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Offensive Line Discussion

AZGrizFan

AZGrizFan

Well-known member
DONOR
OK, i have a question I want to pose to the board.

Each year, when recruiting classes are announced, people here gush about the size, strength, and film of the players, including the O-linemen. We always seem happy (for the most part, maybe could use more quantity) with the classes brought in by Bobby as they are announced, yet we ALWAYS seem disappointed by the performance on the field. Every year we say “this team goes only so far as the O-line can take it”…We pray for drop downs, but then when we get them (Pillans, Forbes, Mayginnes, etc.) they don’t seem to perform up to the level we expect/need to get over the hump or give our offense a fighting chance. We gush about NDSU’s O-line, but what is it that makes them so special and able to work together as such a unit?

So, here’s my question: Is it a recruiting issue? An identification of talent issue? A strength coach issue? A position coach development issue? A coaching philosophy/system issue? All of the above?

I mean, could these guys be great if they had a great O-line coach? Or is the talent just not there and we (and the coaches/recruiters) aren’t able to identify what’s needed in the initial phases of recruitment and pursuit of various players? Or are they just bad O-line recruiters? Because its certainly not a SIZE issue…they are large humans….
 
AZGrizFan said:
OK, i have a question I want to pose to the board.

Each year, when recruiting classes are announced, people here gush about the size, strength, and film of the players, including the O-linemen. We always seem happy (for the most part, maybe could use more quantity) with the classes brought in by Bobby as they are announced, yet we ALWAYS seem disappointed by the performance on the field. Every year we say “this team goes only so far as the O-line can take it”…We pray for drop downs, but then when we get them (Pillans, Forbes, Mayginnes, etc.) they don’t seem to perform up to the level we expect/need to get over the hump or give our offense a fighting chance. We gush about NDSU’s O-line, but what is it that makes them so special and able to work together as such a unit?

So, here’s my question: Is it a recruiting issue? An identification of talent issue? A strength coach issue? A position coach development issue? A coaching philosophy/system issue? All of the above?

I mean, could these guys be great if they had a great O-line coach? Or is the talent just not there and we (and the coaches/recruiters) aren’t able to identify what’s needed in the initial phases of recruitment and pursuit of various players? Or are they just bad O-line recruiters? Because its certainly not a SIZE issue…they are large humans….
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The O-Line play this year was outstanding in comparison to the last couple of years. Large improvement over 2019. Our challenges converting on 1st, and 3rd down and scoring in the redzone was not all on them and was very little due to them. If you watched this year, they were opening very large holes and blowing people off the line. Our run game could have been and should have been much more effective. I do think they struggled a little in pass blocking, but that was not that often. The QBs just took off a little too soon at times. Mayginnes, and Forbes are coming back. They were arguably our best lineman anyway. Sounds like we may have another Mayginnes brother to fill a roll and Casey was pretty good when in at Tackle. I recommend we get 1-2 more studs in the portal for the line and keep developing what we have. 0-Line is not the problem with the Griz. Not sure why so many folks were hard on them this year. The O-Line coach is tough, but respected. He knows what he is talking about.
 
The main issue with the line this year for the run game was having freshman 170 and 180 pound tailbacks.

On the pass blocking I thought we looked okay when Cam was in as he had great pocket awareness and moved around the pocket to extend the play. Chris Brown was the opposite as he was a redshirt freshman. Experience counts.
 
I guess the question, to be more clear, is this:

How does NDSU consistently have the best O-Line in the FCS? Do their recruits start OUT that way? Or are they developed INTO it? And if so, are we missing at recruiting or developing talent?
 
AZGrizFan said:
I guess the question, to be more clear, is this:

How does NDSU consistently have the best O-Line in the FCS? Do their recruits start OUT that way? Or are they developed INTO it? And if so, are we missing at recruiting or developing talent?
Click to expand...

Been some stories about their Strength and Conditioning Coach. Guess he’s been there forever and is a badass.
 
AZGrizFan said:
I guess the question, to be more clear, is this:

How does NDSU consistently have the best O-Line in the FCS? Do their recruits start OUT that way? Or are they developed INTO it? And if so, are we missing at recruiting or developing talent?
Click to expand...

Upper Midwest farm boys under the supervision of the best S&C coach in FCS football.
 
BDizzle said:
AZGrizFan said:
I guess the question, to be more clear, is this:

How does NDSU consistently have the best O-Line in the FCS? Do their recruits start OUT that way? Or are they developed INTO it? And if so, are we missing at recruiting or developing talent?
Click to expand...

Been some stories about their Strength and Conditioning Coach. Guess he’s been there forever and is a badass.
Click to expand...

Is it some kind of secret sauce that nobody else can duplicate?
 
HelenaHandBasket said:
AZGrizFan said:
I guess the question, to be more clear, is this:

How does NDSU consistently have the best O-Line in the FCS? Do their recruits start OUT that way? Or are they developed INTO it? And if so, are we missing at recruiting or developing talent?
Click to expand...

Upper Midwest farm boys under the supervision of the best S&C coach in FCS football.
Click to expand...

Don’t we grow some fairly large farm boys in Montana? Seems like MSU has had several pretty good O-linemen out of Montana the past few years…we seem to always want to go get ours out of Arizona or somewhere like that…
 
AZGrizFan said:
HelenaHandBasket said:
Upper Midwest farm boys under the supervision of the best S&C coach in FCS football.
Click to expand...

Don’t we grow some fairly large farm boys in Montana? Seems like MSU has had several pretty good O-linemen out of Montana the past few years…we seem to always want to go get ours out of Arizona or somewhere like that…
Click to expand...

I will take a stab at this. Montana just doesn't have the numbers like it used to 20 years ago that was the bread and butter of Griz teams of during the hey days. Rural Montana population has decreased significantly and family farms can rely on technology instead of the labor of 8 boys. The upper midwest still has a significant rural farm population.
 
grizindabox said:
AZGrizFan said:
Don’t we grow some fairly large farm boys in Montana? Seems like MSU has had several pretty good O-linemen out of Montana the past few years…we seem to always want to go get ours out of Arizona or somewhere like that…
Click to expand...

I will take a stab at this. Montana just doesn't have the numbers like it used to 20 years ago that was the bread and butter of Griz teams of during the hey days. Rural Montana population has decreased significantly and family farms can rely on technology instead of the labor of 8 boys. The upper midwest still has a significant rural farm population.
Click to expand...

This is also compounded by the fact that there are just less kids deciding to play football.
 
84GRIZ said:
The main issue with the line this year for the run game was having freshman 170 and 180 pound tailbacks.

On the pass blocking I thought we looked okay when Cam was in as he had great pocket awareness and moved around the pocket to extend the play. Chris Brown was the opposite as he was a redshirt freshman. Experience counts.
Click to expand...


I completely agree with 84, if we would have had our All American running back, and not be down a couple of our best skill players, line would have looked a lot better. I'm not saying it would have looked like NDSU. I've always said one of the biggest keys is home field advantage in the playoffs, if the Griz would have been seeded 1 or 2, would have been a different story also.

He broke our single season touchdown record for touchdowns, and with a line that I don't feel is as good as this years. Major difference.
 
Here is my two cents on this discussion. Everyone commenting makes good points. There has been much criticism from multiple posters about our O-line coach. He is in his second term as our O-line coach, so it would be interesting to look back at the lines he coached in his first tour here. Were they good lines?
If he was an effective line coach then, why wouldn't he continue to be an effective coach today? If the answer is that he was a good coach back then, the answer now must be that we are not recruiting the same level of talent now as we did back then.
It seems true that we are not recruiting many O-linemen any longer from the state of Montana. Maybe there are not many worthy of recruiting now. I do agree that the Mid-West is a better place to recruit the big uglies than Washington and Oregon. Do we have coaches who have any connections in MN, WI, IA, etc? Not sure. It may be prudent to hire some assistant coaches who have ties to that region, to open up a pipeline to talent there.
 
One of the NDSU coaches was talking about how they really highlight and make a big deal about thier offensive lineman in their PR. He said everybody in Fargo knows thier names. That coupled with thier excellent s&c coach and whole great program makes it very attractive to recruits.
 
LaJollaGriz said:
Here is my two cents on this discussion. Everyone commenting makes good points. There has been much criticism from multiple posters about our O-line coach. He is in his second term as our O-line coach, so it would be interesting to look back at the lines he coached in his first tour here. Were they good lines?
If he was an effective line coach then, why wouldn't he continue to be an effective coach today? If the answer is that he was a good coach back then, the answer now must be that we are not recruiting the same level of talent now as we did back then.
It seems true that we are not recruiting many O-linemen any longer from the state of Montana. Maybe there are not many worthy of recruiting now. I do agree that the Mid-West is a better place to recruit the big uglies than Washington and Oregon. Do we have coaches who have any connections in MN, WI, IA, etc? Not sure. It may be prudent to hire some assistant coaches who have ties to that region, to open up a pipeline to talent there.
Click to expand...
If you played OL for North Dakota State and you had their fullback running up their backs, you darn tooting, you would be blocking.
 
Spanky2 said:
LaJollaGriz said:
Here is my two cents on this discussion. Everyone commenting makes good points. There has been much criticism from multiple posters about our O-line coach. He is in his second term as our O-line coach, so it would be interesting to look back at the lines he coached in his first tour here. Were they good lines?
If he was an effective line coach then, why wouldn't he continue to be an effective coach today? If the answer is that he was a good coach back then, the answer now must be that we are not recruiting the same level of talent now as we did back then.
It seems true that we are not recruiting many O-linemen any longer from the state of Montana. Maybe there are not many worthy of recruiting now. I do agree that the Mid-West is a better place to recruit the big uglies than Washington and Oregon. Do we have coaches who have any connections in MN, WI, IA, etc? Not sure. It may be prudent to hire some assistant coaches who have ties to that region, to open up a pipeline to talent there.
Click to expand...
If you played OL for North Dakota State and you had their fullback running up their backs, you darn tooting, you would be blocking.
Click to expand...

:lol: :lol: :lol: That kid is an absolute BEAST. And only a junior, FFS. :eek: :eek:
 
LaJollaGriz said:
I do agree that the Mid-West is a better place to recruit the big uglies than Washington and Oregon. Do we have coaches who have any connections in MN, WI, IA, etc? Not sure. It may be prudent to hire some assistant coaches who have ties to that region, to open up a pipeline to talent there.
Click to expand...
We got a great looking RB from MN so someone must be paying attention there.
 
AllWeatherFan said:
Ostmo could be that guy for us. Especially if those hogs were opening up holes for him.
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Don't get me wrong. I love Ostmo and the way he runs. But he does NOT run like Leupke. That kid is just.....different. He reminds me of Mike Alstott.
 
bigsky33 said:
One of the NDSU coaches was talking about how they really highlight and make a big deal about thier offensive lineman in their PR. He said everybody in Fargo knows thier names. That coupled with thier excellent s&c coach and whole great program makes it very attractive to recruits.
Click to expand...

That’s a damn good point. Probably similar in the way EWU attracts good WR’s.
 
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