Cornerback Position

[Htowngriz]

There are FCS All American corners every single year. The BSC produces All BSC corners every single year.

Tired of the corners are hard to find nonsense.

Corners are hard to find. There’s a reason they’re paid so well in the NFL. It’s because the ideal body type and skill set is so rare, that when you find one it becomes significantly valuable. A lot of coaches say it is the most important position on the field. You can protect every other position on the field, but if you have a slapstick corner you will be exposed at one point or another. The obvious answer to shitty corners is cover 2, but cover 2 to 12/21 personnel is less than ideal.

Point being is corners are hard to find, and corners that want to play in Montana cold are less than hard to find given their demographic quite frankly.

Don’t give me examples of the great corners we have had because it doesn’t matter. Those are outliers, but generally they will be significantly more difficult for Montana to find than other positions and other schools.

Stop gumming up this discussion with facts.

 

[AZGrizFan]

There are FCS All American corners every single year. The BSC produces All BSC corners every single year.

Tired of the corners are hard to find nonsense.

Corners are hard to find. There’s a reason they’re paid so well in the NFL. It’s because the ideal body type and skill set is so rare, that when you find one it becomes significantly valuable. A lot of coaches say it is the most important position on the field. You can protect every other position on the field, but if you have a slapstick corner you will be exposed at one point or another. The obvious answer to shitty corners is cover 2, but cover 2 to 12/21 personnel is less than ideal.

Point being is corners are hard to find, and corners that want to play in Montana cold are less than hard to find given their demographic quite frankly.

Don’t give me examples of the great corners we have had because it doesn’t matter. Those are outliers, but generally they will be significantly more difficult for Montana to find than other positions and other schools.

223, I have a question, give your take: Now I know we don't know how they'll turn out, but in the past two years MSU has signed 4-5 3-star CB's....(I'm kind of making that number up because I'm too lazy to do the research but I remember reading about it on here a number of times). So my question is this: Is it THAT much warmer in Bozeman? :| :| :|

 

[HookedonGriz]

There are FCS All American corners every single year. The BSC produces All BSC corners every single year.

Tired of the corners are hard to find nonsense.

Corners are hard to find. There’s a reason they’re paid so well in the NFL. It’s because the ideal body type and skill set is so rare, that when you find one it becomes significantly valuable. A lot of coaches say it is the most important position on the field. You can protect every other position on the field, but if you have a slapstick corner you will be exposed at one point or another. The obvious answer to shitty corners is cover 2, but cover 2 to 12/21 personnel is less than ideal.

Point being is corners are hard to find, and corners that want to play in Montana cold are less than hard to find given their demographic quite frankly.

Don’t give me examples of the great corners we have had because it doesn’t matter. Those are outliers, but generally they will be significantly more difficult for Montana to find than other positions and other schools.

223, I have a question, give your take: Now I know we don't know how they'll turn out, but in the past two years MSU has signed 4-5 3-star CB's....(I'm kind of making that number up because I'm too lazy to do the research but I remember reading about it on here a number of times). So my question is this: Is it THAT much warmer in Bozeman? :| :| :|

Some of that may be attributed to a difference in recruiting philosophy though. Choate has come out and said he tries to grab three or four corners in hopes that one works out

 

[AZGrizFan]

There are FCS All American corners every single year. The BSC produces All BSC corners every single year.

Tired of the corners are hard to find nonsense.

Corners are hard to find. There’s a reason they’re paid so well in the NFL. It’s because the ideal body type and skill set is so rare, that when you find one it becomes significantly valuable. A lot of coaches say it is the most important position on the field. You can protect every other position on the field, but if you have a slapstick corner you will be exposed at one point or another. The obvious answer to shitty corners is cover 2, but cover 2 to 12/21 personnel is less than ideal.

Point being is corners are hard to find, and corners that want to play in Montana cold are less than hard to find given their demographic quite frankly.

Don’t give me examples of the great corners we have had because it doesn’t matter. Those are outliers, but generally they will be significantly more difficult for Montana to find than other positions and other schools.

223, I have a question, give your take: Now I know we don't know how they'll turn out, but in the past two years MSU has signed 4-5 3-star CB's....(I'm kind of making that number up because I'm too lazy to do the research but I remember reading about it on here a number of times). So my question is this: Is it THAT much warmer in Bozeman? :| :| :|

Some of that may be attributed to a difference in recruiting philosophy though. Choate has come out and said he tries to grab three or four corners in hopes that one works out

And Bobby does what? Recruits one guy and pins all his hopes on that guy? I'm fairly confident Bobby hopes to bring in 3-4 each class just like every other coach....

 

[Missoula223]

There are FCS All American corners every single year. The BSC produces All BSC corners every single year.

Tired of the corners are hard to find nonsense.

Corners are hard to find. There’s a reason they’re paid so well in the NFL. It’s because the ideal body type and skill set is so rare, that when you find one it becomes significantly valuable. A lot of coaches say it is the most important position on the field. You can protect every other position on the field, but if you have a slapstick corner you will be exposed at one point or another. The obvious answer to shitty corners is cover 2, but cover 2 to 12/21 personnel is less than ideal.

Point being is corners are hard to find, and corners that want to play in Montana cold are less than hard to find given their demographic quite frankly.

Don’t give me examples of the great corners we have had because it doesn’t matter. Those are outliers, but generally they will be significantly more difficult for Montana to find than other positions and other schools.

223, I have a question, give your take: Now I know we don't know how they'll turn out, but in the past two years MSU has signed 4-5 3-star CB's....(I'm kind of making that number up because I'm too lazy to do the research but I remember reading about it on here a number of times). So my question is this: Is it THAT much warmer in Bozeman? :| :| :|

Right I don’t know if those numbers are correct either. To answer your question, no obviously it’s not, but that doesn’t detract in the difficulty in doing so. McGhee was an established recruiter in Texas. If you sign 1 ideal top tier guy a year that’s a hell of a year for a school like that. It will be interesting to see how they do in signing those guys with him gone.

Another point is since the new staff got in they got a freshman everyone seems to like in Corbin Walker, and I think a steal in Autjoe Soe.

Every college in America is looking for JC corners so quite frankly if you don’t get them it isn’t because of effort.

 

[SACCAT66]

There are FCS All American corners every single year. The BSC produces All BSC corners every single year.

Tired of the corners are hard to find nonsense.

Corners are hard to find. There’s a reason they’re paid so well in the NFL. It’s because the ideal body type and skill set is so rare, that when you find one it becomes significantly valuable. A lot of coaches say it is the most important position on the field. You can protect every other position on the field, but if you have a slapstick corner you will be exposed at one point or another. The obvious answer to shitty corners is cover 2, but cover 2 to 12/21 personnel is less than ideal.

Point being is corners are hard to find, and corners that want to play in Montana cold are less than hard to find given their demographic quite frankly.

Don’t give me examples of the great corners we have had because it doesn’t matter. Those are outliers, but generally they will be significantly more difficult for Montana to find than other positions and other schools.

223, I have a question, give your take: Now I know we don't know how they'll turn out, but in the past two years MSU has signed 4-5 3-star CB's....(I'm kind of making that number up because I'm too lazy to do the research but I remember reading about it on here a number of times). So my question is this: Is it THAT much warmer in Bozeman? :| :| :|

Some of that may be attributed to a difference in recruiting philosophy though. Choate has come out and said he tries to grab three or four corners in hopes that one works out

This, and also scheme. It is hard to teach a kid (no matter how many stars are behind his name) how to play different cover zone packages in College. When they are in high school they are put on an island and only have to cover one guy. They are all great athletes, and so they excel at this at that level. Then they get to College, and they are now having to learn the opposite... Don't chase the receiver, stay in your zone. Look at it like trying to play against a triple option team for a defense.. The griz seem to have a scheme where everything is filtered from the outside in towards the safeties and LB's (this is just my opinion from the few games I watched. But when you have offenses like the Big Sky (lots of 4 wide with TE covers) it is hard for the outside CB to filter those in while also covering out routes, and RB coming out of backfield.

 

[AZGrizFan]

This, and also scheme. It is hard to teach a kid (no matter how many stars are behind his name) how to play different cover zone packages in College. When they are in high school they are put on an island and only have to cover one guy. They are all great athletes, and so they excel at this at that level. Then they get to College, and they are now having to learn the opposite... Don't chase the receiver, stay in your zone. Look at it like trying to play against a triple option team for a defense.. The griz seem to have a scheme where everything is filtered from the outside in towards the safeties and LB's (this is just my opinion from the few games I watched. But when you have offenses like the Big Sky (lots of 4 wide with TE covers) it is hard for the outside CB to filter those in while also covering out routes, and RB coming out of backfield.

Watching San Fran fuck up zone coverage against Tyreek Hill and Mahomes at a critical point (3rd & 14, late 4th quarter) in the Super Bowl points to the difficulty you speak of.

 

[SACCAT66]

This, and also scheme. It is hard to teach a kid (no matter how many stars are behind his name) how to play different cover zone packages in College. When they are in high school they are put on an island and only have to cover one guy. They are all great athletes, and so they excel at this at that level. Then they get to College, and they are now having to learn the opposite... Don't chase the receiver, stay in your zone. Look at it like trying to play against a triple option team for a defense.. The griz seem to have a scheme where everything is filtered from the outside in towards the safeties and LB's (this is just my opinion from the few games I watched. But when you have offenses like the Big Sky (lots of 4 wide with TE covers) it is hard for the outside CB to filter those in while also covering out routes, and RB coming out of backfield.

Watching San Fran [*]f*** up zone coverage against Tyreek Hill and Mahomes at a critical point (3rd & 14, late 4th quarter) in the Super Bowl points to the difficulty you speak of.

Not to name drop like PR, but I interviewed Joey Thomas for my sports show, and he talked a little about this. He said he would much rather play strait up Man, and get beat than have to rely on others to cover guys (paraphrasing there). He talked about how tuff it is to coach kids to not be physical and play an area. If NFL covers struggle with this, you can imagine how hard it is to find FCS players that can get it down. Then you throw on good QB's like Sneed throwing to good WR like Toure, and it is a VERY tall task.

 

[SACCAT66]

Corners are hard to find. There’s a reason they’re paid so well in the NFL. It’s because the ideal body type and skill set is so rare, that when you find one it becomes significantly valuable. A lot of coaches say it is the most important position on the field. You can protect every other position on the field, but if you have a slapstick corner you will be exposed at one point or another. The obvious answer to shitty corners is cover 2, but cover 2 to 12/21 personnel is less than ideal.

Point being is corners are hard to find, and corners that want to play in Montana cold are less than hard to find given their demographic quite frankly.

Don’t give me examples of the great corners we have had because it doesn’t matter. Those are outliers, but generally they will be significantly more difficult for Montana to find than other positions and other schools.

223, I have a question, give your take: Now I know we don't know how they'll turn out, but in the past two years MSU has signed 4-5 3-star CB's....(I'm kind of making that number up because I'm too lazy to do the research but I remember reading about it on here a number of times). So my question is this: Is it THAT much warmer in Bozeman? :| :| :|

Some of that may be attributed to a difference in recruiting philosophy though. Choate has come out and said he tries to grab three or four corners in hopes that one works out

And Bobby does what? Recruits one guy and pins all his hopes on that guy? I'm fairly confident Bobby hopes to bring in 3-4 each class just like every other coach....

Also, it is easier to recruit a lot of these kids to MSU when we have a MILF academy every summer... (that one is for CDA)

 

[Htowngriz]

223, I have a question, give your take: Now I know we don't know how they'll turn out, but in the past two years MSU has signed 4-5 3-star CB's....(I'm kind of making that number up because I'm too lazy to do the research but I remember reading about it on here a number of times). So my question is this: Is it THAT much warmer in Bozeman? :| :| :|

Some of that may be attributed to a difference in recruiting philosophy though. Choate has come out and said he tries to grab three or four corners in hopes that one works out

And Bobby does what? Recruits one guy and pins all his hopes on that guy? I'm fairly confident Bobby hopes to bring in 3-4 each class just like every other coach....

Also, it is easier to recruit a lot of these kids to MSU when we have a MILF academy every summer... (that one is for CDA)

That one's for all of us, Sac. :lol:

 

[PlayerRep]

I think we'll like the Oregon St transfers. Both are fast. Probably more athletic than most recent corners at UM. Walker is talented and will keep getting better.

UM has produced at least 4 NFL corners that I can think of.

You could definitely be right but it’s just a prediction without anything concrete. Personally I am going to have to see something in Spring ball from them before I feel alright about the transfers. Additionally, walker had up and down moments. Granted he was a true freshman.

These transfers have played only safety ever that includes high school. Even dropping down a level, Big Sky receivers are pretty damn good. WR position is closer to FBS talent than most think in this conference. I don’t think anyone should assume anything at this point with that position.

They have both played some corner and don't expect playing corner to be a problem. They are both fast and athletic and have nice size for corner. One was .01 from being the 3d fastest player, and fastest d-back, at Oregon St last year. That's speed. Yes, everyone will have to see what they can do in spring ball.

 

[Missoula223]

Corners are hard to find. There’s a reason they’re paid so well in the NFL. It’s because the ideal body type and skill set is so rare, that when you find one it becomes significantly valuable. A lot of coaches say it is the most important position on the field. You can protect every other position on the field, but if you have a slapstick corner you will be exposed at one point or another. The obvious answer to shitty corners is cover 2, but cover 2 to 12/21 personnel is less than ideal.

Point being is corners are hard to find, and corners that want to play in Montana cold are less than hard to find given their demographic quite frankly.

Don’t give me examples of the great corners we have had because it doesn’t matter. Those are outliers, but generally they will be significantly more difficult for Montana to find than other positions and other schools.

223, I have a question, give your take: Now I know we don't know how they'll turn out, but in the past two years MSU has signed 4-5 3-star CB's....(I'm kind of making that number up because I'm too lazy to do the research but I remember reading about it on here a number of times). So my question is this: Is it THAT much warmer in Bozeman? :| :| :|

Some of that may be attributed to a difference in recruiting philosophy though. Choate has come out and said he tries to grab three or four corners in hopes that one works out

This, and also scheme. It is hard to teach a kid (no matter how many stars are behind his name) how to play different cover zone packages in College. When they are in high school they are put on an island and only have to cover one guy. They are all great athletes, and so they excel at this at that level. Then they get to College, and they are now having to learn the opposite... Don't chase the receiver, stay in your zone. Look at it like trying to play against a triple option team for a defense.. The griz seem to have a scheme where everything is filtered from the outside in towards the safeties and LB's (this is just my opinion from the few games I watched. But when you have offenses like the Big Sky (lots of 4 wide with TE covers) it is hard for the outside CB to filter those in while also covering out routes, and RB coming out of backfield.

I don’t disagree regarding scheme makes a difference, but I will say zone is easy to teach. Anyone can guard an area, it takes special athletes to guard dudes man to man.

Every DC in America wants to be able to play man free but can’t because they don’t have dudes that can cover consistently or a pass rush that can get home with 4. If you want to bring 5, your choices are man free or fire zone coverage.

 

[PlayerRep]

223, I have a question, give your take: Now I know we don't know how they'll turn out, but in the past two years MSU has signed 4-5 3-star CB's....(I'm kind of making that number up because I'm too lazy to do the research but I remember reading about it on here a number of times). So my question is this: Is it THAT much warmer in Bozeman? :| :| :|

Some of that may be attributed to a difference in recruiting philosophy though. Choate has come out and said he tries to grab three or four corners in hopes that one works out

This, and also scheme. It is hard to teach a kid (no matter how many stars are behind his name) how to play different cover zone packages in College. When they are in high school they are put on an island and only have to cover one guy. They are all great athletes, and so they excel at this at that level. Then they get to College, and they are now having to learn the opposite... Don't chase the receiver, stay in your zone. Look at it like trying to play against a triple option team for a defense.. The griz seem to have a scheme where everything is filtered from the outside in towards the safeties and LB's (this is just my opinion from the few games I watched. But when you have offenses like the Big Sky (lots of 4 wide with TE covers) it is hard for the outside CB to filter those in while also covering out routes, and RB coming out of backfield.

I don’t disagree regarding scheme makes a difference, but I will say zone is easy to teach. Anyone can guard an area, it takes special athletes to guard dudes man to man.

Every DC in America wants to be able to play man free but can’t because they don’t have dudes that can cover consistently or a pass rush that can get home with 4. If you want to bring 5, your choices are man free or fire zone coverage.

I agree completely.

With modern day complicated and mixed coverages, there are more choices.There is more of a pre-snap mental aspect. The defense, the other team's formation, where to line up, and who's responsible for what in the zone, or combo zone-man. I don't think it's hard to learn to play zone coverage, tho, as 223 said. What's hard is playing man coverage against a very good and athletic receiver, especially one who is more athletic and faster than the defender. Good eyes are very important in zone coverage. Not so in man. I do think it takes some time to learn all of the coverages of modern day football, and that does take some time.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

223, I have a question, give your take: Now I know we don't know how they'll turn out, but in the past two years MSU has signed 4-5 3-star CB's....(I'm kind of making that number up because I'm too lazy to do the research but I remember reading about it on here a number of times). So my question is this: Is it THAT much warmer in Bozeman? :| :| :|

Some of that may be attributed to a difference in recruiting philosophy though. Choate has come out and said he tries to grab three or four corners in hopes that one works out

And Bobby does what? Recruits one guy and pins all his hopes on that guy? I'm fairly confident Bobby hopes to bring in 3-4 each class just like every other coach....

Also, it is easier to recruit a lot of these kids to MSU when we have a MILF academy every summer... (that one is for CDA)

Thank you kindly, sir. MSU is winning the MILF Arms Race. BH needs to recognize that failure to evolve is fatal to a program.

 

[kemajic]

Some of that may be attributed to a difference in recruiting philosophy though. Choate has come out and said he tries to grab three or four corners in hopes that one works out

And Bobby does what? Recruits one guy and pins all his hopes on that guy? I'm fairly confident Bobby hopes to bring in 3-4 each class just like every other coach....

Also, it is easier to recruit a lot of these kids to MSU when we have a MILF academy every summer... (that one is for CDA)

Thank you kindly, sir. MSU is winning the MILF Arms Race. BH needs to recognize that failure to evolve is fatal to a program.

BH recognizes there is CB talent hidden in HS WRs.

 

[CDAGRIZ]

And Bobby does what? Recruits one guy and pins all his hopes on that guy? I'm fairly confident Bobby hopes to bring in 3-4 each class just like every other coach....

Also, it is easier to recruit a lot of these kids to MSU when we have a MILF academy every summer... (that one is for CDA)

Thank you kindly, sir. MSU is winning the MILF Arms Race. BH needs to recognize that failure to evolve is fatal to a program.

BH recognizes there is CB talent hidden in HS WRs.

Nice in theory, but it hasn't come close to MILF Academy standards. You know it, I know it, and Bob Dole knows it.

 

[IntuitiveGriz]

Good corners are hard to find, and corners who turn into good internet posters are even harder to find.

This is an under-appreciated post. PR with the mic drop.

Ironic, said CB existed before the internet. Hell, said CB, existed before home computers. Hell, what technology was prevalent when said CB played? Lol

My college was very advanced with computers when I attended. Two of my professors, Kemeny and Kurtzm, invented a very important code, called Basic. I created a rudimentary program for scouting the passing game of opposing teams for my main project in a computer programming glass.

Invented in early form in 1984.

"BASIC was the language of the personal computer back in the 1980s. It was also the language that most people associate with Microsoft in its early days - Microsoft Basic, then QBasic, Visual Basic and finally Visual Basic .NET. Microsoft started as a company by selling implemenations of the language for just about every personal computer on the market."

Kemeny was a math guy. Princeton. Became a research assistant to Albert Einstein. Kemeny became Dartmouth's president while I was there.


https://www.i-programmer.info/history/people/739-kemeny-a-kurtz.html

Interesting. I remember taking BASIC programming in my senior year of high school in '89. I can still see those flow charts in my head. No wait, my eighties Alyssa Milano poster now is crowding that out. :arrow: :lol:

 

[CDAGRIZ]

This is an under-appreciated post. PR with the mic drop.

Ironic, said CB existed before the internet. Hell, said CB, existed before home computers. Hell, what technology was prevalent when said CB played? Lol

My college was very advanced with computers when I attended. Two of my professors, Kemeny and Kurtzm, invented a very important code, called Basic. I created a rudimentary program for scouting the passing game of opposing teams for my main project in a computer programming glass.

Invented in early form in 1984.

"BASIC was the language of the personal computer back in the 1980s. It was also the language that most people associate with Microsoft in its early days - Microsoft Basic, then QBasic, Visual Basic and finally Visual Basic .NET. Microsoft started as a company by selling implemenations of the language for just about every personal computer on the market."

Kemeny was a math guy. Princeton. Became a research assistant to Albert Einstein. Kemeny became Dartmouth's president while I was there.


https://www.i-programmer.info/history/people/739-kemeny-a-kurtz.html

Interesting. I remember taking BASIC programming in my senior year of high school in '89. I can still see those flow charts in my head. No wait, my eighties Alyssa Milano poster now is crowding that out. :arrow: :lol:

I raise:

 

[IntuitiveGriz]

CDAGRIZ - I FOLD, you win! Hahaha

 

[AZGrizFan]

CDAGRIZ - I FOLD, you win! Hahaha

Yes, he does. Milano is full on crazy mode, nuttier than a goddamned fruitcake. :? :?