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Email from O'Day about the WAC, BSC & More.

to add on...a college kid gets offers saying we would love you to play for us up in montana....wait where is that again coach is that in the US??

or hey we would love for you to play football down here in southern cali. at sjsu.

kids says...well they both are not very good....hmmm cali...girls, beach, fun, hot , sunny
or montana...ummm i hear its cold there.

you better plan on getting some amazing coaches here..but then again we are just a fbs nobody...not a fcs stepping stone
 
number1debater said:
I really hope you guys don't believe this email is real. Talk about taking a hook line and sinker. bobcat nation served whoever "found" this email thread.

number1debater said:
MrTitleist said:
The email is real. It was posted on eGriz first, then removed by a mod because Jimbo asked that it not be made public, then someone else posted it again, and by that time, it was all over the place. Nice try though.

Ah, good point! Because there is no way someone would try to sell the validity of this by saying "please don't make this public." You sold me!

I'm sure it's real. JOD has been saying all the exact same stuff on his Facebook page. Just scroll down and look at his answers in the comment section:
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=23508042&v=wall&story_fbid=151333388238848
 
number1debater said:
Ah, good point! Because there is no way someone would try to sell the validity of this by saying "please don't make this public." You sold me!

Do you have a learning disability? I don't get what's so hard to understand about this.
 
mtgrizfankb said:
your all high on life...IF IF this is an actual email from Oday...then so be it. but if the ncaa has lost money and is so disperate...they would have changed a ton of things by now. there is no way they are standing by and losing money. nothing has changed. whoever wrote this email oday or not...does not like the FCS and are pointing out every thing "wrong with the griz and the FCS" while pointed out nothing that poor about the fbs system?? we are all acting like the ncaa is making moves and they are not. Only schools are making moves. schools are losing money...but the griz however...how would we gain money by moving up?? we wouldnt. Period. we would get the same fans at most. the prices cant really go up much more. we would need MORE scholarship money....a bigger stadium...more travel costs. Plus instead of playing up to 3 games on espn we would not get any. we already have maxed out our funds for advertising...thats what half the game is anyway...our announcer blabling on and on. if we were really struggling that bad....would the griz be doing half the stuff they are? new jerseys...special jerseys....gettting bids for fixing locker rooms... getting more stupid mascots....bought a new sound system. FBS schools need alot more funding than what we have. This town is pretty much tapped out. of talent...of money...of sponsors..of fans. its not like we will get more in state fans for being fbs and we gain most our out state fans for traveling in the playoffs. we were struggling that bad we would have bought out div 2 schools and played more FBS games... we are not losing our shirts that bad. i just think that missoula montana has 0% of the things needed to be a decent FBS team..sure we could go up and be the next tulsa...or marshall or idaho or flordai atl or ohio or akron or new mexico or sjsu or new mexico state or west michigan or la tech. but thats not the goal. so whats the point?

they say we are hurting our academics....but ours are on par with colorado ahead of most wac teams.
they say our kids hate it...really a national championship team is a national championship and players seem to love it
they say we are dominating...dominating the big sky as in beign 1-1??
they say we can compete at a higher level? like vs oregon...or iowa...??
they say we can get the players? the 2 and 3 star talent is what we get...the top 25 and historical programs get the 4 and 5s
they say bowls reward kids....here kids you got you ace beat 45% of the time this year and beat 5 wac/c.usa teams...congrats play in the mid atlanic southern holiday spread butter bowl in ohio. YAY
and to top it off the ncaa has said a few times if makes the most money of the year on the NCAA tourney in basketball. so if the ncaa was struggling so so so so so bad like claimed....dont you think that they would try and replicate the most profitable event they have??

This is a very good post.
 
"In asking faculty and deans who are their “peers,” they mentioned schools such as Idaho, Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State, Nevada, Wyoming, Colorado and Colorado State."

Aren't we all missing the point here? It's not just about football. It's also about academics. Perhaps academics are more important than football After all, when the Pac-10 went looking to become the Pac-12, it was about finding "peer" academic institutions, not "peer" football institutions.

As the study shows, the University of Montana is not on the same level with the rest of the Big Sky academically. To be honest, the only school even close is Montana State, but it lacks some core graduate programs that really sets the U of M apart regionally.

And if we are honest, we aren't a "peer" in football with the Big Sky anymore. We are better than a majority of the league. No school is suppose to win the conference for years, and years, and years, and years. We aren't playing against our "peers" in football in the Big Sky, and we aren't in study hall with them either. It's time to move on, and move up.
 
PlayerRep said:
mtgrizfankb said:
your all high on life...IF IF this is an actual email from Oday...then so be it. but if the ncaa has lost money and is so disperate...they would have changed a ton of things by now. there is no way they are standing by and losing money. nothing has changed. whoever wrote this email oday or not...does not like the FCS and are pointing out every thing "wrong with the griz and the FCS" while pointed out nothing that poor about the fbs system?? we are all acting like the ncaa is making moves and they are not. Only schools are making moves. schools are losing money...but the griz however...how would we gain money by moving up?? we wouldnt. Period. we would get the same fans at most. the prices cant really go up much more. we would need MORE scholarship money....a bigger stadium...more travel costs. Plus instead of playing up to 3 games on espn we would not get any. we already have maxed out our funds for advertising...thats what half the game is anyway...our announcer blabling on and on. if we were really struggling that bad....would the griz be doing half the stuff they are? new jerseys...special jerseys....gettting bids for fixing locker rooms... getting more stupid mascots....bought a new sound system. FBS schools need alot more funding than what we have. This town is pretty much tapped out. of talent...of money...of sponsors..of fans. its not like we will get more in state fans for being fbs and we gain most our out state fans for traveling in the playoffs. we were struggling that bad we would have bought out div 2 schools and played more FBS games... we are not losing our shirts that bad. i just think that missoula montana has 0% of the things needed to be a decent FBS team..sure we could go up and be the next tulsa...or marshall or idaho or flordai atl or ohio or akron or new mexico or sjsu or new mexico state or west michigan or la tech. but thats not the goal. so whats the point?

they say we are hurting our academics....but ours are on par with colorado ahead of most wac teams.
they say our kids hate it...really a national championship team is a national championship and players seem to love it
they say we are dominating...dominating the big sky as in beign 1-1??
they say we can compete at a higher level? like vs oregon...or iowa...??
they say we can get the players? the 2 and 3 star talent is what we get...the top 25 and historical programs get the 4 and 5s
they say bowls reward kids....here kids you got you ace beat 45% of the time this year and beat 5 wac/c.usa teams...congrats play in the mid atlanic southern holiday spread butter bowl in ohio. YAY
and to top it off the ncaa has said a few times if makes the most money of the year on the NCAA tourney in basketball. so if the ncaa was struggling so so so so so bad like claimed....dont you think that they would try and replicate the most profitable event they have??

This is a very good post.
A "very good post" :? You must admire incoherency. ;)
 
Flathead Griz said:
As I've said in several other posts, it is all about the money and TV revenue.

Big 12 Realignment: TV Revenue Fueling the Race To Expand

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/406030-college-football-realignment-tv-revenue-fueling-the-race-to-expand

How much revenue did your favorite Football Bowl Subdivision school take in in 2007-08? This chart will tell you :

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/sports_college/2009/07/how-much-revenue-did-your-favorite-fbs-school-take-in-in-200708-this-chart-will-tell-you.html
Thanks for sharing the link!
 
quote: "Aren't we all missing the point here? It's not just about football. It's also about academics. Perhaps academics are more important than football After all, when the Pac-10 went looking to become the Pac-12, it was about finding "peer" academic institutions, not "peer" football institutions."

Of all the stupid comments on EGriz......now we have somebody claiming academics are more important than athletics! What planet are you from? ;)
 
Grizmayor posts aside, here is my current reasoning for favoring a move.

Quite frankly, the welfare of the BSC and FCS concerns me much more than taking a chance in moving.

I have posted before that I am all for staying put if we could get guarantees and commitments from our current conference members to better their programs. Give me the assurance we get this commitment from other programs and their fans, then I will lessen my current outlook.

Right now, I do not like the dance we are in because our dance partners are weak. Does that make sense? WAC or Bigsky, we need better dance partners, or commitment of current partners to step it up!

Simple enough for you? Instead of arguing here someone give concrete plans to strengthen the current BSC and the FCS. I challenge every BSC school to at least get to 75% capacity every game, not just when the GRIZ come to town. I challenge every program and fan base to commit to excellence. How about creating a football environment.

Can someone come up with some suggestions and work on some plans to ensure the GRIZ becoming stronger, regardless of conference affiliation? I for one know many things have to be done. I can see that. O'day's letter even makes that more obvious. Rather than bicker, can we brainstorm to help with the cause, maybe offer prospective solutions to ponder?

With some of the know it all attitudes here, one would think it would be easy to come up with a solution that works? After all some of us know everything, yet none of us know a logical solutions for this!
 
Great post.

I believe its time to move up but for those who dont you make great points.

For those who are opposed to moving its time to admit to the issues we are currently facing in both the Big Sky and the FCS. Come up with some constructive proposals to help UM deal with these issues. Lets hear them. It would be ALOT more helpful than just dumping negative snyde comments etc about moving up.

If moving up isnt a fix lets hear what is?

And everything staying the same isnt an option, if you havent realized that yet you need to. Change is coming no matter were UM is in FCS or FBS in the near future.
 
Tokyogriz said:
Great post.

I believe its time to move up but for those who dont you make great points.

For those who are opposed to moving its time to admit to the issues we are currently facing in both the Big Sky and the FCS. Come up with some constructive proposals to help UM deal with these issues. Lets hear them. It would be ALOT more helpful than just dumping negative snyde comments etc about moving up.

If moving up isnt a fix lets hear what is?

And everything staying the same isnt an option, if you havent realized that yet you need to. Change is coming no matter were UM is in FCS or FBS in the near future.

Thanks TG, we either agree or disagree on subjects I guess. :thumb:

I just do not see the point in arguing this any longer now. Reminds me when I coached AAU ball. After the 1st few weekends I had 1/2 my players on one mindset and the other 1/2 on another due to being unfamiliar with another. Practice helped their skills, but not their mindset. Finally, on a tuesday night practice, I told them to put down the basketballs, stop stretching, grab a seat and just think. I told them we would not touch a basketball until they collectively could come together as to what needed to be done as a team to get better. After 15 minutes of silence, one player spoke up, another, etc. Within 15 minutes they had it figured out.

Each game and practice we got better. Being on the same page and unity was there rest of the season. Amazing 9 jr high kids can figure something out like that, but adults struggle with it sometimes. :thumb:
 
Question is answered about its authenticity.

From today's Missoulian....


An e-mail written by University of Montana athletic director Jim O’Day, apparently sent to an unidentified Grizzly booster, has ruffled feathers across the Big Sky Conference and beyond.

Big Sky Conference commissioner Doug Fullerton said Friday that he’d been on the phone much of the day with commissioners around the Football Championship Subdivision, the future of which is questioned in an e-mail from O’Day that was made public this week.

In it, O’Day addresses several points, from the financial strain the FCS playoff system puts on participating schools to a potential merger of the Big Sky and Western Athletic conferences. Montana’s pursuit by the WAC, a Football Bowl Subdivision conference in upheaval, is at the center of it.

*****

But O’Day’s five-page memo struck Fullerton as favoring a move up to the FBS. Several points jarred the commissioner, including the question: “Should the FCS fail – which is another possibility, especially with Appalachian State, James Madison, Villanova, Delaware, Georgia Southern and Richmond and others being considered for moves (to) FBS conferences – would (UM) be all alone?”

“That drew the interest not only of the commissioners of the other FCS conferences, it got the attention of the people at the NCAA,” said Fullerton, who maintains the death of the FCS is greatly exaggerated and in fact feels the growth of super conferences puts several FBS programs on shaky ground.

“There’s a real concern that the FBS is unsustainable, particularly at the lowest levels,” Fullerton asserted. “The (cost) increase is happening so fast, people are saying, ‘OK, how are we going to sustain this level of football?’ ”

Fullerton has expressed hope that Montana has all the facts before it moves into a conference that is losing big-ticket members Boise State, Fresno State and Nevada.

“The FCS is going to become an ever more major player in the future,” Fullerton added. “And the NCAA is going to talk about learning-based decision making. People need to understand that developing your brand and having athletics do what it’s supposed to do for a university, often has nothing to do with moving up a level. You find the level that works for you and you stay there, where you can afford to do it.”

Publicly, O’Day has made fans aware of the potential cost increases of moving up, and addresses many of the concerns along with the potential for added revenue, particularly from television contracts.

But O’Day’s written assertion that the $100,000 TV contract for the Cat-Griz game was unfairly geared toward MSU when it was the home team – the MSU athletic department earned $60,000 from the game, the Griz $35,000 – was misleading, Fullerton said, as was the line: “The television money should be following UM, but we get outvoted on this 8-1 whenever it comes up.”

“About six years ago we changed the TV money at Montana’s request,” Fullerton said. “We used to have a much more socialistic approach and used to spread the money throughout the league to help make the teams stronger.”

*****

Montana, which has had all of its games televised for several years, fought to keep more of the money and succeeded, Fullerton said.

“That’s the only time it was ever brought up; there’s never been an 8-1 vote,” Fullerton said. “We’ve never stood in the way of them making their TV money.”

Fullerton also said for the Cat-Griz game the home team gets more money to guard against a bad-weather game hurting the gate, though it should be noted the games are quickly sold out regardless of the weather.

“It’s really a red herring,” Fullerton concluded.

O’Day could be construed to be “spit-balling” his way through an informal response.

“It was a personal letter to somebody, explaining how complicated a potential move up could be,” O’Day said Friday after a Grizzly function in Denver (the Griz play football at Northern Colorado Saturday). “Basically, the letter stands on its own.”

O’Day does make valid points: The FCS title game was moved to Frisco, Texas, this season in the hopes of generating more revenue in football-crazed Texas, but its Jan. 7 date will coincide with the Cotton Bowl in nearby Dallas.

He also bemoans the welfare of the student-athlete who plays four extra weeks of football – five, possibly, with the addition of another playoff tier – at the FCS level.

O’Day noted that Montana lost $150,000 by making the last two FCS title games, and added that UM made around $100,000 for its three home playoff games last season while producing $1.1 million of last year’s FCS $2.5 million playoff budget.

In closing the letter mentions that incoming UM President Royce Engstrom will have the final say, pending support from the Board of Regents.

“Wish it were easier, but it isn’t,” he wrote. “At least UM has options – others are only followers in all of these discussions."

“As you can see, there are no easy answers,” he added. “And it is very, very complicated.”

Fullerton’s stance is that O’Day didn’t make things any easier with the e-mail.

“His job is to get all the information out there,” Fullerton said, before adding that that’s his job as well.

“My job is not to stand at the door, arms out, saying, ‘You can’t leave,’ ” he added.

O’Day apparently sent out a follow-up e-mail apologizing for his remarks, though Fullerton didn’t confirm that. Whatever the case, this may take a while to blow over Griz Nation and the rest of the FCS.

“It’s going to be hard to get this back in the bottle,” Fullerton said.
 
ordigger said:
Question is answered about its authenticity.

He also bemoans the welfare of the student-athlete who plays four extra weeks of football – five, possibly, with the addition of another playoff tier – at the FCS level.

WTF on this statement? What about those in basketball that make March Madness?
Does he bemoan that they miss three-four weeks of school and the money it takes to send teams to March Madness (especially from one weekend to another they go to different parts of the US)?
And those that don't make March Madness but go to the NIT playoffs? They get to go to other places in the US with less money thrown their way?

I throw out the BS flag and say he is talking out of both sides of his mouth
 
It is refreshing to hear our Athletic Director outline the issues. If Fullerton doesn't like it, Oh well..
 
fltheadgriz said:
ordigger said:
Question is answered about its authenticity.

He also bemoans the welfare of the student-athlete who plays four extra weeks of football – five, possibly, with the addition of another playoff tier – at the FCS level.

WTF on this statement? What about those in basketball that make March Madness?
Does he bemoan that they miss three-four weeks of school and the money it takes to send teams to March Madness (especially from one weekend to another they go to different parts of the US)?
And those that don't make March Madness but go to the NIT playoffs? They get to go to other places in the US with less money thrown their way?

I throw out the BS flag and say he is talking out of both sides of his mouth
You cannot be serious if you are comparing the beating a football player takes per game to what a basketball player experiences. :?
 
GrizWhiz, I think they are referencing the academic welfare of the student-athlete because of all the missed classtime, etc.
 
grizindabox said:
GrizWhiz, I think they are referencing the academic welfare of the student-athlete because of all the missed classtime, etc.

I felt oday was really talking about both academics suffering AND physically the football players are getting banged up playing an extra 4 games a year. Just my take.
 
It seems as if the moment is fraught with peril no matter what we do or don't do. I have long been a fan of staying put, with the actual championship being decided on the field, and a feeling of some sort of equality at least at the playoff level. Now, I am not so sure.
Some have mentioned dropping NAU, ISU and No Co, but what if they just quit? We would no longer be a big enough conference to retain an AQ status for the playoffs, and most of the FCS writers are in the East, so maybe one school would get in the playoffs from the Big Sky, but not two. Throw in the idea that Cal Poly and UC Davis may be in the Big Sky for only as long as it takes to be added to some new FBS conference centered in California, and the Big Sky could completely disappear. Add in the problem of Title IX. As the future of college education is being predicted, soon 75-80% of students are going to be female. If so, then that same percentage has to be applied to sports. With the size of the football team, it's entirely possible that football will be the only male sport played. Bye bye basketball, track, etc.
Then there is the idea of joining the WAC which brought O'Day to Texas so he could watch the presentations of Seattle U and some other no name that are applying. If we did go to the WAC what schools will be there in two or three more years? Would we be moving from one imploding conference to another?
The way I see it, in ten years there will be no FCS teams of consequence west of the Mississippi. TThe FCS will become a version of JuCo championship, interesting only to those in their geographic area. The old Big Sky will probably be reconstituted at the FBS level, and it would be cool to have UNR, Boise State Montana and Idaho in the same conference again, even though I doubt it will happen. But with all of those tiny schools trying to move into the FBS, who would be left to play that would be willing to travel to Montana?
We have two choices and they both involve moving up. First, go with the WAC invite, try to get up to full speed and look for a better conference if available. Second, stay in the FCS and hope that enough FCS schools in the West decide to move up at the same time to create our own conference.

We are living the Chinese curse: "May you live in interesting times."

:coffee:
 

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