O line position discussion/revision 2/spring practices

[reinell30]

I can't remember this small of O-Line ever. I believe it will hurt our running game. Those big bodies take there toll on defense's late in the game...Although, those close to 290 this past year, could all come into the fall over 300...

We had a huge O Line last year, and our run game sucked. I don't see the correlation.

:roll: :roll:

You keep stating that like it's fact, when it's not. UND's run game sucked. UNC's, ISU's...SUU...Weber State. THEIR run games sucked. We averaged 4.5 yards per carry, over 180 yards per game, and scored 21 TD's on the ground. Our running game didnt' suck. Was there room for improvement? Certainly....but to say it sucked is being overly dramatic.

Which isn't cool, unless you're a chick. Then it's expected.

Our running sucked???? Jordan Canada rushed for over 1000 yds, how long has it been since that happened? Travon Van was hurt or out for how many games? Joey counts hurt for how long. Yes our O-Line wasn't real mobile and were lazy at times, but our run game did not suck!

 

[grizatwork]

I think our run game could have been better. We were very predictable in our run game. Formations and motions tipped off what we were running, especially on first and second down. More creativity and being able to run or pass out of multiple formations would help our running game get over 200/game. Just my opinion.

 

[BWahlberg]

Totally uninformed and sucrose-based wild ass guess at spring camp depth. Changing my opinion based on some good discussion here from my earlier post.

T: Schmaing / LaRowe
G: Hines / Todd
C: Hines / Weyer
G: Kalekini / Deitrich
T: Poole / Kelly / Rockich

That's how I see it potentially opening spring camp, with the Hines brothers pegged as senior starters. However, I see some big battles brewing, mostly over the interior line. This is what I'll be watching for once spring ball starts:

- Ben Weyer. This guy exploded in spring and fall camp last year and wound up starting at guard while Poole worked his way back in and didn't miss a beat. He's being primed to be the next center for the Griz and even played some center in a few games this year when Oiland was dealing with a bad hammy and Hines was hurt. Weyer could probably start at guard, and he might just do that.

- The Hines brothers health. These guys have been here since 2011 now and have rarely seen the field. Both are going to probably be penciled in to start but will need to prove they can stay healthy on the field. Last year Jordan Hines opened fall camp as a starter but an injury practically sidelined him for 2 months. I'm told these two are really strong and put up big weight room numbers but there's questions on durability as well as toughness on the field.

- IMO both guard spots are wide open. Kalekini missed all of fall camp and returned to the team late, will he be ready to go this spring? Todd is healthy and looked like the tough and mean O-linemen we saw in his high school highlight reel. I have a feeling Todd will respond the best to Gerber's weight training program and he could come in as the biggest/strongest guard in the class. Deitrich played ahead of Todd last season and traveled I believe, he's another guy that I think will really respond well to the new program. Lots of moving pieces on the interior.

- While the coaches have 5 or 6 guys they can mix and move on the interior O-line there's really only two options at tackle if Schmaing or Poole get hurt. LaRowe and Kelly look like solid two heir-apparents to the starters in front of them, but man oh man, it's thin back there. Will be interesting to see if Rokich has put on some weight, he was supposed to grey shirt at first but wound up taking a red shirt on the roster, he was just 245 pounds last season.

I may be way off here but I wouldn't be shocked if the starting roster at the end of spring ball looked like this:

T: Schmaing
G: Todd
C: Weyer
G: Hines
T: Poole

 

[horribilisfan8184]

Will the 2014 griz football team have the smallest O line they've had in 20+ years? Seems like you've always had monsters. BTW, this is not smack in the least. In fact I've always said that you guys placed too much emphasis on SIZE along the O line rather than agility, speed, and technique. Of course it also largely depends on what type of offense you're trying to run.

It'll be the first year I can remember in, like, FOREVER that we haven't had at least ONE guy over 300 lbs.... :| :| Not sure what that'll mean, long term.

I can't remember this small of O-Line ever. I believe it will hurt our running game. Those big bodies take there toll on defense's late in the game...Although, those close to 290 this past year, could all come into the fall over 300...

We had a huge O Line last year, and our run game sucked when we needed to run the most.]. I don't see the correlation.

FIFY Can't believe the mushheads here who don't remember how much trouble we had punching in touchdowns with the run. Those plays Jordy fumbled at the goalline should have never been necessary. Third and 3 against CC and we throw to the endzone twice instead of run for first down (multiple times). Counts and Van could have had 1500 yds each with their talent levels, and quicker lineman who can get to the correct linebacker sooner.

 

[AZGrizFan]

I may be way off here but I wouldn't be shocked if the starting roster at the end of spring ball looked like this:

T: Schmaing
G: Todd
C: Weyer
G: Hines
T: Poole

I think this is closer to reality.

 

[AZGrizFan]

FIFY Can't believe the mushheads here who don't remember how much trouble we had punching in touchdowns with the run. Those plays Jordy fumbled at the goalline should have never been necessary. Third and 3 against CC and we throw to the endzone twice instead of run for first down (multiple times). Counts and Van could have had 1500 yds each with their talent levels, and quicker lineman who can get to the correct linebacker sooner.

I know. If we'd just score on every play like we're fully capable of, we'd go 15-0 every year and win the chipper. Fuckin' players. What's wrong with them? :| :|

 

[Spanky]

We have excellent running backs. The yards gained by them was with little help from the OL.

 

[horribilisfan8184]

FIFY Can't believe the mushheads here who don't remember how much trouble we had punching in touchdowns with the run. Those plays Jordy fumbled at the goalline should have never been necessary. Third and 3 against CC and we throw to the endzone twice instead of run for first down (multiple times). Counts and Van could have had 1500 yds each with their talent levels, and quicker lineman who can get to the correct linebacker sooner.

I know. If we'd just score on every play like we're fully capable of, we'd go 15-0 every year and win the chipper. f***[*]' players. What's wrong with them? :| :|

Ahhhh. A pithy response from the Summer's Eve brigade.

We didn't even touch on how often Jordy ran for his life on pass plays when lighter-quicker DL's smoked the giants.

 

[AZGrizFan]

FIFY Can't believe the mushheads here who don't remember how much trouble we had punching in touchdowns with the run. Those plays Jordy fumbled at the goalline should have never been necessary. Third and 3 against CC and we throw to the endzone twice instead of run for first down (multiple times). Counts and Van could have had 1500 yds each with their talent levels, and quicker lineman who can get to the correct linebacker sooner.

I know. If we'd just score on every play like we're fully capable of, we'd go 15-0 every year and win the chipper. f***[*]' players. What's wrong with them? :| :|

Ahhhh. A pithy response from the Summer's Eve brigade.

We didn't even touch on how often Jordy ran for his life on pass plays when lighter-quicker DL's smoked the giants.

I'm not even sure what the fuck that first sentence means, but you should go watch a game or two of EWU's. Adams was "running for his life" as much or more than Jordy. All I know is it's a goddamned miracle this team went 10-3, had the 2nd highest scoring average in the league, 3rd highest YPG average in the league, 3rd highest rushing offense in the league, 3rd most passing yards in the league (with WAAAAY fewer attempts than the two teams above us) with such a shitty O-line.

 

[horribilisfan8184]

FIFY Can't believe the mushheads here who don't remember how much trouble we had punching in touchdowns with the run. Those plays Jordy fumbled at the goalline should have never been necessary. Third and 3 against CC and we throw to the endzone twice instead of run for first down (multiple times). Counts and Van could have had 1500 yds each with their talent levels, and quicker lineman who can get to the correct linebacker sooner.

I know. If we'd just score on every play like we're fully capable of, we'd go 15-0 every year and win the chipper. f***[*]' players. What's wrong with them? :| :|

Ahhhh. A pithy response from the Summer's Eve brigade.

We didn't even touch on how often Jordy ran for his life on pass plays when lighter-quicker DL's smoked the giants.

I'm not even sure what the f*** that first sentence means, but you should go watch a game or two of EWU's. Adams was "running for his life" as much or more than Jordy. All I know is it's a goddamned miracle this team went 10-3, had the 2nd highest scoring average in the league, 3rd highest YPG average in the league, 3rd highest rushing offense in the league, 3rd most passing yards in the league (with WAAAAY fewer attempts than the two teams above us) with such a shitty O-line.

Who wants to be compared ot EWU? I watched NDSU's o-line, and with that line, we would have been first in all categories. With the experience (amount of games started) last year's o-line should have dominated every game. When I watched the Griz o-line play I saw tons of potential and unrealized talent. I don't blame any of that on the players. They and the O-line coaches should all be required to watch 100 hours of Conrad Dobler film before spring ball starts.

 

[AZGrizFan]

I know. If we'd just score on every play like we're fully capable of, we'd go 15-0 every year and win the chipper. f***[*]' players. What's wrong with them? :| :|

Ahhhh. A pithy response from the Summer's Eve brigade.

We didn't even touch on how often Jordy ran for his life on pass plays when lighter-quicker DL's smoked the giants.

I'm not even sure what the f*** that first sentence means, but you should go watch a game or two of EWU's. Adams was "running for his life" as much or more than Jordy. All I know is it's a goddamned miracle this team went 10-3, had the 2nd highest scoring average in the league, 3rd highest YPG average in the league, 3rd highest rushing offense in the league, 3rd most passing yards in the league (with WAAAAY fewer attempts than the two teams above us) with such a shitty O-line.

Who wants to be compared ot EWU? I watched NDSU's o-line, and with that line, we would have been first in all categories. With the experience (amount of games started) last year's o-line should have dominated every game. When I watched the Griz o-line play I saw tons of potential and unrealized talent. I don't blame any of that on the players. They and the O-line coaches should all be required to watch 100 hours of Conrad Dobler film before spring ball starts.

Only, you did.

 

[BWahlberg]

I may be way off here but I wouldn't be shocked if the starting roster at the end of spring ball looked like this:

T: Schmaing
G: Todd
C: Weyer
G: Hines
T: Poole

I think this is closer to reality.

Tough to make assumptions but lets say Gerbs program and a focus on adding a little bit more bulk adds 10 pounds to our interior OL and 5 to the tackles. The starting weights and heights would be:

Schmaing: 6-7, 296
Todd: 6-7, 305
Weyer: 6-4, 280
Hines: 6-4, 301
Poole: 6-5, 300

That's roughly an average of 6-5.5 tall and 296.4 pounds on the line. Actually probably just a little bit lighter than more of our previous power-OLs that we had in 2008 and 2009.

Also as a reference I checked the starting line height/weight for NDSU

Turner: 6-6, 314
Johnson: 6-4, 317
Colville: 6-2, 270
Gimmestad: 6-2, 304
Haeg: 6-6, 293

Avg 6-5 and 297.

I know that height and weight are just a small piece to the pie, blocking, technique, coaching, toughness, strength, smarts, etc have bigger roles. On paper this O-line at least shows they have the physical size that would match up with what NDSU has had.

 

[horribilisfan8184]

Ahhhh. A pithy response from the Summer's Eve brigade.

We didn't even touch on how often Jordy ran for his life on pass plays when lighter-quicker DL's smoked the giants.

I'm not even sure what the f*** that first sentence means, but you should go watch a game or two of EWU's. Adams was "running for his life" as much or more than Jordy. All I know is it's a goddamned miracle this team went 10-3, had the 2nd highest scoring average in the league, 3rd highest YPG average in the league, 3rd highest rushing offense in the league, 3rd most passing yards in the league (with WAAAAY fewer attempts than the two teams above us) with such a shitty O-line.

Who wants to be compared ot EWU? I watched NDSU's o-line, and with that line, we would have been first in all categories. With the experience (amount of games started) last year's o-line should have dominated every game. When I watched the Griz o-line play I saw tons of potential and unrealized talent. I don't blame any of that on the players. They and the O-line coaches should all be required to watch 100 hours of Conrad Dobler film before spring ball starts.

Only, you did.

Wrong. There was a whole other thread about how this years' line didn't have the swagger of previous o-lines, and had more of a laid back attitude of one of the coaches. Try reading that thread if you still don't get what I was saying.

 

[AZGrizFan]

I'm not even sure what the f*** that first sentence means, but you should go watch a game or two of EWU's. Adams was "running for his life" as much or more than Jordy. All I know is it's a goddamned miracle this team went 10-3, had the 2nd highest scoring average in the league, 3rd highest YPG average in the league, 3rd highest rushing offense in the league, 3rd most passing yards in the league (with WAAAAY fewer attempts than the two teams above us) with such a shitty O-line.

Who wants to be compared ot EWU? I watched NDSU's o-line, and with that line, we would have been first in all categories. With the experience (amount of games started) last year's o-line should have dominated every game. When I watched the Griz o-line play I saw tons of potential and unrealized talent. I don't blame any of that on the players. They and the O-line coaches should all be required to watch 100 hours of Conrad Dobler film before spring ball starts.

Only, you did.

Wrong. There was a whole other thread about how this years' line didn't have the swagger of previous o-lines, and had more of a laid back attitude of one of the coaches. Try reading that thread if you still don't get what I was saying.

I see. So, you blame their attitude, lack of "swagger", their lack of quickness, but none of that is blaming the player. Gotcha.

 

[Grizmayor]

We have excellent running backs. The yards gained by them was with little help from the OL.

Yep.

 

[poorgriz]

I may be way off here but I wouldn't be shocked if the starting roster at the end of spring ball looked like this:

T: Schmaing
G: Todd
C: Weyer
G: Hines
T: Poole

I think this is closer to reality.

Tough to make assumptions but lets say Gerbs program and a focus on adding a little bit more bulk adds 10 pounds to our interior OL and 5 to the tackles. The starting weights and heights would be:

Schmaing: 6-7, 296
Todd: 6-7, 305
Weyer: 6-4, 280
Hines: 6-4, 301
Poole: 6-5, 300

That's roughly an average of 6-5.5 tall and 296.4 pounds on the line. Actually probably just a little bit lighter than more of our previous power-OLs that we had in 2008 and 2009.

Also as a reference I checked the starting line height/weight for NDSU

Turner: 6-6, 314
Johnson: 6-4, 317
Colville: 6-2, 270
Gimmestad: 6-2, 304
Haeg: 6-6, 293

Avg 6-5 and 297.

I know that height and weight are just a small piece to the pie, blocking, technique, coaching, toughness, strength, smarts, etc have bigger roles. On paper this O-line at least shows they have the physical size that would match up with what NDSU has had.

Uh... that's quite the assumption. "Gerbs" may come in and say they're playing too heavy and make them drop some weight. Who knows. Your starters for Fall ball might average 280. They might average 305. Probably not the important factor - and comparing your line, and probably anyone else's in FCS, to NDSU is silly.

 

[PlayerRep]

I may be way off here but I wouldn't be shocked if the starting roster at the end of spring ball looked like this:

T: Schmaing
G: Todd
C: Weyer
G: Hines
T: Poole

I think this is closer to reality.

Tough to make assumptions but lets say Gerbs program and a focus on adding a little bit more bulk adds 10 pounds to our interior OL and 5 to the tackles. The starting weights and heights would be:

Schmaing: 6-7, 296
Todd: 6-7, 305
Weyer: 6-4, 280
Hines: 6-4, 301
Poole: 6-5, 300

That's roughly an average of 6-5.5 tall and 296.4 pounds on the line. Actually probably just a little bit lighter than more of our previous power-OLs that we had in 2008 and 2009.

Also as a reference I checked the starting line height/weight for NDSU

Turner: 6-6, 314
Johnson: 6-4, 317
Colville: 6-2, 270
Gimmestad: 6-2, 304
Haeg: 6-6, 293

Avg 6-5 and 297.

I know that height and weight are just a small piece to the pie, blocking, technique, coaching, toughness, strength, smarts, etc have bigger roles. On paper this O-line at least shows they have the physical size that would match up with what NDSU has had.

Uh... that's quite the assumption. "Gerbs" may come in and say they're playing too heavy and make them drop some weight. Who knows. Your starters for Fall ball might average 280. They might average 305. Probably not the important factor - and comparing your line, and probably anyone else's in FCS, to NDSU is silly.

You obviously don't know Gerber or much about him. O-lineman get stronger and put on weight under him. I can think of about 2 UM o-lineman who reduced weight under him, and both of them were closer to 350 than 300 at the outset.

Why is it "silly" compare heights and weights of o-lineman to NDSU? Seems like a perfectly good comparison to make.

 

[getgrizzy]

what's weyer's weight at? heard he was having trouble maintaining it after he got here.

 

[poorgriz]

I think this is closer to reality.

Tough to make assumptions but lets say Gerbs program and a focus on adding a little bit more bulk adds 10 pounds to our interior OL and 5 to the tackles. The starting weights and heights would be:

Schmaing: 6-7, 296
Todd: 6-7, 305
Weyer: 6-4, 280
Hines: 6-4, 301
Poole: 6-5, 300

That's roughly an average of 6-5.5 tall and 296.4 pounds on the line. Actually probably just a little bit lighter than more of our previous power-OLs that we had in 2008 and 2009.

Also as a reference I checked the starting line height/weight for NDSU

Turner: 6-6, 314
Johnson: 6-4, 317
Colville: 6-2, 270
Gimmestad: 6-2, 304
Haeg: 6-6, 293

Avg 6-5 and 297.

I know that height and weight are just a small piece to the pie, blocking, technique, coaching, toughness, strength, smarts, etc have bigger roles. On paper this O-line at least shows they have the physical size that would match up with what NDSU has had.

Uh... that's quite the assumption. "Gerbs" may come in and say they're playing too heavy and make them drop some weight. Who knows. Your starters for Fall ball might average 280. They might average 305. Probably not the important factor - and comparing your line, and probably anyone else's in FCS, to NDSU is silly.

You obviously don't know Gerber or much about him. O-lineman get stronger and put on weight under him. I can think of about 2 UM o-lineman who reduced weight under him, and both of them were closer to 350 than 300 at the outset.

Why is it "silly" compare heights and weights of o-lineman to NDSU? Seems like a perfectly good comparison to make.

Go ahead... make the comparison. Look at last year for example, the griz O line was huge. Quite a bit bigger than NDSU's. Way worse though. You obviously never played O Line.

 

[BWahlberg]

I may be way off here but I wouldn't be shocked if the starting roster at the end of spring ball looked like this:

T: Schmaing
G: Todd
C: Weyer
G: Hines
T: Poole

I think this is closer to reality.

Tough to make assumptions but lets say Gerbs program and a focus on adding a little bit more bulk adds 10 pounds to our interior OL and 5 to the tackles. The starting weights and heights would be:

Schmaing: 6-7, 296
Todd: 6-7, 305
Weyer: 6-4, 280
Hines: 6-4, 301
Poole: 6-5, 300

That's roughly an average of 6-5.5 tall and 296.4 pounds on the line. Actually probably just a little bit lighter than more of our previous power-OLs that we had in 2008 and 2009.

Also as a reference I checked the starting line height/weight for NDSU

Turner: 6-6, 314
Johnson: 6-4, 317
Colville: 6-2, 270
Gimmestad: 6-2, 304
Haeg: 6-6, 293

Avg 6-5 and 297.

I know that height and weight are just a small piece to the pie, blocking, technique, coaching, toughness, strength, smarts, etc have bigger roles. On paper this O-line at least shows they have the physical size that would match up with what NDSU has had.

Uh... that's quite the assumption. "Gerbs" may come in and say they're playing too heavy and make them drop some weight. Who knows. Your starters for Fall ball might average 280. They might average 305. Probably not the important factor - and comparing your line, and probably anyone else's in FCS, to NDSU is silly.

PoorGriz - I compared height and weight. Not talent. That's all.

And I expect Gerbs will put weight on these guys b/c that was how he worked when he was Bobby's S&T guy. Pflu brought in Oviatt to make the O-line more athletic to fit the Oregon scheme, but we don't run that offense anymore. That usually asks for a little bit lighter linemen who can handle a more up-tempo offense.