ESPN Bracketology - Weber @14

[1986cat]

Big Sky beat: Utah, Oregon, Fresno St., Air Force, Colorado St., Hawaii, Denver, TCU, Boise St., San Jose St.,Morehead St.(Ohio Valley 1st place and last year champs, with 4 returning starters who won first round NCAA last year) Cal St. Fullerton(1st place in conf)

ALMOST WINS Washington -4, Oklahoma -1, Utah State-4,Wyoming-4, Nevada-3

CLOSE GAMES BYU, UNLV

Utah, Oregon, Fresno, Air Force, CSU, Hawaii, Denver, TCU, Boise, SJU, Morehead - Not going to the tournament and it won't even be close.

Washington, Oklahoma, Wyoming, Nevada. Not going to the tournament and it won't be close.

Being up on a team and losing doesn't mean anything It is still a loss. "Almost wins" don't mean anything. They don't factor into your tournament resume or your RPI.

The Big Sky is where inconsistency reigns. Honestly, U of M was starting to look good and then they laid a dud against EWU. Now be honest with yourself, no Big Sky team will beat Gonzaga OR BYU in the tournament. It won't even be close.

Keep counting those "almost" wins and "close games." I will be looking at reality.

 

[LillardMVP]

Does North Carolina '99 ring a bell (lost to Florida in OT in 2ND round), Dumb Ass. OR how about '95 when we took out Michigan St.(Lost to Georgetown and A.I. on last second shot in 2ND Round.) Montana took care of business in '06. DO YOU KNOW WHEN THE LAST TIME BYU WON IN THE NCAA'S? 1993

 

[1986cat]

Does North Carolina '99 ring a bell (lost to Florida in OT in 2 round), Dumb Ass. OR how about '95 when we took out Michigan St.(Lost to Georgetown and A.I. on last second shot in round 2.) Montana took care of business in '06. DO YOU KNOW WHEN THE LAST TIME BYU WON IN THE NCAA'S? 1993

Could really care less about your magical once a decade upsets. I am a Gonzaga grad and care about quality basketball. Again, keep counting those "almost wins."

 

[LillardMVP]

We would wipe Gonzaga off the court, hope we meet in the tourney. Gonzaga is the most overrated team in the country. Giacaletti sux too.

 

[1986cat]

We would wipe Gonzaga off the court, hope we meet in the tourney. Gonzaga is the most overrated team in the country. Giacaletti sux too.

Just like I have Griz envy in football, this sounds quite a little bit like Zag envy. I don't see one quality win on your resume, and in fact, I see some pretty bad losses, especially to Seattle. That one is a real joke.

We have elite facilities, elite recruiting, and an elite coach. We make the tournament every single year. We beat quality non-conference teams every single year. Weber makes the tourney once in a while, plays in the Big Sky, and lost to Seattle U.

Why don't you tell me more about those quality "almost" wins and where the selection committee factors those in?

 

[Potomac Griz]

All of Big Sky basketball is painful. They might pull off one upset here and there, but be honest. Not one team can regularly compete with establishment basketball teams. Big Sky is worse than the WCC, the WAC, and even the Pac-10 this year. One and done.

Seriously.... a zag fan coming here to talk trash after the beatdown they took from LMU (who the Griz beat twice btw). BTW, the WCC is ranked lower than the WAC this year too..and "even" the PAC-10.

We know that Gonzaga is a very good team. We know that the WCC is a good conference. I'm pretty sure that most all fans in the Big Sky would like to have their teams eventually get to the same level as Gonzaga. That would be great, and is something to strive for as a mid major conference.

However, Gonzaga is easily the most over hyped team in the country every year. They get talked about like they may actually be able to make it to the elite 8 or final 4, but then get into the tournament and either get upset in the first or second round, or if they manage to avoid upset, get their asses handed to them when they finally run into an "establishment" team.

Lets have a look at their tournament success over the past few years.

Last year the Zags were a 4 seed. They play Akron in the first round and win (big surprise). WKU upsets 5 seed Illinois in the first round so the Zags get to play a 12 seed in the 2nd round. The Zags need a last second shot to beat 12 seed WKU... which was made possible by WKU deciding that defense with 7 seconds on the clock was not necessary giving the Zags an easy layup. Then the Zags run into an "establishment" team, and promptly get embarrassed by 21 points.

2008 Tournament. Woops...upset by #10 seed Davidson and Stephan Curry 82-76. Ouch.. one and done for the mighty 7 seed Zags..

2007 Tournament. Aww..how unfair...the Zags had to play a higher ranked team in the first round. Results - 70-57 beating by 7 seed Indiana. One and done.

2006 Tournament. This will be the year for the Zags to make it to the final four! They are 26-3 going into the tournament and got a 3 seed! Uh oh..wtf is going on here... 14 seed Xavier damn near upset the Mighty Zags in the first round... Oh well, a win is a win! Ok now we are looking good, we beat 6 seed Indiana! Bring on UCLA! We can do it! Oh shit..did I say UCLA?! Even after a big halftime lead, the Zags get outscored 44-29 in the second half to end up losing to UCLA. Morrison's tears cause flash floods in Oakland..

2005 Tournament. Looking good for the Zags! A 3 seed and they get to beat up on lowly Winthrop in the first round. What's this? Game is tied 64-64 with 1:50 to go, and Wintrop was up at halftime?! Good thing the Zags get to shoot 8 straight free throws (their only scoring in the last 1:50) to beat Winthrop by 6. Close call there, but that's OK, the Zags are still a 3 seed! Bring on the 6 seed Texas Tech! Crap..someone forgot to give the Zags the memo that there are two halves in the game They get outscored by 11 in the second half and are upset by 6 seed Texas Tech. Morrison's tears end a long drought in Arizona.

2004 Tournament. 2 seed for the 27-2 zags! They get to beat up on 18-13 Valparaiso in the first round (and do). This year should definitely result in at least an elite 8 appearance! Bring on 10 seed Nevada (who btw, the Griz beat in the 2006 tournament when Nevada was a 5 seed and a better team). *sigh* Oh well, there's always next year... a 19 point beatdown by the 10 seed over a 2 seed. Morrison scores 14 points off the bench and cries 96 tears. Luckily this was in Seattle, so no one really noticed the extra rain.

2003 Tournament. Actually a good showing by the 9 seed Zags. They beat 8 seed Cincinnati in the first round, and hung with 1 seed Arizona. Nothing to be ashamed of here.

2002 Tournament. Looking good going into the tournament! 28-2 and a 6 seed. End up being upset by the 11 seed Wyoming in the first round. One and done.

Guess what... you aren't one of the "elite" teams. You play in a Mid Major conference, and aren't even the top mid major team many years. When you do run into an elite team in the NCAA tournament, you lose. Many times in the NCAA tournament you get upset by another Mid Major team, or a lower ranked team. Gonzaga is a very good team, there's no doubting that. But as LillardMVP said, they are always very overrated. I would love to see either Weber, UNC or the Griz draw the Zags in the first round instead of a real elite team like Duke or West Virginia.

 

[1986cat]

All of Big Sky basketball is painful. They might pull off one upset here and there, but be honest. Not one team can regularly compete with establishment basketball teams. Big Sky is worse than the WCC, the WAC, and even the Pac-10 this year. One and done.

Seriously.... a zag fan coming here to talk trash after the beatdown they took from LMU (who the Griz beat twice btw). BTW, the WCC is ranked lower than the WAC this year too..and "even" the PAC-10.

We know that Gonzaga is a very good team. We know that the WCC is a good conference. I'm pretty sure that most all fans in the Big Sky would like to have their teams eventually get to the same level as Gonzaga. That would be great, and is something to strive for as a mid major conference.

However, Gonzaga is easily the most over hyped team in the country every year. They get talked about like they may actually be able to make it to the elite 8 or final 4, but then get into the tournament and either get upset in the first or second round, or if they manage to avoid upset, get their asses handed to them when they finally run into an "establishment" team.

Lets have a look at their tournament success over the past few years.

Last year the Zags were a 4 seed. They play Akron in the first round and win (big surprise). WKU upsets 5 seed Illinois in the first round so the Zags get to play a 12 seed in the 2nd round. The Zags need a last second shot to beat 12 seed WKU... which was made possible by WKU deciding that defense with 7 seconds on the clock was not necessary giving the Zags an easy layup. Then the Zags run into an "establishment" team, and promptly get embarrassed by 21 points.

2008 Tournament. Woops...upset by #10 seed Davidson and Stephan Curry 82-76. Ouch.. one and done for the mighty 7 seed Zags..

2007 Tournament. Aww..how unfair...the Zags had to play a higher ranked team in the first round. Results - 70-57 beating by 7 seed Indiana. One and done.

2006 Tournament. This will be the year for the Zags to make it to the final four! They are 26-3 going into the tournament and got a 3 seed! Uh oh..wtf is going on here... 14 seed Xavier damn near upset the Mighty Zags in the first round... Oh well, a win is a win! Ok now we are looking good, we beat 6 seed Indiana! Bring on UCLA! We can do it! Oh shit..did I say UCLA?! Even after a big halftime lead, the Zags get outscored 44-29 in the second half to end up losing to UCLA. Morrison's tears cause flash floods in Oakland..

2005 Tournament. Looking good for the Zags! A 3 seed and they get to beat up on lowly Winthrop in the first round. What's this? Game is tied 64-64 with 1:50 to go, and Wintrop was up at halftime?! Good thing the Zags get to shoot 8 straight free throws (their only scoring in the last 1:50) to beat Winthrop by 6. Close call there, but that's OK, the Zags are still a 3 seed! Bring on the 6 seed Texas Tech! Crap..someone forgot to give the Zags the memo that there are two halves in the game They get outscored by 11 in the second half and are upset by 6 seed Texas Tech. Morrison's tears end a long drought in Arizona.

2004 Tournament. 2 seed for the 27-2 zags! They get to beat up on 18-13 Valparaiso in the first round (and do). This year should definitely result in at least an elite 8 appearance! Bring on 10 seed Nevada (who btw, the Griz beat in the 2006 tournament when Nevada was a 5 seed and a better team). *sigh* Oh well, there's always next year... a 19 point beatdown by the 10 seed over a 2 seed. Morrison scores 14 points off the bench and cries 96 tears. Luckily this was in Seattle, so no one really noticed the extra rain.

2003 Tournament. Actually a good showing by the 9 seed Zags. They beat 8 seed Cincinnati in the first round, and hung with 1 seed Arizona. Nothing to be ashamed of here.

2002 Tournament. Looking good going into the tournament! 28-2 and a 6 seed. End up being upset by the 11 seed Wyoming in the first round. One and done.

Guess what... you aren't one of the "elite" teams. You play in a Mid Major conference, and aren't even the top mid major team many years. When you do run into an elite team in the NCAA tournament, you lose. Many times in the NCAA tournament you get upset by another Mid Major team, or a lower ranked team. Gonzaga is a very good team, there's no doubting that. But as LillardMVP said, they are always very overrated. I would love to see either Weber, UNC or the Griz draw the Zags in the first round instead of a real elite team like Duke or West Virginia.

Poor Grizzlies. Zag envy running rampant.

 

[Potomac Griz]

Poor Grizzlies. Zag envy running rampant.

Wow, what a comeback. So you basically have nothing to refute my statement that the Zags typically choke in the NCAA tournament and get upset in the first couple rounds, or get a beatdown delivered to them by a real elite team? Ok then. I'm glad we are on the same page and both think that the Zags are overrated

 

[bigtyme]

You guys lost to Denver. Matchup problems with a 2-3 seed? Are you kidding me?[/quote]


Yup, same as our game against FSU in' 92. If we are hitting the three we have a chance to beat teams that are dynamically better than us on paper. And we will beat you by at least 15 next weekend so be careful what you say big fella. Fifteen minimum!

 

[WSUWALDO]

If it wasn't for the last decade, who the hell would care about Gonzaga?

Also, when did the Zags last win a national title? Oh, wait you never have!!

When did you get to the final four? Oh wait, you never have!!

You act like the Zags are the greatest team in the country and deserves to be mentioned in tow with UCLA, Kansas, UNC, and Duke... Hate to break it to you. You are a team in a mid-major conference, just like the Sky, that is having a good spell of luck, just San Fran did in the 50s, Santa Clara and Loyala did in the 80s, but where are they now?? Hate to break it to ya...there is gonna come a time when the Zags wont be the power they happen to be now.

Oh yeah, once you've become a dual sport power and maybe, we will respect Gonzaga, until them I hope you continue to beat Portland and Santa Clara (aren't those schools a lot like Sac St and NAU?).

Don't start pounding your chest and claiming the Sky is crap when the WCC would be rated lower than the Great West (DI independents are higher right now) if it wasn't for the Zags. Way to beat those pathetic programs.

 

[BARN BALL]

Sorry I brought it up but Loyola Mary Mount has lots of potential but could not get it together enough to

handle all of Big Sky early this year but had a good night and defeated Gonzogo this week.

 

[1986cat]

Poor Grizzlies. Zag envy running rampant.

Wow, what a comeback. So you basically have nothing to refute my statement that the Zags typically choke in the NCAA tournament and get upset in the first couple rounds, or get a beatdown delivered to them by a real elite team? Ok then. I'm glad we are on the same page

Dearest Dexter -

Yes, we Zags haven't quite lived up to our billing lately. Last year was a great step in the right direction, even with a blowout loss to UNC. You might check, Dexter, and realize that every team got beat down by UNC. They were an absolute powerhouse.

In the history of college basketball, Gonzaga's success is limited to the last 12 years. Starting with that run in 1999, we have made the tourney every year since. We schedule difficult teams out of conference every single year, and now some of those teams are coming to play in the Kennel. Wake played there this year. Michigan State will play there in 2011. You don't have to take my word for it, Dex, but I interpret those games as a sign that other powerhouse teams DO recognize Gonzaga as an elite team. Even when we lose to those teams, Dex, their resume's are bolstered by a quality win over a quality program. Not the kind of resume boost you can get out of beating Montana, and it isn't even close.

Gonzaga will make it further in the tournament and will continue to grow in popularity and national reputation every year. The quality of recruits, facilities, and coaches will undoubtedly result in more tournament wins. It is a short history, as I have said, and the Zags will continue to build on it.

I think the envy from other mid-majors comes in the fact that replicating what Gonzaga has done is difficult. Sustained success and sustained tournament appearances are difficult for mid-major teams. Gonzaga doesn't have to win its conference tournament to make it in. Montana does. Weber does. Southern Illinois does. Gonzaga has an ESPN contract to televise its games to a national audience. None of those other mid-majors do. Losing to LMU and San Fran before that are two of the best things that could happen to the Zags. We have one senior on the team, and he is our only returning starter. I wasn't expecting Gonzaga to do this well this year, in all honesty, but freshman have really stepped up. Gonzaga should win 25 games every year. These are the goals and realities of a quality program. Instead of rebuilding like other mid majors must, we reload.

I know it is frustrating for Griz fans because they expect basketball success to be like football success. It doesn't work that way for ANY school. I know you beat LMU and we lost to LMU. I know you also lost to Denver and EWU. I know we also beat Illinois, Wisconsin, Oklahoma, Washington State, and Cincinatti. We have five losses this year. Three of them are good losses (Michigan State, Wake, and Duke) all tourney teams. Can anybody in the Big Sky say that?

Make sure to tune in to watch the Zags in the dance this year. Perhaps they will get to stay in Spokane for the first two rounds. Where will Montana be?

 

[bigtyme]

"86CAT-Gonzaga won't be in Spokane mark my words! Why in the world are you puffing your chest? Is this the only way you can get back at the Griz? The WCC is a HORRIBLE conference! Almost as bad as the BSC is top heavy in football, so is the WCC. The only reason Gonzaga is in the top 10 right now is because basketball in the west SUCKS this year compared to years past. The Pac 10 is horrible and so GU and BYU are getting respect because they are literally the only teams in the west that are worth being in the top 25. But I would probably put GU at 20-25, not sure of BYU. UM has some decent wins on our schedule this year too, big deal. Your GU antics on here are unwanted and unwarranted! Few care. As much as I like to see a team from Spokane have success the so-called Zag fans are annoying!

 

[Potomac Griz]

Dearest Dexter -

Yes, we Zags haven't quite lived up to our billing lately. Last year was a great step in the right direction, even with a blowout loss to UNC. You might check, Dexter, and realize that every team got beat down by UNC. They were an absolute powerhouse.

In the history of college basketball, Gonzaga's success is limited to the last 12 years. Starting with that run in 1999, we have made the tourney every year since. We schedule difficult teams out of conference every single year, and now some of those teams are coming to play in the Kennel. Wake played there this year. Michigan State will play there in 2011. You don't have to take my word for it, Dex, but I interpret those games as a sign that other powerhouse teams DO recognize Gonzaga as an elite team. Even when we lose to those teams, Dex, their resume's are bolstered by a quality win over a quality program. Not the kind of resume boost you can get out of beating Montana, and it isn't even close.

Gonzaga will make it further in the tournament and will continue to grow in popularity and national reputation every year. The quality of recruits, facilities, and coaches will undoubtedly result in more tournament wins. It is a short history, as I have said, and the Zags will continue to build on it.

I think the envy from other mid-majors comes in the fact that replicating what Gonzaga has done is difficult. Sustained success and sustained tournament appearances are difficult for mid-major teams. Gonzaga doesn't have to win its conference tournament to make it in. Montana does. Weber does. Southern Illinois does. Gonzaga has an ESPN contract to televise its games to a national audience. None of those other mid-majors do. Losing to LMU and San Fran before that are two of the best things that could happen to the Zags. We have one senior on the team, and he is our only returning starter. I wasn't expecting Gonzaga to do this well this year, in all honesty, but freshman have really stepped up. Gonzaga should win 25 games every year. These are the goals and realities of a quality program. Instead of rebuilding like other mid majors must, we reload.

I know it is frustrating for Griz fans because they expect basketball success to be like football success. It doesn't work that way for ANY school. I know you beat LMU and we lost to LMU. I know you also lost to Denver and EWU. I know we also beat Illinois, Wisconsin, Oklahoma, Washington State, and Cincinatti. We have five losses this year. Three of them are good losses (Michigan State, Wake, and Duke) all tourney teams. Can anybody in the Big Sky say that?

Make sure to tune in to watch the Zags in the dance this year. Perhaps they will get to stay in Spokane for the first two rounds. Where will Montana be?

Dearest delusional Zag fan -

Sorry to inform you, but you are not one of the "elite" teams. Having Wake Forest go down there to play you does not mean you are an elite team. Wake Forest also travelled to play North Carolina Wilmington (8-19 and in the CAA conference). Wake Forest also played UNC Greensboro on the road (6-21 in the Southern conference). Does that mean that UNC Greensboro and NC Wilmington are elite teams? Michigan State also played on the road against 15-12 Citadel from the Southern Conference. I guess since some elite teams played on the road against Southern Conference teams, that means the Southern Conference is more elite than the WCC and the Zags?

I'm not sure where you get the idea that the Griz basketball fans expect the Griz to have the same type of success that the football team does. It's comparing apples and oranges really. There may be some fans who don't really follow basketball that don't see the huge difference between the FCS and DIV1 Basketball, but any fan that follows basketball would not expect the Griz to be a top team in Division 1 basketball every year. What I think people do expect is to see some improvement and to be one of the top teams in the Big Sky each year and have a chance at making it to the big dance.

The Big Sky has a good chance of having 3 teams with 20+ wins this year, which is quite an accomplishment for the Big Sky in my opinion. As LillardMVP pointed out, the Big Sky has some good wins over quality opponents this year too, as well as some tough fought losses against very good teams. I just hope that one of the 3 top teams int he Big Sky is the team representing the Big Sky in the NCAA tournament.

 

[WILDCATFAN]

Bracketology has us now as a 14 seed playing 3 seeded New Mexico, that would be cool, west vs west game.

Well maybe, I just checked ESPN and all the Brackatology brackets are empty, so who knows.

 

[Zootown Rox]

I always root for Gonzaga, expect when they play the Griz.

 

[weberwildcat]

I always root for Gonzaga, expect when they play the Griz.

same here, its pretty cool seeing the zags having the success they are being a former big sky team, same goes for boise state and nevada.