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Letter from O'Day to Students in Kaimin

'68griz said:
Rule, I understand your passion and I applaud it. But, I'm just not that interested in basketball ... never have been, never will be, I guess. We go to a couple Griz/Lady Griz BB games a year, and enjoy ourselves. But, that's enough. I always hope the Griz win, and I even occasionally listen to a game on the radio (always watch if on TV), but that's as involved as I can get in a basketball season. Football ... that's a totally different story. We plan our fall around the Griz games, and wouldn't have it any other way.

We're simply not "basketball fans." I don't think that makes us "bad fans."
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That my man is exactly why I used the term "true griz football fans". Nowhere in there did I call football fans only bad fans. Reread my post that is exactly how I termed it. Yes, I have, am, and will continue to knock GRIZNATION for the lack of basketball support. I feel it is a shame, especially so after football season when the GRIZ are the only ticket in town. I understand supporting a son or daughter in their HS events. Even then there is so many more fans that can show up.

I am even more disappointed in student participitation. In the past, Missoula has proven it can fill the house. We have more people there than then. There has not been any other things added to the community to prevent turnout.

Win or lose, the GRIZ are now playing exciting, fun to watch basketball. They have a great inside scorer in Strait, a versatile scorer in Hasquet, a great perimeter shooter in Staudacher, do or die players in Martin and Rundles, good paint defender in Qvale, a well rounded pass 1st, heady pg in CET.

The inconsistent play has turned more toward consistent the past 6 weeks. They are no longer playing "milk the shotclock" basketball other than when called for it. The best thing Tinkle has done this year, is give these guys more freedom to get better shots with better ball movement and more screens for the likes of Staudacher, Martin, and Hasquet.

I really do wonder how many in GRIZNATION choose to go to the bars over attending a game? Why not attend the game, then start drinking around 9 PM? By GRIZ terms and expectation, we as a fan base are disappointing and letting our University down as a whole. God knows we fans bitch about them letting us down more often than not. Here the shoe is on the other foot, yet it is reality, and I for one am very disappointed in how GRIZNATION supports basketball. It is very disheartening and frustrating from this fans point of view.
 
I thought this was the year it would all be different. I told Swilly and others that similar efforts were made in my day, only to be rendered ineffective when the ones making the efforts lost interest. He, and others, assured me that 'No way, this year is waaaaaay different.' This year is the exact same (result anyway).

The ONLY way to get students to come to the games is to have an exciting team that wins games. Run and gun; shoot a ton of 3s; whatever it takes to at least be exciting. When kids can watch an exciting Pac-10 matchup on HD in their dorm room, it's tough to lure them to a UM game against Northern Colorado. Not saying it's right, or that's what I did, just saying it's what I've seen.

UM has the students (13,000?); the venue (8500?); and the strong athletic dept. Hate to bring up GU, but a lot of people even think the BSC is as good as the WCC. On a January/February night in Missoula, there is MUCH less going on than in Spokane. So, UM is as good or better than GU in terms of infrastucture in almost every department except for the one that actually drives attendance.

People will pay to sit on a five gallon bucket at the city park to watch an exciting team on a winning streak.
 
Well I might eat my words on this but I will predict the Griz Basketball team and Griz Nation will turn out if not next year but the following year especially if the students get the rightful seats back!!! I follow both sports & Love each equally. I attend all football games and most Basketball games (unless working late). Let me tell you now folks Griz Basketball is going to be exciting & fun to be a part of!!! The first step is getting the students back where they belong!!! If that happens the rest will follow!!! :twocents:
 
100%GRIZ said:
Well I might eat my words on this but I will predict the Griz Basketball team and Griz Nation will turn out if not next year but the following year especially if the students get the rightful seats back!!! I follow both sports & Love each equally. I attend all football games and most Basketball games (unless working late). Let me tell you now folks Griz Basketball is going to be exciting & fun to be a part of!!! The first step is getting the students back where they belong!!! If that happens the rest will follow!!! :twocents:
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Yeah, that's what I thought following '05... "The fans will come out following a tourney bid and win... if not then, they'll be out in '07-08 for sure for Matt and Drew's senior year... we'll be unstoppable then!"

Now I'll be a senior next year and things have almost gone the other way.
 
As far as student attendance, i think we have definitely made a step forward. As a freshman last year, i attended most of the games and coming from a pretty rowdy highschool basketball program, the Griz games were pretty boring. The section was half full and most people remained sitting down (seemed like a Sonics game. Anyways, this season it seems like the student section is pretty full and there are quite a few, if not all, standing up. Maybe in a few years, we can get our numbers back up and move back to the east side. But for now, lets notice the small things that have improved.
 
Hey Jim, this is not rocket science. Give us a winning team and attendance would not be an issue. I like Wayne Tinkle but this should not be a surprise to an AD. Win or move on.

If the Griz were winning like they should be, attendance would not be an issue. Kick Wayne in the Butt and lets win the tournament!!!!!!!
 
argh! said:
for some strange reason, this thread makes me wonder: what ever happened to nate schweber?
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Had heard he went to NYC and disowned any notion of the dancing fool he was in Missoula.
 
mtgrizrule said:
'68griz said:
Rule, I understand your passion and I applaud it. But, I'm just not that interested in basketball ... never have been, never will be, I guess. We go to a couple Griz/Lady Griz BB games a year, and enjoy ourselves. But, that's enough. I always hope the Griz win, and I even occasionally listen to a game on the radio (always watch if on TV), but that's as involved as I can get in a basketball season. Football ... that's a totally different story. We plan our fall around the Griz games, and wouldn't have it any other way.

We're simply not "basketball fans." I don't think that makes us "bad fans."
Click to expand...

That my man is exactly why I used the term "true griz football fans". Nowhere in there did I call football fans only bad fans. Reread my post that is exactly how I termed it. Yes, I have, am, and will continue to knock GRIZNATION for the lack of basketball support. I feel it is a shame, especially so after football season when the GRIZ are the only ticket in town. I understand supporting a son or daughter in their HS events. Even then there is so many more fans that can show up.

I am even more disappointed in student participitation. In the past, Missoula has proven it can fill the house. We have more people there than then. There has not been any other things added to the community to prevent turnout.

Win or lose, the GRIZ are now playing exciting, fun to watch basketball. They have a great inside scorer in Strait, a versatile scorer in Hasquet, a great perimeter shooter in Staudacher, do or die players in Martin and Rundles, good paint defender in Qvale, a well rounded pass 1st, heady pg in CET.

The inconsistent play has turned more toward consistent the past 6 weeks. They are no longer playing "milk the shotclock" basketball other than when called for it. The best thing Tinkle has done this year, is give these guys more freedom to get better shots with better ball movement and more screens for the likes of Staudacher, Martin, and Hasquet.

I really do wonder how many in GRIZNATION choose to go to the bars over attending a game? Why not attend the game, then start drinking around 9 PM? By GRIZ terms and expectation, we as a fan base are disappointing and letting our University down as a whole. God knows we fans bitch about them letting us down more often than not. Here the shoe is on the other foot, yet it is reality, and I for one am very disappointed in how GRIZNATION supports basketball. It is very disheartening and frustrating from this fans point of view.
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Then why doesn't the University of Miami have an elite 8 caliber BBall team? Why doesn't Pittsburgh have an NBA team when they so passionately support their football and hockey teams? Why is USC barely on the college basketball radar?

I think that some sports are just ingrained in the culture of the city. Having a dominant program in one sport doesn't mean that support and passion will carry over to other sports. :twocents:
 
CDAGRIZ said:
UM has the students (13,000?); the venue (8500?); and the strong athletic dept. Hate to bring up GU, but a lot of people even think the BSC is as good as the WCC. On a January/February night in Missoula, there is MUCH less going on than in Spokane. So, UM is as good or better than GU in terms of infrastucture in almost every department except for the one that actually drives attendance.
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WCC may put three teams in the NCAA this year. sorry BSC is not close this year but a long shot.
 
GrizRanger said:
Hey Jim, this is not rocket science. Give us a winning team and attendance would not be an issue. I like Wayne Tinkle but this should not be a surprise to an AD. Win or move on.

If the Griz were winning like they should be, attendance would not be an issue. Kick Wayne in the Butt and lets win the tournament!!!!!!!
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Christ sakes, did LK not do that? Yet his 2nd year as coach attendance still stunk. The exceptions being the Stanford game, Milwaukee Wisconsin, and the CATS.

It seems to me the fans want it both ways here. They do not support the team like they should, yet still bitch when they do not win, and think they have all the say in the world. Being this is a football school and the basketball does not mean much, then why in the hell should the coach be expected to win? Even when winning this program is not supported.

As things look I think the teams average performance matches our average at best fan support for basketball. It is amazing how a fan base can expect W's, but the program cannot have equal fan expectations. I guess the majority of Tinkle bashers probably very seldom attend a game.

I just think some on here do more complaining than supporting. If you cannot attend a game then keep your damn mouth shut, you have no right to have any say in the coaching. You do not care enough to support the team, why do you think you should care enough to complain?

Seriously, thank you to all those that do support basketball. :thumb: :thumb:
 
billings_poke said:
CDAGRIZ said:
UM has the students (13,000?); the venue (8500?); and the strong athletic dept. Hate to bring up GU, but a lot of people even think the BSC is as good as the WCC. On a January/February night in Missoula, there is MUCH less going on than in Spokane. So, UM is as good or better than GU in terms of infrastucture in almost every department except for the one that actually drives attendance.
Click to expand...

WCC may put three teams in the NCAA this year. sorry BSC is not close this year but a long shot.
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The fact that their conference leader got beat by MSU this season and UM last year makes me wonder why we're not in that league.
 
Home loses to Weber, ISU and NAU. Is a bit too much to overcome.

I continue to attend because Andrew Strait continues to show up.
 
It is clear from the tone of O'Days letter that the decision is already made. No change back will happen.

It is unfortunate for the students and team that the old rich guys who occasionally attend the games get the prime seats. In the big sceme of things, their season tickets are a small drop in the bucket of financing an athletic department. The students pay thousands in tuition, books and fees over the course of their stay. Having prime seats for D1 basketball should be part of the students package in their college experience. O'day shows a serious deficiency in long range vision in chasing the money of the old rich guys. Those people will show up no matter where their seats are. Why not increase/double the price of the seats behind the benches as see who is willing to pay?

It takes time to bring that culture back that we had from the 70's-90's. The philosophy of placing the buggy before the horse is stupid. "We need more students to show up and then we'll consider making a move"

O'Day has already decided to take the easy way out, to the detriment of students, players, recruiting, coaches, and the program.
 
this thread contains a lot of fodder for an excellent rebuttal to o'day.

i'm not going to step out of the argh! persona to write it - but somebody ought to!
 
That game with the students sitting where they should be was great. the environment was great and can't think of anyone who didn't think it was great. If they kept it that way, the fans would come, and I am sure the Griz BB team would have won more games.

But, O'day isn't the business man we need to turn the Basketball game around. He is too filled with greed for the richer season ticket holder whether they come to the games at all, which in turn hurts the game environment which in turn hurts ticket sales with in turn hurts making more money and that effects growth of the BB team and attracting larger crowds, and attracting the students.

Where I sit, there are three seats that have gone empty for all but maybe three games this season. Maybe just two game someone sat in them. One of those games was against Northern Colorado this past thursday. I thought maybe nobody bought those seats for the season. But, one of the guys mentioned the season ticket holders that had those seats, but I had to tell him, the season ticket holder rarely if ever used the seats as they have been empty for just about every game this year. Should have mentioned to him they have been pretty much empty since the remodel. I told the guy the season ticket holder should just give the tickets to him.

But, as with the three seats going unused next to me, it is the same situation throughout the arena. Seats going empty even though they maybe added in the attendance due to being sold to ticket holders that never show up. Creates a lousy environment for both fans and players, and is nearly impossible to attract more fans because the environment makes the game boring.

But, that game where the students got to sit on the east lower level was not boring at all. That is where they need to be. O'Day's ultimatum was doomed to failure because of greed. After that one game test, the students showed up, but the games just weren't that exciting because of so many empty seats of no show season ticket holders.

The real test is to give the students the east lower level for all the games during school session next year. That would be the best test.
 
Also, I think maybe they should do a study on who actually comes to the games. Maybe look around you, check the age of the fans. Because of the smaller student crowds since remodel, the average age of fans at Griz basketball games I would say has been increasing.

Because the ever shrinking attendance by students each year (it sure seems to be shrinking this year with each game), there will likely follow with future years with fewer young fans. Thus, average age increasing.

At some point, it could be games played in a stadium half filled up with grouchy old men that come just to scream at the refs.

O'Day, you have to do better than what you have been doing to get the students back. What your doing now is not the right way of doing it. Give them back the seats for one season in the game during school session. Or, It appears to me, future years will be played in front of grouchy old men that just come to scream at the refs. Your selling off our future generation fans because of greed for the Season Ticket holder money who never show for games.
 
I agree that the students belonging there, and hope the university figures out something to make everyone happy. With that said, I totally disagree with the claim of O'day being greedy. I have known the O'day family for going on 10 years, including coaching one of their boys, and getting to know this family away from the University. They are a very good family with values. Professionally, Jim is a guy that takes time to get to know anyone. Greedy is NOT one of the traits I would label Jim or any of his family. If it is coming off that way, it is from the decision makers beyond him. GREEDY, is not O'day.
 
How can the AD displace season ticket holders, most of whom are longtime ticket holders and many of whom are the program's best supporters (financially and otherwise), when the students have had terrible attendance other than for CSU?

I just don't see how it can be done, unless perhaps a section near one end can be carved out and/or reconfigured for students--thus minimizing the impact on lower level season ticket holders.

The student section has continued to be weak this year, and the overall crowd has also been weak.

I suppose there may be some chicken and egg arguments here, but I don't see how a large student section can be created on the side at this time.

I think the long press table gets in the way and distracts from the atmosphere too, as it blocks off the crowd a bit from the action.
 
PlayerRep said:
How can the AD displace season ticket holders, most of whom are longtime ticket holders and many of whom are the program's best supporters (financially and otherwise), when the students have had terrible attendance other than for CSU?

I just don't see how it can be done, unless perhaps a section near one end can be carved out and/or reconfigured for students--thus minimizing the impact on lower level season ticket holders.

The student section has continued to be weak this year, and the overall crowd has also been weak.

I suppose there may be some chicken and egg arguments here, but I don't see how a large student section can be created on the side at this time.

I think the long press table gets in the way and distracts from the atmosphere too, as it blocks off the crowd a bit from the action.
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I guess if some of those fans like the season tickets holders that have the seats next to me that never use the seats at all start screaming bloody murder over losing them, then I guess I just won't care about how they feel at all about losing their seats.

It is obviously going to be a very tough thing to do.

That one game was a good experiment, but the way I figure they would have to do is start out small. Give the students sections 110 and 111. I think the students already sit in 111. I know section 101 on west side is student seating. Section 110 is east side on north side of the half court line, and section 111 is obviously next to it, but is a very small end section, just like section 101. Students can still sit in north side behind basket.

South side behind basket goes to season ticket holders like it is at Lady Griz games.

Press table can be moved more in front of the season ticket holders.
 
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