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Some not happy about Grizzlies Champions Center...

How do the wonks @ the B School feel about it?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iz-WuLQz_ns

May be an urban legend, but it seems I've heard that UW's marketing kids participated in the attachment. In agreement, they need real marketing folks for this kind of thing, and kids with skin in the game make it even better.
 
bgbigdog said:
How do the wonks @ the B School feel about it?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iz-WuLQz_ns

May be an urban legend, but it seems I've heard that UW's marketing kids participated in the attachment. In agreement, they need real marketing folks for this kind of thing, and kids with skin in the game make it even better.
The Seattle Ad Agency that did Rainier, Ivars and several others had the most creative team probably ever assembled outside of New York. Everybody, I mean Everybody, in the industry still studies those ads; Budweiser even outright stole the Rainier Beer Frogs commercial. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0IYUXWn3UY

That also underscores the phenomenon known as "Engstrom." There is not just a lack of imagination and creativity, there is a profound inability to even recognize it. The old saying, "I'm not too bright, but I'm smart enough to know I have to hire people a lot smarter than me just to even things out!" doesn't work at UM. UM chose generic college advertising and recruiting agencies BECAUSE they were generic college advertising and recruiting agencies. Engstrom was comfortable with the TV ad campaign precisely because it was also generic; it "looked" like college and university advertising. To him, that's good stuff! It looked "collegy!"

How much creativity can be bought? Lots. Here's that same ad agency's ad trying to get on the Super Bowl on a local ad budget for a small Seattle wharfside restaurant, Ivars, and finding out that they could only afford a one-half second commercial. They did it! The most successful one-half second commercial in history.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5K0Oaz0QGQ

Imagination can go a long ways. It can't be found in Main Hall.
 
UMGriz75 said:
One of the key indicators of Main Hall incompetence is the approach to "recruiting." UM was very good at it under George Dennison, the results speak for themselves. It wasn't big on pamphlets and advertisements, but was very good at positive public relations. Dennison himself was a terrific recruiter.

Engstrom of course decided to make a very public "PC" approach at the outset of his administration that simply and quickly blew up in his face. Compared to Cruzado's handling of a music professor run sexually amok, with faculty and staff knowledge, to the point that the high school music teachers across the state were refusing to allow him on premises -- never heard about that one did you? There's a reason. -- Engstrom went the "full confessional," followed by two public hangings that he thought would establish his Liberal bona fides.

No one, in their right minds could have thought that would have a positive recruiting message: women were prey and men were predators, predators that would be pre-judged and their civil rights removed -- But, there he was right out in front of the mob, leading it forward. It had worked so well at Duke University, what could possibly go wrong?

Students stopped applying.

As that focused then on UM's administrative recruiting efforts, it was obvious how poor they were in the absence of a strong and positive leader. In some odd fashion, the blame was placed on the lack of pamphlets, not the absence of a strong, positive leader.

With great fanfare, UM "redesigned" its public relations. It went from being "THE University of Montana" to just "University of Montana." One of several, apparently. The ad agency that thought of that one replaced "Truth is Light," -- a neoclassic University motto of great dignity -- with "Thrive," inspiring posters of which are all around campus, and replaced UM's standard neoclassical logos with a limp lightning bolt that was supposed to resemble a mountain ridge, ostensibly Mount Sentinel, which looks to be in a pretty weak mountain range, and adopted a Helvetica type style that lost favor in the 1970s.

Then, the "Welcome to Montana State University" email blast fiasco. That underscored what Main Hall was. There was no monitoring in place, no feedback, no oversight. Frankly, that could not have happened under George Dennison. He wanted to see everything first. He took his job seriously. It also underscored Engstrom's hands-off approach -- the one that had him signing the DOE agreement without reading it. They had hired a recruiting firm. That was all it took. He didn't need to DO ANYTHING which fit his style perfectly.

And of course it was an unmitigated disaster. A million bucks down the rathole and a thousand more students lost.

Gosh, "let's change agencies!!" That's the ticket! Of course, the new folks were burdened with the legacy of the logo changes; can't undo that expensive mistake! It would "look bad!!!"

Another million bucks. Bad letters, bad pamphlets, and, oh, a series of generic television ads of the kind that such agencies were peddling to universities all across the country. And just that -- completely generic, formulaic, and required no imagination or even knowledge of the University itself -- just disjointed campus scenes showing cool stuff like break dancing and interviews with "diversity" students that showed that the UM campus had all the strengths of any other campus in the country, students that had accents! They are flacccid, the scripts could apply to any University in the country and probably do. The one ad that did mention academic achievement -- Rhodes, Fullbright, etc -- did so on the overlay of an uninspiring student with a visible and painful-looking case of acne sitting morosely in a class-room making desperate looking attempts to engage in some class discussion.

The ads are unbelievably bad. They are beyond stupid. But that underscores what goes on in Main Hall. Nobody has responsibility. No one says "no." No, after blowing another million, and losing another 1,500 students, UM figured out -- as part of the budget cutting process! -- that it can do just as good a job recruiting by taking the tasks in-house and doing the mailing lists and high school graduation research in Lommason Center -- just like they were doing when they started losing thousands of students! But, that's not the bad part. The bad part is that UM paid a million bucks to an Iowa company with a so-so track record to do exactly what UM had already been doing, in-house. Exactly what was the contract supposed to accomplish?

There's that "Main Hall Competency" problem again. No one could ask that question. "These guys aren't proposing to do anything differently than what we are already doing. What's the point?" Seriously, Engstrom is so overwhelmed and inept, he cannot make those kind of analyses. And anybody else that could have is gone.

That's the key here: incompetence is hiring incompetence. It is now an established track record. Nothing could be clearer than in how Engstrom has handled these successive outside contract fiascoes.

The bad part -- yes, "there is a bad part" -- is that nearly every study on the point, points to athletic team success as being a leverage toward increased enrollment, higher selectivity in applications, higher average ACT and SAT scores, and larger public and private support. We can assume those have been in play at UM. In other words, all of this hemorrhaging under Engstrom would have been much worse but for the athletic team success -- a key positive point that Engstrom himself, in the only bold action he ever took, nearly scuttled -- and but for that UM's enrollment declines would have been worse, possibly and even probably much worse, something the Kaimin editor ought to think long and seriously about, as should the Bored of Regents.

And for all that he gets a $500,000 bonus.

Where do I sign up?
 
Ursa Major said:
bgbigdog said:
Hammer said:
bgbigdog said:
If they are just letting bids now, 18 mos might be overly optimistic.

Why is that? Provided there are no unforeseen issues 18 months should be enough time.

Having built more than one large office/warehouse facility in my day, there are always unforseen circumstances. You're dealing with entities that may or may not share your sense of urgency as well - contractors, subs, inspectors, etc. Not wishing that it runs long - just coming down on the side of pragmatic.
If it's a Union job it could go either way.

tumblr_nbc4b6yB691tybfhmo5_250.gif

:lol: Bada Bing!
 
UMGriz75 said:
With great fanfare, UM "redesigned" its public relations. It went from being "THE University of Montana" to just "University of Montana." One of several, apparently. The ad agency that thought of that one replaced "Truth is Light," -- a neoclassic University motto of great dignity -- with "Thrive," inspiring posters of which are all around campus, and replaced UM's standard neoclassical logos with a limp lightning bolt that was supposed to resemble a mountain ridge, ostensibly Mount Sentinel, which looks to be in a pretty weak mountain range, and adopted a Helvetica type style that lost favor in the 1970s.

LOVE the Lux et Veritas logo! It actually says "The University of Montana" around the circular border.

At least it's still featured on the west side facade at Wa-Griz. I would like to see it featured on the uniforms as well, helmet sticker on the back for FB, back of the neckline on other sports' jerseys, etc.

That new font and lightning bolt (or 2 year performance graph of the Dow Jones) and Thrive were completely underwhelming from the jump.
 
UM's official motto is still Lux et Veritas (Light and Truth). And this logo hasn't been eliminated:

University_of_Montana_seal.png




Thrive is a marketing brand, and admittedly one with which I am underwhelmed. I do think the Mountain "M" is a cool and modern looking logo, however. Remember, we're trying to attract 16 and 17 year old kids, not 80 year old alumni.
 
EverettGriz said:
I do think the Mountain "M" is a cool and modern looking logo, however. Remember, we're trying to attract 16 and 17 year old kids, not 80 year old alumni.
OK. Did it work?
 
UMGriz75 said:
EverettGriz said:
I do think the Mountain "M" is a cool and modern looking logo, however. Remember, we're trying to attract 16 and 17 year old kids, not 80 year old alumni.
OK. Did it work?

I dunno. Are you attracted to the motto logo?
 
EverettGriz said:
UM's official motto is still Lux et Veritas (Light and Truth). And this logo hasn't been eliminated:

University_of_Montana_seal.png




Thrive is a marketing brand, and admittedly one with which I am underwhelmed. I do think the Mountain "M" is a cool and modern looking logo, however. Remember, we're trying to attract 16 and 17 year old kids, not 80 year old alumni.

Well, using that logic, we should incorporate emojis into the brand. ;)
 
mtgriz said:
EverettGriz said:
UM's official motto is still Lux et Veritas (Light and Truth). And this logo hasn't been eliminated:

University_of_Montana_seal.png




Thrive is a marketing brand, and admittedly one with which I am underwhelmed. I do think the Mountain "M" is a cool and modern looking logo, however. Remember, we're trying to attract 16 and 17 year old kids, not 80 year old alumni.

Well, using that logic, we should incorporate emojis into the brand. ;)

Insightful, and not talking about the emoji thing. Opting for the generic will net nothing. Alumni need to be courted, but not in the same manner as college-bound kids. And even that's slightly askew of how you market to their parents when UM makes a dinner table discussion. Need an infusion of new ideas and marketing through channels that today are largely under used. Royce should be briefed - but should leave the development of these solutions to someone closer to the customer image and culture.
 
EverettGriz said:
I do think the Mountain "M" is a cool and modern looking logo, however. Remember, we're trying to attract 16 and 17 year old kids, not 80 year old alumni.
The problem with the new "M" logo is that you have to realize it is a stylistic rendition of Mount Sentinel. For the 16 and 17 year olds that have never been to campus, they likely have no idea what it is. How could they? To them, it is an undefined squiggle. Now, there's something to get inspired about: "University of Montana = Undefined Squiggle!"

The 80-year-old alumni are likely the only ones who DO get it.
 
Or could they just see an "M" in the shape of any mountain, knowing there are plenty of those in Montana?
 
This is the "M-pulse" Logo now used. (Yes, it has that name.) Symbolizing the "Engstrom" era.

UM%20Main%20Logo%20Maroon.jpg


This is the design it replaced. The "Dennison" vision.

um-letterhead-logo-black-white.png


Or, if you prefer:

university-of-montana-old-logo.gif
 
EverettGriz said:
Or could they just see an "M" in the shape of any mountain, knowing there are plenty of those in Montana?
Well, that could explain why UM's PR firm sent out the email blast encouraging high school seniors to attend Montana State University. You know, just mountains, plenty of them ....
 
UMGriz75 said:
This is the "M-pulse" Logo now used. (Yes, it has that name.) Symbolizing the "Engstrom" era.

UM%20Main%20Logo%20Maroon.jpg


This is the design it replaced. The "Dennison" vision.

um-letterhead-logo-black-white.png


Or, if you prefer:

university-of-montana-old-logo.gif




Undoubtedly, the "The" denotes a singular context. It helps making us exclusive thus more appealing.
 
I kiddingly referred to the mountain outline as a Dow Jones graph. Actually, it is somewhat representative of enrollment since its adoption.
 
Is it true that GSA has committed to putting up a half million dollars per year for 10 (or 15) years to fund the Champions Center?
 
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