Big Sky establishes serious misconduct rule

[mtgrizfankb]

I know this question is apples and oranges, but hoping someone has some insight...

If I have a son or daughter attending UM on a full or near-full academic scholarship, and they commit an offense deemed "serious misconduct," does the University revoke the scholarship? How?

Lines of The Student Code of Conduct under Violations of the Student Code of Conduct

19. Homicide, assault, aggravated or felony assault, or threat of the same.
20. Conduct that recklessly or otherwise threatens or endangers the health or safety
of another person.
15. Malicious intimidation or harassment of another. When a student, with the intent to
terrify, intimidate, threaten, or harass (1) causes bodily injury to another, (2) causes
reasonable apprehension of bodily injury in another, (3) damages, destroys, or defaces
any property of another or any public property, or (4) makes repeated, persistent and/or
severe communications, including telephone, digital, or electronic communications, that
are unwelcome to the receiver.

 

[SoldierGriz]

I know this question is apples and oranges, but hoping someone has some insight...

If I have a son or daughter attending UM on a full or near-full academic scholarship, and they commit an offense deemed "serious misconduct," does the University revoke the scholarship? How?

Lines of The Student Code of Conduct under Violations of the Student Code of Conduct

19. Homicide, assault, aggravated or felony assault, or threat of the same.
20. Conduct that recklessly or otherwise threatens or endangers the health or safety
of another person.
15. Malicious intimidation or harassment of another. When a student, with the intent to
terrify, intimidate, threaten, or harass (1) causes bodily injury to another, (2) causes
reasonable apprehension of bodily injury in another, (3) damages, destroys, or defaces
any property of another or any public property, or (4) makes repeated, persistent and/or
severe communications, including telephone, digital, or electronic communications, that
are unwelcome to the receiver.

Thanks.

 

[PlayerRep]

I know this question is apples and oranges, but hoping someone has some insight...

If I have a son or daughter attending UM on a full or near-full academic scholarship, and they commit an offense deemed "serious misconduct," does the University revoke the scholarship? How?

Lines of The Student Code of Conduct under Violations of the Student Code of Conduct

19. Homicide, assault, aggravated or felony assault, or threat of the same.
20. Conduct that recklessly or otherwise threatens or endangers the health or safety
of another person.
15. Malicious intimidation or harassment of another. When a student, with the intent to
terrify, intimidate, threaten, or harass (1) causes bodily injury to another, (2) causes
reasonable apprehension of bodily injury in another, (3) damages, destroys, or defaces
any property of another or any public property, or (4) makes repeated, persistent and/or
severe communications, including telephone, digital, or electronic communications, that
are unwelcome to the receiver.

Okay, violation of policy. Does it also say they will automatically lose their scholarship, or get kicked out of school?

 

[Amie]

If y'all want details than the press release gave:

http://406mtsports.com/college/big-...cle_9f891326-e768-5f7f-8a96-10e1fe059a5f.html

 

[PlayerRep]

Big Sky leading the way or out of step?

"The Big Sky is the first league in the NCAA to ban student-athletes with misdemeanor or felony convictions of serious misconduct across the board."

"I'm really proud that the Big Sky Conference would step up and set this kind of a policy," Montana's Athletic Director Kent Haslam told 406mtsports.com. "It really in many, many ways aligns perfectly with what we already have in place through our student-athlete code of conduct."

Kent: It doesn't align with the Athletic Code. It goes far beyond it. Think misdemeanor. 2 game suspension in the Athletic Code. Not banned for life.

"Several athletic departments across the country, such as Indiana University, have similar iterations of the Big Sky's policy, but the biggest difference is that Indiana and other schools ban felony convictions only, not misdemeanors."

Hope this doesn't get press that ends up having recruits looking elsewhere.

I don't believe in lessor organizations or organizations that are not leaders, getting out in front and trying to lead the way. If no one follows, it makes the organization an outlier. Generally speaking, some organizations are better off not breaking new ground. Being a quick follower is often the better approach.

 

[Sam A. Blitz]

If you are a believer that punishment deters bad behavior/crime, then this is a good thing for the student athlete.

 

[KILO217]

Don't we want to recruit good student athletes who are good citizens too? The vast majority - probably about 95% - of all student athletes never get in trouble during their college career, why are we justifying being lenient on the few who can't behave? Seems to me the proposed guidelines cover behavior we shouldn't condone - assaults, rapes and domestic violence. I don't think its unreasonable to expect those getting scholarships to be good citizens and not criminals...

 

[Ursa Major]

Agree. Like the rule. It's beyond time to hold athletes accountable.


Quick question, however: Does the rule apply to student-athletes who repeatedly bang their own head into a wall following shitty officiating of their game in the bsc? Asking for a friend.

This is a brilliant repurposing for my shed! :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[PlayerRep]

Don't we want to recruit good student athletes who are good citizens too? The vast majority - probably about 95% - of all student athletes never get in trouble during their college career, why are we justifying being lenient on the few who can't behave? Seems to me the proposed guidelines cover behavior we shouldn't condone - assaults, rapes and domestic violence. I don't think its unreasonable to expect those getting scholarships to be good citizens and not criminals...

No one is suggesting being "lenient". The question is: how severe should the punishment be?

Do you think all conferences or the ncaa should' have these rules? Then, any of these enumerated would be the end of a kid's college football career, whether it happened in high school or college. A college sports death penalty.

Does anyone recall how Hilliard's partner assault/abuse charge was resolved? I think it might have been a plea, or solo plea. So, if true, his college career over in the Big Sky.

How about Big Sky conference coaches or people in athletic departments? Should they be able to coach if this ever happened to them in the past?

How about this? I realize I'm stretching the rule. No one with a misdemeanor partner plea/conviction should ever be able to work again? Why should this Big Sky rule apply only to college sports?

 

[PlayerRep]

How is "serious bodily injury" going to be defined? Similar to state felony statutes? I assume all state statutes/interpretations are not the same.

Note that MT's felony assault, serious bodily harm, includes knowingly and purposely. That's not in the new Big Sky code.

How about vehicular assault? A kid runs a red light and hits someone causing serious injuries? Can't play sports in the Big Sky ever.

Stalking? Really? Not sure what misdemeanor stalking entails?

What is "sexual exploitation"? Is that all youth stuff? Where does sexting fit in? If a group of young get caught sexting, does that disqualify them for life for playing sports in the Big Sky? Just asking, I don't know

 

[PlayerRep]

Sorry, double post.

 

[grizeyes]

So, kids drinking after a game and throw a beer bottle at a sign - common practice when I was at college. Gets stopped, misdemeanor vandalism charge and he/she loses their scholarship and is done in the Big Sky forever? Really? I understand a felony charge but would this ban apply to the example I just gave?

Go Griz!

 

[SoldierGriz]

This whole thing seems like bureaucrats doing bureaucratic things.

The University already removed most of the coach discretion for dealing with misconduct, which was a good move IMO. I'd argue athletes are already held to a much higher standard than the rest of the student body.

Seems like a solution looking for a problem? I agree with PR - there will be some unintended consequences.

 

[PlayerRep]

So, kids drinking after a game and throw a beer bottle at a sign - common practice when I was at college. Gets stopped, misdemeanor vandalism charge and he/she loses their scholarship and is done in the Big Sky forever? Really? I understand a felony charge but would this ban apply to the example I just gave?

Go Griz!

I don't think this one gets caught under the new policy, unless I am missing something.

 

[GrizRealist]

This is absolutely a step in the right direction. Is it perfect? Definitely not. But, if your a student athlete and can refrain from doing stupid sh%t you have nothing to worry about. I get the perspective people are talking about on here. College kids do dumb things and most fans would prefer they don't get reprimanded in a way that leaves them with missing playing time or being kicked from the team. Many people can't look past how this will affect the team, but it sets a good example to adopt something like this and live by it. In the end its good for everyone assuming kids can be smart enough not to get themselves in a situation that could possibly leave them getting convicted on a misdemeanor or felony. Its a good PR move too. My guess is there will be a few casualties from this, and that's ok if its what it takes to get kids to behave.

 

[EverettGriz]

Hope this doesn't get press that ends up having recruits looking elsewhere.

:? :roll:

 

[SoldierGriz]

This is absolutely a step in the right direction. Is it perfect? Definitely not. But, if your a student athlete and can refrain from doing stupid sh%t you have nothing to worry about. I get the perspective people are talking about on here. College kids do dumb things and most fans would prefer they don't get reprimanded in a way that leaves them with missing playing time or being kicked from the team. Many people can't look past how this will affect the team, but it sets a good example to adopt something like this and live by it. In the end its good for everyone assuming kids can be smart enough not to get themselves in a situation that could possibly leave them getting convicted on a misdemeanor or felony. Its a good PR move too. My guess is there will be a few casualties from this, and that's ok if its what it takes to get kids to behave.

Do UM student athletes commit "serious misconduct" more frequently than other members of the student body? I'd love if someone could post that statistic. I actually have no idea.

Where does the idea that UM student athletes are not held accountable come from?

I just don't understand the notion that this "is a step in the right direction." That implies there are still more steps to take. What additional steps? Why?

 

[go96griz]

This is absolutely a step in the right direction. Is it perfect? Definitely not. But, if your a student athlete and can refrain from doing stupid sh%t you have nothing to worry about. I get the perspective people are talking about on here. College kids do dumb things and most fans would prefer they don't get reprimanded in a way that leaves them with missing playing time or being kicked from the team. Many people can't look past how this will affect the team, but it sets a good example to adopt something like this and live by it. In the end its good for everyone assuming kids can be smart enough not to get themselves in a situation that could possibly leave them getting convicted on a misdemeanor or felony. Its a good PR move too. My guess is there will be a few casualties from this, and that's ok if its what it takes to get kids to behave.

Do UM student athletes commit "serious misconduct" more frequently than other members of the student body? I'd love if someone could post that statistic. I actually have no idea.

Where does the idea that UM student athletes are not held accountable come from?

I just don't understand the notion that this "is a step in the right direction." That implies there are still more steps to take. What additional steps? Why?

I don't have any facts to back this up, but the Missoulian sure reports more frequently on UM student athlete's misconduct than regular student's misconduct so it must be true.

 

[PlayerRep]

This is absolutely a step in the right direction. Is it perfect? Definitely not. But, if your a student athlete and can refrain from doing stupid sh%t you have nothing to worry about. I get the perspective people are talking about on here. College kids do dumb things and most fans would prefer they don't get reprimanded in a way that leaves them with missing playing time or being kicked from the team. Many people can't look past how this will affect the team, but it sets a good example to adopt something like this and live by it. In the end its good for everyone assuming kids can be smart enough not to get themselves in a situation that could possibly leave them getting convicted on a misdemeanor or felony. Its a good PR move too. My guess is there will be a few casualties from this, and that's ok if its what it takes to get kids to behave.

Do UM student athletes commit "serious misconduct" more frequently than other members of the student body? I'd love if someone could post that statistic. I actually have no idea.

Where does the idea that UM student athletes are not held accountable come from?

I just don't understand the notion that this "is a step in the right direction." That implies there are still more steps to take. What additional steps? Why?

1. Don't know.

2. It's a myth. Just isn't true.

3. I agree on the step in the right direction. The good improvement was the Athletic Code a number of years ago. Add some clarity and some specific punishments, and created a committee that didn't include the football coach.

4 I don't think this new policy would have caught many UM athletes in the last decade or so. But I also don't think any of those situations needed this additional severe punishment. The existing policies and the law already adequately took care of the situation. If my recollection is correct, one of the athletes might have been a well-regarded star running back. Would have been a terrible result.

5. My fear is that the new policy may end up catching people that it probably shouldn't catch, and that the existing Athletic Code already is very good. Don't know about other conference schools.

6. Certain victim/complainers already have significant control over athletes in some situations. If you don't do, or do do, this, I will complain to the university or legal authorities on you. This gives the victim/complainer even more power. Look at the MeToo movement, and the lack of due process.

 

[GrizRealist]

This is absolutely a step in the right direction. Is it perfect? Definitely not. But, if your a student athlete and can refrain from doing stupid sh%t you have nothing to worry about. I get the perspective people are talking about on here. College kids do dumb things and most fans would prefer they don't get reprimanded in a way that leaves them with missing playing time or being kicked from the team. Many people can't look past how this will affect the team, but it sets a good example to adopt something like this and live by it. In the end its good for everyone assuming kids can be smart enough not to get themselves in a situation that could possibly leave them getting convicted on a misdemeanor or felony. Its a good PR move too. My guess is there will be a few casualties from this, and that's ok if its what it takes to get kids to behave.

Do UM student athletes commit "serious misconduct" more frequently than other members of the student body? I'd love if someone could post that statistic. I actually have no idea.

Where does the idea that UM student athletes are not held accountable come from?

I just don't understand the notion that this "is a step in the right direction." That implies there are still more steps to take. What additional steps? Why?

By step in the right direction, I meant for the conference and college football as a whole, not specifically for UM. I dont think its too much to ask that student athletes keep themselves out of trouble, and if they find themselves in trouble they suffer consequences. It's really not hard to stay out of trouble, lots of young people never find themselves in trouble with the law.