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Question for the Griz fans

Moneymoney said:
Genuine questions for the knowledgeable fans (hoops please don’t start any arguments). What is the difference between the cats and griz. Is it recruiting/evaluation, strength/conditioning, development, coaching, scheme, a combination, or other? Cats lead 7-3 in the last 10 meetings and clearly things are swinging in that direction as of late.

In my opinion I think the way the programs are ran is completely different. Vigen recruits mainly high schools guys and develops them into all-conference guys then fills in gaps with transfers (which has been very successful). BH seems to prioritize transfers year after year as he typically has many players to replace and apparently doesn’t think the younger guys are ready. Bobby and co have been hit or miss with transfers. Wortham, McDowell, Tolbert, Wing, etc. have been fantastic All-American level dudes but then there have been some misses. I think this isn’t the worst strategy as many high level programs do this, but what happens when thing slip and players stop wanting to transfer? Would it be a bad idea to hit the reset button and offer every good high school kid in the region and roll the red carpet out to them in hopes of trying to match what MSU, NDSU, and SDSU do? Is it coaching? The gris straight up have the most talented roster in the FCS yet they can’t seem to climb to the top, but hell neither can the cats.
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I don't care about the difference between the cats and the Griz. This is not a question made in good faith and is radically self-serving. You are obviously trying to get Griz fans to agree with your argument that high school recruitment is superior...or rage bait them. The cats have a game against the best player in the FCS in two weeks...maybe worry about that team on your own message board instead?
 
brewskis said:
What makes that the proper measurement? Because that’s the sole remaining metric that favors Bobby? (As long as you measure back to 2004 lol)

If you do it since 2020 he loses that matchup
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There is no measurement. It can be what you want it to be.
 
catgrizfan said:
I don't care about the difference between the cats and the Griz. This is not a question made in good faith and is radically self-serving. You are obviously trying to get Griz fans to agree with your argument that high school recruitment is superior...or rage bait them. The cats have a game against the best player in the FCS in two weeks...maybe worry about that team on your own message board instead?
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My view too.
 
grizfnz said:
The narrative that Liberal Arts degrees don’t pay is bullshit and the fact that a Griz fan would help perpetuate it is embarrassing. The Liberal Arts are the basis on which higher education was founded…. math, science, rhetoric, humanities, not fine arts and dance.
The only STEM field they offer in Bozeman compared to UM is engineering (of which they have a dozen or so football players enrolled in). UM has many science, tech and math degrees, they just don’t market a business degree as “ financial engineering” to unsuspecting students who fault to realize they won’t actually have an ABET recognized engineering degree upon graduation.
UM’s pre-medical sciences program has one of the highest med-school acceptance rates in the country and has placed several students in T10 medical schools over the last 5 years. Some of the top people at global leader Nike have UM business degrees. The university now offers a degree in the cutting edge field of cybersecurity,
It’s time for Griz fans and UM alumni to to speak up about the great academic programs offered at UM and put a stop to the fallacy that you can’t make a living off a degree from a Liberal Arts school!!!!
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Please don't compare a business degree from the UM to a financial engineering degree from MSU. It's absolutely apples vs oranges. A financial engineering degree at MSU requires calc 1-3, differential equations, linear algebra and calc based physics. It's waaaaay more challenging and marketable than a business degree at UM. I do agree that stem based run of the mill science degrees are equivalent.
 
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grizfnz said:
The narrative that Liberal Arts degrees don’t pay is bullshit and the fact that a Griz fan would help perpetuate it is embarrassing. The Liberal Arts are the basis on which higher education was founded…. math, science, rhetoric, humanities, not fine arts and dance.
The only STEM field they offer in Bozeman compared to UM is engineering (of which they have a dozen or so football players enrolled in). UM has many science, tech and math degrees, they just don’t market a business degree as “ financial engineering” to unsuspecting students who fault to realize they won’t actually have an ABET recognized engineering degree upon graduation.
UM’s pre-medical sciences program has one of the highest med-school acceptance rates in the country and has placed several students in T10 medical schools over the last 5 years. Some of the top people at global leader Nike have UM business degrees. The university now offers a degree in the cutting edge field of cybersecurity,
It’s time for Griz fans and UM alumni to to speak up about the great academic programs offered at UM and put a stop to the fallacy that you can’t make a living off a degree from a Liberal Arts school!!!!
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Great post.
 
grizfnz said:
The narrative that Liberal Arts degrees don’t pay is bullshit and the fact that a Griz fan would help perpetuate it is embarrassing. The Liberal Arts are the basis on which higher education was founded…. math, science, rhetoric, humanities, not fine arts and dance.
The only STEM field they offer in Bozeman compared to UM is engineering (of which they have a dozen or so football players enrolled in). UM has many science, tech and math degrees, they just don’t market a business degree as “ financial engineering” to unsuspecting students who fault to realize they won’t actually have an ABET recognized engineering degree upon graduation.
UM’s pre-medical sciences program has one of the highest med-school acceptance rates in the country and has placed several students in T10 medical schools over the last 5 years. Some of the top people at global leader Nike have UM business degrees. The university now offers a degree in the cutting edge field of cybersecurity,
It’s time for Griz fans and UM alumni to to speak up about the great academic programs offered at UM and put a stop to the fallacy that you can’t make a living off a degree from a Liberal Arts school!!!!
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“Big things are happening here”. Fire Bodnar. Fire the AD who hired Bob Stitt and ran our WBB program into the ground. Fire everyone.
UM needs a reset.
 
Skookum-Jim said:
Please don't compare a business degree from the UM to a financial engineering degree from MSU. It's absolutely apples vs oranges. A financial engineering degree at MSU requires calc 1-3, differential equations, linear algebra and calc based physics. It's waaaaay more challenging and marketable than a business degree at UM. I do agree that stem based run of the mill science degrees are equivalent.
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Can earn a MBA @ UM, can't @MSU. An MBA degree from UM is waaaay more marketable than a financial engineering degree at MSU, which to a lot of folks sounds like the shady degree the late Bernie Madoff had that helped land him in prison for the rest of his life. ( Ponzi schemes require a lot of " financial engineering !!! " )

The Montana BBER ( Bureau of Business and Economic Research.) is HQ'd @ UM, not MSU. UM has Montana's flagship business school--MSU does not : ( !!!
 
billingsgriz said:
Can earn a MBA @ UM, can't @MSU. An MBA degree from UM is waaaay more marketable than a financial engineering degree at MSU, which to a lot of folks sounds like the shady degree the late Bernie Madoff had that helped land him in prison for the rest of his life. ( Ponzi schemes require a lot of " financial engineering !!! " )

The Montana BBER ( Bureau of Business and Economic Research.) is HQ'd @ UM, not MSU. UM has Montana's flagship business school--MSU does not : ( !!!
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What? You can get an MBA at MSU. Now you are comparing graduate degrees to bachelor degrees. There isn't a degree at UM aside from physics and math with more math than a financial engineering degree. It's way harder to achieve than anything in the business department. Most liars come from the business department not the engineering department. Bernie Madoff was certainly not an engineer.
 
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Skookum-Jim said:
Please don't compare a business degree from the UM to a financial engineering degree from MSU. It's absolutely apples vs oranges. A financial engineering degree at MSU requires calc 1-3, differential equations, linear algebra and calc based physics. It's waaaaay more challenging and marketable than a business degree at UM. I do agree that stem based run of the mill science degrees are equivalent.
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I don’t see Dif Eq’s listed as a requirement in the MSU course catalogue, and while the degree may have some additional math requirements, at the end of the day it’s a finance degree not an engineering degree.

BTW these are the math requirements for a Gen Chem degree at UM, perhaps the U should market it as a Chem E degree.😉
Calc 1
Calc 2
Physics with Calc 1
Physics with Calc 2
Computer Science
Analytical Chemistry
Physical Chemistry
 
grizfnz said:
I don’t see Dif Eq’s listed as a requirement in the MSU course catalogue, and while the degree may have some additional math requirements, at the end of the day it’s a finance degree not an engineering degree.

BTW these are the math requirements for a Gen Chem degree at UM, perhaps the U should market it as a Chem E degree.😉
Calc 1
Calc 2
Physics with Calc 1
Physics with Calc 2
Computer Science
Analytical Chemistry
Physical Chemistry
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Hahahaha where is calc III, linear algebra and differential equations? Those are sophomore classes in any engineering degree. You've listed Freshman financial engineering or engineering requirements.
 
Skookum-Jim said:
Hahahaha where is calc III, linear algebra and differential equations? Those are sophomore classes in any engineering degree. You've listed Freshman financial engineering or engineering requirements.
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M274 is an elective not a requirement for an msu financial “engineering” degree.
 
BadlandsGrizFan said:
When Hauck is done here the program is going to go through a Hard Reset. Which it will probably be better off for. But it is going to be a big big chance across multiple organizations in Missoula.
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I hope the hard reset doesn't include changing offense style like we saw in the change from Hauck 1.0 to Pflugrad.
 
mthoopsfan said:
In the decade, Cats improved significantly with better coaching and more support and Griz declined after Pflu was fired. Until Bobby returned. It took him a couple years to get rolling again. It had little or nothing to do with the things you mentioned. Those show you don’t understand football or the programs.
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This is literally the answer and i dont understand why this isnt more supported in this forum. In the 2010s MSU had a big upswing in enrollment, they had more money coming in and found a great coach (choate) that ran with the resources and when he left, vigen took over a great program and has continued to push its success. During that same time, UM school and football team was having a bad downturn. And when hauck finally came back, he had to rebuild what was lost with expiremental and place-filler coaches. UM lost a lot of its instate pipeline before haucks return. Hauck rebuilt the program rather quickly but has to lean on transfers more to since those in state pipelines to UM arent what they once were. Its honestly just a blessing both programs are on top of the FCS. Anyone who thinks its deeper than that doesnt understand college programs. Essentially, UM just had a more recent complete rebuild than msu has.
 
Skookum-Jim said:
Please don't compare a business degree from the UM to a financial engineering degree from MSU. It's absolutely apples vs oranges. A financial engineering degree at MSU requires calc 1-3, differential equations, linear algebra and calc based physics. It's waaaaay more challenging and marketable than a business degree at UM. I do agree that stem based run of the mill science degrees are equivalent.
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Okay, I won't compare them. I manage people with financial engineering degrees. they are smart but they are not the leaders to develop the strategy and lead the business.
 
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