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Ash and Kennedy act quickly

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doebrmn said:
PR, I don't know why I waste my time with your stupidity. If a person is originally charged with three counts and two counts are dropped, yes, the charges have been "reduced" from three charges to one. Now, you can pat yourself on the back and say the charges were dropped because that is correct, they have to be dropped, how else would they go away. But in typical legal parlance, it is referred to as reducing the charges. As in this case, by plea agreement, the charges were reduced to disordery conduct. And yes, pleading no contest still requires an affirmation that the evidence was sufficient to convict on the charge. So in this instance, both players pled no contest to disorderly conduct and in doing so made an admission that the evidence was sufficient to convict on that charge. The conviction remains on their records.

Now back to the actual substance of this topic, Plu's handling of the situation was still pathetic. Even a cursory investigation demonstrated that the players were not acting appropriately, which should have been, "yes officer, we will turn our music down and we are sorry for causing a problem." There failure to do that, and the following actions, warranted the charges. The Players should have been publicly admonished by Plu and suspended a game. That would have been the appropriate way for the "adults" to handle the situation. Instead, the University took the same B.S. line (UM athletic director Jim O'Day said any discipline will be handled internally. "We are continuing our investigation into the allegations, and will let the judicial system run its course," he said Sunday. ) and damaged the reputation of the institution all because winning was more important. The sad part, they could have simply done the right thing and it would not have affected the outcome of any games and earned some respect in the process. Instead, they just came off looking like pathetic losers.

Nope, when charges are dropped. They are dropped. Reduced means that a more serious charge has been reduced to a lessor charge. That wasn't done in this situation. The two most serious ones were dropped, and the less serious one (disorderly conduct) remained (and the players plead no-contest to it, which is not the same as guilty).

Yes, on that Sunday (which was only hours after the incident), O'Day said what you quoted. By then, the university already knew that the charges were incorrect and would likely be dropped or largely go away. Saying that they'll let the legal process run its course is essentially saying that they don't believe the charges are valid or will stand and/or they don't have sufficient information to be able to determine the facts sufficiently to make an informed decision.

Despite saying that day that the univesity would led the legal process run its course, UM took action later in the week, suspending the players for part of the important Weber game and presumably other internal discipline. The university also decided that it would look at the matter again, after the charges were resolved and the disputed facts were better known.

I don't agree with your view of what should have occurred. There was not sufficient evidence that the players were not acting appropriately. In fact, there was considerable evidence (multiple witness accounts and video and audio) indicating that the police had acted inappropriately and escalated the situation. The police had illegally wanted to enter the apartment and grab Kemp's phone when he said he was calling a lawyer. The police were mouthing off to the players, and making marginally racist comments. The player's lawyer said the police had acted inappropriately and wrongfully tased the players. I heard that Kemp was tased when he said he couldn't get the arm of injured shoulder further behind his back, and suffered further injury when the cop forced his arm back. I heard that Johnson, who was not near the police, eventually came to assist Kemp after he was tased, went down, and called for Johnson. The athletic dept was told that Johnson was a complete gentlemen on the way to the station. Neither players had had much to drink that night.

It is important for a university and an athletic department to support its students and athletes, when they have been wronged. It is especially important to support black athletes when they have been subject to possible racist statements and actions by people in Missoula--as black athletes encounter plenty of bigotry and racism in Missoula on some occasions. I applaud the university for supporting Kemp and Johnson in this matter. It was not easy, given the noise coming from no-nothing yahoos like yourself, and people who refused to even accept the fact that there hadn't been a charge of assault on the police and refused to look objectively at what had occurred. I thought it was quite telling that many of the calls to the university after the incident, were coming from Bobcats wanting harsh action taken against the players.

In my view, the university gained more respect from people like me by doing what I viewed as the right thing. They worked to ascertain the true facts in a matter of days. They didn't bow to pressure from people who didn't understand the situation or were just plain biased like yourself.
 
Growler1 said:
Just wanted to notify the board that Play-a R-ape has obviously been whining to the mods about being called that term, because the mods have dis-allowed posting that term (it automatically changes to Player Rep when posted). Oh well, thank God for hyphens! :lol: :lol: :lol:


Look Jack, G1 is obviously referring to how when you type Playa-Rape it gets changed to PlayerRep...now if you would read through here and tell me where you see "Runs to sniff jocks" IN THIS QUOTE, I will gladly admit I'm wrong. I mean c'mon...it's really not that difficult. If G1 tells me that's now what he was referring to, I will also admit I'm wrong. I'm not afraid to say I'm wrong, I just don't believe I am in this case. And I'm a Grizzly fan Jack, try to keep up please.
 
PTGrizzly said:
Growler1 said:
Just wanted to notify the board that Play-a R-ape has obviously been whining to the mods about being called that term, because the mods have dis-allowed posting that term (it automatically changes to Player Rep when posted). Oh well, thank God for hyphens! :lol: :lol: :lol:


Look Jack, G1 is obviously referring to how when you type Playa-Rape it gets changed to PlayerRep...now if you would read through here and tell me where you see "Runs to sniff jocks" IN THIS QUOTE, I will gladly admit I'm wrong. I mean c'mon...it's really not that difficult. If G1 tells me that's now what he was referring to, I will also admit I'm wrong. I'm not afraid to say I'm wrong, I just don't believe I am in this case. And I'm a Grizzly fan Jack, try to keep up please.

Here's an example. There were others. I believe there have been various phrases/words that have been deleted or changed.

"Report this postReply with quoteRe: Position by position discussion: linebackers
by Growler1 » Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:00 pm

Yeah, I should not have questioned whether old "sniffs-a-jock" knew the exact diagnosis of Tripp's injury, his doctor, the nurse, and the orderly who cleaned his room."

I was told you a first year PT student who went to Montana St.
 
Students and Bobcat players are now petitioning to get Trammel reinstated in the Fall. I bet it happens and it will be really funny to hear Cat fans try to talk about what a hard ass disciplinarian Ash is.
 
WaGriz4life said:
Students and Bobcat players are now petitioning to get Trammel reinstated in the Fall. I bet it happens and it will be really funny to hear Cat fans try to talk about what a hard ass disciplinarian Ash is.
Just think what those former players will say about him then! ;)
 
OptimusPrime said:
WaGriz4life said:
Students and Bobcat players are now petitioning to get Trammel reinstated in the Fall. I bet it happens and it will be really funny to hear Cat fans try to talk about what a hard ass disciplinarian Ash is.
Just think what those former players will say about him then! ;)

:lol:

it won't happen. even if it comes out that blount was the aggressor and jumped trammell (which i doubt will be the case) this isn't trammells first situation like this. he's gone.

i don't mind his peers and teammates having his back on this one. i think they are wrong and i doubt it makes a difference but it's nice of them. :thumb:
 
ilovethecats said:
OptimusPrime said:
WaGriz4life said:
Students and Bobcat players are now petitioning to get Trammel reinstated in the Fall. I bet it happens and it will be really funny to hear Cat fans try to talk about what a hard ass disciplinarian Ash is.
Just think what those former players will say about him then! ;)

:lol:

it won't happen. even if it comes out that blount was the aggressor and jumped trammell (which i doubt will be the case) this isn't trammells first situation like this. he's gone.

i don't mind his peers and teammates having his back on this one. i think they are wrong and i doubt it makes a difference but it's nice of them. :thumb:
I could see him still being "dismissed" from the team during Spring Ball and then in the Fall be "reinstated" before Fall Camp because of his good behavior
 
PlayerRep said:
PTGrizzly said:
Growler1 said:
Just wanted to notify the board that Play-a R-ape has obviously been whining to the mods about being called that term, because the mods have dis-allowed posting that term (it automatically changes to Player Rep when posted). Oh well, thank God for hyphens! :lol: :lol: :lol:


Look Jack, G1 is obviously referring to how when you type Playa-Rape it gets changed to PlayerRep...now if you would read through here and tell me where you see "Runs to sniff jocks" IN THIS QUOTE, I will gladly admit I'm wrong. I mean c'mon...it's really not that difficult. If G1 tells me that's now what he was referring to, I will also admit I'm wrong. I'm not afraid to say I'm wrong, I just don't believe I am in this case. And I'm a Grizzly fan Jack, try to keep up please.

Here's an example. There were others. I believe there have been various phrases/words that have been deleted or changed.

"Report this postReply with quoteRe: Position by position discussion: linebackers
by Growler1 » Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:00 pm

Yeah, I should not have questioned whether old "sniffs-a-jock" knew the exact diagnosis of Tripp's injury, his doctor, the nurse, and the orderly who cleaned his room."

I was told you a first year PT student who went to Montana St.

Yes I am aware that he has called you "sniffs-a-jock" and other variations of that phrase. However, obviously in his quote he referring to your often called nickname of "Playa-Rape". Can you deny that?

I did my under-grad at MSU and am now in PT school at U of M. That does not make me a Bobcat fan. And I never told you what year I was in, so stop trying to guess at who I am.
 
PTGrizzly said:
PlayerRep said:
PTGrizzly said:
Growler1 said:
Just wanted to notify the board that Play-a R-ape has obviously been whining to the mods about being called that term, because the mods have dis-allowed posting that term (it automatically changes to Player Rep when posted). Oh well, thank God for hyphens! :lol: :lol: :lol:


Look Jack, G1 is obviously referring to how when you type Playa-Rape it gets changed to PlayerRep...now if you would read through here and tell me where you see "Runs to sniff jocks" IN THIS QUOTE, I will gladly admit I'm wrong. I mean c'mon...it's really not that difficult. If G1 tells me that's now what he was referring to, I will also admit I'm wrong. I'm not afraid to say I'm wrong, I just don't believe I am in this case. And I'm a Grizzly fan Jack, try to keep up please.

Here's an example. There were others. I believe there have been various phrases/words that have been deleted or changed.

"Report this postReply with quoteRe: Position by position discussion: linebackers
by Growler1 » Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:00 pm

Yeah, I should not have questioned whether old "sniffs-a-jock" knew the exact diagnosis of Tripp's injury, his doctor, the nurse, and the orderly who cleaned his room."

I was told you a first year PT student who went to Montana St.

Yes I am aware that he has called you "sniffs-a-jock" and other variations of that phrase. However, obviously in his quote he referring to your often called nickname of "Playa-Rape". Can you deny that?

I did my under-grad at MSU and am now in PT school at U of M. That does not make me a Bobcat fan. And I never told you what year I was in, so stop trying to guess at who I am.

Like I said all along, you are a Bobcat. I don't have to guess who you are. There are only a few males in each PT class, and the 3 classes are only about 30 or 35. Note that you never told me you went to MSU either, nor did I notice you say on the board that you went to MSU. You have provided sufficient information for us to figure out who you are. We aren't completely sure, but if I was so inclined, I could determine it in short order. Some of us have become pretty good at figuring out who posters are.
 
I like how you said nothing about me proving you wrong. Solid lawyering work PR.

Also, why are you trying to figure out who I am? According to your quote, you were told I did my undergrad at MSU...so who are you asking? I haven't tried to find out any information on you because frankly, I don't give a damn who you are. I'm not going to drag in anything from your personal life other than calling you Jack (which I honestly don't know if it is your real name) or the fact that you said you're a lawyer, which you have mentioned previously. If you continue to investigate into my private life, maybe the mods would have something to say about that...ya think?
 
PlayerRep said:
PTGrizzly said:
PlayerRep said:
PTGrizzly said:
Look Jack, G1 is obviously referring to how when you type Playa-Rape it gets changed to PlayerRep...now if you would read through here and tell me where you see "Runs to sniff jocks" IN THIS QUOTE, I will gladly admit I'm wrong. I mean c'mon...it's really not that difficult. If G1 tells me that's now what he was referring to, I will also admit I'm wrong. I'm not afraid to say I'm wrong, I just don't believe I am in this case. And I'm a Grizzly fan Jack, try to keep up please.

Here's an example. There were others. I believe there have been various phrases/words that have been deleted or changed.

"Report this postReply with quoteRe: Position by position discussion: linebackers
by Growler1 » Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:00 pm

Yeah, I should not have questioned whether old "sniffs-a-jock" knew the exact diagnosis of Tripp's injury, his doctor, the nurse, and the orderly who cleaned his room."

I was told you a first year PT student who went to Montana St.

Yes I am aware that he has called you "sniffs-a-jock" and other variations of that phrase. However, obviously in his quote he referring to your often called nickname of "Playa-Rape". Can you deny that?

I did my under-grad at MSU and am now in PT school at U of M. That does not make me a Bobcat fan. And I never told you what year I was in, so stop trying to guess at who I am.

Like I said all along, you are a Bobcat. I don't have to guess who you are. There are only a few males in each PT class, and the 3 classes are only about 30 or 35. Note that you never told me you went to MSU either, nor did I notice you say on the board that you went to MSU. You have provided sufficient information for us to figure out who you are. We aren't completely sure, but if I was so inclined, I could determine it in short order. Some of us have become pretty good at figuring out who posters are.

Creeper.........geez. Hide your kids.
 
Maynardsgametrail said:
PlayerRep said:
Like I said all along, you are a Bobcat. I don't have to guess who you are. There are only a few males in each PT class, and the 3 classes are only about 30 or 35. Note that you never told me you went to MSU either, nor did I notice you say on the board that you went to MSU. You have provided sufficient information for us to figure out who you are. We aren't completely sure, but if I was so inclined, I could determine it in short order. Some of us have become pretty good at figuring out who posters are.

Creeper.........geez. Hide your kids.
No kidding. That's some of the creepiest shit I've read on here in awhile. :wtf:
 
PR,

You can continue arguing semantics all you want. Bottom line is I have written dozen of letters to counsel offering plea agreements and in each and every one that involved reducing the number charges against a defendant I never once used the word "drop." Instead, each referred to reducing the charges to a single count of __________ or to two counts of ________ etc. And guess what, never once had opposing counsel called me and asked if that meant the charges would be dropped. You know why, because everyone that isn't a moron understands reducing the number of charges includes dropping those which will not be pled.

But semantics aside, it is time for you to stop your whining and crying. It is a fact that the two players committed the crime of disorderly conduct. No matter how much whining you do, nothing will change this FACT. The players admitted that the evidence was sufficient to convict them beyond a reasonable doubt of the crime. From now until the end of time, the facts are legally established and these players will live with a record of committing the crime. Sadly, the facts supporting the charge were known within 24 hours by the UM administration and HC and they chose to make no public admonishment of the Players conduct and quitely suspended the players for one quarter. If you believe a one quarter suspension is appropriate for a player that has commited the crime of disorderly conduct, then that really says something about you. Unfortunately, UM believes that a one quarter suspension is appropriate punishment for a player that commits the crime of disorderly conduct and in doing so have made it clear that the priority lies with winning over all else which is an embarrassement to the institution. You only have to look to institutions like Miami and Ohio State to see where this type of attitude leads. For most of the Alumni, this is unacceptable because we do not share these low standards of character. If you are happy to be associated with it, then by all means go right ahead and be part of the problem and not part of the solution. But stop trying to convince the world that these players did not commit a crime, because it is an undisputable fact that they did and the UM administration and HC simply chose to ingore it.
 
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