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Why Would We Ever Hire a Coach With a Losing Record

G

Griz1

Well-known member
Consider this Papa Bear Don Read's record -

Division 1 (Portland State and Oregon) 69 Wins 91Losses 1 Tie
Division II (Portland State Independent) 2 Wins 9 Losses
UNIVERSITY OF MONTANA 85 Wins 36 Losses
CAREER RECORD INCLUDING DIVISION II 156 WINS 136 LOSSES 1 TIE


Record per Wikipedia excluding Division II 154 WINS 127 LOSSES 1 TIE

'NUFF SAID
 
You forgot his 9-24 record at Oregon between 1974-1976.

It might be sacrilegious to say it around here but Read would not have had the success he did without Denehey as his OC and Sours as his DC. It was a great combo with read as the head man.
 
Yes, but at the time Read was hired Montana had a history of pretty bad football teams. Wa-Griz wasn't completed yet, and what did UM have to lose really? It's a whole different ballgame now, and the fans, boosters, administration, students, etc., all expect perfection. The University can't afford to risk much on an unproven coach.
 
indian-outlaw said:
You forgot his 9-24 record at Oregon between 1974-1976.

It might be sacrilegious to say it around here but Read would not have had the success he did without Denehey as his OC and Sours as his DC. It was a great combo with read as the head man.
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I had included his record at Oregon but fixed the error in the team name where I had said Oregon State. I knew better but made a mistake. Sorry about that. Thanks for pointing it out to me.
 
Dont get me wrong, I love Don Read and what he did for Griz. However, college football in 2014 is a completely different animal than college football in 1968 when he first coached at Portland State.
 
Da Boyz Mom nailed it. Montana football is in a completely different place from where it was when Don Read was hired. Though there was the occasional good season, through most of the 1970's well into the 80's a winning record was a relative rarity for the Grizzlies.

When Don Read was hired the Grizzlies would hire just about any coach to see if they could get something going. Read did not have a stellar record but he was a solid candidate and a great personality. He had plenty of experience and was noted for running an exciting offense. Before long he, his staff, and the athletes he brought in began to re-establish an expectation that the Grizzlies would have a winning season. In time coach Read had us beginning to think the Grizzlies being in the playoffs each year was also a reasonable expectation.

In term of the coaching search you can't compare those circumstances with Montana football now. Though there has been the occasional poor season, for the past twenty years the Grizzlies expectation is to compete for championships not mere winning records.

The closest thing to our search then would be Weber State seeking a new coach today. It is possible a coach with a losing record might come to Montana and do well, but there is little reason to believe he would be given that chance.
:ugeek:
 
kemajic said:
Do you mean like we did three years ago?
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Again, completely different circumstances than the current situation. Although the main problems at the time of Delaney's hire have been alleviated, his lack of success in the playoffs haven't bought him much respect around here, so holding him up as an example of a "good" hire is misguided. On the other hand, maybe you are just playing devil's advocate. If so, carry on.
 
Da Boyz Mom said:
Yes, but at the time Read was hired Montana had a history of pretty bad football teams. Wa-Griz wasn't completed yet, and what did UM have to lose really? It's a whole different ballgame now, and the fans, boosters, administration, students, etc., all expect perfection. The University can't afford to risk much on an unproven coach.
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No Stitt!!!!! (pun intended).
 
I have to admit, the whole thing about the hs coach getting in as the UNLV hc must really grind on BH. The hs coach better bring his own staff because there wont be too many assistants that are going to respect a hs coach with no college experience.
 
I honestly could CARE less what kind of respect Delaney gets on Egriz. I tend to take the words of experts over Egrizzers on those things, and when it comes to what kind of coach Delaney was and has been, I'll take the words of Beau Baldwin over what anyone thinks on this board.

As for the OP, previous records don't mean much to me when it comes to the next head coach. Whoever he is was coaching a different team, most likely at a different level, with completely different players and a different recruiting base, more than likely. It's honestly apples to oranges.
 
Read finished at Montana with a record of 85-36 over 10 years. Yet, after 7 of those 10 years he was 51-29 with 2 playoff appearances. Only one of those years did he win more than 8 games (3 of the 7 years he won 6 games). '93 - '95 was where he really got the ball rolling and set Montana on the path to the upper level of the FCS. Would Montana fans allow a new coach 3 more years to get that ball rolling again?
 
Coach Read did not have a winning record when he was hired at the University of Montana. He had a vision, he knew football, he knew what kind of players he wanted, he had an eye for talent, he knew how to lead them and he knew how to get assistants with experience that bought into his vision. If you look at the staff he brought with him it was obvious.

Bill Smith was his defensive coordinator and Tommy Lee his offensive coordinator. Both of these guys had professional experience, one in the NFL and one in the CFL. He also brought in Bob Beers. Look at a couple of his support guys Jerome and Robin. I can't remember the whole staff but it was outstanding.

My whole point here is it isn't the gun it is the gunner. If a coach has a vision, knowledge and connections in getting assistants and recruiting with an eye for talent he can be successful regardless of his previous record.

I don't agree that Don was in a different era and wouldn't be successful now either. IMO he would be just as successful now as he was then. However, it is a pointless argument as there is no way to prove it.
 
By the way Mike Kramer's coaching record is 91 Wins 107 Losses. It seems to me a lot of Grizzly fans would want to hire him in a blink of an eye. Again one of his strengths is putting together a strong staff.
 
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