street and smiths fcs top 25

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PlayerRep
Posts: 21663
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 11:06 am

Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by PlayerRep » Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:09 pm

statler & waldorf wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:29 pm
griznative24 wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:39 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:40 pm
Anyone questioning just how far our football program has deteriorated under Bob Stitt, just consider the fact that Sacramento State is now regarded more highly by the national sports media than Montana! Is there anyone out there who thought they would EVER see the day that Sac. State would possibly be better than we are?

The short answer is that we have sunken their their level, instead of them ascending to our previous level!
I'd argue the program was in decline well before Stitt. But yes, it is an alarming fact that not seeing Montana in a top 25 preseason poll has become common.
Spot on, guys!
O'Day picked Pflu to guide the fortunes of the Cadillac program of the FCS. After a sputtering 7-4 first season(now considered the norm), Pflu brought our Griz back to the accustomed level. Enter Engstrom, who fires O'Day and Pflu, based on a legal charge much later refuted in court, hires Haslam and Delaney. Delaney kept for THREE F****** YEARS!!! Then, a also ran DII HC is hired to continue the mediocrity slide. Three year contract to continue this 'death by a thousand cuts,' and succeeds at his assigned task. I presume he left his green cap on his vacated desk. Stitt inherited(by that time)a lower level FCS team, at best, and brings in a whole new system and coaches, and degrades, even further, Griz football.

Who do you hang this one on, Haslam or Engstrom? I haven't seen Haslam or Engstrom fall on his sword, and Engstrom still is on the faculty. Someone's head needs to roll, but whom?
Please explain your complaint about Delaney's last 2 years. Ranked nos. 12 and 8, post-season. Wins over the Cats and playoffs both years. Okay, hotshot, let's see your analysis.

PlayerRep
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by PlayerRep » Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:11 pm

statler & waldorf wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:49 pm
IF... Haslam was told what to do, he should have resigned in disgust, and saved his reputation.
Why? Don't understand why you would say that.

PlayerRep
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by PlayerRep » Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:11 pm

4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm
get'em_griz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:35 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:17 pm
griznative24 wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:39 pm


I'd argue the program was in decline well before Stitt. But yes, it is an alarming fact that not seeing Montana in a top 25 preseason poll has become common.
Oh, I agree that our program declined with Delaney. Engstrom and Haslam are directly responsible for our decline. Why they thought that they needed to bring a tired old 70+ year-old coach out of retirement to "save" our troubled program was idiocy. If we had conducted a national search after Pflu left, and hired the right coach, we would not be having this 10-year re-building program on our plates now.

Fans don't realize that a poor hire sets the program back much longer than the 3 wasted years under the wrong head coach!
I don’t think Haslam can really be blamed for the downfall of the football program. I think his hands were tied by Engstrom and he was pretty much told he had to hire Stitt. Do you think if it came down to Stitt or Hauck that Hauck, a proven HC, would have been hired in 2015? Hell no, Engstrom wouldn’t allow that to happen. Stitt was the safe pick and Engstrom led the charge. In light of all that, I think Haslam has done a great job as UM’s AD.

I agree that UM took a huge risk in hiring Stitt and it didn’t work out, so I guess Haslam shares some responsibility as the AD. I honestly don’t think Hauck would be here now if Engstrom were still president, which tells me that he was the catalyst in everything going back to Pflugrad and Oday’s firings.
What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football........ we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Stitt was hardly a safe pick. He was a risky pick.

The safe pick was Hauck.

statler & waldorf
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by statler & waldorf » Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:19 pm

Where the hell were all of you when this shitshow was developing? Seems the only ones I remember(I know, memory growing weaker by the day)with the balls enough to call a spade a spade were AG1, growler, and a handful of others. Engstrom should get canned immediately for his actions. Haslam should get canned immediatley for his CYA inactions.
PR, for years after Pflu, the Griz were grossly overrated, despite Delaney. With all your 'influence' and expertise in 'playing the game,' you had NO impact? Looks like your input has also been grossly overrated. Therefore, what transpired must have had your blessing. Maybe you could pull some of your posts from eGriz history to show me the error of my ways, that you were fighting FOR the Griz, instead of leading the 'Kumbaya Choir.' As for Haslam, character is like virginity, something you have, or don't, 'hotshot.' :roll: Just my opinion, doesn't have to be yours.
Last edited by statler & waldorf on Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"The two pillars of 'political correctness' are: a) willful ignorance b) a steadfast refusal to face the truth." - George MacDonald.

Catsrgrood
Posts: 214
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by Catsrgrood » Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:28 pm

4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm
get'em_griz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:35 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:17 pm
griznative24 wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:39 pm


I'd argue the program was in decline well before Stitt. But yes, it is an alarming fact that not seeing Montana in a top 25 preseason poll has become common.
Oh, I agree that our program declined with Delaney. Engstrom and Haslam are directly responsible for our decline. Why they thought that they needed to bring a tired old 70+ year-old coach out of retirement to "save" our troubled program was idiocy. If we had conducted a national search after Pflu left, and hired the right coach, we would not be having this 10-year re-building program on our plates now.

Fans don't realize that a poor hire sets the program back much longer than the 3 wasted years under the wrong head coach!
I don’t think Haslam can really be blamed for the downfall of the football program. I think his hands were tied by Engstrom and he was pretty much told he had to hire Stitt. Do you think if it came down to Stitt or Hauck that Hauck, a proven HC, would have been hired in 2015? Hell no, Engstrom wouldn’t allow that to happen. Stitt was the safe pick and Engstrom led the charge. In light of all that, I think Haslam has done a great job as UM’s AD.

I agree that UM took a huge risk in hiring Stitt and it didn’t work out, so I guess Haslam shares some responsibility as the AD. I honestly don’t think Hauck would be here now if Engstrom were still president, which tells me that he was the catalyst in everything going back to Pflugrad and Oday’s firings.
What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football...... we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Please... No you were not.

I know I’ll get some crap for this, “another Cat troll stirring the pot”. Truly not the intention.

But come on....

The Griz were very good for a few years, yes much better than the Cats, so don’t turn it into the typical what have the Cats done, Cats suck, etc type argument here.
For 15 or so years the Griz were in the conversation for one of the top teams, in the playoffs every year, etc and it was an impressive run, but they’ve won 2 titles, ever. So to say that they even remotely resembled what Alabama is to FBS is laughable.

Alabama has won something like 17 National Titles and lost a few more in its history. The Griz are what, 2-3?

PlayerRep
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by PlayerRep » Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:39 pm

Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:28 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm
get'em_griz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:35 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:17 pm


Oh, I agree that our program declined with Delaney. Engstrom and Haslam are directly responsible for our decline. Why they thought that they needed to bring a tired old 70+ year-old coach out of retirement to "save" our troubled program was idiocy. If we had conducted a national search after Pflu left, and hired the right coach, we would not be having this 10-year re-building program on our plates now.

Fans don't realize that a poor hire sets the program back much longer than the 3 wasted years under the wrong head coach!
I don’t think Haslam can really be blamed for the downfall of the football program. I think his hands were tied by Engstrom and he was pretty much told he had to hire Stitt. Do you think if it came down to Stitt or Hauck that Hauck, a proven HC, would have been hired in 2015? Hell no, Engstrom wouldn’t allow that to happen. Stitt was the safe pick and Engstrom led the charge. In light of all that, I think Haslam has done a great job as UM’s AD.

I agree that UM took a huge risk in hiring Stitt and it didn’t work out, so I guess Haslam shares some responsibility as the AD. I honestly don’t think Hauck would be here now if Engstrom were still president, which tells me that he was the catalyst in everything going back to Pflugrad and Oday’s firings.

What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football...... we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Please... No you were not.

I know I’ll get some crap for this, “another Cat troll stirring the pot”. Truly not the intention.

But come on....

The Griz were very good for a few years, yes much better than the Cats, so don’t turn it into the typical what have the Cats done, Cats suck, etc type argument here.
For 15 or so years the Griz were in the conversation for one of the top teams, in the playoffs every year, etc and it was an impressive run, but they’ve won 2 titles, ever. So to say that they even remotely resembled what Alabama is to FBS is laughable.

Alabama has won something like 17 National Titles and lost a few more in its history. The Griz are what, 2-3?
Please, in the 15 years period between 1994 and 2008, UM won two national championships and Alabama won none.

Yes, you're right, the Griz were very good in that 15 year period.
Last edited by PlayerRep on Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Catsrgrood
Posts: 214
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by Catsrgrood » Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:53 pm

PlayerRep wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:39 pm
Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:28 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm
get'em_griz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:35 pm


I don’t think Haslam can really be blamed for the downfall of the football program. I think his hands were tied by Engstrom and he was pretty much told he had to hire Stitt. Do you think if it came down to Stitt or Hauck that Hauck, a proven HC, would have been hired in 2015? Hell no, Engstrom wouldn’t allow that to happen. Stitt was the safe pick and Engstrom led the charge. In light of all that, I think Haslam has done a great job as UM’s AD.

I agree that UM took a huge risk in hiring Stitt and it didn’t work out, so I guess Haslam shares some responsibility as the AD. I honestly don’t think Hauck would be here now if Engstrom were still president, which tells me that he was the catalyst in everything going back to Pflugrad and Oday’s firings.

What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football...... we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Please... No you were not.

I know I’ll get some crap for this, “another Cat troll stirring the pot”. Truly not the intention.

But come on....

The Griz were very good for a few years, yes much better than the Cats, so don’t turn it into the typical what have the Cats done, Cats suck, etc type argument here.
For 15 or so years the Griz were in the conversation for one of the top teams, in the playoffs every year, etc and it was an impressive run, but they’ve won 2 titles, ever. So to say that they even remotely resembled what Alabama is to FBS is laughable.

Alabama has won something like 17 National Titles and lost a few more in its history. The Griz are what, 2-3?
Please, in the 25 years period between 1994 and 2008, UM won two national championships and Alabama won none.

Yes, you're right, the Griz were very good in that 25 year period.
That is a 14 year period you pointed out, not 25 years...

I know you’re just being difficult (weird), but way to completely misconstrue the point. I’m not trying to compare the Griz to Alabama over that exact 15 yr period. In general and historically speaking, they are not even remotely comparable programs, like 4luvofgriz is trying to say.

PlayerRep
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by PlayerRep » Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:56 pm

PlayerRep wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:39 pm
Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:28 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm
get'em_griz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:35 pm


I don’t think Haslam can really be blamed for the downfall of the football program. I think his hands were tied by Engstrom and he was pretty much told he had to hire Stitt. Do you think if it came down to Stitt or Hauck that Hauck, a proven HC, would have been hired in 2015? Hell no, Engstrom wouldn’t allow that to happen. Stitt was the safe pick and Engstrom led the charge. In light of all that, I think Haslam has done a great job as UM’s AD.

I agree that UM took a huge risk in hiring Stitt and it didn’t work out, so I guess Haslam shares some responsibility as the AD. I honestly don’t think Hauck would be here now if Engstrom were still president, which tells me that he was the catalyst in everything going back to Pflugrad and Oday’s firings.

What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football...... we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Please... No you were not.

I know I’ll get some crap for this, “another Cat troll stirring the pot”. Truly not the intention.

But come on....

The Griz were very good for a few years, yes much better than the Cats, so don’t turn it into the typical what have the Cats done, Cats suck, etc type argument here.
For 15 or so years the Griz were in the conversation for one of the top teams, in the playoffs every year, etc and it was an impressive run, but they’ve won 2 titles, ever. So to say that they even remotely resembled what Alabama is to FBS is laughable.

Alabama has won something like 17 National Titles and lost a few more in its history. The Griz are what, 2-3?
Please, in the 15 years period between 1994 and 2008, UM won two national championships and Alabama won none.

Yes, you're right, the Griz were very good in that 15 year period.

PlayerRep
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by PlayerRep » Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:03 pm

Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:53 pm
PlayerRep wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:39 pm
Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:28 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm



What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football...... we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Please... No you were not.

I know I’ll get some crap for this, “another Cat troll stirring the pot”. Truly not the intention.

But come on....

The Griz were very good for a few years, yes much better than the Cats, so don’t turn it into the typical what have the Cats done, Cats suck, etc type argument here.
For 15 or so years the Griz were in the conversation for one of the top teams, in the playoffs every year, etc and it was an impressive run, but they’ve won 2 titles, ever. So to say that they even remotely resembled what Alabama is to FBS is laughable.

Alabama has won something like 17 National Titles and lost a few more in its history. The Griz are what, 2-3?
Please, in the 25 years period between 1994 and 2008, UM won two national championships and Alabama won none.

Yes, you're right, the Griz were very good in that 25 year period.
That is a 14 year period you pointed out, not 25 years...

I know you’re just being difficult (weird), but way to completely misconstrue the point. I’m not trying to compare the Griz to Alabama over that exact 15 yr period. In general and historically speaking, they are not even remotely comparable programs, like 4luvofgriz is trying to say.
15 year period, not 14 years.

I thought the poster was trying to point out that the Griz were very good in a certain period of time, which could have been from early 90's to several years ago. The poster wasn't talking about the entire history of football.

I didn't misconstrue the point. I just pointed out that what you said was incorrect, and not the point that the poster was making. FCS football didn't even start until the 80's, so you can't compare it back to the beginning of football.

During some 10-year period, or decade, UM won more football games than any other D-I program, including Alabama.

You are the one who is off base here, not the poster who compared the Griz to Alabama.

Catsrgrood
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by Catsrgrood » Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:06 pm

PlayerRep wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:03 pm
Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:53 pm
PlayerRep wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:39 pm
Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:28 pm


Please... No you were not.

I know I’ll get some crap for this, “another Cat troll stirring the pot”. Truly not the intention.

But come on....

The Griz were very good for a few years, yes much better than the Cats, so don’t turn it into the typical what have the Cats done, Cats suck, etc type argument here.
For 15 or so years the Griz were in the conversation for one of the top teams, in the playoffs every year, etc and it was an impressive run, but they’ve won 2 titles, ever. So to say that they even remotely resembled what Alabama is to FBS is laughable.

Alabama has won something like 17 National Titles and lost a few more in its history. The Griz are what, 2-3?
Please, in the 25 years period between 1994 and 2008, UM won two national championships and Alabama won none.

Yes, you're right, the Griz were very good in that 25 year period.
That is a 14 year period you pointed out, not 25 years...

I know you’re just being difficult (weird), but way to completely misconstrue the point. I’m not trying to compare the Griz to Alabama over that exact 15 yr period. In general and historically speaking, they are not even remotely comparable programs, like 4luvofgriz is trying to say.
15 year period, not 14 years.

I thought the poster was trying to point out that the Griz were very good in a certain period of time, which could have been from early 90's to several years ago. The poster wasn't talking about the entire history of football.

I didn't misconstrue the point. I just pointed out that what you said was incorrect, and not the point that the poster was making. FCS football didn't even start until the 80's, so you can't compare it back to the beginning of football.

During some 10-year period, or decade, UM won more football games than any other D-I program, including Alabama.

You are the one who is off base here, not the poster who compared the Griz to Alabama.
Ok

4theluvofgriz
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by 4theluvofgriz » Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:23 am

kemajic wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 9:35 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm
get'em_griz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:35 pm
I don’t think Haslam can really be blamed for the downfall of the football program. I think his hands were tied by Engstrom and he was pretty much told he had to hire Stitt. Do you think if it came down to Stitt or Hauck that Hauck, a proven HC, would have been hired in 2015? Hell no, Engstrom wouldn’t allow that to happen. Stitt was the safe pick and Engstrom led the charge. In light of all that, I think Haslam has done a great job as UM’s AD.

I agree that UM took a huge risk in hiring Stitt and it didn’t work out, so I guess Haslam shares some responsibility as the AD. I honestly don’t think Hauck would be here now if Engstrom were still president, which tells me that he was the catalyst in everything going back to Pflugrad and Oday’s firings.
What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football........ we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Really? After Engstom personally had the University, let alone the AD, on a crash spiral, please provide the list of your "best coach possible" candidates that were available for Haslam to choose. The answer was of course Hauck, not allowed by Engstom. So show us the list. This job is not where most "best coach possibe"s wanted to be. You act like every coach in the country was competing for the job.
Are you serious? It is total B.S. that Engstrom dictated that Haslam hire Stitt. Engstrom is a chemistry professor, and understands that he does not have a clue about hiring football coaches. But he demanded that Haslam hire a coach who had a squeaky clean track record with no player personnel issues clouding his past. So you are telling me that Bob Stitt was the only applicant among the 150 who applied that fit those qualifications? I get a kick out of the narrative that Haslam had no real choices to hire from. The Montana head football job is one of the most coveted FCS jobs in the nation. We have the best facilities in all of FCS to use as a recruiting tool, the best a largest fan base in the nation, a storied past of competing for National Championships, and a history of our head coaches getting FBS head coaching jobs. We are a perfect stepping-stone job for any hot young coach who has FBS coaching aspirations.

I don't have the list of applicants which Haslam had to choose from, and neither do you, so stop the ridiculous challenges for me or anyone else to provide them for discussion. But I assure you that there were several great choices who would have been great hires among that group...... certainly better hires than a Division II coach with a 15-year record of 0.530 football!

IdaEag92
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by IdaEag92 » Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:24 am

4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:40 pm
Anyone questioning just how far our football program has deteriorated under Bob Stitt, just consider the fact that Sacramento State is now regarded more highly by the national sports media than Montana! Is there anyone out there who thought they would EVER see the day that Sac. State would possibly be better than we are?

The short answer is that we have sunken to their level, instead of them ascending to our previous level!
I wouldn't worry too much about the ranking, next time you all attend a game just look around, Montana is doing it right. You have too much history and pride. I remember as a little kid growing up in Moscow in the 60's, going to Spokane and watching the Grizzlies play the Vandals at Joe Albi Stadium. I thought you gyes were the Packers. Keep recruiting Montana kids, coaching them up to compete, and find coaches that are vested in Montana. That is what Eastern has done. Don't fall into the same trap as Idaho, with a revolving door of coaches, where there arn't any local kids good enough. Idaho had a chance to get their Cooper Cupp in Vaderesch, but he too wasn't good enough for a Vandal walk on. My youngest is not a Cupp, he's just a solid blue collar OL, not good enough for Idaho but has found a home in cheney. Go Eags Protect the Red!!!

4theluvofgriz
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by 4theluvofgriz » Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:29 am

Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:53 pm
PlayerRep wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:39 pm
Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:28 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm



What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football...... we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Please... No you were not.

I know I’ll get some crap for this, “another Cat troll stirring the pot”. Truly not the intention.

But come on....

The Griz were very good for a few years, yes much better than the Cats, so don’t turn it into the typical what have the Cats done, Cats suck, etc type argument here.
For 15 or so years the Griz were in the conversation for one of the top teams, in the playoffs every year, etc and it was an impressive run, but they’ve won 2 titles, ever. So to say that they even remotely resembled what Alabama is to FBS is laughable.

Alabama has won something like 17 National Titles and lost a few more in its history. The Griz are what, 2-3?
Please, in the 25 years period between 1994 and 2008, UM won two national championships and Alabama won none.

Yes, you're right, the Griz were very good in that 25 year period.
That is a 14 year period you pointed out, not 25 years...

I know you’re just being difficult (weird), but way to completely misconstrue the point. I’m not trying to compare the Griz to Alabama over that exact 15 yr period. In general and historically speaking, they are not even remotely comparable programs, like 4luvofgriz is trying to say.

what is funny is a Cat fan trying to denigrate the fact that Montana played in 5 NC games during a relatively short period of years, winning two of them, and then trying to suggest that we were not one of the elite FCS programs in the nation during that time, of which the end of that period of dominance was caused by the stupid and unjustified firing of our head coach and AD, which ignited our continued downfall to the mediocrity that your Bobcats have wallowed in for so many decades.

Catsrgrood
Posts: 214
Joined: Fri Apr 07, 2017 4:39 pm

Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by Catsrgrood » Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:51 am

4theluvofgriz wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:29 am
Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:53 pm
PlayerRep wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:39 pm
Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:28 pm


Please... No you were not.

I know I’ll get some crap for this, “another Cat troll stirring the pot”. Truly not the intention.

But come on....

The Griz were very good for a few years, yes much better than the Cats, so don’t turn it into the typical what have the Cats done, Cats suck, etc type argument here.
For 15 or so years the Griz were in the conversation for one of the top teams, in the playoffs every year, etc and it was an impressive run, but they’ve won 2 titles, ever. So to say that they even remotely resembled what Alabama is to FBS is laughable.

Alabama has won something like 17 National Titles and lost a few more in its history. The Griz are what, 2-3?
Please, in the 25 years period between 1994 and 2008, UM won two national championships and Alabama won none.

Yes, you're right, the Griz were very good in that 25 year period.
That is a 14 year period you pointed out, not 25 years...

I know you’re just being difficult (weird), but way to completely misconstrue the point. I’m not trying to compare the Griz to Alabama over that exact 15 yr period. In general and historically speaking, they are not even remotely comparable programs, like 4luvofgriz is trying to say.

what is funny is a Cat fan trying to denigrate the fact that Montana played in 5 NC games during a relatively short period of years, winning two of them, and then trying to suggest that we were not one of the elite FCS programs in the nation during that time, of which the end of that period of dominance was caused by the stupid and unjustified firing of our head coach and AD, which ignited our continued downfall to the mediocrity that your Bobcats have wallowed in for so many decades.
I believe my exact words were, for 15 or so years the Griz were in the conversation for one of the top teams, in the playoffs every year and that it was an impressive run.
I’d say that’s the exact opposite of “suggesting the Griz were not among the elite teams in FCS” as you just said.

But the Alabama of FCS they were not and have never been.

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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by get'em_griz » Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:55 am

4theluvofgriz wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:23 am
kemajic wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 9:35 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm
get'em_griz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:35 pm
I don’t think Haslam can really be blamed for the downfall of the football program. I think his hands were tied by Engstrom and he was pretty much told he had to hire Stitt. Do you think if it came down to Stitt or Hauck that Hauck, a proven HC, would have been hired in 2015? Hell no, Engstrom wouldn’t allow that to happen. Stitt was the safe pick and Engstrom led the charge. In light of all that, I think Haslam has done a great job as UM’s AD.

I agree that UM took a huge risk in hiring Stitt and it didn’t work out, so I guess Haslam shares some responsibility as the AD. I honestly don’t think Hauck would be here now if Engstrom were still president, which tells me that he was the catalyst in everything going back to Pflugrad and Oday’s firings.
What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football........ we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Really? After Engstom personally had the University, let alone the AD, on a crash spiral, please provide the list of your "best coach possible" candidates that were available for Haslam to choose. The answer was of course Hauck, not allowed by Engstom. So show us the list. This job is not where most "best coach possibe"s wanted to be. You act like every coach in the country was competing for the job.
Are you serious? It is total B.S. that Engstrom dictated that Haslam hire Stitt. Engstrom is a chemistry professor, and understands that he does not have a clue about hiring football coaches. But he demanded that Haslam hire a coach who had a squeaky clean track record with no player personnel issues clouding his past.
You really think that Engstrom wasn’t pulling the strings? He told O’Day to fire Pflugrad in 2012. When O’Day stood up for Pflugrad and said no, Engstrom fired them both. So to say that Engstrom didn’t dictate that Haslam hire Stitt is a stretch.
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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by 4theluvofgriz » Fri Jun 15, 2018 9:26 am

get'em_griz wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:55 am
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:23 am
kemajic wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 9:35 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm


What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football........ we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Really? After Engstom personally had the University, let alone the AD, on a crash spiral, please provide the list of your "best coach possible" candidates that were available for Haslam to choose. The answer was of course Hauck, not allowed by Engstom. So show us the list. This job is not where most "best coach possibe"s wanted to be. You act like every coach in the country was competing for the job.
Are you serious? It is total B.S. that Engstrom dictated that Haslam hire Stitt. Engstrom is a chemistry professor, and understands that he does not have a clue about hiring football coaches. But he demanded that Haslam hire a coach who had a squeaky clean track record with no player personnel issues clouding his past.
You really think that Engstrom wasn’t pulling the strings? He told O’Day to fire Pflugrad in 2012. When O’Day stood up for Pflugrad and said no, Engstrom fired them both. So to say that Engstrom didn’t dictate that Haslam hire Stitt is a stretch.

Seriously? Engstrom didn't know Bob Stitt from Lady GaGa. He knows nothing about the game of football. Haslam presented Stitt to Engstrom as his choice to hire, from 150 applicants, and Engstrom agreed. But it was HASLAM who decided on Stitt, not the other way around.

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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by PlayerRep » Fri Jun 15, 2018 10:22 am

Catsrgrood wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:51 am
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:29 am
Catsrgrood wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:53 pm
PlayerRep wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 10:39 pm


Please, in the 25 years period between 1994 and 2008, UM won two national championships and Alabama won none.

Yes, you're right, the Griz were very good in that 25 year period.
That is a 14 year period you pointed out, not 25 years...

I know you’re just being difficult (weird), but way to completely misconstrue the point. I’m not trying to compare the Griz to Alabama over that exact 15 yr period. In general and historically speaking, they are not even remotely comparable programs, like 4luvofgriz is trying to say.

what is funny is a Cat fan trying to denigrate the fact that Montana played in 5 NC games during a relatively short period of years, winning two of them, and then trying to suggest that we were not one of the elite FCS programs in the nation during that time, of which the end of that period of dominance was caused by the stupid and unjustified firing of our head coach and AD, which ignited our continued downfall to the mediocrity that your Bobcats have wallowed in for so many decades.
I believe my exact words were, for 15 or so years the Griz were in the conversation for one of the top teams, in the playoffs every year and that it was an impressive run.
I’d say that’s the exact opposite of “suggesting the Griz were not among the elite teams in FCS” as you just said.

But the Alabama of FCS they were not and have never been.
During that 15 year period, UM was just as elite, or more elite (at the FCS level), than Alabama. That's our point. Don't know why you ignore that.

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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by PlayerRep » Fri Jun 15, 2018 10:24 am

get'em_griz wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:55 am
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:23 am
kemajic wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 9:35 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm


What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football........ we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Really? After Engstom personally had the University, let alone the AD, on a crash spiral, please provide the list of your "best coach possible" candidates that were available for Haslam to choose. The answer was of course Hauck, not allowed by Engstom. So show us the list. This job is not where most "best coach possibe"s wanted to be. You act like every coach in the country was competing for the job.
Are you serious? It is total B.S. that Engstrom dictated that Haslam hire Stitt. Engstrom is a chemistry professor, and understands that he does not have a clue about hiring football coaches. But he demanded that Haslam hire a coach who had a squeaky clean track record with no player personnel issues clouding his past.
You really think that Engstrom wasn’t pulling the strings? He told O’Day to fire Pflugrad in 2012. When O’Day stood up for Pflugrad and said no, Engstrom fired them both. So to say that Engstrom didn’t dictate that Haslam hire Stitt is a stretch.
I don't think Engstrom told O'Day to fire Pflu. When O'Day and Pflu were asked to meet with Engstrom first thing one morning, they had no idea what was coming or what the meeting was about as they walked to Main Hall.

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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by PlayerRep » Fri Jun 15, 2018 10:25 am

4theluvofgriz wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 9:26 am
get'em_griz wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:55 am
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:23 am
kemajic wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 9:35 pm

Really? After Engstom personally had the University, let alone the AD, on a crash spiral, please provide the list of your "best coach possible" candidates that were available for Haslam to choose. The answer was of course Hauck, not allowed by Engstom. So show us the list. This job is not where most "best coach possibe"s wanted to be. You act like every coach in the country was competing for the job.
Are you serious? It is total B.S. that Engstrom dictated that Haslam hire Stitt. Engstrom is a chemistry professor, and understands that he does not have a clue about hiring football coaches. But he demanded that Haslam hire a coach who had a squeaky clean track record with no player personnel issues clouding his past.
You really think that Engstrom wasn’t pulling the strings? He told O’Day to fire Pflugrad in 2012. When O’Day stood up for Pflugrad and said no, Engstrom fired them both. So to say that Engstrom didn’t dictate that Haslam hire Stitt is a stretch.

Seriously? Engstrom didn't know Bob Stitt from Lady GaGa. He knows nothing about the game of football. Haslam presented Stitt to Engstrom as his choice to hire, from 150 applicants, and Engstrom agreed. But it was HASLAM who decided on Stitt, not the other way around.
I don't know the facts, but this is my impression too. My impression is that Engstrom may not have allowed BH to be hired, but I doubt that Haslam wanted to do that anyway.

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Re: street and smiths fcs top 25

Post by kemajic » Fri Jun 15, 2018 11:26 am

4theluvofgriz wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:23 am
kemajic wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 9:35 pm
4theluvofgriz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:28 pm
get'em_griz wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:35 pm
I don’t think Haslam can really be blamed for the downfall of the football program. I think his hands were tied by Engstrom and he was pretty much told he had to hire Stitt. Do you think if it came down to Stitt or Hauck that Hauck, a proven HC, would have been hired in 2015? Hell no, Engstrom wouldn’t allow that to happen. Stitt was the safe pick and Engstrom led the charge. In light of all that, I think Haslam has done a great job as UM’s AD.

I agree that UM took a huge risk in hiring Stitt and it didn’t work out, so I guess Haslam shares some responsibility as the AD. I honestly don’t think Hauck would be here now if Engstrom were still president, which tells me that he was the catalyst in everything going back to Pflugrad and Oday’s firings.
What is this "safe pick" bullshit??? We are the Montana Grizzlies....... we don't hire safe picks, we re-tool, hire the best coach possible, and continue to dominate! Haslam hired Stitt and needs to be held accountable! We were the Alabama of FCS football........ we don't hire safe picks..... we hire WINNERS!
Really? After Engstom personally had the University, let alone the AD, on a crash spiral, please provide the list of your "best coach possible" candidates that were available for Haslam to choose. The answer was of course Hauck, not allowed by Engstom. So show us the list. This job is not where most "best coach possibe"s wanted to be. You act like every coach in the country was competing for the job.
Are you serious? It is total B.S. that Engstrom dictated that Haslam hire Stitt. Engstrom is a chemistry professor, and understands that he does not have a clue about hiring football coaches.
Where did I say that? Can you even read? You're way too ready to argue and you don't even know what you're arguing against.
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