Perception is Reality

[ilovethecats]

your school rapes more than my school. is this really where we are at guys? jesus.

some of you need to get a strong grip of reality. wow.

I think both of those figures for both universities are too high, in the sense that we hope that no rapes ever occur on either campus. And I agree that resorting to those sort of reductive comparisons doesn't look well for either fanbase.

But I think that for us as Griz fans and, for the most part, loyal alumni and fans of our university, it's frustrating to see that one of the major reasons we're struggling right now stems from, fair or unfair, a reputation of being an "unsafe" university, painted in the public conscience as the "rape capital of the US", while 220 miles to the West, our sister university that is flourishing as we languish seems to have a just as bad, if not worse, sexual assault problem on campus.

That's not the only reason we're struggling, and MSU has a lot going for it outside of not having become a pariah in the public conscience, for sure, but it sure sucks for us when it seems like the actual severity of sexual assault problems don't accurately correlate with public scorn for your university in regards to the same subject.

i get that. like i pointed out in the other thread though, some need to do a better job differentiating between football smack talk and real world shit.

i don't give a crap what anyone here says about my bobcats. i don't lose sleep over it. some stuff i might even secretly agree with though i'd never admit as such. i don't care when people bash my team, university, etc. but we're talking about rape here. and assault. and what is being reported and what isn't. these are HUGE issues that go far beyond cats and griz.

i totally get that the krakaur book painted a bad picture for you guys. and i agree it seemed to be exagerrated. we dealt with the same thing when sports illustrated wrote a huge article on our issues. people lost jobs, a lot of people were hurt, and we hear about it still today. very annoying for sure.

i'd just like to see more people remember what the real world is like, and it's a million miles from the football message boards...

 

[uofmman1122]

your school rapes more than my school. is this really where we are at guys? jesus.

some of you need to get a strong grip of reality. wow.

I think both of those figures for both universities are too high, in the sense that we hope that no rapes ever occur on either campus. And I agree that resorting to those sort of reductive comparisons doesn't look well for either fanbase.

But I think that for us as Griz fans and, for the most part, loyal alumni and fans of our university, it's frustrating to see that one of the major reasons we're struggling right now stems from, fair or unfair, a reputation of being an "unsafe" university, painted in the public conscience as the "rape capital of the US", while 220 miles to the West, our sister university that is flourishing as we languish seems to have a just as bad, if not worse, sexual assault problem on campus.

That's not the only reason we're struggling, and MSU has a lot going for it outside of not having become a pariah in the public conscience, for sure, but it sure sucks for us when it seems like the actual severity of sexual assault problems don't accurately correlate with public scorn for your university in regards to the same subject.

i get that. like i pointed out in the other thread though, some need to do a better job differentiating between football smack talk and real world shit.

i don't give a crap what anyone here says about my bobcats. i don't lose sleep over it. some stuff i might even secretly agree with though i'd never admit as such. i don't care when people bash my team, university, etc. but we're talking about rape here. and assault. and what is being reported and what isn't. these are HUGE issues that go far beyond cats and griz.

i totally get that the krakaur book painted a bad picture for you guys. and i agree it seemed to be exagerrated. we dealt with the same thing when sports illustrated wrote a huge article on our issues. people lost jobs, a lot of people were hurt, and we hear about it still today. very annoying for sure.

i'd just like to see more people remember what the real world is like, and it's a million miles from the football message boards...

Oh, for sure.

At the end of the day, if you're looking at these numbers as a "rivalry" type thing, from either fanbase, you're being a jackass.

 

[PlayerRep]

Why are we rehashing this? Yes, the entire world has a rape problem. Yes, Florio and Krakauer are evil. Yes, Engstrom is spineless. Why is this a competition?!? This is stupid. Rape is evil. That there is even one is a tragedy. Griz-Cat should not be about who has the least rapes. That is reprehensible and makes light of the horror that real people have gone through and will go through for the rest of their lives. Some of you need to grow up.

far more articulate than myself but spot on.

Perhaps because the UM stats were just in the news last week. Also, because of the recent Kavanaugh hearing stuff, which I assume some of you realize was in the news.

Did anyone notice that that there was not one shred of evidence that corroborated the allegations, especially of the first one. And, sorry, but supposedly telling someone decades later is not corroboration. It is worse that total inadmissible hearsay.

 

[PlayerRep]

Is Clery Act reporting based on complaints, not verified or adjudicated events?

 

[PlayerRep]

Note, below, that it's all based on just "reporting", i.e. making an allegation, not on anything else, except liquor and drugs are based on arrests or disciplinary actions.

"The report must contain the following information:
Crime Statistics
• Crime statistics for the three most recent calendar years for each of the following crimes that occurred on or within Clery geography that were reported to a local police agency or campus security authority:
» Criminal homicide: murder and non-negligent manslaughter, manslaughter by negligence
» Sex o enses: rape, fondling, incest, statutory rape
» Robbery
» Aggravated assault
» Burglary
» Motor vehicle theft
» Arson
» Arrests and referrals for disciplinary action for liquor law violations, drug law violations, and
weapons law violations
» Hate crimes for all of the above crimes and crimes of larceny-theft, simple assault, intimidation,
vandalism/damage/destruction of property, motivated by a bias from one of the bias categories;
» Dating violence, domestic violence, and stalking

 

[retiredpopo]

blind reporting and anonymous reporting and 3rd party reporting.... it is crazy. somebody can be pissed off at the over priced beer at a concert in the adams center and walk away claiming to be raped to his buddy and a 3rd party can overhear it and call it in the next day. For the record Kavanaugh might have stole some halloween candy from my candy dish I am not sure it was him cause he had a mask on but it could have been him as he most likely was trick or treating on halloween 40 years ago.

 

[rail43boy]

Florio did her best to ruin U of M with her biased reporting, and then went on to be an editor at the Montana Magazine. Guess what? She came on board and now the magazine has folded. She kills all things Montana. Bitch!

 

[KILO217]

UM Public Safety doesn't investigate the rapes committed on campus, Missoula PD does. I believe the Clery Act relates to the crimes reported to UM Public Safety. A rape may initially be reported to them and a report is taken, then the investigation is conducted by MPD. UM Public Safety now has their detective assigned to MPD SVU so the collaboration between agencies is improved to work those felonies that are committed at UM and investigated by MPD.

 

[behappp]

I found it interesting in the recent articles in the Missoulian and Bozeman Daily Chronicle that from 2015-2017 Montana State reported 42 sexual assaults while Montana reported 23. Most people don't know that MSU also reported more rapes than UM during the period of time covered in Krakauer's book. However, the perception by many that Montana has this rape problem on campus has surely contributed to the 28% decline in student enrollment during the last several years - and its not reality...

Do you have links, kilo?