Lady Griz need to recruit some athletes

[argh!]

I'm not disagreeing with anyone's argument about where/if UM should be conference-wise or with recruiting ... I just want to know where the money for any big changes would come from?

Me too - this, to me, seems to be the biggest reason why we don't move. If we can't win in the big dance with the athletes and resources we have now, what will make that any different if we move to the WAC/MWC/etc? We will still have the same resources and recruiting base, no? It seems the only difference would be less auto-bids into the national tourney.

What?????

I know that nothing is guaranteed, but the Griz being in the WAC or MWC would, sooner rather than later, bring bigger revenues in hoops, thanks to the chance of bigger crowds than can fit in the preponderantly dinky BSC gyms. Also, wouldn't TV revenues rise? It isn't hard to beat the current 'none'. Moreover, UM's recruiting base would indeed increase, because they'd have a chance at guys who at this point in time immediately dismiss the notion of playing for the Griz because it would mean playing in the pathetic Big Sky Conference. And "less autobids"??? Maybe, but there would also be an increased chance of being the second or third team from the conference to be invited. And now, before someone writes yet again that the WAC was worse than the BSC in hoops this year, answer me this: which conference has the greater POTENTIAL to edge towards a degree of parity with the "elites" of college basketball? The Big Sky or the WAC? Or, maybe a better question would be "which conference has NO potential to edge towards parity with the "elites" of college basketball"?

In other words, what you say can be refuted on many levels, if one is willing to engage in a modest amount of open-minded thought.

 

[UMclassof2002]

I'm not disagreeing with anyone's argument about where/if UM should be conference-wise or with recruiting ... I just want to know where the money for any big changes would come from?

Me too - this, to me, seems to be the biggest reason why we don't move. If we can't win in the big dance with the athletes and resources we have now, what will make that any different if we move to the WAC/MWC/etc? We will still have the same resources and recruiting base, no? It seems the only difference would be less auto-bids into the national tourney.

What?????

I know that nothing is guaranteed, but the Griz being in the WAC or MWC would, sooner rather than later, bring bigger revenues in hoops, thanks to the chance of bigger crowds than can fit in the preponderantly dinky BSC gyms. Also, wouldn't TV revenues rise? It isn't hard to beat the current 'none'. Moreover, UM's recruiting base would indeed increase, because they'd have a chance at guys who at this point in time immediately dismiss the notion of playing for the Griz because it would mean playing in the pathetic Big Sky Conference. And "less autobids"??? Maybe, but there would also be an increased chance of being the second or third team from the conference to be invited. And now, before someone writes yet again that the WAC was worse than the BSC in hoops this year, answer me this: which conference has the greater POTENTIAL to edge towards a degree of parity with the "elites" of college basketball? The Big Sky or the WAC? Or, maybe a better question would be "which conference has NO potential to edge towards parity with the "elites" of college basketball"?

In other words, what you say can be refuted on many levels, if one is willing to engage in a modest amount of open-minded thought.

Fair enough - good points. I'm just asking the questions because I don't have, and don't pretend to have, the answers. I know very little about the revenue generating aspects of running an athletic department. (edit) And, for the record, I would love to see the Griz compete at a higher level. I would just want to make sure that we weren't doomed to failed based on economic/population/geographic factors.


As an aside - Is there some deep seeded beef you have with me that I don't know about that causes you to fly off the handle any time I ask a question? It takes away dramatically from an otherwise well reasoned and articulated POV.

 

[GrizBBIsKing]

I'm not disagreeing with anyone's argument about where/if UM should be conference-wise or with recruiting ... I just want to know where the money for any big changes would come from?

Me too - this, to me, seems to be the biggest reason why we don't move. If we can't win in the big dance with the athletes and resources we have now, what will make that any different if we move to the WAC/MWC/etc? We will still have the same resources and recruiting base, no? It seems the only difference would be less auto-bids into the national tourney.

What?????

I know that nothing is guaranteed, but the Griz being in the WAC or MWC would, sooner rather than later, bring bigger revenues in hoops, thanks to the chance of bigger crowds than can fit in the preponderantly dinky BSC gyms. Also, wouldn't TV revenues rise? It isn't hard to beat the current 'none'. Moreover, UM's recruiting base would indeed increase, because they'd have a chance at guys who at this point in time immediately dismiss the notion of playing for the Griz because it would mean playing in the pathetic Big Sky Conference. And "less autobids"??? Maybe, but there would also be an increased chance of being the second or third team from the conference to be invited. And now, before someone writes yet again that the WAC was worse than the BSC in hoops this year, answer me this: which conference has the greater POTENTIAL to edge towards a degree of parity with the "elites" of college basketball? The Big Sky or the WAC? Or, maybe a better question would be "which conference has NO potential to edge towards parity with the "elites" of college basketball"?

In other words, what you say can be refuted on many levels, if one is willing to engage in a modest amount of open-minded thought.

WAC in women's basketball is a one bid conference. Maybe in men's basketball, there could be a greater chance of more than 1 bid. Plus, most of the revenue comes from football and men's basketball, which ends up in the football coffers and mens basketball. So, just for men's sports, I could see Griz benefiting from moving to the WAC. I just don't see it for the Lady Griz.

Plus, considering the Griz is primarily a football school, and football is the most expensive sport, most or all the extra revenue that would come from being in the WAC from TV revenue, bowl money would go right back into the football program OR WORSE YET, into the University General fund and athletic department to get a percentage of it just like the concessions revenue.

I figure no matter what, fans are going to bitch and moan no matter what the University does.

 

[ronangrizfan]

Just like in football, the rest of the conference/world has caught up with us and/or passed us by.

Ali won't save the LG. Just as Mandy hasn't. Deal with it.

 

[citygriz]

hihglight of this thread--other than argh!'s post--is the thread itself. i mean, how many times have the lady griz been thumped at the big dance by better teams...georgia, vandy, florida, utah last year in the w.n.i.t.--with hardly a peep from the faithful. years ago there was one lone voice crying out amid outright prolonged derision for an "inner city point" guard and a move up to a better conference, and now the faithful be clamoring for "better athletes" (code words understood) and a move up to a better conference. hah!

 

[argh!]

As an aside - Is there some deep seeded beef you have with me that I don't know about that causes you to fly off the handle any time I ask a question? It takes away dramatically from an otherwise well reasoned and articulated POV.

i have no beef with you. argh!, on the other hand, seems to have a beef with everyone. the response i wrote was aimed at a 'more general audience' - the "can't do" crowd. i apologize if i came off as attacking you in the one post in which i decided to try and make a little bit of sense. heck, i even used OK punctuation!

 

[grizpack]

argh! had a good post. And I agree with it mostly.

However, I can tell you one of the primary issues is the "start up" costs to move up. In other words, the costs to add the necessary sports, scholarships, etc., right off the bat. That is a big number. I can't remember what it is, but it was in the millions, last time I heard.

Those costs have to be paid right up front. And while there may be bigger revenue up front, you would have to find a way to pay it now. I am pretty sure the Regents would have a problem with that.

Finally, again, while there are bigger revenues down the road (hopefully), the sports that would be added would be basically non-revenue generating. Likely things like softball, gymnastics, etc. The increased revenues would be necessary to fund these sports and scholarships before we saw any benefit.

Just my :twocents:

 

[Spanky]

Currently, the problem isn't with The Board Of Regents. It is with Dennison as he refuses to request a feasibility study of a possible conference change.

 

[bigtyme]

Currently, the problem isn't with The Board Of Regents. It is with Dennison as he refuses to request a feasibility study of a possible conference change.

With the quality business school in Missoula I would think that someone would be willing to do a feasibility study just for the simple fact it would shut some people up, either way! Of course, they would have to be neutral of either option, so going outside of Missoula may be the only realistic way to get it done. Just by using the 10 or so schools in the last 10 years that have moved up may give someone a good start.

 

[LAGriz67]

All this negative talk, not to mention disgusting racism is really a downer....I was under the impression the LADY GRIZ had a great season...once again. Just like the men's football...UM produces winners....All the emphasis on being the winner of a "championship game" detracts from the very reason for existence of college sports in the first place...There is little wrong with Montana and the Big Sky.....for most people, anyway....so the athletes UM presents to the world don't win all the games....so what.?"...it is rare when I am embarrassed by them....it has happened..but then, as a grad student at Stanford, I also saw blowouts for the home team...not to mention my stint at Oklahoma....trust me, OU has been routed in football....yup..it's true....tomorrow is another day....so get over it...and drop the racist crap!

 

[JP]

:thumb:

 

[grizpack]

It is my understanding that Hogan actually did a feasibility study when he was here. I am pretty sure that it is updated on a fairly regular basis, so the administration knows what it would take.

However, Spanky is correct in that any move would not occur until after Dennison is gone.

 

[BWahlberg]

All this negative talk, not to mention disgusting racism is really a downer....I was under the impression the LADY GRIZ had a great season...once again. Just like the men's football...UM produces winners....All the emphasis on being the winner of a "championship game" detracts from the very reason for existence of college sports in the first place...There is little wrong with Montana and the Big Sky.....for most people, anyway....so the athletes UM presents to the world don't win all the games....so what.?"...it is rare when I am embarrassed by them....it has happened..but then, as a grad student at Stanford, I also saw blowouts for the home team...not to mention my stint at Oklahoma....trust me, OU has been routed in football....yup..it's true....tomorrow is another day....so get over it...and drop the racist crap!

:clap: :clap:

 

[GrizBBIsKing]

It is my understanding that Hogan actually did a feasibility study when he was here. I am pretty sure that it is updated on a fairly regular basis, so the administration knows what it would take.

However, Spanky is correct in that any move would not occur until after Dennison is gone.

Hogan was quoted in the Missoulian it would take around $5 Million to move up to 1A and still remain competitive.

 

['68griz]

And that was a few years back. I would imagine that the dollar amount has increased considerably (along with everything else that costs money these days).

 

[bigtyme]

All this negative talk, not to mention disgusting racism is really a downer....I was under the impression the LADY GRIZ had a great season...once again. Just like the men's football...UM produces winners....All the emphasis on being the winner of a "championship game" detracts from the very reason for existence of college sports in the first place...There is little wrong with Montana and the Big Sky.....for most people, anyway....so the athletes UM presents to the world don't win all the games....so what.?"...it is rare when I am embarrassed by them....it has happened..but then, as a grad student at Stanford, I also saw blowouts for the home team...not to mention my stint at Oklahoma....trust me, OU has been routed in football....yup..it's true....tomorrow is another day....so get over it...and drop the racist crap!

Did I miss something?

 

[Spanky]

GrizPack....you may be correct about Hogan doing a feasibility study, however, the current Regents haven't seen it if that is the case. The request for a study has to come from Dennison to the Regents and he won't do it as his view is that The Big Sky Conference serves the needs of UM.

 

[UMclassof2002]

I've always wondered - does anyone know how old Dennison is? It doesn't look like he's aged a day since I first set foot on campus almost a decade ago.

 

[fanofzoo]

I want to win or even lose with the ladies from Malta, Whitefish, Gardiner, Lewistown, Seeley Lake and Billings than to get everybody from out of state. This is what the crowd loves , seeing the kids from in state do very well.

 

[Silvertip]

I want to win or even lose with the ladies from Malta, Whitefish, Gardiner, Lewistown, Seeley Lake and Billings than to get everybody from out of state. This is what the crowd loves , seeing the kids from in state do very well.

News Flash! Griz athletics do not exist to serve as an entitlement work program for Montana kids!?!? For those, such as yourself, so enamored with this haywire idea I suggest you become totally engaged with your local high school programs. They're ALL Montana kids! Then consider Griz athletic teams populated by the best athletes from Malta, Whitefish,etc. How do you think they would do in time in a BSC already largely populated by second tier teams - that would continue to recruit in and out of state?

If that"is what the crowd loves" I suspect in short order you would become a majority of one. Enjoy.

(This goes in my file with the "...yeah, but look at the Vandals")