I'm getting the feeling this team is average at best. I'm amazed that the loss of just two guys has made such a difference. The Big Sky looks to be tougher this season and the Griz might struggle to go 8-8 in the league. Let's see .500 in league play and they end the regular season at 14-16 or 15-15. I'm hoping they turn this thing around, but it's starting to look like the writing is on the wall.
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After 13 games have we got a feel for this team?
- Thread starter ronbo
- Start date
Criswell and Virg brought consistancy, urgency, passion, mental/physical toughness every night....and LEADERSHIP!
This years team seems to lack the above, they are talented athletes no doubt but need cohesion to pull it together...
I for em win or lose, but it must be tough on them to struggle to meet their and our expecatations....
Coach Tink almost seems too 'nice', if that is possible. Players last year almost feared going to the bench when Larry held court.
This years team seems to lack the above, they are talented athletes no doubt but need cohesion to pull it together...
I for em win or lose, but it must be tough on them to struggle to meet their and our expecatations....
Coach Tink almost seems too 'nice', if that is possible. Players last year almost feared going to the bench when Larry held court.
Seattle Griz Fan
Well-known member
first11 said:
Agreed totally. Tinkle just may be another Don Holst.
beastie
Well-known member
The main difference is the coach and expectations. All teams lose quality players and contributors each year. Tinkle does not have the same drive and intensity as former quality coaches the griz have had. Don't forget he was instrumental in driving the program into the ground with Kennedy and Holst. Losing became the norm, and Tinkle was a big part of that. Only his political skills of kissing ass kept him around.
It was Larry that reinvigorrated all the guys to play with heart.
Tinkle is confused. He does not push the players. He is more like a friend to them than their coach. He's tried to play too many combinations rather than picking 8 or nine players to rely on, and encouraging the others to stay positive and practice hard.
The only Division 1 teams we've beaten are Minnesota, Boise State and UC Riverside. The other wins are against the frontier conference teams.
Heading into league we have no set rotations and starters. We keep changing hoping for "the right combination". As the coach who works with these kids all year, you know who the best players are, play them and live and die with it.
Confusion from the top leads to confusion by the players.
It was Larry that reinvigorrated all the guys to play with heart.
Tinkle is confused. He does not push the players. He is more like a friend to them than their coach. He's tried to play too many combinations rather than picking 8 or nine players to rely on, and encouraging the others to stay positive and practice hard.
The only Division 1 teams we've beaten are Minnesota, Boise State and UC Riverside. The other wins are against the frontier conference teams.
Heading into league we have no set rotations and starters. We keep changing hoping for "the right combination". As the coach who works with these kids all year, you know who the best players are, play them and live and die with it.
Confusion from the top leads to confusion by the players.
GrizWhiz
Well-known member
South Dakota State does not play in the Frontier Conference. Also, Larry K was an assistant coach for Holst. Does that mean he too helped drive the program into the ground? I don't think the Griz losing has much to do with lack of heart. If Larry was still here, I suspect the Griz would have a similar record to what they have now. I have confidence in Wayne and think things will turn around. I don't think this team is going to end up as good a last year's team, however. That is more likely to happen next season when our senior losses will not be nearly as significant as what we just experienced. :twocents:
this season has been an unqualified disappointment. cam rundles has lived up to prior billing, but sharp, swift, vanderjagt, staudacher, martin and mayes haven't, while gus chase has been a total bust.
nor do i fully understand why. yes, there's a new head coach, but he was an assistant last year, so nobody has to learn a new system. yes, we lost two great players, but you would expect others to step up to fill those roles. besides, we return two of the top post players in the big sky conference--one a mid-major all-american, the other one of the best players to come out of montana high school ball in years. given the talent, proven and potential, i would expect more than a 6-7 record at this point.
nor am i a big believer in dramatic turnarounds. a year ago we were 10-1 at this point, and had won five road games, including an 11 point win at santa clara (always a tough place to play) and the championship of the drake invitational. a definite harbinger of the good times ahead.
maybe we should look at the distaff side, where our team is 10-1, to see how it's done. inner city point guard aside, the hallmarks of a selvig-coached team were all on display against santa clara:
1. total team unity, from the redshirts right on up to the star player;
2. unquestioned respect for the authority and the knowledge of the coaching staff;
3. the ability to make in-game adjustments, as in the way we tightened our perimiter defense after santa clara bolted to a 9-0 lead on the strength of three wide-open threes;
4. steady improvement of players--on this night, britney lohman, an emerging star. before the end of the season, we'll see one or two others stepping up to make valuable contributions at tournament time (bet on lauren beck, for sure.)
until i see the men play in person, i'll reserve judgment.
and one final note. before the lady griz-santa clara game, i checked out their roster to see how many sistahs they had--just one. not only that, she didn't start.
but when junior guard tracey walker entered the game, she was easily the quickest player on the floor. in less than a half of play, her line was 7 points, 3 assists, 4 steals (okay she did foul out.) our ladies are well-coached, play as a team, have a huge star in mandy morales, and will probably be even better by tournament time--where they'll get blown out by a team with 10 (as in ohio state) tracey walkers. please, ladies, prove me wrong; i'll be rooting for you.
nor do i fully understand why. yes, there's a new head coach, but he was an assistant last year, so nobody has to learn a new system. yes, we lost two great players, but you would expect others to step up to fill those roles. besides, we return two of the top post players in the big sky conference--one a mid-major all-american, the other one of the best players to come out of montana high school ball in years. given the talent, proven and potential, i would expect more than a 6-7 record at this point.
nor am i a big believer in dramatic turnarounds. a year ago we were 10-1 at this point, and had won five road games, including an 11 point win at santa clara (always a tough place to play) and the championship of the drake invitational. a definite harbinger of the good times ahead.
maybe we should look at the distaff side, where our team is 10-1, to see how it's done. inner city point guard aside, the hallmarks of a selvig-coached team were all on display against santa clara:
1. total team unity, from the redshirts right on up to the star player;
2. unquestioned respect for the authority and the knowledge of the coaching staff;
3. the ability to make in-game adjustments, as in the way we tightened our perimiter defense after santa clara bolted to a 9-0 lead on the strength of three wide-open threes;
4. steady improvement of players--on this night, britney lohman, an emerging star. before the end of the season, we'll see one or two others stepping up to make valuable contributions at tournament time (bet on lauren beck, for sure.)
until i see the men play in person, i'll reserve judgment.
and one final note. before the lady griz-santa clara game, i checked out their roster to see how many sistahs they had--just one. not only that, she didn't start.
but when junior guard tracey walker entered the game, she was easily the quickest player on the floor. in less than a half of play, her line was 7 points, 3 assists, 4 steals (okay she did foul out.) our ladies are well-coached, play as a team, have a huge star in mandy morales, and will probably be even better by tournament time--where they'll get blown out by a team with 10 (as in ohio state) tracey walkers. please, ladies, prove me wrong; i'll be rooting for you.
Grizbacker1
Well-known member
The Griz are rated ahead of only Sac State and msu in RPI ratings in the BSC.
http://www.midmajority.com/standings.php?y=2007
http://www.midmajority.com/standings.php?y=2007
Sports Junkie
Member
Griz Whiz you are an idiot! If Larry K was still here we would have a similiar record?!?!?!? YA RIGHT!! We lost two players you fool! We return are team MVP, and pick up great recruits! LK didnt put up with any shit from his players, it was his way on the highway, there was no confusion. He had a plan and you either followed or got the hell out. All the players followed his confidence and got on board with the program!!Bottom line, losing LK was a huge loss, I know both him and wayne personaly and wayne is a great guy, but larry was a general and his players followed his marching orders! He didnt care about making any friends with the players, he wanted to WIN and thats it!
Sports Junkie is absolutely right. Talented coaches which are few
have different styles but they have one thing in common-they
have the gift of motivating a team of people to perform at high
levels. Also, they leave no doubt about their confidence to do so.
Wayne is a quality person but so far he has struggled with
decision making, he plays too many kids because he recruited them.
I also cannot help but wonder about his assistants and how things
might be if Brad was still around. But make no mistake the record
wouldn't be the same with Larry at the helm. I am thankful that he
was around for 2yrs but I sure wish he had given it another few yrs.
All is not lost; lets hope things improve.
have different styles but they have one thing in common-they
have the gift of motivating a team of people to perform at high
levels. Also, they leave no doubt about their confidence to do so.
Wayne is a quality person but so far he has struggled with
decision making, he plays too many kids because he recruited them.
I also cannot help but wonder about his assistants and how things
might be if Brad was still around. But make no mistake the record
wouldn't be the same with Larry at the helm. I am thankful that he
was around for 2yrs but I sure wish he had given it another few yrs.
All is not lost; lets hope things improve.
Seattle Griz Fan
Well-known member
I saw enough on TV when the Griz played those games in Orlando to know that Tinkle shows no fire in his coaching, does not inspire his players to have any fire, and tolerates consistant defensive and offensive foibles on the court.
I have not totally blown him off as a coach. I think he deserves to have an entire season to show me something. But, I am beginning to think that this hire is going to return the Griz BB program to the levels we were forced to endure the past decade prior to the short up-swing we had when LK was here.
I have not totally blown him off as a coach. I think he deserves to have an entire season to show me something. But, I am beginning to think that this hire is going to return the Griz BB program to the levels we were forced to endure the past decade prior to the short up-swing we had when LK was here.
GrizBBIsKing
Well-known member
GrizWhiz said:
Actually, if it weren't for Krysko, the 1999-2000 team would not have won the regular season Big Sky tournament. After a loss to Sacremento, Assist. Coach K took the players on a midnight drive in Sacremento giving them some kind of motivational speech, something like telling them about the birds and bees sort of stuff. The Griz started playing much better after that, playing well above their expectations and won the regular season. They weren't the best team in the Sky that year, but did win some games they weren't expected to win. That is, he motivated the players to play better, and they did.
Coach K is able to motivate the players better than any coach that coached at UM since Heathcote. Add the added Intensity Coach K has along with the ability to motivate, and it becomes very much noticed.
I think the Griz played much better last two years because of Coach K, and I fear it may have raised expectations so much to make a bit more difficult for the next coach, whoever that coach was to be.
Tinkle is that next coach now, and we have to support him. Or go support the Lady Griz. There isn't any coach with more intensity than Robin Selvig. One reason Lady Griz play with more intensity most times. The intensity of Robin Selvig just rubs off onto the Lady Griz players. It doesn't seem to with Wayne Tinkle..
AtHomeInTheDahlbergDen
Well-known member
As much as i've put down and doubted tinks so far. I have a fair amount of confidence this is what will happen. It's early enough in his tenure that he's still getting the feel. I'm not saying he goes blameless for the first stretch of this season, i'm saying he's capable of righting the ship. LK went 6-7 through nonconference play in his first year as coach... well, those 3 of those losses were to Gonzaga, Stanford and Missouri on the road.Swilly3224 said:
Don't you think it's a little early to write off Tinkle?
AtHomeInTheDahlbergDen
Well-known member
Yes.AllWeatherFan said:
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