Anyone Else Notice?

[dupuyer griz]

Actually, not disagreeing with you. Student loans have become a scam in that they are the safest loans that cannot be discharged in bankruptcy, and in some cases even death, but they still have a very high interest rate. Someone is getting rich on this, and I think it's partly Obamacare that is sucking out the profits at the expense of the young people trying to improve their lives.

Agree with you, however I think most student interest profit goes toward funding Pell grants. So poor kids are being taxed to send other poor kids to school. Great model :roll:

While I was overseas on my honeymoon we talked to people our age about schooling and most of them said it was paid for so everyone could go. Seems like a better use of government money educating people rather than paying them to sit on their asses and watch oprah and reality tv all day because lets face it, working is hard

 

[BadlandsGrizFan]

I have seen several comments on this over here. I happen to cover the education industry within the investment management industry. Waded Cruzado has done a lot over here and I am guessing marketing during Griz games is no coincidence.

The biggest difference in the enrollments between UM and MSU has to do with the changing job requirements in the US today. Most of the job growth in the US is coming from energy, technology, engineering, nursing and education. There are others. Energy and tech are the biggies.

While UM offers many relevant degrees, it suffers like many liberal-arts-based colleges around the country. You simply can't get a good payback on the dollars spent on a degree that isn't relevant in today's job market.

Example: today, a UM degree all in is $18, 235 per year. That's ~$72,000 for a 4 yr degree. Most student loans are amortized on a 10 year basis. Many kids gets scholarships and parents help. But let's assume many students have $40K in loans. That is $425 per month. Some of these private loans kids get today are like credit card rates - they suck.

That $425 per month is a huge nugget for graduates of Anthropology, History, Art, Classics, Dance and Creative Writing can't afford on a $32,000 (probably high) per year ($2,662 per month BEFORE tax) degree.

Graduates in Chemical Engineering, Industrial Technology, Genetics, Computer Engineering, Pre-med make far, far more starting salaries (think $60K+) to cover "that nugget." And frankly, there are just more jobs in the US today in those degrees.

I wound attribute MSU enrollment success to the types of degrees being offered, their relevance and their earnings power.

My $0.02. This is not meant as smack although I am awaiting the shelling.

This poster is not wrong...there's more to it but not wrong. We still haven't recovered from the black eye we got in 2011 and following.

Counter Assault has it right to an extent. While the programs offered by MSU may be more commercially viable, whatever happened to learning for learning's sake. And if the selling point of a school is future employment, why not just label it a trade school and be honest about it.

In todays day and age..no one can afford to learn for learnings sake..you better learn that fro getting you a god damn jobs sake! Missoula was doing good when everything was great in our country economically...but now we need degrees that get jobs...I wonder if you can get a masters in living off welfare with an emphasis on registering for Obamacare at the UofM?

 

[reinell30]

I have seen several comments on this over here. I happen to cover the education industry within the investment management industry. Waded Cruzado has done a lot over here and I am guessing marketing during Griz games is no coincidence.

The biggest difference in the enrollments between UM and MSU has to do with the changing job requirements in the US today. Most of the job growth in the US is coming from energy, technology, engineering, nursing and education. There are others. Energy and tech are the biggies.

While UM offers many relevant degrees, it suffers like many liberal-arts-based colleges around the country. You simply can't get a good payback on the dollars spent on a degree that isn't relevant in today's job market.

Example: today, a UM degree all in is $18, 235 per year. That's ~$72,000 for a 4 yr degree. Most student loans are amortized on a 10 year basis. Many kids gets scholarships and parents help. But let's assume many students have $40K in loans. That is $425 per month. Some of these private loans kids get today are like credit card rates - they suck.

That $425 per month is a huge nugget for graduates of Anthropology, History, Art, Classics, Dance and Creative Writing can't afford on a $32,000 (probably high) per year ($2,662 per month BEFORE tax) degree.

Graduates in Chemical Engineering, Industrial Technology, Genetics, Computer Engineering, Pre-med make far, far more starting salaries (think $60K+) to cover "that nugget." And frankly, there are just more jobs in the US today in those degrees.

I wound attribute MSU enrollment success to the types of degrees being offered, their relevance and their earnings power.

My $0.02. This is not meant as smack although I am awaiting the shelling.

This poster is not wrong...there's more to it but not wrong. We still haven't recovered from the black eye we got in 2011 and following.

Counter Assault has it right to an extent. While the programs offered by MSU may be more commercially viable, whatever happened to learning for learning's sake. And if the selling point of a school is future employment, why not just label it a trade school and be honest about it.

In todays day and age..no one can afford to learn for learnings sake..you better learn that fro getting you a god damn jobs sake! Missoula was doing good when everything was great in our country economically...but now we need degrees that get jobs...I wonder if you can get a masters in living off welfare with an emphasis on registering for Obamacare at the UofM?

If these degrees were awarded, they would become the number one degree in the USA. Lots of free loaders out there and Obama administration breeds more every day!

 

[Buttegrizzle]

"That $425 per month is a huge nugget for graduates of Anthropology, History, Art, Classics, Dance and Creative Writing can't afford on a $32,000 (probably high) per year ($2,662 per month BEFORE tax) degree.

Graduates in Chemical Engineering, Industrial Technology, Genetics, Computer Engineering, Pre-med make far, far more starting salaries (think $60K+) to cover "that nugget." And frankly, there are just more jobs in the US today in those degrees."


Counter Assault chose pretty selectively there. Kinda left out Law, Chem, Business Admin, Pharmacy, business marketing, bio chem, Econ, etc. I got a lowly Liberal Art degree in Anthropology and I have my own business and do pretty good. My wife has a UM law degree and makes way more than me. My roommate did pre-med at UM and makes obscene dough now. In fact all those egrizzers I went to school with here on the mid-late 80s are doing pretty damn good. It's nice to end up in administration level jobs, rather than tech jobs. May not start out as high, but we end up being your boss...

 

[Umista]

This all boils down to: Never hire a professor to be a president of our University!
Most of them can teach but they can't run a business such as the U.
Hire a business person that has been running a solid business. Or a AD or a lawyer like Missouri St. did.That last guy was the schools lawyer and has done a fantastic job.
My take on this is all profs are not bad but many examples indicate they are not worth it!

 

[Copper Griz]

Disappointed in the drivel and typical politics being spewed on here. Right - left, they are all the same. Rich get rich and avoid paying their taxes because of lawyers and loopholes. Poor folks have no motivation and not enough intellect to pull themselves up. The middle class is supporting both ends of the spectrum. I know one thing for damn sure - bankers and investment firms are doing quite we'll thank you very much. Check out who sat on Bush's and Obama's cabinet. The same thieves pulling the puppet strings. Now back to football.

 

[EverettGriz]

"That $425 per month is a huge nugget for graduates of Anthropology, History, Art, Classics, Dance and Creative Writing can't afford on a $32,000 (probably high) per year ($2,662 per month BEFORE tax) degree.

Graduates in Chemical Engineering, Industrial Technology, Genetics, Computer Engineering, Pre-med make far, far more starting salaries (think $60K+) to cover "that nugget." And frankly, there are just more jobs in the US today in those degrees."


Counter Assault chose pretty selectively there. Kinda left out Law, Chem, Business Admin, Pharmacy, business marketing, bio chem, Econ, etc. I got a lowly Liberal Art degree in Anthropology and I have my own business and do pretty good. My wife has a UM law degree and makes way more than me. My roommate did pre-med at UM and makes obscene dough now. In fact all those egrizzers I went to school with here on the mid-late 80s are doing pretty damn good. It's nice to end up in administration level jobs, rather than tech jobs. May not start out as high, but we end up being your boss...

Great post, BG.

 

[MrTitleist]

"That $425 per month is a huge nugget for graduates of Anthropology, History, Art, Classics, Dance and Creative Writing can't afford on a $32,000 (probably high) per year ($2,662 per month BEFORE tax) degree.

Graduates in Chemical Engineering, Industrial Technology, Genetics, Computer Engineering, Pre-med make far, far more starting salaries (think $60K+) to cover "that nugget." And frankly, there are just more jobs in the US today in those degrees."


Counter Assault chose pretty selectively there. Kinda left out Law, Chem, Business Admin, Pharmacy, business marketing, bio chem, Econ, etc. I got a lowly Liberal Art degree in Anthropology and I have my own business and do pretty good. My wife has a UM law degree and makes way more than me. My roommate did pre-med at UM and makes obscene dough now. In fact all those egrizzers I went to school with here on the mid-late 80s are doing pretty damn good. It's nice to end up in administration level jobs, rather than tech jobs. May not start out as high, but we end up being your boss...

Counter Assault's post is good, and mostly accurate. UM may have law school but there aren't a ton of people that can afford the price tag with getting a law degree. Chem, BA, and Rx are very good fields too, about the only degrees with a damn at UM right now. You're probably in the minority of graduates who have done well with an Anthropology degree. UM should be helped by having a residency program starting up here (or has started), big shortage of doctors around here.

 

[Counter Assault]

"That $425 per month is a huge nugget for graduates of Anthropology, History, Art, Classics, Dance and Creative Writing can't afford on a $32,000 (probably high) per year ($2,662 per month BEFORE tax) degree.

Graduates in Chemical Engineering, Industrial Technology, Genetics, Computer Engineering, Pre-med make far, far more starting salaries (think $60K+) to cover "that nugget." And frankly, there are just more jobs in the US today in those degrees."


Counter Assault chose pretty selectively there. Kinda left out Law, Chem, Business Admin, Pharmacy, business marketing, bio chem, Econ, etc. I got a lowly Liberal Art degree in Anthropology and I have my own business and do pretty good. My wife has a UM law degree and makes way more than me. My roommate did pre-med at UM and makes obscene dough now. In fact all those egrizzers I went to school with here on the mid-late 80s are doing pretty damn good. It's nice to end up in administration level jobs, rather than tech jobs. May not start out as high, but we end up being your boss...

Hey yeah. That was maybe too selective. There are many relevant degrees at UM, but I do think the essence of the argument is right. Just one quick example, MSU graduated 408 kids in the engineering school or 16% of the entire degree base (high earners). I can't find UM's degrees by degree online, but they have 15% of the entire enrollment in Forestry, Journalism and Visual and Performing Arts. VPA's are over 1,000 of enrolled students. Its that general type of enrollment base that is very very low payback - nationally, not just speaking to UM.

So, yeah, you are a very good example of a success story and there are many like that. But depending on your age, I doubt you had the kind of debt leaving school that these kids do today. The cost of college overall in the US has doubled in the last 15 years. Incomes have not and more importantly, the jobs needed in the US have changed greatly.

Lastly, while the law school makes up high earners, its a very small part of enrollment (275 kids from what I see).

 

[BadlandsGrizFan]

"That $425 per month is a huge nugget for graduates of Anthropology, History, Art, Classics, Dance and Creative Writing can't afford on a $32,000 (probably high) per year ($2,662 per month BEFORE tax) degree.

Graduates in Chemical Engineering, Industrial Technology, Genetics, Computer Engineering, Pre-med make far, far more starting salaries (think $60K+) to cover "that nugget." And frankly, there are just more jobs in the US today in those degrees."


Counter Assault chose pretty selectively there. Kinda left out Law, Chem, Business Admin, Pharmacy, business marketing, bio chem, Econ, etc. I got a lowly Liberal Art degree in Anthropology and I have my own business and do pretty good. My wife has a UM law degree and makes way more than me. My roommate did pre-med at UM and makes obscene dough now. In fact all those egrizzers I went to school with here on the mid-late 80s are doing pretty damn good. It's nice to end up in administration level jobs, rather than tech jobs. May not start out as high, but we end up being your boss...

Counter Assault's post is good, and mostly accurate. UM may have law school but there aren't a ton of people that can afford the price tag with getting a law degree. Chem, BA, and Rx are very good fields too, about the only degrees with a damn at UM right now. You're probably in the minority of graduates who have done well with an Anthropology degree. UM should be helped by having a residency program starting up here (or has started), big shortage of doctors around here.

They should promote and expand on the Geography/GIS programs at UM....you can do many things out of Geography degrees such as urban and land use planning, GIS, community development programming...those are all well paying job and in abundance right now because no one in the younger generations realize that somebody planned that road you drove on to get your spiced pumpkin latte this morning...WHO KNEW???