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Are we EVER Going There ?

oldngrizzly said:
it's certainly not moving up
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DrainBramage said:
......No.

Regardless of what the subdivisions in college football are titled there will alway be tiers. 300+ school fielding competitive teams could never be included in a single playoff system. At least not one that is reasonable. There will also not be complete parity across that many programs. That means everyone who isn't in the top tier needs to find a place where they can find a definition of success for both the players and school.

Montana cannot compete with the larger populations that the current Power conferences enjoy & the corresponding fundraising potential. Montana is simply too small of a population. Our fan base is maxed out with its level of support. Unless Montana becomes more welcoming to Californians or creates a six child family policy, the size of the fan base will continue limit how high up the tiers Montana can rise.

If Montana would jump back into the Pac-?? conference the issue of recruiting becomes a bigger specter. While in the FCS we are able to find success in the field using 50% locally grown stock. That is relevant to the mission of a state school: how many Montana boys are recruited at the Power conference level? Maybe 2-3 kids each year. If the Griz were to recruit like the biggest programs today the culture of the program would alter to the point it wasn't Montanan anymore.

Montana is a good place in the FCS. Competitive, modestly profitable, entertaining and home grown. That's a good measure of success! Moving up is only good on the romantic level... a little success make you dream of 'bigger' things.
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It's the new D2. G5 is the new FCS/1AA.
 
All the good teams left the FCS except NDSU and we still barely tread water.

If we moved up we would get crushed every weekend, fans would leave money would stop coming in and we would end up being on the cats level. Nobody wants that
 
Tony Clifton said:
All the good teams left the FCS except NDSU and we still barely tread water.

If we moved up we would get crushed every weekend, fans would leave money would stop coming in and we would end up being on the cats level. Nobody wants that
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Wow, that's quite the outlook you have on Griz Football.

I think it would be the opposite. I believe UM would be a #1/2 of the PAC and a top five team in the MWC.

The Griz recently beat nationally ranked Washington. IDC what the excuses are, a win is a win.

You're doom and gloom depiction of the fans not coming to games is not even right. Had a losing program been the case for attendance to drop off, we would have seen that from 2017-2022. That didn't happen.

In fact, I would argue attendance would go up. Personally, I would rather see Montana play Oregon State, Boise State, Utah State, Wyoming, Air Force, Hawai'i, than Sac State, Northern Colorado, Weber, Eastern Washington, or NAU. I have all the confidence UM would be a G5 power program.

I don't understand the myopic view of fans who believe Montana would implode. I believe that if Montana were to make the jump, they could easily beat the great majority of G5 teams. With an equal number of scholarships, that levels the playing field, the only teams I see giving UM any trouble, would be SMU, Boise State, maybe Utah State, maybe Air Force.

Most of the G5 teams used to be FCS teams, and Montana used to beat them quite regularly, so that dog don't bark.
 
Tony Clifton said:
All the good teams left the FCS except NDSU and we still barely tread water.

If we moved up we would get crushed every weekend, fans would leave money would stop coming in and we would end up being on the cats level. Nobody wants that
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Shhhhhh, don't you understand that Bobby has returned us to dominance, even though 15-2-0 of the best FCS teams have moved up? Just ask the board geniuses to enlighten you on Hauck's excellence.
 
oldngrizzly said:
DII QB =Mcdowell. No we have not lost many in the portal but rather out of high school in Montana. Some of the quality players do not want to play in the FCS.We lost a damm good punter to Nebraska.The fact is the players we gained in the portal are drop downs from the FBS level.
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True dat
 
oldngrizzly said:
He did not lead anyone.He was all about himself.Nobody wanted him in the FBS or FCS except possibly a couple of the worst teams in the league.He's lucky he still playing.He is toast after this year.
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Futile trying to use logic and your obvious football acumen with some of these dudes. They live in a fantasy world
 
thirdandlong said:
Futile trying to use logic and your obvious football acumen with some of these dudes. They live in a fantasy world
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Can't tell where you stand on McDowell? From the above post it seems you agree with oldngrizzly who doesn't seem to think much of him. Earlier though when you were defending your statement of "what does having a strong o-line have to do with winning a National Championship", you posted;

" So, according to you, if we beat a team with a superior O-line, it can then be determined that having a good O-line is not important. Defense, QB play, special teams play, apparently has no bearing on the outcome."

From this did you mean that one of the factors in our victories over MSU and NDSU was our quality QB play or their poor QB play?
 
SaskGriz said:
Can't tell where you stand on McDowell? From the above post it seems you agree with oldngrizzly who doesn't seem to think much of him. Earlier though when you were defending your statement of "what does having a strong o-line have to do with winning a National Championship", you posted;

" So, according to you, if we beat a team with a superior O-line, it can then be determined that having a good O-line is not important. Defense, QB play, special teams play, apparently has no bearing on the outcome."

From this did you mean that one of the factors in our victories over MSU and NDSU was our quality QB play or their poor QB play?
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McDowell was a below average FCS QB who Hauck brought-in to be a back-up insurance policy behind his expected starter, Vidlak. McDowell passed the football worse than Mellot. He was aided in the passing game by having really good receivers. We won last season with defense, and Junior's key punt returns at very opportune times. Even though we employed the gimmick 3-3-5 defense, we had Gubner and three great LBs to mask the shortfalls of the 3-3-5, which NC caliber teams would never employ. Our offense was not national championship quality. And we have significant questions about the QB position going into this season. Having 6-7 QBs in the QB room means nothing, since only one of them can play at a time. Totally un-proven QB situation.
 
Here is a question to ponder: If Bobby Hauck had never joined the staff at San Diego State, would Montana be using the 3-3-5 defense now?
 
Berkeley_Griz said:
He's wanted by some FBS schools, so therefore he's not even a FCS player, but a D2 player. It would be really difficult for you to make a more moronic argument.
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What FBS schools wanted him? Don't say Temple either. He kept switching schools because he could never win the starting job at an second-rate FCS school. He got the Montana starting job because Vidlak was such a bust, and we had nobody better.
 
thirdandlong said:
Here is a question to ponder: If Bobby Hauck had never joined the staff at San Diego State, would Montana be using the 3-3-5 defense now?
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Unlikely but also unanswerable. Here is a question to ponder; if we didn't use the 3-3-5 would we have still made the National Championship game?

Who would you have taken out of the secondary and who would you have moved off the bench into the line? Or is it a case of if we had stuck with a 4-3 all these years we would have recruited more traditional DT's?
 
SaskGriz said:
Unlikely but also unanswerable. Here is a question to ponder; if we didn't use the 3-3-5 would we have still made the National Championship game?

Who would you have taken out of the secondary and who would you have moved off the bench into the line? Or is it a case of if we had stuck with a 4-3 all these years we would have recruited more traditional DT's?
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No, because Bobby has shown little ability to recruit a stable of great D-linemen. Therefore, the talent did not exist to switch to a 4-3. He is all-in on recruiting for the 3-3-5. Still, none of you 3-3-5 supporters have ever given a rational explanation as to why the power teams in both FBS and FCS do NOT use the 3-3-5 as their base defense.

You don't emulate freaking San Diego State. You emulate Alabama, Michigan, Ohio State, Georgia, SDSU or NDSU.

One additional thing to ponder: Hauck's 1.0 success was better than Hauck's 2.0 success. Yet his 1.0 defenses did not use the 3-3-5. And his 2.0 defense does utilize it. To me, he obviously allowed his D-coordinators to construct their defense back in the 1.0 days. Then, he got a revelation from Long about how great the 3-3-5 defense was, so he demanded that we run that here. Why would anyone think that Long was a defensive guru?
 
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thirdandlong said:
No, because Bobby has shown little ability to recruit a stable of great D-linemen. Therefore, the talent did not exist to switch to a 4-3. He is all-in on recruiting for the 3-3-5. Still, none of you 3-3-5 supporters have ever given a rational explanation as to why the power teams in both FBS and FCS do NOT use the 3-3-5 as their base defense.

You don't emulate freaking San Diego State. You emulate Alabama, Michigan, Ohio State, Georgia, SDSU or NDSU.

One additional thing to ponder: Hauck's 1.0 success was better than Hauck's 2.0 success. Yet his 1.0 defenses did not use the 3-3-5. And his 2.0 defense does utilize it. To me, he obviously allowed his D-coordinators to construct their defense back in the 1.0 days. Then, he got a revelation from Long about how great the 3-3-5 defense was, so he demanded that we run that here. Why would anyone think that Long was a defensive guru?
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SaskGriz said:
Unlikely but also unanswerable. Here is a question to ponder; if we didn't use the 3-3-5 would we have still made the National Championship game?

Who would you have taken out of the secondary and who would you have moved off the bench into the line? Or is it a case of if we had stuck with a 4-3 all these years we would have recruited more traditional DT's?
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The second sentence of your first para is a great question. I say that UM wouldn't have gotten to Frisco without the 3-3-5.
 
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