10-18? We need changes

[Jimus]

That's the worst Griz basketball record in 33 years. There's no where to go from here but up. So how about it? Is a change in leadership in order? I know we can't keep everything the same next year and just expect the good old days of 20+ wins and 6,000 per game at Dahlberg. The worst thing about it is that no one in Missoula outside of this message board seems to notice. That's problem #1 for the new AD to address, I suppose.

 

[GrizWhiz]

Nope! And here's why. First, Don Holst was given 4 years and compiled a 48-56 record against Division 1 opponents. I think Coach K deserves the same chance. Second, and this is something that I have not seen discussed on this board or grizzlyboards, Coach K inherited an extraordinarily bare cupboard. Coach Holst relied heavily on JC transfers (10 recruited in his 4 years). While Coach K inherited some good JC transfers (David Bell in particular), there was a real lack of impact HS recruits. For example, next year the GRIZ will have zero HS recruits graduate. These would have been Coach Holst recruits if they existed. Only Davis and Booker (both Coach K JC recruits), will comprise the senior class. If you think about it, with the exception of Kevin Criswell, who never played for Coach Holst, there really have been no Coach Holst HS recruits who have been real impact players. Cummings was until his injury. The jury is still out on Easley and McKay. I think Mike Chavez (another Holst recruit who did not play for him,) has a bright future but we can't be sure here either. True Griz is right when he says it is better to build a program based on HS recruits. The last 2 years have been pretty good evidence of that. Coach K was forced to go the JC route early on in order to plug some huge holes. I think he is commited to building the program with HS kids and as evidence of that has 3 highly regarded HS recruits coming in next year along with only one JC player. I certainly think he deserves a chance to succeed or fail with players he recruited. We have our 3 top scorers and 3 top rebounders returning next year. This is an awfully good nucleus to build around and bodes very well for the future.

 

[sarge]

I think a change is in order also, someone who can coach and not rely so heavily on his JC players to just come in and play with no direction. Coach K looked for other jobs last spring as I am sure he will do again this spring. Maybe even more now since his buddy Wayne is gone.

 

[GrizWhiz]

:-? Sarge-"just come in and play with no direction"?! What are you talking about? Did you see the team play very often (or at all)? One additional observation is that these guys played their butts off to the very end. This is a complement to them and the coaching staff!

 

[MontanaRaised]

Mike Krzyzewski, coach of Duke (you may heard of him) was 10-17 (4-10 in the ACC conference) in his second year. Should he have been fired? Building a solid foundation takes awhile.

Coach K looked for other jobs last spring as I am sure he will do again this spring.

I don't remember this in the Missoulian, have the link?

That's problem #1 for the new AD to address, I suppose.

A basketball team that worked their tails off with the nucleus coming back and some great recruits. This is the #1 problem? I would think a budget in the red by 1m would be.

Reguardless of what their record was, Kennedy got a lot out of this team, and the future looks bright. He needs a minimum of 4 years.

Oh yeah, side note....Krzyzewski was 11-17 his 3rd year and into the sweet 16 his 7th.

 

[sarge]

Coaches don't let the newspapers know they are searching for a new job, so no article was ever in the missoulian.

Yes I know who Duke's Coach K is, my niece worked for Coach K at Duke for 3 years.

You need $$ to build a program and with this deficit hanging over their heads that will be hard to do.

 

[MontanaRaised]

Coaches don't let the newspapers know they are searching for a new job, so no article was ever in the missoulian.

Should someone's livelihood be threatened by a rumor. Even if it wasn't a rumor, should he be canned with this being one of the reasons?

Here's a goofy statement..."Coach K is looking at other jobs, he's fired"

Yes I know who Duke's Coach K is, my niece worked for Coach K at Duke for 3 years.

What does this have to do with Kennedy and why he should be fired?

You need $$ to build a program and with this deficit hanging over their heads that will be hard to do.

Again, what does this have to do with Kennedy's job? Will firing him and bringing in someone new change the 1m deficit?

If you have a problem with his coaching style, abilities, control of team, etc. then I can respect that. But just because his record isn't all that great isn't a good enough reason to fire him...not at this stage of his era.

 

[twentythreeOh4]

Nope! And here's why. First, Don Holst was given 4 years and compiled a 48-56 record against Division 1 opponents. I think Coach K deserves the same chance. Second, and this is something that I have not seen discussed on this board or grizzlyboards, Coach K inherited an extraordinarily bare cupboard. Coach Holst relied heavily on JC transfers (10 recruited in his 4 years). While Coach K inherited some good JC transfers (David Bell in particular), there was a real lack of impact HS recruits.

GrizWhiz, I have to disagree with you on one thing. It was coach Holst that inherited a program with an empty cupboard. Early in Blaine Taylor's tenure, the Griz did well with in state recruiting, getting guys like Matt Kempfert, Jeremy Lake, and Chris Spoja, but the in the last few years under Taylor, it was the Cats who were getting Danny Sprinkle, Justin Brown, Pete Conway, John Lazosky. After Holst stepped in, the Griz did start to do better with in state recruits. In his last 3 years, Holst arguably got the best in state player each year with Matt Luedtke, Kevin Criswell and Mike Chavez. But as you pointed out none really got a chance to show what they could do before Holst was gone. That wasn't Holst's fault.

I think it's too early to pass judgement on Kennedy. I want to see how his recruits do next year. I like the fact that he signed 3 prep players and 1 JC. I think we need a more realistic schedule -- not an easy schedule. Say a few more teams like Idaho (in home and home deals) instead of teams like Auburn. You need to build the program before you can jump into the kind of schedule we played this year.

 

[GrizWhiz]

Grizzle- I believe you are exactly right on the subject of BS. 2304- The cupboard that Coach Holst inherited included Matt Seidensticker, Mike Warhank, Shane Christensen, Jared Buckmaster and Dominique Davis. He did become head coach after one of Blaine Taylor's poorest years and I do not fault him for bringing in some JC's his first year.

 

[Jimus]

Whether Coach K is committed to building the program based on high school recruits remains to be seen. I agree that's the way to go about building a solid program.

I think he's a good coach, but I don't think he's a great coach. We just might need a great coach to get us out of where we are. Sure, we've heard the incoming players will be solid and they'll be crucial in getting the program back where it needs to be, but we've been hearing that for a few years now. Remember the expectations we all had at the start of the season? Now here we are. The Griz haven't had a winning regular season in four years, haven't won at least 20 games in seven years, and have won a grand total of three Big Sky Tournament games in that span. That looks pretty scary considering the great winning tradition this program has had in the past.

I know you can only pin a couple of those years on the current coaching staff, but they should have had this thing up and running by now. That's why they came here. I'm not saying we should have had a Big Sky Championship yet, but it should at least be improving in that direction. Nothing personal, I just want what's best for the program. If Kennedy & company get another year to work it out, that's not my call anyway. I hope they get it turned around and all will be well again in Grizzlyville. Let's not be shocked though if the Griz start the season the same way and Kennedy gets let go in December to possibly salvage a conference run.

 

[Ballhog]

Griz need to step up their recruiting-Montana has a great university to sell.
They need to look outside the state for recruits to be competitive. Thats why it is imporant to play markee teams-HS players of note may not be thrilled playing in the bigsky but if you add some markee teams it should enhance your recruiting. There is no comparison beween GU or Eastern in terms of the school-no reason why you can't recruit against them if you play your cards right.

 

[grizgirl317]

The biggest problem we had this year was that fact that all the new players didn't mesh well with the old players. It took most of the season to get it right. That's one of the major problems with bringing in JUCO transfers instead of freshmen.
Unfortunately Kennedy kind of had to bring in the transfers this year in order to make up for some problems caused by Holst's recruiting. Without the JUCO transfers there would be no juniors on the team this year and therefore no seniors next year (the recruits from 2000-all two of them-both left UM under Holst's tenure). Also Holst went 4 years without recruiting a freshman point guard (last one was Sam Riddle in 99-00) which left a major hole for Kennedy to fill and fill quickly. This was pretty much Kennedy's first recruiting class at UM and he really just did what he had to do.
From the looks of next years recruiting class, it seems like he won't be as reliant on JUCO transfers in the future. He's bringing in 3 freshmen and 1 transfer which is the direction this program needs to be going. Not to mention the prognosis for next year and the year after looks really good if you consider that 4 of our 5 starters were sophomores and juniors and there are a lot of young talented players coming off the bench.

 

[GrizMania]

IMHO, PK should be judged by the same ruler they used for Holst, which is 4 years. We need to keep in mind, though that one of those Holst years was at Sentinel gym. does that win or lose games? probably not, but it might not help recruiting much.
Still, i'd go with 4 years with a disclaimer....if next year is even worse than this one i'd really have a hard time defending the retention of PK.

 

[Lone Ranger]

4+4+4+4+4+4= 2 many years of being mediocre...

Oh yeah, who wants to come to a D-1 school that plays their home games in a high school gym? Holst never had a scoreboard... OH NO, IT'S NOT FAIR!!!!

As for the four year debate... I think we need to get the program on track ASAP, rather than waiting for another 2 years and hoping something good happens. I would like to see a young coach with a lot of knowledge and energy, kind of like Giacolleti (sp?) over at Eastern...

 

[twentythreeOh4]

Lone Ranger,

I guess you are cut a twice mesure once type of guy. You could work in upper management at my company -- no need to get facts before making a decision; just make a rash judgement, and then keep changing it every 6 months thereafter, because we didn't have time to do things right the first time.

 

[Ballhog]

I agree that CoachK hasn't been given enough time. However, when and if
a new coach should appear I would hope that Wayne Tinkle would be considered-he is a class guy in all areas. I wonder how long Ray G. will stay at EWU;he is very dynamic and motiated.

 

[jagur1]

Hey, New Guy
Please forward a copy of Tinkel's resume for readers review.
Highlight point you feel make him worthy!
NONE.