MT Kids in a Class

[grizpack]

Here is what I have been able to pull from various google searches for UM recruits of Montana kids:

2003 - 2004 19 MT kids from 32 total recruits
2005 11 of 18
2006 8 of 15
2007 7 of ?
2008 12 of 33
2009 (Hauck's last class) 11 of 19
2010 (Pflugrad's first class) 3 of 19
2011 11 of 23
2012 (Pflugrad's last class) 7 of 24
2013 (Delaney;s first class) 8 of 24
2014 (Delaney's last class) 12 of 24
2015 (Stitt's first class) 5 of 17
2016 5 of 31

10 would seem to be a normal number of MT recruits for when the Griz were not going through a coaching change where the coach wanted to change the schemes and needed "better" players to fit his scheme.

Excellent research. That's what I was looking for. Thank you for putting that together!

I've got all of this tracked back to 2010. I could give you guys the scholarship players, the preferred walk-ons, and walk-ons who joined the Cats and Griz or another FCS level school each year as well as the ones who went FBS out of high school. They should be included as well as "best players in the state". I can try and put something out this afternoon.

Vim - I really enjoy all that you do for both boards. However, for Christmas, I hope you get a life..... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

 

[VimSince03]

Here is what I have been able to pull from various google searches for UM recruits of Montana kids:

2003 - 2004 19 MT kids from 32 total recruits
2005 11 of 18
2006 8 of 15
2007 7 of ?
2008 12 of 33
2009 (Hauck's last class) 11 of 19
2010 (Pflugrad's first class) 3 of 19
2011 11 of 23
2012 (Pflugrad's last class) 7 of 24
2013 (Delaney;s first class) 8 of 24
2014 (Delaney's last class) 12 of 24
2015 (Stitt's first class) 5 of 17
2016 5 of 31

10 would seem to be a normal number of MT recruits for when the Griz were not going through a coaching change where the coach wanted to change the schemes and needed "better" players to fit his scheme.

Excellent research. That's what I was looking for. Thank you for putting that together!

I've got all of this tracked back to 2010. I could give you guys the scholarship players, the preferred walk-ons, and walk-ons who joined the Cats and Griz or another FCS level school each year as well as the ones who went FBS out of high school. They should be included as well as "best players in the state". I can try and put something out this afternoon.

Vim - I really enjoy all that you do for both boards. However, for Christmas, I hope you get a life..... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

I tracked that thing a year ago. Haven't updated it with 2016 kids yet however. As far as getting a life..."I know what I'm about son."

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_g_8CGcWrI[/youtube]

 

[MTOutsider]

As long as you are making lists.
How many Montana kids go to schools in other states to play? FBS, FCS, etc.

 

[grizpack]

Excellent research. That's what I was looking for. Thank you for putting that together!

I've got all of this tracked back to 2010. I could give you guys the scholarship players, the preferred walk-ons, and walk-ons who joined the Cats and Griz or another FCS level school each year as well as the ones who went FBS out of high school. They should be included as well as "best players in the state". I can try and put something out this afternoon.

Vim - I really enjoy all that you do for both boards. However, for Christmas, I hope you get a life..... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

I tracked that thing a year ago. Haven't updated it with 2016 kids yet however. As far as getting a life..."I know what I'm about son."

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_g_8CGcWrI[/youtube]

:lol: :thumb:

 

[The_Real_Chief]

As long as you are making lists.
How many Montana kids go to schools in other states to play? FBS, FCS, etc.

Are we classifying this by Montana High School kids? Or kids born in Montana? Would an outsider that conceived a child in Whitefish on a ski trip then moved back to another state be considered a Montana kid? What are the parameters here?

 

[Sam A. Blitz]

I have a hard time believing there are more than 10 players in Montana that should be playing at this level.

I don't think there are and 10 might even be too high. But the question will be, which of the Montana kids recruited by UM/State will be the ones that make it at the FCS level. The inexact science of recruiting leads to the fishing net approach for the instate kids.

The fishing net approach goes for both instate and out of state. This class will consist of both, and like in the past, many of both will not end up contributing (as is the norm for any program). The coaches have too much on the line to not be offering kids that give them the best chance to win. The instate are probably a bit easier as you are more likely to get kids under the radar with partial scholarships or as PWO.

Historically, we have had a lot of success with that recruiting approach. Coaches are smart enough to take advantage of that. The argument of recruiting more/less instate vs. out of state, is more for the fans to argue about. Coaches are getting the best players they can for the scholarship money they have available.

Another quick point, the star ratings from the scouting sites have very little merit for the quality of the recruit for the players that get recruited at the FCS level. Most of our best players had very little to no accolades from those sites. Just look at the players we ended up sending to the NFL.

 

[VimSince03]

As long as you are making lists.
How many Montana kids go to schools in other states to play? FBS, FCS, etc.

Are we classifying this by Montana High School kids? Or kids born in Montana? Would an outsider that conceived a child in Whitefish on a ski trip then moved back to another state be considered a Montana kid? What are the parameters here?

Wow

 

[The_Real_Chief]

As long as you are making lists.
How many Montana kids go to schools in other states to play? FBS, FCS, etc.

Are we classifying this by Montana High School kids? Or kids born in Montana? Would an outsider that conceived a child in Whitefish on a ski trip then moved back to another state be considered a Montana kid? What are the parameters here?

Wow

I was also a member of the birther movement...I want birth certificates to prove everything

 

['68griz]

I wish everyone on our team was from Montana, players, coaches, and fans...everyone else can just go back to where they came from

Oh, for gawd's sake, what rock do you live under?

 

[G-BEARS]

Don't you think 20 is unrealistic?

Instead of putting a number on it, actually look at the tape and the player. Some years there could be 20-25. Other years there could be 7-10. So on avearge, it is about 15-20.

What year were there 25? Can you show me a year where there were that many? I honestly haven't kept the stats for myself so don't know the answer to this.

 

[G-BEARS]

Don't you think 20 is unrealistic?

Instead of putting a number on it, actually look at the tape and the player. Some years there could be 20-25. Other years there could be 7-10. So on avearge, it is about 15-20.

What year were there 25? Can you show me a year where there were that many? I honestly haven't kept the stats for myself so don't know the answer to this.

We're not just talking about the size of recruiting classes, but kids who actually show the ability to play at this level during their careers.

 

[The_Real_Chief]

I wish everyone on our team was from Montana, players, coaches, and fans...everyone else can just go back to where they came from

Oh, for gawd's sake, what rock do you live under?

I'm obviously just being sarcastic. I honestly usually cheer for the Montana kids, but this deep dive analysis people do to try and figure out what the ratio per team should be is a bit ridiculous. Bring in the best kids to give us a chance to win, I don't care if they are from Westby MT or Seattle WA.

 

[JDoub]

http://247sports.com/Article/What-states-produce-the-most-NFL-players-37696556
"Some strong per capita states - producing a lot of players without a lot of population - include Mississippi (27 players, 3 million population), Hawaii (11 players 1.4 million population) and Montana (7 players, 1.1 million population)." -that stat is for 2015 NFL rosters

A few years ago when Biermann and Dane Fletcher were still active, the total was 11, which made Montana rank #3 in NFL players produced per capita.

Which is impressive when you consider Montana is not routinely recruited by P5 conferences due to low density of prospects, and consequently don't often get our best kids on FBS/P5 rosters where they have a better chance statistically to develop into NFL talent.

 

[AZGrizFan]

http://247sports.com/Article/What-states-produce-the-most-NFL-players-37696556
"Some strong per capita states - producing a lot of players without a lot of population - include Mississippi (27 players, 3 million population), Hawaii (11 players 1.4 million population) and Montana (7 players, 1.1 million population)." -that stat is for 2015 NFL rosters

A few years ago when Biermann and Dane Fletcher were still active, the total was 11, which made Montana rank #3 in NFL players produced per capita.

Which is impressive when you consider Montana is not routinely recruited by P5 conferences due to low density of prospects, and consequently don't often get our best kids on FBS/P5 rosters where they have a better chance statistically to develop into NFL talent.

Do they? Because of the 11 that were in the NFL, I think 9 of them went to the University of Montana. You can name on one hand the # of Montana-born players in the NFL from FBS/P5 schools in the last 20 years. In fact, pathway to the NFL is SPECIFICALLY why the JC DE transfer picked Montana over some other schools recruiting him.

 

[JDoub]

Do they? Because of the 11 that were in the NFL, I think 9 of them went to the University of Montana. You can name on one hand the # of Montana-born players in the NFL from FBS/P5 schools in the last 20 years. In fact, pathway to the NFL is SPECIFICALLY why the JC DE transfer picked Montana over some other schools recruiting him.

Yes, UM does well developing talent to the NFL comparatively

but I think you missed my point -- the State of Montana is under-recruited by FBS schools as evidenced by one of the highest % per capita for NFL players -- and their main path to the NFL has been through UM. Of those 11, 7 were from UM, 2 from MSU, one from Oregon State and one from Arizona State. What I'm trying to say is that there should be more Montana HS football players moving on to play D1 football than there currently are. There should be more water in the lake so all boats rise higher.

One comment on this thread is that there is not many (10?) Division 1 players in Montana High Schools. I disagree, I think Montana HS players are underrated and consequently fewer of them get the chance to play D1 football, especially out of state. So, UM (and lately MSU) benefit from that.

My son's HS here in Salt Lake City had 7 football players land at D1 FBS schools, and there are 55 D1 players this year coming out of the greater SLC area, an area with about 1.6 million population. I coach here, and I would put up Montana's best 55 players against the Wasatch Front's best 55 and I think they're comparable. (with the exception of the top 3 guys maybe, who really are 5 star). And how many Montana kids are moving on to play D1 football this year? 15-20?

I see 10 kids I've coached play for Utah and BYU, and I'm sure there are 10 kids in Montana that could compete for their roster spots. Some I've seen (like Balue Chapman) from Montana are better than the Utah kids, IMO, but wouldn't get the chance to play anywhere other than UM or MSU.

That said, it's hard for me to agree that UM would be a better path to the NFL than Utah, for example. Cody Barton, one kid I coached, plays for the Utes -- there are at least 5 Montana kids this year that are equivalent players to Cody -- he has a better chance to play in the NFL by playing at Utah than he would have if he played at UM.

 

[AZGrizFan]

Yes, UM does well developing talent to the NFL comparatively

but I think you missed my point -- the State of Montana is under-recruited by FBS schools as evidenced by one of the highest % per capita for NFL players -- and their main path to the NFL has been through UM. Of those 11, 7 were from UM, 2 from MSU, one from Oregon State and one from Arizona State. What I'm trying to say is that there should be more Montana HS football players moving on to play D1 football than there currently are. There should be more water in the lake so all boats rise higher.

Cody Barton, one kid I coached, plays for the Utes -- there are at least 5 Montana kids this year that are equivalent players to Cody -- he has a better chance to play in the NFL by playing at Utah than he would have if he played at UM.

I hear ya, and I agree. But I'm still not certain playing at UM hinders a players ability to make it to the NFL. In fact, many times a player (like, maybe Cody Barton), has to sit for 2-3 years before they get their chance at a school like Utah, whereas in Missoula they can be a 2, 3 or even 4 year starter and get LOTS of PT, building up stats, etc., etc (i.e., Trumaine Johnson).

I do find it odd, however, that of the kids from Montana that DO go to P5 schools, so FEW of them ever make it to the NFL. In fact, Osweiler and the kid from OSU are the only two that I can think of in recent memory. No Miller, no Roderick, etc., etc.

 

[Buttegrizzle]

Overlooked are the numerous UM and MSU walk-ons from Montana high schools. These kids who maybe got NAIA interest but just want to try to live out a dream of playing at a higher level. Just every now and then you get the exceptionally motivated Colt Anderson or Marc Mariani types who rise to the top. I know of a few who right now just want to make the 105 and live the dream. Best of luck to them!