Get Rid of Engstrom!

[bpcats]

This situation is eerily close to what happened at MSU...the main difference was that our AD threw our Coach in front of the bus before it ran them both over.

It seems to me that the Athletic Director has to set the standards for recruiting, punishments (working with Coach on expectations) etc. My impression about this whole deal was that O'Day and Pflugrad were caught off guard a little bit on how to handle what they should and shouldn't do and what the appropriate response should be. It sounded like they were moving in the right direction but it was too little too late according to Engstrom.

The only thing I can think of is that if they had been more strict up front and not apply kid gloves approach to punishments, etc then they still may be working.

I think either way O'Day is probably gone for good because he set the boundaries for Athletics. Coach Pflugrad may have a strong case to retain his job. Both are good men that got caught up in stuff out of their control.

Hope for the best for both them and the Griz programs.

I do know that no matter who is coach the Griz next year that there is enough talent on that team to make a push for a national championship game even if you end up changing schemes on both sides of the ball.

 

[ranco]

It seems pretty clear that ole Royce likely decided to fire these guys on a whim. He had no post firing game plan, he never consulted with his staff (perhaps not even with the regents), and his post fireing statements show he likely never consulted with legal counsel either. His decision will cost the UM a lot of money, both in terms of payments to PFlu and O'day and loss of booster money. Engstrom's blundered handling of this matter llustrates that he is inept to be president. He should resign or be fired.

 

[mtgrizrule]

I posted the majority of this on another thread, just adding in everyone on the Fire Engstrom band wagon. Here it is.

TG, out of curiosity, why are you so extreme on this one? Pretty unlike you to go extreme before knowing all the details. I have been told, if Engstrom were to say much more than he did, or get to more specifics too early, U of M would have a much larger settlement to address. Also, my uncle pointed out to me, with all the legal trouble a few players are going through right now, prosecution, and defending lawyers are building cases, and saying much more could have jeopardized some legal court proceedings. My uncle would not be surprised he had to protect the best interest of the U of M due to pending criminal cases against player(s), and possible civil cases as a result of what transpired.

He, and a few others, feel the U of M will reveal more details, depending on the outcome of cases, and court proceedings. Rest assured, any and every thing said by anyone tied the university only be after legal counsel. This could take a few years before the public knows everything the school, and individuals choose to divulge.

I admit, I was pissed hearing O'day had been let go. I consider him a friend. I am just praying something better comes along for him, and GRIZ athletics get through this in a better position than before . Honestly, how long has the public, locally, regionally, and nationally been questioning, when will something be done? Will the U of M ever make a standt, with impact, against the criminal element that crept into this program through a few coaches.

Like Dave Dickenson looks at it, at the professional level, you can cut players. At the collegiate level, it is not so easy, and someone has to be held accountable. Granted, Engstrom took a a few steps back in my mind over the recent few months, but he did inherit a football program heading in the wrong direction, off the field. As for the student that managed to get off campus and get back home, I agree, it is bad the guy got away with whatever he did, without facing the music. However, the asshole is far away form Missoula now, and will never harm another woman there again. He will face the music, whenever, and where ever he is caught. One strike against a president that inherited what he did, does not deserve losing his job. At least not at this stage, when the general public does not, and may not know all the details for quite some time.

As for me, I am relieved the GRIZ are back on another road, even if we have some construction delays to work around. Just as I have learned to do with our athletes, I am giving Engstrom the benefit of the doubt on this as well. Fair is Fair.

 

[Tokyogriz]

A group called Demand Answers on facebook is worth looking up if you feel the people of Montana and UM alumns and students are owed a honest explanation for these firings.

Continue to call and pressure state representatives, the BORS, missoulas mayor should get an earful as well due to his public support of Royce.

If you truely believe Oday needed to go there is no reason to not say Royce Engstrom needs to be burned at the stake as well. Multiple publicized rapes involving non athlete students happend and were unprosecuted under Royce Engstroms leadership at UM. Royce Needs to be thrown in the fire as well.

 

[Grizmayor]

It seems pretty clear that ole Royce likely decided to fire these guys on a whim. He had no post firing game plan, he never consulted with his staff (perhaps not even with the regents), and his post fireing statements show he likely never consulted with legal counsel either. His decision will cost the UM a lot of money, both in terms of payments to PFlu and O'day and loss of booster money. Engstrom's blundered handling of this matter llustrates that he is inept to be president. He should resign or be fired.

JCU... is this you??? From the weird assumptions, my guess is YES.

 

[Moose Pojansky]

For most intelligent people the "explanation" was crime after crime after crime committed by our football program for the last decade.

That really is all anyone needs to know.

To some intelligent people a crime has not been committed until a jury says 'guilty'. Apparently the arena of sexual based offenses, hysteria and public opinion carry the day. All I have seen is a lot of accusations flying around supported by little facts. Saying a crime has been committed by someone that hasn't been prosecuted is a load of crap.

This is a chicken shit firing decision based on known facts. The only thing that makes sense is if the administration is trying to get ahead of the story that is still developing and due to get uglier.

 

[Griz Time]

I'm not looking an eye for an eye. I just honestly think that since Oday and Pflu didn't do enough, neither did Engstrom. The guy also needs to go. Some one needs to write a letter to the regents.

 

[Hammer]

I'm not looking an eye for an eye. I just honestly think that since Oday and Pflu didn't do enough, neither did Engstrom. The guy also needs to go. Some one needs to write a letter to the regents.

hell yeah!!! :thumb:

 

[yakgriz]

In my opinion it wasn't the Board of Regents, so much as Clay Christian...interesting...he has some very strong opinions in regards to the University of Montana...maybe people should be calling him as well...he seems to have "the answer" everyone is looking for.

 

[wbtfg]

In my opinion it wasn't the Board of Regents, so much as Clay Christian...interesting...he has some very strong opinions in regards to the University of Montana...maybe people should be calling him as well...he seems to have "the answer" everyone is looking for.

Wondering why you think that. Has he made a statement to the media?

 

[Washgrizfan1]

In my opinion it wasn't the Board of Regents, so much as Clay Christian...interesting...he has some very strong opinions in regards to the University of Montana...maybe people should be calling him as well...he seems to have "the answer" everyone is looking for.

Engstrom had discussions with Christian, Pat Williams, Lopatch, Gee and legal counsel.

 

[GrizRanger]

For most intelligent people the "explanation" was crime after crime after crime committed by our football program for the last decade.

That really is all anyone needs to know.

To some intelligent people a crime has not been committed until a jury says 'guilty'. Apparently the arena of sexual based offenses, hysteria and public opinion carry the day. All I have seen is a lot of accusations flying around supported by little facts. Saying a crime has been committed by someone that hasn't been prosecuted is a load of crap.

This is a chicken shit firing decision based on known facts. The only thing that makes sense is if the administration is trying to get ahead of the story that is still developing and due to get uglier.

If you have any doubts about what side to take on this matter, you can be sure that going against this drunken hypocrite, troll and sociopath, alfalfa is the correct path to take.

Pflugrad and O'Day were unfairly treated by a University President trying to take attention away from his own poor management. I won't be attending Griz games while Engstrom remains as President.

 

[MooUBaby]

What happens if in a few weeks some new information comes out that proves the firing of the AD and coach was the absolute right decision. Will some of you swallow the pride and admit your over reaction. Interested if hammer would be capable of that.

 

[tickle]

For most intelligent people the "explanation" was crime after crime after crime committed by our football program for the last decade.

That really is all anyone needs to know.

To some intelligent people a crime has not been committed until a jury says 'guilty'. Apparently the arena of sexual based offenses, hysteria and public opinion carry the day. All I have seen is a lot of accusations flying around supported by little facts. Saying a crime has been committed by someone that hasn't been prosecuted is a load of crap.

This is a chicken shit firing decision based on known facts. The only thing that makes sense is if the administration is trying to get ahead of the story that is still developing and due to get uglier.

If you have any doubts about what side to take on this matter, you can be sure that going against this drunken hypocrite, troll and sociopath, alfalfa is the correct path to take.

Pflugrad and O'Day were unfairly treated by a University President trying to take attention away from his own poor management. I won't be attending Griz games while Engstrom remains as President.

sounds to me like you need a drink, i know just the thing to fix yur reality

 

[PlayerRep]

Did UM or Engstrom ever comment on or explain the allegation by an accuser in the Dec. 2011 rape situation, i.e. the one that started the Barz independent counsel investigation, where the accuser told Barz that she wouldn't talk to UM or Barz because UM had disclosed her name to the media. This is the one where the Missoulian contacted her. The accuser then stopped talking to UM or anyone, it appears.

If this allegation was true, then UM's performance was awful, and heads should have rolled. This would have been a clear legal violation.

If this was explained somewhere, please call it to our attention--as I missed.

 

[moose/squirrel]

MR. Royce has even more on his agenda, so far only banning alchohol from few selected campus events, but eliminating it from tailgating is not far down the road....

THAT would be killing the goose that lays the golden egg. I don't think he's that stupid.

Ya think and yeah this Engstrom Dbag will put this on the table. He doesn't care about athletics

 

[Grizzoola]

Engstrom will not be fired. Rightfully so. He finally called a spade a spade. Not just the Griz football program, but the entire culture of the UM campus. These were getting onto a side track re: sexual assaults, misconducts of various kinds, not only by football players, but other students. UM was, WAS, mind you, getting into a pr disaster situation: What parent would want their daughter to attend UM?

Someone had to get the UM train back on its main track: educating young people for professional positions in American society and to contribute to the advancement of knowledge. In reality, UM athletic programs are a sideshow of what UM is all about. It's difficult for most eGrizzers to comprehend that. I'll admit, the tail DOES wag the dog, or it appears to. IF it does, that's why Engstrom had to do what he did.

As I heard ("heard" is hearsay), O'Day was asked to fire Pflu. O'Day refused, so O'Day was fired, too. Whatever. The point is Engstrom took courageous action. From this time on, students, athletes, coaches, whomever connected to UM is in jeopardy of their positions if they cause...just cause...embarrassment to UM. To my mind, Engstrom has sent a message: It does not matter whether or not you are charged, it's a misdemeanor, felony, whatever; whether or not it's in the press, ANY violation of the student conduct codes is grounds for POSSIBLE dismissal from UM.

Plus, no more of this shilly-shally by coaches, ADs, etc. A college pres. has more things to worry about. Maybe, finally, UM will cast off decades of nonsense re: Griz football, wipe the slate clean, and have a school and football program unscathed by bad pr. It's too bad Pflu & O'Day took the bullet. It's too bad it had to come to this, but come it did. I support Pres. Engstrom in what he did. I don't like it, but it had to be done. GO GRIZZZ!!!

 

[Tokyogriz]

Theres a young man in Saudi Arabia that completly agrees with you.

 

[Grizzoola]

Look, Tokyo, you above all others on this board should be aware of international protocols. My sense is, is that situation was between Saudi students. Nothing has been said re: the nationality of the victims. My sense is that they were Saudis, as well. I believe there are protocols between not only UM, but also between the U.S. State Dept. & the Saudi government. I believe UM followed the protocols in this case, as it was bound to.

I do not envy the treatment the offender will get back in Saudi Arabia. I do not know the Saudi justice system that well, but I'm sure he will get punishment for besmirching his country, for violating its trust in him to conduct himself well in another country. We will never know the full details of this situation, but I stand by my perceptions, howsomever they may be incorrect.