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speculations from afar based on inconclusive evidence

citygriz

Well-known member
most improved: kareem jamar. most player improvements show up between the freshman and sophomore years, but sounds like jamar wins that award going into his senior year-- testimony to his dedication and the high standards set by tinkle. my one problem with kareem's game was that he sometimes disappeared the first half. doesn't sound like that will be a problem this year.

personal favorite: jordan gregory. it took me about one minute when i first saw him play to come to this conclusion. love his grit, hustle, spunk--wait, where's my roget's?

biggest surprise: brandon gfeller. i thought, skinny kid, small town, needs a redshirt year. but everyone who's commented on him likes his physicality and ah, what's the other thing? oh, yeah. he can shoot! you shoot, you play, period.

close second surprise: michale weisner. wish he could add more weight and muscle, but that doesn't seem to be his body type. still, stylish game, hope he can take the pounding down low. reverse is, he'll present defensive problems for fours who have to defend him out to the three point line.

belated clarification of reshirt policy: freshmen today are far more schooled and skilled than ever before; kentucky wins national championships with 'em. play dunn. play gfeller. (not sure about lopez though.)

jury still out: kemp and martin. kemp is supposed to be this "monster," but five points and six rebounds against simon frazier? hardly monster stats. as for martin, i was hoping for a major improvement freshman to sophomore year but i'm not seeing that in the reports i'm getting. our season will turn on how these two progress.

question mark: riley bradshaw. i watched his hig school tapes and was immediatly reminded of steph curry--great ball skills, combined with a deadly outside shot. can be the same player at this level?

major hope: tinks turns loose his athletes and relies more on the three-quarter court trapping defense. i saw this strategy turn a sure loss into a near victory a couple of years ago against a very athletic usf team. we have the shot blocker in martin to defend the goal, and depth and athleticism at the smaller positions. more, this could be a necesary strategy should we lose any of our post players, where depth is a huge issue. just sayin'.
 
Well done, Citay. I agree with most everything you posted. Jamar is going to be a handful for defenses this season. I won't be surprised if he gets close to 20 points per game. Gregory is by far my favorite GRIZ as well. I have a feeling by season's end Dunn and Gfeller will be fan favorites too. Speaking of which, both these guys will be in our 8 man rotation.

Got to give Kemp time though. JC usually always take time to adjust. I believe 100% come conference play, Kemp will be 7 rebounds per game, and be a very consistent scorer on the blocks. This guy is athletic, big, and strong.

I think we all need to tamper expectations this season for Martin. The original plan was to redshirt him. He was expected to be a player to bring along slowly. Unfortunately, that plan did not go as he, and the staff wanted. It takes raw big men longer to develop than perimeter players. They don't see the ball often, which really hurts their offensive development. To be honest, the kid has good offensive position quite often. The problem is, his teammates do not look for him. When they do, he is surprised to see the ball. My hope is when the games are in solid command, to make a commitment to getting him the ball. We really do need to build him offensively. Cannot do that with him, or any post player without the cooperation of his teammates. I think he could be a solid scorer. He has a soft touch, and moves well for a big man. Defensively, he always makes a solid impact with his length. That goes well beyond the stat book. Rebounding, he will be inconsistent. He needs to get stronger still to hold his position. He gets solid position initially, just cannot sustain it yet. All this comes with physical maturity, which comes with age.

Gfeller has an absolutely beautiful shot. He gets rid of it quickly, smoothly, and the ball rotation is just the way it is coached. I doubt Lopes will redshirt this season. Unfortunately, until Bradshaw is eligible, we need him to fill minutes on the court. Bradshaw will likely progressively contribute more as the season progresses. It takes time to find your game after not playing competitively for almost 2 years. Dunn just looks like a natural at PG, with a nice perimeter shot too. Deshields will feel more and more pressure to perform this season, with Dunn on his heels for playing time. Offensively, I think Dunn is more of difference maker. Defensively, Deshields is tough, and his reactions are just a little below Cherry. I am not sure how quickly Dunn can develop the off the ball instincts. On the ball, Dunn is capable of being a shut down defender.

As I watching the Simon Fraser game, I notice Tinkle demanding the ball to be pushed the whole time. I have no doubt, a point of emphasis this season will be more transition. Your desire for more pressure will happen has the season progresses.

I don't expect them to dominate record wise like they did the last 2 seasons, but would be disappointed with anymore than 5 conference losses this season. Weber State, UNC, and UND are all very good BSC teams this season.
 
mtgrizrule said:
As I watching...I notice Tinkle demanding the ball to be pushed the whole time. I have no doubt, a point of emphasis this season will be more transition.

I don't expect them to dominate record wise like they did the last 2 seasons, but would be disappointed with anymore than 5 conference losses this season.


Perhaps Tinkle was watching how Michigan defeated Syracuse last year in the NCAA Tournament...'demanding the ball to be pushed the whole time.' This preventing the opponent's defense to get set; hence allowing our 6'2" to 6'5" players to score more readily. Just a thought.
 
good observation, wyoming. we-walked-the-ball-up, walked-the-ball-up, walked-the-ball-up, time-and-again, time-and-again, time-and-agan, letting syracuse set up that death-trap of a zone every possession, never adjusting. i was there with my nephew from new york whose dad went to syracuse, and it was humiliating to have an 11-year-old kith-and-kin razzing me throughout that nightmare. i hope tinks learned from that experience. he certaintly didn't in-game.
 
citay said:
good observation, wyoming. we-walked-the-ball-up, walked-the-ball-up, walked-the-ball-up, time-and-again, time-and-again, time-and-agan, letting syracuse set up that death-trap of a zone every possession, never adjusting. i was there with my nephew from new york whose dad went to syracuse, and it was humiliating to have an 11-year-old kith-and-kin razzing me throughout that nightmare. i hope tinks learned from that experience. he certaintly didn't in-game.


Wayne has learned and improved every season as a coach. Got to admit, he has come a long way. In my opinion the best GRIZ men's coach in school history. I hope he stays here as long as Robin. I know that is not realistic though. :thumb:
 
Citay, Mt & Wyo Griz: Excellent, on-target comments.

I sit south floor level, close to the Griz bench & heard Tinkle continually roaring, "push it, push it!" particularly when Dunn was on the floor.

A couple of brief observations from last night:

1. Eric Hutchison had an excellent floor game. He's been working on offensive & rebounding positioning all summer & some of that showed last night. He's still a step slow with man-on D, but has improved greatly with helping D when opponents get into the key.

2. Jordan Gregory got-in a nice rotation at point guard last night & ran the team well. The 3-guard rotation with DeShields & Dunn will be a major plus for Montana this season. Folks around me were commenting on Dunn... saying, " #@!!** he plays just like Cherry... only faster!" Still needs to work on offensive court vision. The college game is, after all, a lot faster than he's used to.

3. Gfeller is the real deal. Which is an unexpected bonus, because he'll be able to give Jamar quick blows in both first & second halves, which Jamar will need, because teams are going to key on him big time.

4. The rotation of Weisner & Kemp will present opponents major matchup problems, because they're such different players... yet both very potent offensively and intense defensively. Kemp is still trying to prove himself & when he relaxes & plays his role, the game will start coming to him.

5. I've seen a major maturity step up from DeShields. Less talk, more walk. Huge upgrade in on-floor toughness. Plus, he's got a good eye for reversing the game flow with quick steals at 3/4 court.

6. Lastly: dare I say it? Very mature & supportive bench; very vocal. No more synchronized kids stuff this year(I hope). They mean business, very into the game... even while on the bench.

Folks seated around me were unanimous: this is the most impressive early season we've seen from the Griz in a long time. And it's good that pre-season previews have picked them to slide to 2nd or 3rd: they're already playing like they've got something to prove.
 
mtgrizrule said:
citay said:
good observation, wyoming. we-walked-the-ball-up, walked-the-ball-up, walked-the-ball-up, time-and-again, time-and-again, time-and-agan, letting syracuse set up that death-trap of a zone every possession, never adjusting. i was there with my nephew from new york whose dad went to syracuse, and it was humiliating to have an 11-year-old kith-and-kin razzing me throughout that nightmare. i hope tinks learned from that experience. he certaintly didn't in-game.


Wayne has learned and improved every season as a coach. Got to admit, he has come a long way. In my opinion the best GRIZ men's coach in school history. I hope he stays here as long as Robin. I know that is not realistic though. :thumb:

agree, journal. remember, both observations can be true at the same time.

good subsequent report. unhappily, i won't see this team in person until march, at sac state. rats.
 
grizzlyjournal said:
Citay, Mt & Wyo Griz: Excellent, on-target comments.

I sit south floor level, close to the Griz bench & heard Tinkle continually roaring, "push it, push it!" particularly when Dunn was on the floor.

A couple of brief observations from last night:

1. Eric Hutchison had an excellent floor game. He's been working on offensive & rebounding positioning all summer & some of that showed last night. He's still a step slow with man-on D, but has improved greatly with helping D when opponents get into the key.

2. Jordan Gregory got-in a nice rotation at point guard last night & ran the team well. The 3-guard rotation with DeShields & Dunn will be a major plus for Montana this season. Folks around me were commenting on Dunn... saying, " #@!!** he plays just like Cherry... only faster!" Still needs to work on offensive court vision. The college game is, after all, a lot faster than he's used to.

3. Gfeller is the real deal. Which is an unexpected bonus, because he'll be able to give Jamar quick blows in both first & second halves, which Jamar will need, because teams are going to key on him big time.

4. The rotation of Weisner & Kemp will present opponents major matchup problems, because they're such different players... yet both very potent offensively and intense defensively. Kemp is still trying to prove himself & when he relaxes & plays his role, the game will start coming to him.

5. I've seen a major maturity step up from DeShields. Less talk, more walk. Huge upgrade in on-floor toughness. Plus, he's got a good eye for reversing the game flow with quick steals at 3/4 court.

6. Lastly: dare I say it? Very mature & supportive bench; very vocal. No more synchronized kids stuff this year(I hope). They mean business, very into the game... even while on the bench.

Folks seated around me were unanimous: this is the most impressive early season we've seen from the Griz in a long time. And it's good that pre-season previews have picked them to slide to 2nd or 3rd: they're already playing like they've got something to prove.

I commented during my in game thread how Dunn looked quicker than Cherry. Also this is the 1st time in years I recall the GRIZ playing great in an exhibition game. Normally teams are not too focused in the exhibition games.
 
Kemp will be a big contributor for UM this year. Don't think Dunn is quicker than Cherry; in fact, think the opposite.
 
Not many guards in the country are/were quicker than a healthy Will Cherry. It's one of the things that made him such a great defender.

But Dunn has some offensive skills that Cherry did not possess as a freshman, if ever.
 
AllWeatherFan said:
Not many guards in the country are/were quicker than a healthy Will Cherry. It's one of the things that made him such a great defender.

But Dunn has some offensive skills that Cherry did not possess as a freshman, if ever.
Dunn certainly showed a nice touch from the free throw line Saturday night. Will really struggled with free throw shooting his freshman year. I should add that Kemp showed some really strong and athletic moves around the basket. He also is very good at getting rebounding position. He reminds me a little of Kamarr Davis. Hopefully, he will have a career similar to Kamarr's although that is really a lofty goal.
 
PlayerRep said:
Don't think Dunn is quicker than Cherry; in fact, think the opposite.

Big deal. It's like what they always say:.."If you can't outrun the competition, what good is bragging about your so-called speed?"

It ain't Dunn against Cherry; it's the Griz against everyone else. Get it?
 
WyomingGrizFan said:
PlayerRep said:
Don't think Dunn is quicker than Cherry; in fact, think the opposite.

Big deal. It's like what they always say:.."If you can't outrun the competition, what good is bragging about your so-called speed?"

It ain't Dunn against Cherry; it's the Griz against everyone else. Get it?

PR, I posted it looks to me he is quicker. I cannot say for sure until I have seen him live for a good amount of playing time. My perspective is on 16" computer screen against a weaker opponent. Even if he is not as quick as Cherry, the fact that I think he is close is a good sign for his future. Offensively he is a lot more polished than Cherry as a FR.

Also from what I hear from a few people who follow CA AAU ball, he is a more natural distributor at PG. Cherry was starting to improve that part of his game. Had he not been injured last season, I think he would have proven he could do that. It sucks he got injured. That injury made it a harder road for his basketball career.

I was high on Cherry the moment he stepped on campus. Ditto that for Dunn. Dunn is very impressive. If GRIZ basketball continues to be where it is at or better, Cherry will be the key recruit that brought the program to the level it is at. It be nice to land a 3 star PG every 2 to 3 years. Now we need to figure out how to do that with bigs. We've been struggling there since Qvale. I hear Galloway committed to another school, but it is a very weak commit at this point. There is a small change Dunn can convince him to change his mind still. I am guessing you have seen Dunn play in person. I have not. If so, I take your word on Cherry being quicker. I have had heard nothing but good about Dunn. I will enjoy his career every bit as much as I enjoyed Cherry's. We shall see how his career turns out and how quick he is when he faces better competition. :thumb:
 
PlayerRep said:
Kemp will be a big contributor for UM this year. Don't think Dunn is quicker than Cherry; in fact, think the opposite.

Not that it really matters, but I think Dunn is quicker, but Cherry definitely had the edge in strength and size which are major factors when it comes to dribble penetration and on ball D. Cherry was extremely fast end to end with the ball as well, and was more of a straight line speed guy while Dunn is a shiftier quicker PG. Both are amazing basketball players, and Dunn should be up there with Will after 4 years as one of the great PGs in UM history.
 
mtgrizrule said:
WyomingGrizFan said:
PlayerRep said:
Don't think Dunn is quicker than Cherry; in fact, think the opposite.

Big deal. It's like what they always say:.."If you can't outrun the competition, what good is bragging about your so-called speed?"

It ain't Dunn against Cherry; it's the Griz against everyone else. Get it?

PR, I posted it looks to me he is quicker. I cannot say for sure until I have seen him live for a good amount of playing time. My perspective is on 16" computer screen against a weaker opponent. Even if he is not as quick as Cherry, the fact that I think he is close is a good sign for his future. Offensively he is a lot more polished than Cherry as a FR.

Also from what I hear from a few people who follow CA AAU ball, he is a more natural distributor at PG. Cherry was starting to improve that part of his game. Had he not been injured last season, I think he would have proven he could do that. It sucks he got injured. That injury made it a harder road for his basketball career.

I was high on Cherry the moment he stepped on campus. Ditto that for Dunn. Dunn is very impressive. If GRIZ basketball continues to be where it is at or better, Cherry will be the key recruit that brought the program to the level it is at. It be nice to land a 3 star PG every 2 to 3 years. Now we need to figure out how to do that with bigs. We've been struggling there since Qvale. I hear Galloway committed to another school, but it is a very weak commit at this point. There is a small change Dunn can convince him to change his mind still. I am guessing you have seen Dunn play in person. I have not. If so, I take your word on Cherry being quicker. I have had heard nothing but good about Dunn. I will enjoy his career every bit as much as I enjoyed Cherry's. We shall see how his career turns out and how quick he is when he faces better competition. :thumb:

Yes, I have seen Dunn in person multiple times. I will ask around, tho. Dunn is a better shooter than Cherry. I don't see him starting this year, unless DeShields were to falter. DeShields is defending well, and he dogs Dunn in practice and scrimmages. It will make Dunn a better player. Dunn will be a terrific player.
 
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