Brown (wr- Texas State)
Jaden Smith (wr- Tarleton)
TJ Session (ol- Cal)
Demarius Hosey (rb- Texas AM Commerce)
Jamahd Monroe (wr- ?)
Andrew Patterson (wr- ?)

 

[Monymony]

GRIZ TRANSFERS LAST 3 YEARS
This is copied and pasted... don't judge and please fact check!!
2023- (believe this is only in?)
QB- Sam Vidlak 6' 0" 195 (Boise/Oregon State) 3 to play 3
OL- Cannon Pamfiloff 6' 6" 290 (Utah Tech) 3 to play 3

DL- Hayden Harris 6' 5" 260 (UCLA) Sammamish, WA 3- Star .810, 2 to play 2
LB/TE- Riley Wilson III 6' 2" 220 (U of Hawaii) Prosper TX 3 to play 3
DB- (RJ) Ronald Jackson 6' 1" 200 (Transfer from Akron) 3 to play 3
2022- Don't think this is everyone (missing outs maybe)
Transfers (6)
QB- Lucas Johnson 6'3" 215 (San Diego State) 1 to play 1
OL- Dylan Mayginnes 6'5" 300 (Wash State) (Instagram)
WR- Sawyer Racanelli 6' 2" 210 (2. 3-star) (U of Washington)

LB/ATH- Garrett Hustedt 6'2" 230 (Nebraska) 3 to play 3 (Instagram)
DB- Jayden Dawson 5'11" 190 (Idaho State) 1 to play 1
CB- Robert Whitehead 6'1" 180 (Grossmont J.C.) 3 to play 2

2021
Out
RB- Kevin Armstead (Freshman) Playing time?
FB- Trase LaTexier (Senior) Injured
WR- Samori Toure (Senior) Trans to Nebraska
TE- Bryson Deming (Junior) Medical program- Illinois State
DE- Brayden Deming (Junior) Medical program- Illinois State
S- Nick Guerena
K- Jack Cooper (Junior)

Late 2021/ Spring / Transfers (11)
QB- Quinn Lamers (Rhindlander HS) Rhindlander, WI (N 4/21/21) Walk-on Class of 2021
RB- Isiah Childs 6'2" 215 (Akron Transfer) (T 4/6/21) 4 to play 4
WR- Junior Bergen 6'0" 175 (Kitten Transfer, glad he came to his senses) (N 4/15/21) Signed Class of 2021
WR- Tanner Huff 6' 0" 185 (Butte HS) Butte, MT (T 6/10/21) Class of 2021 Walk-on
WR- Nick Williams 6' 5" 195 (Oceanside HS) Oceanside, CA (On EGriz Roster) Signed Class of 2021
OL- Hunter Mayginnes 6' 5" 308 (Washington State Transfer) (T 6/14/21) 3 to play 3
OL- Ethan Barney 6' 4" 285 (Sumner HS) Sumner, WA (T 4/20/21) Class of 2021

DE- DeAri Todd 6' 4" 265 (Michigan State Transfer) (T 4/30/21) 2 to play 2
LB- Josh McCurty (Southwestern College) Chula Vista, CA (Spring Wallk-on egriz roster) 4 to play 4
DB- Dylan Simmons 6' 0" 180 (Day HS) Matairie, LA (T 6/7/21) Class of 2021
K- Kevin Macias (Arizona State Transfer) (On Egriz Roster) 1 to play 1

 

[Monymony]

This is my take on MSU
The cats have brought in some great talents (Chambers, Polidore, Thomas, Aigbedion, etc.) and have clearly lost some great players (Ifanse, 3 OL this year, Valdez) but I believe the Cats have come out in the positive in the end. I believe this next offseason will be key in determining how well the Cats can use the portal to fill in lost players who don't have enough players under them who are ready. The cats seem to use the portal as more of a fill (Eckert for Valdez, etc) which time will tell if that is good or not.