Emails blast O'Day for disparity

[griz5700]

I really don't want to get involved with a thread involving race but I'm gonna throw in my two cents. If I remember right the Lehigh player was white and used a racial slur about an opponent. That's unacceptable even if it is just a retweet. I believe the Griz racial slurs referenced were one black player talking to another black friend/teammate using the word ni**a. While probably shouldn't happen anymore it is commonly used and accepted. But that is just another example how twitter can be misinterpreted and get a player in trouble.

EXACTLY! Thank you. No surprise that the Missoulian couldn't explain this. If a white Griz player said something like that on twitter, they would be punished by UM and blasted by egriz and the Missoulian. And rightfully so. I'm sure Gwen could find some tweets by Will Cherry calling someone ni**a. Why doesn't she write about it? The same reason UM doesn't get involved, he's black and if you're white, you just don't go there.

 

[NorthwestFresh]

I really don't want to get involved with a thread involving race but I'm gonna throw in my two cents. If I remember right the Lehigh player was white and used a racial slur about an opponent. That's unacceptable even if it is just a retweet. I believe the Griz racial slurs referenced were one black player talking to another black friend/teammate using the word ni**a. While probably shouldn't happen anymore it is commonly used and accepted. But that is just another example how twitter can be misinterpreted and get a player in trouble.

Yep.

According to Jim O'Day and the NCAA, white players can't re-tweet words that black players say to each other in everyday conversations.

 

[blazerbird]

Does no one have a problem with the way O'Day answered Engstrom's question?

 

[UMGriz75]

I really don't want to get involved with a thread involving race but I'm gonna throw in my two cents. If I remember right the Lehigh player was white and used a racial slur about an opponent. That's unacceptable even if it is just a retweet. I believe the Griz racial slurs referenced were one black player talking to another black friend/teammate using the word ni**a. While probably shouldn't happen anymore it is commonly used and accepted. But that is just another example how twitter can be misinterpreted and get a player in trouble.

Oddly, I am finding that the current collegiate generation views the "terminology" quite differently than the older generation. There is a distinct generational divide.

I hear the term N***ah -- and other such terms -- used daily on campus now; Black's, Whites, Asians. It is endemic. It is in the music; it is all over the tweets, it is embedded in daily conversation. None think a second about it. The use has multiple meanings including affectionate teasing.

The "old fogies" think in terms of civil rights, the struggle against racism, the corrosive power of disparaging racial stereotyping, and have imposed that worldview upon society. We hear the words with our ears, not with theirs.

The younger generation, by and large, without having those experiences, don't view the "words" the same way. Most older adults would be shocked at the way that young blacks, whites, and Asians refer to each other and themselves these days. It is different. It is a different time and a different generation.

Indeed, using the "words" is their form of rebellion against a battle they did not fight, and a war they believe is won. Indeed, I see it as this generation's "shock" language to its elders in exactly the same fashion that their elders, now forgetting, employed their own "shock language" in the late 60s and 70s against their elders. The irony is profound.

The younger generation has, perhaps, grown up. To them, the power of the word is generated by the character of the speaker, not inherently representing some residual psychological mythical power.

Increasingly, young people generating their own societal norms are running headlong into societal norms generated by an older generation intolerant, ironically, of different interpretations of words and relationships.

But, we will punish them, just the same, upon the theory that our sins must also be theirs.

 

[Silvertip]

Interestingly O'Day dissuaded Engstrom from expelling Gerald Kemp as the president continued to have a large burr under his saddle weeks after the tasing incident. Without Jim's intervention Gerald could well have been long gone.

 

[UMGriz75]

What were the racial slurs and who were the players? Or do you just believe vague reports that attack the Griz?

Here's the thread from the Lehigh scandal.

http://www.egriz.com/grizboard/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=54651" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I suppose it is a useful irony to observe that, had Gwen Florio looked to "egriz" she could have learned much more about the story she was allegedly writing about, than from the FOIA email blast that didn't actually say much.

 

[TxGriz]

What were the racial slurs and who were the players? Or do you just believe vague reports that attack the Griz?

Has Gwen Florio reviewed and approved crackgina's nick for appropriateness?

 

[Moosehead]

I really don't want to get involved with a thread involving race but I'm gonna throw in my two cents. If I remember right the Lehigh player was white and used a racial slur about an opponent. That's unacceptable even if it is just a retweet. I believe the Griz racial slurs referenced were one black player talking to another black friend/teammate using the word ni**a. While probably shouldn't happen anymore it is commonly used and accepted. But that is just another example how twitter can be misinterpreted and get a player in trouble.

Oddly, I am finding that the current collegiate generation views the "terminology" quite differently than the older generation. There is a distinct generational divide.

I hear the term N***ah -- and other such terms -- used daily on campus now; Black's, Whites, Asians. It is endemic. It is in the music; it is all over the tweets, it is embedded in daily conversation. None think a second about it. The use has multiple meanings including affectionate teasing.

The "old fogies" think in terms of civil rights, the struggle against racism, the corrosive power of disparaging racial stereotyping, and have imposed that worldview upon society. We hear the words with our ears, not with theirs.

The younger generation, by and large, without having those experiences, don't view the "words" the same way. Most older adults would be shocked at the way that young blacks, whites, and Asians refer to each other and themselves these days. It is different. It is a different time and a different generation.

Indeed, using the "words" is their form of rebellion against a battle they did not fight, and a war they believe is won. Indeed, I see it as this generation's "shock" language to its elders in exactly the same fashion that their elders, now forgetting, employed their own "shock language" in the late 60s and 70s against their elders. The irony is profound.

The younger generation has, perhaps, grown up. To them, the power of the word is generated by the character of the speaker, not inherently representing some residual psychological mythical power.

Increasingly, young people generating their own societal norms are running headlong into societal norms generated by an older generation intolerant, ironically, of different interpretations of words and relationships.

But, we will punish them, just the same, upon the theory that our sins must also be theirs.

This is a good post. I'm curious, are you a student or faculty member on campus?

 

[NorthEndZoneDan]

I notice that she also found a way to work in her invention the "gang rape" allegation and also squeezed in tasing though not mentioned anywhere in the emails. She is such a loser.

actually it was a Florio Trifecta :clap:

 

[PlayerRep]

I really don't want to get involved with a thread involving race but I'm gonna throw in my two cents. If I remember right the Lehigh player was white and used a racial slur about an opponent. That's unacceptable even if it is just a retweet. I believe the Griz racial slurs referenced were one black player talking to another black friend/teammate using the word ni**a. While probably shouldn't happen anymore it is commonly used and accepted. But that is just another example how twitter can be misinterpreted and get a player in trouble.

Oddly, I am finding that the current collegiate generation views the "terminology" quite differently than the older generation. There is a distinct generational divide.

I hear the term N***ah -- and other such terms -- used daily on campus now; Black's, Whites, Asians. It is endemic. It is in the music; it is all over the tweets, it is embedded in daily conversation. None think a second about it. The use has multiple meanings including affectionate teasing.

The "old fogies" think in terms of civil rights, the struggle against racism, the corrosive power of disparaging racial stereotyping, and have imposed that worldview upon society. We hear the words with our ears, not with theirs.

The younger generation, by and large, without having those experiences, don't view the "words" the same way. Most older adults would be shocked at the way that young blacks, whites, and Asians refer to each other and themselves these days. It is different. It is a different time and a different generation.

Indeed, using the "words" is their form of rebellion against a battle they did not fight, and a war they believe is won. Indeed, I see it as this generation's "shock" language to its elders in exactly the same fashion that their elders, now forgetting, employed their own "shock language" in the late 60s and 70s against their elders. The irony is profound.

The younger generation has, perhaps, grown up. To them, the power of the word is generated by the character of the speaker, not inherently representing some residual psychological mythical power.

Increasingly, young people generating their own societal norms are running headlong into societal norms generated by an older generation intolerant, ironically, of different interpretations of words and relationships.

But, we will punish them, just the same, upon the theory that our sins must also be theirs.

This is a good post. I'm curious, are you a student or faculty member on campus?

These two posts are correct. The reason for the suspension was, as BDizzle said, because the Lehigh player was white, combined with what 75 said in his post. In addition, the ncaa playoff/committee believed it had jurisdiction and had to act, because the tweet was made while the player was on a trip to/from the playoffs, and the tweet had been reported to the ncaa. Some of us talked to O'Day during this time, essentially on behalf of the Lehigh player, trying to make the arguments that 75 made and saying what a bad precedent this would set. O'Day was actually somewhat receptive, but the ship was already sailing and the decision on the matter was eventually bumped up to the head of the ncaa. While O'Day spent some time on this with the committee, eventually he was merely the spokesman. Contrary to the article, O'Day was not receiving much direct criticism because of disparate treatment of the Lehigh kid and UM athletes. He did get some criticism like this on the internet, tho. Most of what he was receiving were scores of examples of similar and worse tweets, almost none of which were by UM athletes. My recollection is that there were more examples from MSU athletes than from UM athletes. I don't recall any of the examples, all of which involved players from playoff schools, that appeared to be made while the player was on a playoff trip. There were many examples from basketball players (of playoff football schools) too.

 

[Ursa Major]

the photo used to headline the article is typical of the media visual smear...

it makes him look a cross between 'curly' and a vintage Italian dictator! The same photo crap used by mindless political- ads all of 'em.

Il Duce!!

That's funny!!

 

[grizbrokebacker1]

I really don't want to get involved with a thread involving race but I'm gonna throw in my two cents. If I remember right the Lehigh player was white and used a racial slur about an opponent. That's unacceptable even if it is just a retweet. I believe the Griz racial slurs referenced were one black player talking to another black friend/teammate using the word ni**a. While probably shouldn't happen anymore it is commonly used and accepted. But that is just another example how twitter can be misinterpreted and get a player in trouble.

Oddly, I am finding that the current collegiate generation views the "terminology" quite differently than the older generation. There is a distinct generational divide.

I hear the term N***ah -- and other such terms -- used daily on campus now; Black's, Whites, Asians. It is endemic. It is in the music; it is all over the tweets, it is embedded in daily conversation. None think a second about it. The use has multiple meanings including affectionate teasing.

The "old fogies" think in terms of civil rights, the struggle against racism, the corrosive power of disparaging racial stereotyping, and have imposed that worldview upon society. We hear the words with our ears, not with theirs.

The younger generation, by and large, without having those experiences, don't view the "words" the same way. Most older adults would be shocked at the way that young blacks, whites, and Asians refer to each other and themselves these days. It is different. It is a different time and a different generation.

Indeed, using the "words" is their form of rebellion against a battle they did not fight, and a war they believe is won. Indeed, I see it as this generation's "shock" language to its elders in exactly the same fashion that their elders, now forgetting, employed their own "shock language" in the late 60s and 70s against their elders. The irony is profound.

The younger generation has, perhaps, grown up. To them, the power of the word is generated by the character of the speaker, not inherently representing some residual psychological mythical power.

Increasingly, young people generating their own societal norms are running headlong into societal norms generated by an older generation intolerant, ironically, of different interpretations of words and relationships.

But, we will punish them, just the same, upon the theory that our sins must also be theirs.

This is a good post. I'm curious, are you a student or faculty member on campus?

These two posts are correct. The reason for the suspension was, as BDizzle said, because the Lehigh player was white, combined with what 75 said in his post. In addition, the ncaa playoff/committee believed it had jurisdiction and had to act, because the tweet was made while the player was on a trip to/from the playoffs, and the tweet had been reported to the ncaa. Some of us talked to O'Day during this time, essentially on behalf of the Lehigh player, trying to make the arguments that 75 made and saying what a bad precedent this would set. O'Day was actually somewhat receptive, but the ship was already sailing and the decision on the matter was eventually bumped up to the head of the ncaa. While O'Day spent some time on this with the committee, eventually he was merely the spokesman. Contrary to the article, O'Day was not receiving much direct criticism because of disparate treatment of the Lehigh kid and UM athletes. He did get some criticism like this on the internet, tho. Most of what he was receiving were scores of examples of similar and worse tweets, almost none of which were by UM athletes. My recollection is that there were more examples from MSU athletes than from UM athletes. I don't recall any of the examples, all of which involved players from playoff schools, that appeared to be made while the player was on a playoff trip. There were many examples from basketball players (of playoff football schools) too.

What's your source for this "fact"?

I don't recall any of the examples, all of which involved players from playoff schools, that appeared to be made while the player was on a playoff trip.

So, you don't recall ANY of the examples, yet you know for a fact they were all from players from playoff schools while they were on a playoff trip??? Convenient you can remember those details. :roll:

 

[JSWNBBY]

This is dumb.

 

[grizfan47]

I really don't want to get involved with a thread involving race but I'm gonna throw in my two cents. If I remember right the Lehigh player was white and used a racial slur about an opponent. That's unacceptable even if it is just a retweet. I believe the Griz racial slurs referenced were one black player talking to another black friend/teammate using the word ni**a. While probably shouldn't happen anymore it is commonly used and accepted. But that is just another example how twitter can be misinterpreted and get a player in trouble.

EXACTLY! Thank you. No surprise that the Missoulian couldn't explain this. If a white Griz player said something like that on twitter, they would be punished by UM and blasted by egriz and the Missoulian. And rightfully so. I'm sure Gwen could find some tweets by Will Cherry calling someone ni**a. Why doesn't she write about it? The same reason UM doesn't get involved, he's black and if you're white, you just don't go there.

Are you kidding me??? ARE YOU KIDDING ME??? That's what this story is about? Unbelievable...and the so called main stream journalists wonder why all the skepticism. I am so happy that the Great Falls Tribune has been wise enough to stay away from the crap that is perpetuated in Missoula as journalism. My daughter just graduated from the UM English department and I am quite confident that she is smarter and better prepared than the staff working at the Missoulian. I always thought that the paper's news department was supposed to report the unbiased story based on facts, not half of the story based on facts edited by the staff to suit their agenda. I am shocked at the new low that this reporter keeps lowering herself to.

 

[GrizPony]

Almost every real journalist at the Missoulian has quit in the last year. The ship she is going down.

 

[rbprospector]

I really don't want to get involved with a thread involving race but I'm gonna throw in my two cents. If I remember right the Lehigh player was white and used a racial slur about an opponent. That's unacceptable even if it is just a retweet. I believe the Griz racial slurs referenced were one black player talking to another black friend/teammate using the word ni**a. While probably shouldn't happen anymore it is commonly used and accepted. But that is just another example how twitter can be misinterpreted and get a player in trouble.

EXACTLY! Thank you. No surprise that the Missoulian couldn't explain this. If a white Griz player said something like that on twitter, they would be punished by UM and blasted by egriz and the Missoulian. And rightfully so. I'm sure Gwen could find some tweets by Will Cherry calling someone ni**a. Why doesn't she write about it? The same reason UM doesn't get involved, he's black and if you're white, you just don't go there.

What if a player is half black and half white? How would you or NCAA judge their tweets?

 

[krammer]

this has to be a very unhappy woman with an agenda that has become personal for her and she never sleeps,,,what a cluster !!!!

 

[Grizinmyyard]

I really don't want to get involved with a thread involving race but I'm gonna throw in my two cents. If I remember right the Lehigh player was white and used a racial slur about an opponent. That's unacceptable even if it is just a retweet. I believe the Griz racial slurs referenced were one black player talking to another black friend/teammate using the word ni**a. While probably shouldn't happen anymore it is commonly used and accepted. But that is just another example how twitter can be misinterpreted and get a player in trouble.

EXACTLY! Thank you. No surprise that the Missoulian couldn't explain this. If a white Griz player said something like that on twitter, they would be punished by UM and blasted by egriz and the Missoulian. And rightfully so. I'm sure Gwen could find some tweets by Will Cherry calling someone ni**a. Why doesn't she write about it? The same reason UM doesn't get involved, he's black and if you're white, you just don't go there.

What if a player is half black and half white? How would you or NCAA judge their tweets?

Whoa... Good one. And then, what if a player is half black and half white and bipolar with two twitter accounts? I'm thinking the sh** is going to hit the fan.