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POOOOOR BOBCATS

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It’s hard to have any sympathy for the bobcats since they’ve pretty much owned us of late. But if you look at the number of football players who’ve entered the transfer portal it could have significant effect on next years performance. From a Griz supporter can’t say I feel all that bad for them.
But more importantly look at it from a different perspectives, which is to say that the cats took a chance on walk ons, one and 2 star recruits, invested in developing their skill levels to the point where FBS teams poached them with enticement of big dollars. Can you blame the players, many come from less than perfect home situations.
There needs to be, there has to be some form of compensation to the teams that lose the players they’ve invested time and effort in. I can only see that not to far in the future it will make FCS a farm system for the FBS.
The Griz have two players that fit into this very situation, and probably more. Gillman in football and Money Williams in basketball. Both of these players are/were pretty raw coming into the programs. If they had gone FBS out of high school they most likely would have ridden the bench the first couple of years and not been exposed to game time situations.
I don’t have to go any further, you all understand the issues. The million dollar question, how to make the system more fair and equitable to this so-called farm system we’ve become a part of?
 
Contracts. If college football is going the way of semi-professional sports and is paying players, then contracts need to be introduced to 1) protect the players, and 2) protect the schools. Make players sign a contract that guarantees a period of time to be spent at a university before the option to enter the portal. Call it "Free Agency".
 
LivingstonNative said:
One thing that would help is that there needs to be a cap on the amount of money that a player can receive from the NIL. Put some rules in place!
Also, I believe someone said that NDSU has Only lost one player to the portal. What in the H are they doing over there?
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Don't know but total cost of school was part of the package before NIL went crazy.
 
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LivingstonNative said:
One thing that would help is that there needs to be a cap on the amount of money that a player can receive from the NIL. Put some rules in place!
Also, I believe someone said that NDSU has Only lost one player to the portal. What in the H are they doing over there?
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That is what got us here in the first place. You cannot limit what a player can make on their name image an likeness. Saying you can get paid, but only up to this much is not that different from being told you can't be paid at all. That tactic would never work and would result huge lawsuits. It'd be like telling a doctor they can only make up to a certain amount of money a year, just can't do it. Can't put limiters on someone ability to earn money especially income derived from their likeness.
 
LivingstonNative said:
One thing that would help is that there needs to be a cap on the amount of money that a player can receive from the NIL. Put some rules in place!
Also, I believe someone said that NDSU has Only lost one player to the portal. What in the H are they doing over there?
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The Dakota schools (all of them…NDSU, UND, SDSU and USD) offer full cost of attendance to their football players. So on top of their scholarship for tuition, room and board, they get an extra $$ amount each month for living costs (rent for some, food, groceries,etc). This is around $1000/month is my understanding.

We are way behind on this. And I truly believe it’s not a coincidence that in NDSU or SDSU has won the majority of titles recently. This plays into that.
 
HookedonGriz said:
The Dakota schools (all of them…NDSU, UND, SDSU and USD) offer full cost of attendance to their football players. So on top of their scholarship for tuition, room and board, they get an extra $$ amount each month for living costs (rent for some, food, groceries,etc). This is around $1000/month is my understanding.

We are way behind on this. And I truly believe it’s not a coincidence that in NDSU or SDSU has won the majority of titles recently. This plays into that.
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12 of the last 14.
 
You may be right Realist, but here in Billings at least, Montana's medical capital with the first and third largest hospitals in Montana and the only two Level 1 Trauma Centers in the state, physicians hired by either Billings Clinic or Intermountain Health ( St. Vincent's Hospital) are paid a negotiated salary.

Like I said, you very well could be right, but on the other hand, courts might also determine a balancing test needs to be applied between players and schools and NIL collectives, and anti-trust law could also possibly apply--Are the SEC, the ACC and Big 10 creating a near monopoly within FBS college football that negatively impacts the rest of not only FBS football, but also FCS, Dib. Ii, etc. ?

I do think the NCAA and schools could possibly limit the number of transfers to promote their own academic integrity and protect student athletes ability to earn a college degree and earn a living after their playing days are over. Clif McDowell would be Exhibit A-- how can 5 or 6 transfers within a five-year academic career be good for any college student, what school confers the degree, what happens to credits that do not transfer from one school to another, and what happens to the kid who plays 4-5 years of college football and has not earned a degree due in part to these frequent transfers ?

I would be in favor of limiting transfers to two--more only with extenuating circumstances such as a family death or disability and limiting transfers to student-athletes with a 2.5 ( C + ) grade average or the school accepting the transfer's academic requirements if they are higher.

I am not a lawyer, but I suspect the case law concerning the transfer portal and NIL collectives is just starting to be determined and decided because they are so relatively new.
 
get'em_griz said:
Contracts. If college football is going the way of semi-professional sports and is paying players, then contracts need to be introduced to 1) protect the players, and 2) protect the schools. Make players sign a contract that guarantees a period of time to be spent at a university before the option to enter the portal. Call it "Free Agency".
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The president of the ncaa has said that this is exactly where it’s going. Possibly as early as next year.

It’s working its way through the courts now and the judge has given an early indication that she intends to side with the ncaa.
 
The problem with transfer limits, legally speaking, is that you can't limit the number of times a normal academic student transfers schools. I suspect the same reasoning works against any rule forcing them to sit (this has already been challenged and the NCAA caved).

Look, this is the entire issue.

Are they students, or are they minor league/semi-pro players?

You cannot have them be both in the eyes of the university system and avoid these types of situations.

You can give them contracts, limit their movement, cap their earnings, etc., but then they can no longer be university students playing organized college sports.
 
BadlandsGrizFan said:
The president of the ncaa has said that this is exactly where it’s going. Possibly as early as next year.

It’s working its way through the courts now and the judge has given an early indication that she intends to side with the ncaa.
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While they may not "cap" NIL...a regulating body can establish "salary caps" for the schools.

I think that's what will happen in some form. If not, haves vs have nots gap will just continue to widen.
 
While what you are saying regarding normal students transferring schools and being able to do so unlimited doesn't necessarily apply to student-athletes and the NCAA as the regulator of college sports.( Normal students can also take 5-10 years or longer to earn their degrees. Student athletes, barring Covid or other extenuating circumstances such as a medical redshirt, only have 5 years of eligibility--they can also take forever to earn their degree, but their schools ain't paying for beyond 5 years, again barring extenuating circumstances approved by the NCAA.
 
billingsgriz said:
While what you are saying regarding normal students transferring schools and being able to do so unlimited doesn't necessarily apply to student-athletes and the NCAA as the regulator of college sports.( Normal students can also take 5-10 years or longer to earn their degrees. Student athletes, barring Covid or other extenuating circumstances such as a medical redshirt, only have 5 years of eligibility--they can also take forever to earn their degree, but their schools ain't paying for beyond 5 years, again barring extenuating circumstances approved by the NCAA.
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These eligibility limits are currently being challenged in court, and if the NCAA loses, then the entire 5-to-play-4 model will be gone, and players may be able to be eligible to play for as long as they want as long as they are enrolled full time, just like how there are no limits on normal academic students in participating in university programs as long as they are enrolled in good standing.
 
Well, that is great but for now, these NCAA eligibility rules still apply and will for years--should the NCAA lose, very unlikely, appeals will last for at least 2-3 more years.

Our justice system moves very slowly, and The NCAA and the colleges and universities it represents have real deep pockets. Personally, I don't find a 30 year old starting GRIZ QB very appealing !!!
 
uofmman1122 said:
These eligibility limits are currently being challenged in court, and if the NCAA loses, then the entire 5-to-play-4 model will be gone, and players may be able to be eligible to play for as long as they want as long as they are enrolled full time, just like how there are no limits on normal academic students in participating in university programs as long as they are enrolled in good standing.
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uofmman1122 said:
The problem with transfer limits, legally speaking, is that you can't limit the number of times a normal academic student transfers schools. I suspect the same reasoning works against any rule forcing them to sit (this has already been challenged and the NCAA caved).

Look, this is the entire issue.

Are they students, or are they minor league/semi-pro players?

You cannot have them be both in the eyes of the university system and avoid these types of situations.

You can give them contracts, limit their movement, cap their earnings, etc., but then they can no longer be university students playing organized college sports.
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This is kind of where I fall on this from a logical standpoint. The old system limited opportunities of student-athletes who wanted to transfer based on the level of program. We all know that, in the past, a FB player could transfer from Alabama to Montana and be allowed to play immediately but would lose a year of eligibility if he transferred to Texas. That rule limited opportunities.

The shit happened when people finally realized that the NCAA also talked out of the other side of its mouth by crowing for decades that the student athletes cannot receive benefits on the basis of being an athlete that are not given to regular students. "They're all just students", etc. Well, then you kinda fucked yourself as a governing body, because a regular student can attend a different school every semester in perpetuity with no penalty/limitation of opportunity. Oops.

Then, of course, people make the argument that, "They could transfer all they wanted like regular students, they just lose eligibility." The problem with that is then their opportunities are limited solely on the basis of being an athlete. Then, you have very established and adhered-to legislation that ensures equal opportunities based on other statuses of people, and it pretty much flies in the face of what the NCAA professed. So then, the question becomes, "Is being an athlete worthy of the same protection of opportunities as being another protected category?" You can't really say "No" unless you want to admit that you're limiting opportunities of students who participate in athletics solely on the basis of them participating in athletics. That's untenable, so here we are.

This is just my opinion on why the transfer restriction didn't make logical sense in light of the NCAA claiming the athletes are just regular students. The question of whether I love it has a different and irrelevant answer.
 
billingsgriz said:
Well, that is great but for now, these NCAA eligibility rules still apply and will for years--should the NCAA lose, very unlikely, appeals will last for at least 2-3 more years.

Our justice system moves very slowly, and The NCAA and the colleges and universities it represents have real deep pockets. Personally, I don't find a 30 year old starting GRIZ QB very appealing !!!
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This is absolutely not true lmao

Most of these decisions have been implemented extremely quickly. Just look at the Juco ruling that was finished just a few weeks ago. It already gave players in that position an extra year.
 
BadlandsGrizFan said:
The president of the ncaa has said that this is exactly where it’s going. Possibly as early as next year.

It’s working its way through the courts now and the judge has given an early indication that she intends to side with the ncaa.
Click to expand...
That could be a mess and expensive with lawyers and such involved. It seems like the NCAA is on a fast track to ruining college sports.
 
If there no appeals, legal decisions can be implimented quickly. If there are appeals, the final decision can take almost forever. When was the last death-row inmate executed within thirty days of being sentenced to death ?
 
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