Feds to Begin Investigation

[Tokyogriz]

Hopefully Royce Engstrom gets shitcanned for his asshole move of throwing Oday and Pflu under the bus to make himself look better when this happened. Its pretty obvious good ole royce knew this would likely happen and trying to scapegoat the Coach and AD was a move to deflect criticism from himself.

But unless there is some huge scandal we dont know about the feds will come in and do pretty much as you estimate AWF.

It is interesting to see some of the new Obama pushed rules on what now constitutes rape. Im sure you will see a spike in rape accusations but unless they start taking the rights of men away in terms of evidence needed to convict a man Im not totally sure convictions will spike at the same rate.

Countries like Sweden have rules were your pretty much guilty until proven innocent if a woman say anything about you. Many of the posters on this board would no doubt support a "guilty until proven innocent" on any sexual assault accusations but hopefully it wont come to this.

 

[bisonboone11]

It is interesting to see some of the new Obama pushed rules on what now constitutes rape.

So you don't think the FBI's definition of rape, that had been in place since the 1920's, was outdated? The old definition stated that rape was "the carnal knowledge of a female, forcibly and against her will". Based on that definition, if you drugged a woman and had sex with her, that wouldn't be considered rape. If you got a woman so drunk that she passed out and then you had sex with her, that wouldn't be considered rape. If you forced a woman to give you oral sex, that wasn't rape. If you used an object (rather than a particular body part), that wasn't rape. If a man sexually assaulted another man, that wasn't rape. If a woman sexually assaulted a man, that wasn't rape. Personally, I think the old definition needed to be revised.

 

[CFallsGriz]

To those of you who have been apologists for many years during the Hauck and Pflu regimes, and have followed the cancer known as Playa-rape during this era, it looks like the axe has now fallen. You stood in line to support these athletes and coaches, and now the day of reckoning has arrived! You see, it is always just a matter of time before the recruitment policies of thugs and cover-up of criminal acts via the football program catches up to any program in America. Many schools have experienced it, and now, we are getting our just due.

I hope that the fact that there is now no dispute as to whether our crisis has become a national issue, some of you meatheads will remove your heads from your derrieres and admit that the firings of our AD and head coach were necessary to clean house and start a new era (rather, RETURN to a former era). If the house-cleaning needs to go further up the ladder, then so be it! Just understand that our program has been soiled nationally, and needs an enema, which has already started happening.

You are the biggest joke on the pfucking planet Dill! You have posted on here multiple times how you could pick up the phone and call your pal George Dennison any time you wanted and "make things happen" so you the asshole responsible since you didn't take care of this "thug" problem by telling your pal George to clean house. Do you really think anyone ever believed your bullshit. Do us all a favor and GFY. you are a total waste of skin you old fat little prick

Notice how everyone on here ignores your rants? Why don't get a clue, stick thumb up your ass, and implode. You are a disgusting hunk of worthless protoplasm that should be rendered to help solve the gasoline shortage. The proctologist just called, and they found your head.

 

[PlayerRep]

I just found some interesting information that sheds a little more light on the statistics that everyone is quoting (including myself). The FBI just changed its definition of the "rape" in 2012, which will make it much broader and include many more cases. The previous definition that had been in place since the late 1920s, and the definition that was used to collect these statistics, was "the carnal knowledge of a female, forcibly and against her will." Under the new definition, rape can involve a range of assaults where consent is not given. Also, based on this new (and more accurate) definition, a victim can be rendered unable to consent by drugs and/or alcohol, which is what it sounds like are the majority of what people have been accused of at UofM. This would also include date rape, which was not included in the statistics. For example, Chicago didn't report any rapes in 2009 because their definition of rape didn't match up with what the FBI had. I highly doubt Chicago had no rapes for an entire year. It would be interesting to hear how many rapes (by the new definition) all of these cities had, including Missoula.

Here is the link stating the changes that the FBI is making in more detail: http://www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/attorney-general-eric-holder-announces-revisions-to-the-uniform-crime-reports-definition-of-rape" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The FBI didn't change the definition of rape. What was changed the definition of "forcible rape" for statistical reporting purposes. It's not true that Chicago didn't report any rapes. Chicago reported a larger number of rapes than the more narrow definition for statistical purposes, so the federal government decided not to include any of Chicago's stats. It's becoming a full time job trying to correct all the mistakes and misinformation provided by some of you.

 

[bisonboone11]

The FBI didn't change the definition of rape. What was changed the definition of "forcible rape" for statistical reporting purposes. It's not true that Chicago didn't report any rapes. Chicago reported a larger number of rapes than the more narrow definition for statistical purposes, so the federal government decided not to include any of Chicago's stats. It's becoming a full time job trying to correct all the mistakes and misinformation provided by some of you.

You might want to contact the FBI and tell them they have a mistake on their website then. If you would've taken time to read the first sentence on the link that I posted, you would see that they said, "Attorney General Eric Holder today announced revisions to the Uniform Crime Report’s (UCR) definition of rape, which will lead to a more comprehensive statistical reporting of rape nationwide." Here's the link again for you so you can re-read that from their website, or so you can notify them that their website is incorrect. http://www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/attorney-general-eric-holder-announces-revisions-to-the-uniform-crime-reports-definition-of-rape" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[OptimusPrime]

I just found some interesting information that sheds a little more light on the statistics that everyone is quoting (including myself). The FBI just changed its definition of the "rape" in 2012, which will make it much broader and include many more cases. The previous definition that had been in place since the late 1920s, and the definition that was used to collect these statistics, was "the carnal knowledge of a female, forcibly and against her will." Under the new definition, rape can involve a range of assaults where consent is not given. Also, based on this new (and more accurate) definition, a victim can be rendered unable to consent by drugs and/or alcohol, which is what it sounds like are the majority of what people have been accused of at UofM. This would also include date rape, which was not included in the statistics. For example, Chicago didn't report any rapes in 2009 because their definition of rape didn't match up with what the FBI had. I highly doubt Chicago had no rapes for an entire year. It would be interesting to hear how many rapes (by the new definition) all of these cities had, including Missoula.

Here is the link stating the changes that the FBI is making in more detail: http://www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/attorney-general-eric-holder-announces-revisions-to-the-uniform-crime-reports-definition-of-rape" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The FBI didn't change the definition of rape. What was changed the definition of "forcible rape" for statistical reporting purposes. It's not true that Chicago didn't report any rapes. Chicago reported a larger number of rapes than the more narrow definition for statistical purposes, so the federal government decided not to include any of Chicago's stats. It's becoming a full time job trying to correct all the mistakes and misinformation provided by some of you.

Thank God you are around Cap'n Jack, how would we run our lives without you showing us the way? I appreciate the time and effort you put in everyday to show us our wrongs and to keep us on the path of enlightenment. You are truly an inspiration to us all and I bow to your benevolence. We are not worthy.
ray: ray: ray: ray:

 

[ilovethecats]

:lol:

you can tell you're new here. trust me....if there is any guy out there more intelligent than the fbi...it HAS to be pr. you'll see.... :thumb:

 

[bisonboone11]

:lol:

you can tell you're new here. trust me....if there is any guy out there more intelligent than the fbi...it HAS to be pr. you'll see.... :thumb:

Haha. I am starting to see that. Sorry, you'll have to bear with me while I get used to that.

 

[bisonboone11]

:lol:

you can tell you're new here. trust me....if there is any guy out there more intelligent than the fbi...it HAS to be pr. you'll see.... :thumb:

Does everyone know to just ignore him then, or do some people actually think he knows what he's talking about?

 

[ilovethecats]

not sure. i will never "foe" anyone because frankly i don't care. some stuff is just too funny not to respond too. much of it is not worth the time. in general, i always enjoy listening to people who are so important in their own minds on an anonymous message board. makes me feel so much better about myself and my relationships.

keep in mind that about half of the crap you read on these boards is nothing more than people talking up a big game. pr doesn't have a lot of respect here, but you gotta give it to the guy that everyone knows who he is and where he works and he doesn't let that keep him from sharing his unbiased opinion. that has to count for something.....

 

[bisonboone11]

not sure. i will never "foe" anyone because frankly i don't care. some stuff is just too funny not to respond too. much of it is not worth the time. in general, i always enjoy listening to people who are so important in their own minds on an anonymous message board. makes me feel so much better about myself and my relationships.

keep in mind that about half of the crap you read on these boards is nothing more than people talking up a big game. pr doesn't have a lot of respect here, but you gotta give it to the guy that everyone knows who he is and where he works and he doesn't let that keep him from sharing his unbiased opinion. that has to count for something.....

Haha. That is a good way of looking at it... and I guess you do have to give him credit where credit is due.

 

[grizhunter]

not sure. i will never "foe" anyone because frankly i don't care. some stuff is just too funny not to respond too. much of it is not worth the time. in general, i always enjoy listening to people who are so important in their own minds on an anonymous message board. makes me feel so much better about myself and my relationships.

keep in mind that about half of the crap you read on these boards is nothing more than people talking up a big game. pr doesn't have a lot of respect here, but you gotta give it to the guy that everyone knows who he is and where he works and he doesn't let that keep him from sharing his unbiased opinion. that has to count for something.....

Does it?

 

[MTOutsider]

I don't know if he is guilty or not but this seems to be what set the whole thing off.


A University of Montana student has made a police report alleging starting Grizzlies quarterback Jordan Johnson raped her, according to the Missoula Police Department.

“We’ll continue to monitor him as time goes along,” Foley said. “It’s a new day and there’s a new athletic code of conduct. We’re going to be very clear and consistent in terms of how we apply it.”

Such consistency was one of the recommendations in a report filed Jan. 31 by former Montana Supreme Court Justice Diane Barz, hired by the university to examine issues surrounding allegations of sexual assault involving students.

Although federal law mandates decisive action in such cases, “this is the most difficult part for the UM and other universities because the guidelines are not clear on what constitutes ‘prompt and effective steps,’ ” Barz wrote in her report.



Read more: http://missoulian.com/news/local/sex-assault-allegation-against-grizzly-quarterback-filed-with-police/article_e807ec7e-71f0-11e1-8fe6-001871e3ce6c.html#ixzz1tpsXrJO5" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[Umista]

Clear this up. I was joking when I stated Missoula is the rape capitol of the USA/world. Yes a sad joke on my part but if you believed that statement you also need assistance.

Tokoyoyo hang in with your feelings I tend to agree.

The 80 rape cases has just gone up to 81. Last night old whats her name got me @ 3:30 this AM. She got me drunk and did me in. I reported it after I became sober enough to remember last night. Female police woman stated I did not have enough evidence. After I showed the scratches on my back she took pictures and stated she would get back with me. Now if I can just find old whats her name.....!

 

[bisonboone11]

Clear this up. I was joking when I stated Missoula is the rape capitol of the USA/world. Yes a sad joke on my part but if you believed that statement you also need assistance.

Tokoyoyo hang in with your feelings I tend to agree.

The 80 rape cases has just gone up to 81. Last night old whats her name got me @ 3:30 this AM. She got me drunk and did me in. I reported it after I became sober enough to remember last night. Female police woman stated I did not have enough evidence. After I showed the scratches on my back she took pictures and stated she would get back with me. Now if I can just find old whats her name.....!

If this would've happened prior to January, it wouldn't have been classified as "rape". Good thing for you... Also, good luck remembering the name and with the scratches on your back. I hope they heal quickly and fully. Those scratches can take a while to heal.

 

[Tokyogriz]

Clear this up. I was joking when I stated Missoula is the rape capitol of the USA/world. Yes a sad joke on my part but if you believed that statement you also need assistance.

Tokoyoyo hang in with your feelings I tend to agree.

The 80 rape cases has just gone up to 81. Last night old whats her name got me @ 3:30 this AM. She got me drunk and did me in. I reported it after I became sober enough to remember last night. Female police woman stated I did not have enough evidence. After I showed the scratches on my back she took pictures and stated she would get back with me. Now if I can just find old whats her name.....!

If this would've happened prior to January, it wouldn't have been classified as "rape". Good thing for you... Also, good luck remembering the name and with the scratches on your back. I hope they heal quickly and fully. Those scratches can take a while to heal.

Isnt this a rerun of a Ghost Hunters episode? Pretty sure I saw it last week on on the travel channel.

 

[cclarkblues]

Clear this up. I was joking when I stated Missoula is the rape capitol of the USA/world. Yes a sad joke on my part but if you believed that statement you also need assistance.

Tokoyoyo hang in with your feelings I tend to agree.

The 80 rape cases has just gone up to 81. Last night old whats her name got me @ 3:30 this AM. She got me drunk and did me in. I reported it after I became sober enough to remember last night. Female police woman stated I did not have enough evidence. After I showed the scratches on my back she took pictures and stated she would get back with me. Now if I can just find old whats her name.....!

If this would've happened prior to January, it wouldn't have been classified as "rape". Good thing for you... Also, good luck remembering the name and with the scratches on your back. I hope they heal quickly and fully. Those scratches can take a while to heal.

Isnt this a rerun of a Ghost Hunters episode? Pretty sure I saw it last week on on the travel channel.

Pretty sure it's on SyFy.

 

[mondayamqb]

Curious. Did the DOJ read the internal investigative reports authored by the City Police and the University? If so, what in those reports produced a red flag or provided insufficient or troublesome information that would require further independent investigation by DOJ? Of the recommended changes in procedures,what did the DOJ find inadequate? It seems to me that all agencies acted appropriately in reviewing their actions, admitted mistakes, and have set new policies which provide resources for immediate confidential help and protection for future rape or assault victims, improved communication and information sharing among all agencies, and require mandatory rape awareness training for all students as a part of the registration process. So, why is the DOJ here? Did some staffer have time on his/her hands and looked at figures from every town in the good old US of A and decide we've got a problem in Missoula that we'd better take a look at. I don't think so. Someone (no conspiracy theories, please) requested this investigation. I think the DOJ should be asked the questions behind the question. Who made the request. What specific fault (s)did they find that required their additional attention? Will it be as open and transparent as the local reports have been and why did the Missoulian know about the investigation before the City, County, and University received letters. This post is limited to the who and why of the DOJ's intrusion. Previous discussion about the various individuals should not be rehashed. Who will be strong enough to ask these questions: CNN, Fox, Missoulian, KUFM, Baucus, Tester, Rehberg--and will DOJ give a straight answer or will they do the old dippy doo? I think we deserve to know.

 

[Spanky]

Max's wife is with the DOJ

 

[Grizinmyyard]

Umm...

I have been reading all of the posts from experts on this forum since the announced investigation news conference.

First of all, I must say Fred Van Valkenberg looked to be a little flushed in a red faced sort of way in the Missoulian. Kinda looked like he was on trial, or is that just my take?

He sure sounded like a belligerent defendant to me. Just my take again.

I am sure that the DOJ had their reasons for this investigation. Maybe the fact that the women who reported sexual assaults through University channels and were blown off, might have something to do with it? Maybe the fact that Muir was quoted saying that 80% of reported sexual assaults were false reports might have something to do with it?

And finally, why would anyone believe that just because all agencies involved said that they had corrected their problems would anybody believe them? I guess that the feds didn't.

All I want, is to see all of the facts out in the open. You can disagree, but in my opinion I don't think we have seen much of that yet.